Is it OK to add sexual content involving children in a mod?

[figandsalt]

I know someone would instantly say "no" after reading the title, but please hear me out. It's very serious issue.

 

Inspired by the Christianity mod and Noxbestia mod, I noticed that the religion in CK2 is a wonderful aspect to be messed up with while designing a new CK2 mod. Lots of primitive regional religions like those in ancient Greece or Mesopotamia area have reproduction worship feature and providing public prostitution service. I can combine such worldly value and moral concept with deity system of some other religion.

 

As my fondness of the Jade Dragon dlc, I decided maybe I could start with Taoist since no one had made any adult mod involving eastern religions before. But after Igathered some history information about Taoist, I noticed that there is a problem.

 

Although it's not the core mechanic of Taoist religious practice, there are several Taoist theory claiming that having sex with a certain amount of female partners would grant male practitioner with longevity or even immortality. This seems nice for me until I saw "ideal ding(woman sexual partner) is a premenarche virgin just under 14 years of age and women older than 18 should be avoided".?

 

OK I understand that the ideological trend of protecting children against sexual assault and abuse is a fairly new concept that didn't appear until 20th century. Before that the child sex was a relatively rare but ethical practice. I'm not here to judge ancient people but is it really OK for me to put this feature into a game that allow player’s character to have sex intercourse with underaged NPC?

 

I understand the loverslab website always keeps a tolerant attitude towards sexual perversion content, but i fear pedosexuality might cross some kind of line here. I am not talking about "I wake up some other day and find a black FBI van parking outside my house" kind of staff, but more concerned about such a mod could irritate players which is the last thing i want to do.

 

 

[Kedwyn]

look, i lurk around here, never posted anything. But i'll give you my two cents.

If the website says in a explicit manner that Child porn is not allowed, then don't do it. ( i say this because i don't really know the TOS )

I personally don't want to have kids getting fucked in my game, but i'm okay if you make the mod because it is something that did happen in history.

I'm just hoping that people don't complain saying that it is a sick thing to do or bla bla bla. These people are the same that make the argument: "It's just a game, it's not real life so it's ok". So if in your opnion you don't like it, great. If you do, great, but don't give me the bullshit argument that it crosses a line or whatever.

 

peace.

[flutie]

As we are typically associated as being an adult pornographic community, we will not allow any sort of nudity or sexual content involving characters that could be seen as depicting somebody as underage. This includes any character that could be seen as loli, shota, child, or underage teen, regardless of it's position as a virtual character or the intent to be passed off as a mystical race who only looks young; the only thing that matters in this respect is what the character appears to be at a glance.

[DoctaSax]

There is such a thing as taking historical accuracy too far. This is one of those cases. Sexual content with children is simply far too much of a hot potato for us to want to be involved with it. Even for a game like CK2.

[figandsalt]

3 hours ago, DoctaSax said:

There is such a thing as taking historical accuracy too far. This is one of those cases. Sexual content with children is simply far too much of a hot potato for us to want to be involved with it. Even for a game like CK2.

Point taken. 

As I searched more of the sexual ritual of Taoist, I started to realized that the Fangzhongshu (practice in chamber) branch was based on some extremely dark religious (or should i say cult) practices. And when i say "dark" i mean disgusting, even in the eyes of ancient people. So I probably won't continue working on that.

[Jack Archer]

I'd side with the safe side of life and say lets not. Though, These are violent times...

[Buzhidao]

According to the laws in most American states, child pornography is defined as a visual image of an underage person in a sexual context. Which should mean that, as long as you don't add pictures of children in any such context, written descriptions in events do not fall under this definition. The laws in the United Kingdom take a similar stance on the issue, whereas Canada and (I think) Australia have much more strict laws. In those countries writing a pornographic text featuring children will get you in trouble.

 

All that said, you better follow the rules set by the website first and foremost or release your content on your own website and keep this community out of whatever problems may arise if the authorities decide to take issue with your work.

[FauxFurry]

It is only a mod in a video game so it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. Just keep said mod off of this site and everything will be copacetic.

[flutie]

7 hours ago, DoctaSax said:

There is such a thing as taking historical accuracy too far. This is one of those cases. Sexual content with children is simply far too much of a hot potato for us to want to be involved with it. Even for a game like CK2.

 

2 hours ago, FauxFurry said:

It is only a mod in a video game so it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. Just keep said mod off of this site and everything will be copacetic.

agreed,  

 

WINNER, WINNER, CHICKEN DINNER

[rhiper]

oy vey, moral questions and wannabe lecturers are here
I mean, do you even have to ask these kinds of questions when there are mods here involving scat, gore etc?
Be and let be man...

[radech]

3 hours ago, rhipeen said:

oy vey, moral questions and wannabe lecturers are here
I mean, do you even have to ask these kinds of questions when there are mods here involving scat, gore etc?
Be and let be man...

There's legal implications to consider as well.

To OP how about a little creative freedom and bump it up to 16-20 or 18-22? or make it a setting? - I'd avoid doing anything overly descriptive or just hand the events themselves over to darkworld or another mod.

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

1 hour ago, radech said:

There's legal implications to consider as well.
 

 

Last thing I want is for this site to get in trouble, I like it here.   I would err on the side of caution

[Nukas]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't CK2 (vanilla) allow the seduction, marriage, sex and reproduction between actors as young as 16 years old?

In the eyes of the law that's a minor, and in that context whether the actor is portrayed as being 16, 14 or 12 is irrelevant, they're all minors.

So, considering CK2 sales aren't outlawed and its discussion isn't banned from this site, I think it's safe to assume whatever they do isn't seen as explicit enough to violate any (US) laws. With that in mind, if you were to create any content involving that age range, I'd personally try to use the vanilla content as an example of what template is safe to be followed. In other words, there's no logical reason for there to be any issues for content that isn't any more explicit as the vanilla game, as that would imply the game itself is also illegal.

With that out of the equation, it all boils down to a matter of morals and measuring the degree of "explicitness" you can go with.

[wazerblade]

I would like to address this issue from the taoism aspect 

Fang zhong shu (Technics in bedroom) is not a pure taoist concept. Normally it only focus on how to "Tame" women in bed with your super badass skills. It is meant for adults, not for children. The purpose of "Taming" is a little like brainwashing, making women addicted to having sex with you. Another name is "Yu nv qi  shu" (Special Skills for fxxking women). But whatever name it has, it is more like a good old story without any actual historical support.

From a pure taosim perspective, it was believed that virgin boys and men would be superior when it comes to learning "Wu gong"(Kungfu) and studying "Xian shu"(Magic used by gods ). The ultimate purpose for a true taoist believer is to practice "Xianshu" and make inner perfection, so that one could "Ascend to the heaven"and become a god. In a lot of stories successful cases have been described.

So perhaps your source on taoism might not be  that accurate. 

 

[Saryon8]

On 9/10/2018 at 5:15 AM, DoctaSax said:

There is such a thing as taking historical accuracy too far. This is one of those cases. Sexual content with children is simply far too much of a hot potato for us to want to be involved with it. Even for a game like CK2.

Crusader Kings II is a hstoric game. I don't think i those game you can take historical accurancy too far. The more the game is accurate, the better it is.

There is already in some mods here, events that involve people under 18, without pics evidently.

And that's just a game not reality. Most people know differences between a game and reality. Those who not are crazy anyway and will do bad things with or without this mod. So for me, i don't see any ethical problem.

Legal problem is another thing but as someone say in most countries writing about it is legal, if you don't put any pics of under 18 caracters that legal.

Nukas: Legal majority depend of countries. And that's even more right if you consider sexual majority. Every country or near has a different one, for example in my country France, sexual majority is 15.

That's not just about thaoism, there is a lot of case where this questions can happen cause there weren't same customs and laws about children sex in the Middle Age. So this have to be answer, i'm glad that someone pose the problem.



 

[DoctaSax]

Nobody said '18', as the vanilla game itself obviously finds sex at 16 entirely normal. 'Under 14' though is a child, and that's not ok by LoversLab. This is not up for debate.

[StinkyBinky]

Yeah if it would be in a mod it would be illegal by law in many countries and the players of the mod could get into trouble. The 16 age which is "unrealistic" in Medieval RL is cause the age of consent and to date and have sex with adults is in most countries is 16 y i think, it is in Germany and i would guess also in Sweden and other European countries. I know in the Middle Ages it was different especially cause ppl died so early and much and so ppl tend to secure workforce and all that stuff - so the "age of consent" was different back then also the whom you could marry changed much in this timepriod in Europe.

 

But that untill the age of 16 y you can not do several aspects which targets sexuality of a characts is caused because it would be against the law and would cause trouble.  I think this wikipedia article is a good start and overview about that topic. And yeah it is good such laws exist even ppl can disucss if such a law about something fictonal, similar to blasphemie should be an issue, but i think it is good to have such a law.

[Froggy]

What you do to your own mod for your own use is your own business.

 

What you publish for public consumption has to follow the site's rules.

[jotunnsurtr]

Put the mod somewhere outside this website, and send people to that other place to download it, if they're interested. Problem solved.

[sen4mi]

In fallout 4, vault 75 was a breeding program where they all were killed on their 18th birthday.

 

It's not pornographic, though.

 

Edit: somehow this seems about right for me to include here:

 

Spoiler

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRSijEW_cDM

 

[Jayleia]

On 9/11/2018 at 8:14 AM, rhipeen said:

oy vey, moral questions and wannabe lecturers are here
I mean, do you even have to ask these kinds of questions when there are mods here involving scat, gore etc?
Be and let be man...

Literally nobody is lecturing anyone on morals.

 

We're talking about the law.

 

And even if we weren't talking about the law, its entirely up to the site owners what is permitted here.  If they want to have scat and gore and ban foot fetish stuff, that's entirely their right as the site owners.  Because they own the site.  As it is, the owners have firmly stated repeatedly, no kid stuff.

[Varithina]

What the historical or game based stuff says or means at the end of the day is immaterial, the only thing that really matters are;

 

What are the CURRENT laws in the country you CURRENTLY live in, when dealing with this stuff, as those are the ones that can get you arrested and fined or imprisoned with.

[heehatatt]

arent there already ck2 mods that allow sex with children on loverslab?

[Madlad1312]

hmm let me think about that 

 

 

NO