Is Necrosis the real life version of Ghoulification?

[Dude500X]

Well, I was trying to figure out what sort of Tan someone would have in a nuclear wasteland and I came across this medical condition called Necrosis.

 

Yes I know, I was bored.

 

Anyway!  I discovered a condition called Necrosis which is essentially dead cells AND it can be caused by radiation exposure.  It got me thinking.. is Ghoulification based off of Necrosis in some way?  Any medical folk on here care to have a say?

[leddis3]

I think possibly the original ghouls from Fallout 1 & 2 which were not immortal or had super speed and were shambling rotting meat on legs that could barely move might be close to this.

Fallout 3 ghouls? Not so much.

[DeadSomething]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acute_radiation_syndrome

thats exactly what we've learned in school.

after the fukushima incident, they showed a japanese fisherman on tv, who was part of a crew who were out with a boat while the americans tested a nuclear bomb eastern of japan on th ocean (after WWII). the fishermen didnt know anything about it and within minutes, all of the men lost their hair, got "seasick" they kept working and after some time, they had to return to the harbor, because some began to bleed out of their noses, ears, everywhere and they got burnt skin. all except of that one man died - most of them were dead before they even reached the harbor.

he showed photos of himself... he looked almost exactly like one of those ghouls.

they had to repair his face with chirurgy to look more like just "a usual burn victim".

 

radiation can do two things: heat up the molecules of your body cells (no matter what cell) and interact with the DNA of each cell.

heating something up too much will cause it to die and maybe burn and changing DNA by pure chance without a plan, will cause cancer.

so except for the ghouls being immortal and healed by more radiation, its quite the exact reallife counterpart.

[Dude500X]

fascinating!

 

if only scientists could try recreate it in the lab, perhaps with animals (to avoid ethical concerns).

[Insidiator]

fascinating!

 

if only scientists could try recreate it in the lab, perhaps with animals (to avoid ethical concerns).

You mean recreate what? Radiate some animal until it is either dead or dying? To prove what? That radiation kills?

[sammythesquirrel]

fascinating!

 

if only scientists could try recreate it in the lab, perhaps with animals (to avoid ethical concerns).

there are ethical concerns regardless,as there will always be those who will claim that such research is unethical for instance the poster above me who failed to take the fact that you were refering to scientitsts recreating the immortality of the fallout ghouls rather that the harmful efects

[Insidiator]

Thank you sammy for the thinly veiled sarcasm. It really facilitates communication in a forum. I only assumed that the recreation would refer to the "dying" part since the "immortality" part is pure fucking fiction so it's kind of impossible to create or recreate. Radiation doesn't give you super powers, it gives you cancer.

[sammythesquirrel]

It was not sarcasm, based on your wording I could only ASSUME that you had failed to realize that  he WAS referring to the immortality part, that is why he said"if only" meaning that yes he knows its impossible or at least so improbable that it will likely never happen ,BUT but it would still be an incredibly good thing for everyone if it did by some miracle actually occur. So please calm down and before making assumptions ask the person to clarify their meaning if you are not sure of their written words.

[Dude500X]

Ugh, I can only assume I riled someones feathers mentioning the idea of testing on animals.  Well, animals are not humans.

 

We have used animals for hundreds of things in this world to test things out on, we used animals in space, animals for cosmetics and animals for countless other things.  The idea of using animals to discover what radiation can do in a controlled environment is no different.

 

But I'm not interested in debating that here.  I have ENOUGH debates on this subject on Facebook Lol.

[Insidiator]

Dude, I'm not against animal testing. I do believe it saves lives. But I also think it has to be based on some scientific basis. Radiating random animals to see if they'll become immortal is like replacing their blood with liquid hydrogen to see if they'll turn into Dr. Freeze versions of animals. Cruel and pointless. They do expose animals to radiation, as far as I know, to improve radiation treatment for cancer but that's kind of different.

[KainsChylde]

The in-game reason for ghoul immortality is radiation combined with a light exposure to FEV. Since FEV doesn't exist in any form in real life, any attempt at causing ghoulification would just be randomly irradiating things.

[Dude500X]

Its only random if its without purpose.

 

Also.. FEV and ghouls? you sure? I can't remember ever seeing this in any of the Fallouts.. im interested in knowing now where you saw it.

[KainsChylde]

In the original two games, FEV is lightly distributed through ALL creatures. That's how the Enclave planned to exterminate all of the people on the mainland in FO2, with a modified FEV that reacts against original FEV in anyone infected. Ghoulification takes place when there's just enough FEV to react with the radiation. Too much FEV and you become a Super Mutant. Not enough FEV and you just die of radiation poisoning. Just enough, and you become a ghoul.

[DoctaSax]

I never gave it much thought but figured the ghouls were just the effect of radiation according to FO science, like the oversized bugs, and only muties & centaurs had anything to do with FEV. The wiki suggests that both Cain & Avellone now say it's radiation-only, Chris Taylor supports the FEV factor. http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Ghoul Although I have no idea what sources were used there.

Because FEV was known to make its test subjects bigger & stronger and ghouls may be wirey but not overly muscular, I'll stick with radiation-only. Which doesn't mean ghoulification would happen to everyone exposed to radiation, of course. Just the ones that don't die too quickly. In an alternate reality. Don't try this at home

[KainsChylde]

The way I understood it, super muties and centaurs were from heavy exposure. Ghouls and other mutations were the result of trace amounts mixed with radiation. Its funny that now the three guys who created it can't agree.

 

Consider this; SMs and centaurs are just immune to radiation, ghouls are healed by it.

[dboura]

I seem to recall a part of F03, a ghoul specified that it was caused from the radiation of the war. She talked about how her hair started falling out and such too. I want to say it was in the Lincoln Memorial where all the ghouls where living together but can't remember exactly.

[KainsChylde]

A civilian ghoul, that new nothing of other military endeavors.

 

And Lincoln Memorial was Slavers or Ex Slaves, depending on player actions. The ghouls were in the Natural history Museum.

[DoctaSax]

Still, it's not likely that FEV, even in small doses, managed to be as widespread across the country as the effects of radiation to account for any & all ghouls, above & underground. Enclave plans to infect the postnuclear population with whichever strain of it never really worked out, for instance, and ghouls were already there before they tried it.

In the end, the games are called Fallout - the nuclear aspect needs to be front & center for me. With FEV being a handy little shady supersecret thingie that you can call in when things don't make sense otherwise. You need the FEV factor to make sense of supermutants, but ghouls not so much.

Of course, if a lore theory's around long enough, it becomes valid enough to never be completely discounted, so I'm not gonna say ghouls being  affected by FEV is simply wrong. It's just not necessary for me. The fact that the original developers can't agree either gives us something to wrestle with, something that can't be as easily resolved as the rest - like the Arcturian Heresy in TES etc. I kinda like that - it becomes more about what you actively choose to believe than just passively accepting only one explanation. Hell, maybe they're doing it on purpose

[dboura]

A civilian ghoul, that new nothing of other military endeavors.

 

And Lincoln Memorial was Slavers or Ex Slaves, depending on player actions. The ghouls were in the Natural history Museum.

Like I said I wasn't fully sure where

[Dude500X]

Where in Fallout 2 does it mention FEV and Ghouls though?  I wanna find it on my next play thorugh lol

[EmhyrVarEmreis]

fascinating!

 

if only scientists could try recreate it in the lab, perhaps with animals (to avoid ethical concerns).

 

That's weird. Isn't it a bit cruel? I think it's disgusting. I would rather try it on criminals, lol.

[Dude500X]

 

fascinating!

 

if only scientists could try recreate it in the lab, perhaps with animals (to avoid ethical concerns).

 

That's weird. Isn't it a bit cruel? I think it's disgusting. I would rather try it on criminals, lol.

 

 

Anything for science my friend.

[ElvenScoundrel]

But... why would scientists fuck around with necrosis? To what end? I'm pretty sure scientists know all there is to know about necrosis, as it isn't something new just recently discovered. Why would they 'ghoulify' animals nowadays? There's no real scientific motivation to do so. Necrosis kills you, it doesn't make you into a being that can live forever like Ghouls.

[Dude500X]

But... why would scientists fuck around with necrosis? To what end? I'm pretty sure scientists know all there is to know about necrosis, as it isn't something new just recently discovered. Why would they 'ghoulify' animals nowadays? There's no real scientific motivation to do so. Necrosis kills you, it doesn't make you into a being that can live forever like Ghouls.

 

 

What evidence do you have for this though?

[ElvenScoundrel]

 

But... why would scientists fuck around with necrosis? To what end? I'm pretty sure scientists know all there is to know about necrosis, as it isn't something new just recently discovered. Why would they 'ghoulify' animals nowadays? There's no real scientific motivation to do so. Necrosis kills you, it doesn't make you into a being that can live forever like Ghouls.

 

 

What evidence do you have for this though?

 

For what exactly?