SE and LE on one machine - how to set up?

[CaptainJ03]

Hi folks,

 

as you might see on my postings-count, I'm a veteran on LL - but on the LE side of things. With all those nice mods on SE and a Black Friday sale on steam, I've decided to buy the SE version too.

 

Now my daft question: how do I set it up so that the games don't conflict with each other? Is it enough to put it in different folders, say D:\games\LE and D:\games\SE ?

Of course I'll need another version of SKSE too. Can I just have two versions of that same program up and running?

What about Bodyslide? The LE version sits somewhere in the Data folder, I guess it'll be the same with SE. Assuming that there are different BS versions *sigh*

 

And are there recommendations to which version I should install, concerning SE/AE and the plethora of versions that seem to come out every week?

 

Body? Ist UUNP still supported or do I need to bear with CBBE?

 

TIA,

Joe.

[traison]

28 minutes ago, CaptainJ03 said:

I've decided to buy the SE version too.

 

This no longer exists. You can only buy Anniversay Edition.

 

28 minutes ago, CaptainJ03 said:

Now my daft question: how do I set it up so that the games don't conflict with each other? Is it enough to put it in different folders, say D:\games\LE and D:\games\SE ?

 

LE and SE/AE install into different directories by default. The tricky part here is protecting the LE version while installing the AE version. Considering you've managed to maintain an LE version up until now, you should already have a method for this.

 

28 minutes ago, CaptainJ03 said:

And are there recommendations to which version I should install, concerning SE/AE and the plethora of versions....

 

Generally I think the sentiment is that you install the newest 1.6.1170 when doing a new install. Personally however I would install 1.5.97, simply beacuse there seems to be issues with RaceMenu morphs on 1.6.* and those are kind of essential to me.

 

28 minutes ago, CaptainJ03 said:

...that seem to come out every week?

 

Regardless of which version you install, you will have to protect it from Steam as it will do its best to update that game and you will have no say in that. Setting the acf file to read-only is not enough, Steam has had a bypass for this for years at this point. This should also be something you already know, considering you have an LE install.

 

28 minutes ago, CaptainJ03 said:

Body? Ist UUNP still supported or do I need to bear with CBBE?

 

BHUNP, but considering 3BA (CBBE) can take the shape of a UNP body I'm not sure there's any point or reason to use anything other than 3BA.

 

Edited November 29, 2024 by traison

[samadara]

I played LE from 2011 to 2020 and after i changed to SE and now i play AE ( version 1.6.1170.0 ), just right klick your

SkyrimSE exe - options - details to see which game version is your SE.

 

BODYSLIDE works exactly the same.

UUNP is supported but the newest version is BHUNP

 

The most important on Skyrim SE-AE is that you dont need to configure the game memory 😉

 

Just forget the LE version, the game engine is too old.

As a veteran you will find your way in SE-AE very fast.

Just be sure the mods you install, that support your game version

and for more questions in the future, you can ask here, many of us will help you.

 

[Just Don't]

35 minutes ago, traison said:

This no longer exists. You can only buy Anniversay Edition.

You say this. But the game is still listed as Special Edition in Steam. Anniversary Edition is just the totally optional paid DLC. You wouldn't individually name each exe version as a separate game. I really don't understand this pushback for the more recent updates. It's an absolute cash grab for unaware players, but it's no different than any other update of any game really.

 

1 hour ago, CaptainJ03 said:

Now my daft question: how do I set it up so that the games don't conflict with each other? Is it enough to put it in different folders, say D:\games\LE and D:\games\SE ?

Of course I'll need another version of SKSE too. Can I just have two versions of that same program up and running?

What about Bodyslide? The LE version sits somewhere in the Data folder, I guess it'll be the same with SE. Assuming that there are different BS versions *sigh*

Different Steam install directories, different SKSE, different Bodyslide, different FNIS, different mods (for the most part). If you use Vortex/MO2 or any other mod manager you can manage each version with whichever you prefer.

 

1 hour ago, CaptainJ03 said:

And are there recommendations to which version I should install, concerning SE/AE and the plethora of versions that seem to come out every week?

It's not every week, latest update was back in January of this year. Usually SKSE and SKSE mods update within a few weeks after the official update is released. So if you follow the golden rule of avoiding automatic updates for any game you want to mod, you can start in the current version, stick to this version in the event of a new update and then once everything else is updated to support the newer version, update. Or stay in that old version for longer. Some people recommend 1.5.97 because it was the last update before all the AE stuff. I would only go for that version if I already have a modded game and don't want or can't update everything.

 

1 hour ago, CaptainJ03 said:

Body? Ist UUNP still supported or do I need to bear with CBBE?

CBBE 3BA or BHUNP are the most modern body options. Both have a bunch of sliders and you can do pretty much whatever you want with either. I wouldn't compare it to early releases of cbbe or unp at all.

 

edit: also check if you don't already own Skyrim SE. It was given for free to anyone owning Skyrim + the 3 DLC back in 2016.

Edited November 29, 2024 by Just Don't

[traison]

6 minutes ago, Just Don't said:

I really don't understand this pushback for the more recent updates.

 

The reason I'm anti-update in Skyrim stems from the fact that I absolutely hate auto-updates in general:

1. The server pushing the update can be compromized, essentially turning legitimate and safe software into involuntary trojan horses.
2. Systems can be built around software that require the it to act in a certain way. An update can be pushed at any moment, changing this and thus breaking all dependant software. As long as backwards compatibility is not guaranteed, updates are a risk.
3. Software can be deliberately made worse with updates. Games have a tendency to alter or remove content, or add gambling and other unwanted monetization elements: Helldivers 2, ...
4. Software can be deleted: The Crew, GTA 3, GTA:VC, GTA:SA, Warcraft 3, ...
5. If it ain't broken, don't fix it.

The way this applies to Skyrim, from my point of view, is:

1. Steam is a prime target for a breach like this considering their size.
2. I've worked on perfecting my Skyrim for a decade. Steam pushing updates just means I spend another year fixing the things that broke. You may be thinking "but pex scripts don't need any work, they work as-is", and yes you're probably right, however my modifications go far beyond scripts and plugins.
3. Creation Club, ads and paid mods in general.
4. I know people have swallowed the whole "you'll own nothing and you'll love it" stupidity, and I'm aware of what Steam essentially is: a video game renting company. However I am "old fashioned" in the sense that, what I purchase, I own. I have specifically made protections that ensure Steam is not deleting *my* games.
5. Nothing wrong with my perfect 1.5.97. Well maybe except for a few things. Some minor things. There's always something to change I guess. Crazy? I'm not crazy.

[MadMansGun]

44 minutes ago, traison said:

Regardless of which version you install, you will have to protect it from Steam

*unless gog version.

[traison]

2 minutes ago, MadMansGun said:

*unless gog version.

 

It's discounted too, -67%.

 

Soooo tempting. If I didn't already feel safe with the Steam version that would be a no-brainer.

[Just Don't]

12 minutes ago, traison said:

The reason I'm anti-update in Skyrim stems from the fact that I absolutely hate auto-updates in general:

And I agree with most of these. But saying that Skyrim Special Edition is no longer available isn't helpful when people literally find the game still listed under that name and AE is explicitly stated as a DLC in the same store. Also most of these points you make apply to any game.

 

And last time I checked not even GOG was safe because they didn't allowed access to old versions of the installers at some point (also it seems like that wasn't a platform wide policy and to be honest felt more like a marketing line). https://www.gog.com/forum/elder_scrolls_series/gog_i_want_to_downgrade_to_16659_where_can_i_get_the_installers

[ShivasBane]

I have both LE and SE 1.6.640 installed and have never had a problem although I refuse to let them update by setting Steam to only update on launch and setting each respective manifest to read only. I then use the script extender for each game to launch it. I always make sure that Steam is fully loaded and running before I launch the game. If you try to launch the script extender before Steam has fully loaded then Steam assumes you used the games launcher and will force an update. (That's how I ended up with SE 1.6.640). Another way to avoid updates is to put Steam in offline mode. I used to also disable my Lan card but after a while found that step was unnecessary. If you have the drive space consider doing a clean install then copying the game folder to another location so that you can just delete your install folder and copy it back from your archive if it gets messed up somehow. I have 2 Skyrim installs, 2 FO4 installs, one of which is now Fallout London, and 1 install of Starfield. Steam has been nagging about updating for months but has thus far been unable to. It's a bit of a pain but far less of a pain than having the game update and breaking a bunch of mods.

[CaptainJ03]

Thank you all for your responses!

 

13 hours ago, traison said:

This no longer exists. You can only buy Anniversay Edition.

It's promoted as SE on steam. Let's see what I'll get.

 

13 hours ago, traison said:

The tricky part here is protecting the LE version while installing the AE version. Considering you've managed to maintain an LE version up until now, you should already have a method for this.

That's easy: LE hasn't been updated for ages. Steam on the other hand checks for updates on every launch.

 

13 hours ago, Just Don't said:

Different Steam install directories, different SKSE, different Bodyslide, different FNIS, different mods (for the most part). If you use Vortex/MO2 or any other mod manager you can manage each version with whichever you prefer.

Good to know. I'm using Vortex. The one time I tried MO it didn't work.

 

13 hours ago, traison said:

I know people have swallowed the whole "you'll own nothing and you'll love it" stupidity, and I'm aware of what Steam essentially is: a video game renting company. However I am "old fashioned" in the sense that, what I purchase, I own. I have specifically made protections that ensure Steam is not deleting *my* games.

I like your way of thinking

 

11 hours ago, ShivasBane said:

If you try to launch the script extender before Steam has fully loaded then Steam assumes you used the games launcher and will force an update.

Uh, good to know, because that's how I usually start my game. Start SKSE, wait for steam and all the ads to load, close, restart.

 

13 hours ago, Just Don't said:

edit: also check if you don't already own Skyrim SE. It was given for free to anyone owning Skyrim + the 3 DLC back in 2016.

So that's why my daughter has it w/o buying (or even playing) and I don't. I've only bought the DLCs in 2020.

 

13 hours ago, traison said:

considering 3BA (CBBE) can take the shape of a UNP body I'm not sure there's any point or reason to use anything other than 3BA.

yes, that was my impression too, but I've never really followed SE content, so I'd rather ask than assume.

 

...now just wait for my daughter to finish downloading Baldur's Gate...

[belegost]

In terms of protecting SE from being updated by Steam, there are two methods:

 

First method:

• Set the game to Update on launch
• Always launch it from SKSE executable
• If an update is published and Steam will list the game with "Update needed" - ignore it.
• Keep using SKSE executable to launch the game

 

Pros: you can keep it perpetually in this state and have access to everything else you own on Steam

Cons: you will NEED to remember to start Steam before staring SKSE executable EVERY TIME. If you fail to do this, it will auto-start Steam and game's native launcher will be launched, thus triggering auto-update. An easy workaround this is to have Steam itself set to auto-start when you start your machine, but I understand not everyone wants that for variety of reasons (myself included)

Potential issues: no telling if Steam itself won't change something in its API in the future that pushes the update anyway.

 

Second method:

• Set steam to Offline mode
• (optional) Disconnect your machine from the Internet

 

Pros: you will not have to worry about forgetting to start Steam beforehand or launching from SKSE executable

Cons: no updates to anything else in your library. If optional is also on, any mods you want to install would have to be manually copied to this machine

Potential issues: I dunno.

 

I've used both methods when it was appropriate. It just works (tm)....

 

 

.....for now.

Edited November 30, 2024 by belegost

[KIKOU16]

Well explained belegost. I have to remember this when I install Steam again on a new machine : mandatory for LE version (sigh), and so I will see about 1.176 and so on...

 

Best advice for me is to stick to GOG version, but :

- it has its own specific tricks and limitations (some mods don't work like UI extensions), and I doubt if Vortex manages it well enough (I use MO2 very traditionally and it works)

- GOG makes updates too... You must now start with 1.179 version. Choosing the no-DRM install (otherwise the install through GOG Galaxy provides quite the same as Steam does) will protect your game for endless time, provided you keep a copy of downloaded files before installation. On my side I made copies of 1.359 and 1.659 so every re-installation on a new volume - I make a lot for testing - keeps all my previous build intact.

[KIKOU16]

6 hours ago, CaptainJ03 said:

That's easy: LE hasn't been updated for ages. Steam on the other hand checks for updates on every launch.

 

... and so LE can disappear one day forever. I frightens me as I love it soooo much. That's why I would like a DRM-free distribution of LE, which never happens.

 

6 hours ago, CaptainJ03 said:

I'm using Vortex. The one time I tried MO it didn't work.

 

Quite surprised that such an experienced guy can't get MO to work. MO2 can be quite tricky but after some work it runs without problem on every version, GOG included (the worst job).

 

On my side I admire that you prove able to run LE through Vortex. Vortex scares me to the bones. There can be some advantage using it, but I don't even dare to start it.

[CaptainJ03]

2 hours ago, KIKOU16 said:

Quite surprised that such an experienced guy can't get MO to work. MO2 can be quite tricky but after some work it runs without problem on every version,

It simply didn't do anything. I set it up, following the instructions, installed one mod, which simply didn't show up. Uninstalled, never looked back.

 

2 hours ago, KIKOU16 said:

On my side I admire that you prove able to run LE through Vortex. Vortex scares me to the bones.

I had been using TESM from good old Oblivion days, but that stopped working one day. I couldn't get DD5 (with 4 esps) to work, so I switched to Vortex. Most of the time it works, but from time to time it needs a kick in the shins with steel capped boots.

 

23 hours ago, traison said:

This no longer exists. You can only buy Anniversay Edition.

You were right *sigh* it just doesn't say anywhere. Only after installing, it says 1.6.1170 and has all that CC crap pre-installed, not removable, and not running, just using disk space.

[traison]

You can use the Steam Console or SteamCMD to download 1.5.97 (SE) directly from Steam. You can also use a downgrader from the Nexus. All options allow you to (optionally) keep the CC content while still running SE.

 

Depots and manifests here.

SteamCMD here.

 

As for which manifest is 1.5.97, that I can't remember. Its been mentioned several times before however so it shouldn't be difficult to dig up.

Edited December 2, 2024 by traison
Fixed version typo

[ghostwalkr]

Here's are the 1.5.97 depots and manifests (English)

 

depot 489831 -manifest 7848722008564294070

depot 489832 -manifest 8702665189575304780

depot 489833 -manifest 2289561010626853674

 

I got them from the following STEP forum thread HOWTO Reinstall Skyrim SE 1.5.97 if you don't have a backup

Edited November 30, 2024 by ghostwalkr

[belegost]

The downgrader from Nexus still works. You can have pure 1.5.97 without Creation Crap or Best of Both Worlds with stupid fishing and other shit but still 1.5.97 executable. Once you do downgrade,  follow what I said in previous post, else all will be for none.

 

One of the mandatory first installs should be BEES. Allows mods made in 1.7 to work on previous versions.

 

You will not have to worry about running out of plugin slots ever again. Welcome to the future.

Edited December 2, 2024 by belegost

[CaptainJ03]

How do I set the game to "update on load"? Couldn't find that setting, neither in Windows nor on Steam.

 

...and I've stayed wit 1.6.1170 - I had to make that decision even before installing the first mod (for the SKSE version), and it was just a gut decision. I think I've spent twelve hours or more modding this game, haven't even started playing, apart from testing stuff. I expect it'll take me another day or two.

[belegost]

3 hours ago, CaptainJ03 said:

How do I set the game to "update on load"?

 

Click me:

 

 

Also this, just in case:

 

Edited December 3, 2024 by belegost

[traison]

3 hours ago, CaptainJ03 said:

How do I set the game to "update on load"?

 

There's probably an option in the UI somewhere, but the way I do it is by editing the appmanifest file:

 

"AppState"
{
    ...
    "AutoUpdateBehavior"		"1"
    ...
}

 

Where 1 is OnLaunch and 2 is Auto (default).

 

Edit: There is a ninja among us.

 

Edited December 3, 2024 by traison

[belegost]

27 minutes ago, traison said:

There is a ninja among us

 

I wanted to post a funny picture in response, but all I got from google was some blue-haired idiot as first 10 suggestions.

Edited December 3, 2024 by belegost

[CaptainJ03]

2 hours ago, belegost said:

Click me:

Oh, thank you! I'd never thought to right-klick on that game!

 

2 hours ago, traison said:

Edit: There is a ninja among us.

Yes, I've seen him too!

 

Spoiler

 

[belegost]

31 minutes ago, CaptainJ03 said:

Oh, thank you! I'd never thought to right-klick on that game!

 

 

Where my like?

 

[CaptainJ03]

9 minutes ago, belegost said:

Where my like?

 

The Ninja stole it!!!

[belegost]

19 minutes ago, CaptainJ03 said:

 

The Ninja stole it!!!

That blue-haired bastard!