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Working on rewrite of The Milk Maid... opinions sought


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I'm working on a rewrite of The Milk Maid that I originally wrote for LE. Completely in CK for SE from scratch. Not trying to duplicate the original quest (which was a little long after you've done it from the beginning a hundred million times while testing), but still trying to write something for a female PC with a Milk Maid theme.

In the original, I relied heavily on SLIF, but had NiOverride calls if SLIF wasn't installed. Basically it was:

 

Function SomeBodyChange(Actor akActorRef)

If SLIF is installed do this stuff

   about 15 lines

   of code to handle

   body changes

Else do this stuff

   about 50 lines

   of code to try to

   do the body changes

   in increments like SLIF does

EndIf

   a few lines of code

   to tweak things

EndFunction

 

I've got the core written using NiOverride calls. Have not added in the SLIF stuff yet. My question is... is it worth it? I love using SLIF. It's in every one of my profiles in MO2. I like the control it gives you over exactly how things are... shaping up... shall we say. I'm just wondering how many people use SLIF and is it worth the time to get it in there. It requires a lot of tweaking to get the resulting changes to match as closely as possible between what SLIF does and what NiOverride does.

I tell people I write mods for ME and make them available in case others find them fun. If I was writing this solely for me I'd probably have written the SLIF parts first and either skipped the NiOverride fallback or minimized it. So it's there now.

 

What do you think? Should I write it to work both ways? Or should I call it good and move on to adding content?

Do enough people use SLIF for it to be worth the time it will take to not only stick the code in there (it's basically cut and paste at this point with some very minor editing), and then get things balanced? (the balancing part will take longer than the code writing part by a long shot)

 

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You need to fix the Milk Maid Quest when dudes end up milking with one another. Seems out of place. I did mention that bug earlier and you haven't fixed it. Referring to this. Sorry for nagging I love the mod but this bug is funny and a nuisance at the same time.

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Edited by SilentOption
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On 7/17/2022 at 8:57 PM, SilentOption said:

You need to fix the Milk Maid Quest when dudes end up milking with one another. Seems out of place. I did mention that bug earlier and you haven't fixed it. Referring to this. Sorry for nagging I love the mod but this bug is funny and a nuisance at the same time.

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And you need to understand that I've run through my mods hundreds and hundreds of times and I've never seen this happen. Not saying it isn't happening. It obviously is happening for you.  But if I can't reproduce it, I have to go through every dialogue and every scriptlet and every condition that applies to them looking for what MAY be causing it. I'm sure it's going to be something simple to fix, but I have to be able to track it down. And, frankly, I have a lot on my plate right now that keeps me from getting into the mods very much.

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11 hours ago, chajapa said:

And you need to understand that I've run through my mods hundreds and hundreds of times and I've never seen this happen. Not saying it isn't happening. It obviously is happening for you.  But if I can't reproduce it, I have to go through every dialogue and every scriptlet and every condition that applies to them looking for what MAY be causing it. I'm sure it's going to be something simple to fix, but I have to be able to track it down. And, frankly, I have a lot on my plate right now that keeps me from getting into the mods very much.

I'm guessing that khajiit is Inigo? I've noticed sex mods often mistake him for female even thought I've made sure he is marked as male in all mods that require it.

It might not be just Inigo either, maybe all male khajiits?

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I will say that SLIF is very important to my load order as well. And it is not just to have one mod in control of all the morphs, but also to be in control of how those morphs are applied (which nodes) and by how much (which scale).

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5 hours ago, Fredfish said:

I'm guessing that khajiit is Inigo? I've noticed sex mods often mistake him for female even thought I've made sure he is marked as male in all mods that require it.

It might not be just Inigo either, maybe all male khajiits?

Hmmm... well I've never installed Inigo, nor have I had a male Khajiit follower. Something else to look at I guess.

 

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23 hours ago, chajapa said:

And you need to understand that I've run through my mods hundreds and hundreds of times and I've never seen this happen. Not saying it isn't happening. It obviously is happening for you.  But if I can't reproduce it, I have to go through every dialogue and every scriptlet and every condition that applies to them looking for what MAY be causing it. I'm sure it's going to be something simple to fix, but I have to be able to track it down. And, frankly, I have a lot on my plate right now that keeps me from getting into the mods very much.

take your time

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Progress so far...

This is being written for a female player character. Follower interaction is for a female follower. I have not yet written anything for a male follower.

 

The mod starts on a location change event. In other words, you install it, go into your game, the quest doesn't start until you change location.

You're still not a milkmaid. You need to speak to an NPC. "Excuse me, do you have a minute?"

 

The backstory is that your mother was a milk maid and you have inherited her ... ability... and are now blossoming into your inherited "gift". Your transformation begins shortly after that first conversation ends.

 

A female follower can be turned into a milk maid.

A female NPC can be turned into a cow. Cows don't get horns or spots or anything. They're just women who produce milk. Of course their breasts are changed to reflect their new role as milkers. And their hips widen to entice males because it seems they produce better when they get a good load shot into them. And they're happy to be cows.

 

NPC interaction:

All interaction between NPCs and almost (but not quite) all interaction between a female follower and NPCs is handled by the in-game story manager. It's driven by Actor Dialogue Events much like conversation between NPCs in a market area or random conversations basically everywhere. In order for a dialogue event to fire, there has to first be a Hello Event. One NPC basically acknowledges another and there's a percent roll to see if this acknowledgment will result in a dialogue event. The default in-game chance of that happening is 25%. You can increase that chance using a console command : set hellopercentchance to 90 .... would change it to 90%

Children make child-appropriate comments to the player who is a milkmaid and the female follower who is a milkmaid and also talk ABOUT the milkmaid they've seen to other children. This is handled by a different system that handles Hellos to the player. More on that in a minute.

 

One of the comments I got... or get... about my mods is that they can be intrusive. Being yanked into a scene repeatedly makes is hard to get other stuff done. So...

There are 3 Global Variables (at this point) to control how much or how little intrusion occurs.

 

KidsCommentChance - default is 15 (or 15% chance) and there's a random roll in order for their comments/interactions to occur that has to be below that 15%

Kids are chatty and intrusive at times. Skyrim kids are no different.  You can raise, lower, or even shut them up. Set KidsCommentChance to <whatever value you want 0-100>

Setting that to 0 basically makes it impossible for their comments to happen. 

 

MM2HelloPercentChance - default is 90. This really only comes into play if you've allowed it by either, telling your follower you'd be up for some random milking, OR told her you'd be up for a good fucking, OR you've told her there should be more cows. Those 3 things can be active in any combination. Just one, any 2, or all of them. With a female follower you can turn on milking and/or sex just for followers and you can separately turn those on for yourself. If you turn on making cows, both the follower and the milkmaid can be approached by female NPCs and the follower will sometimes initiate the conversation with a female NPC. You'll find these options in dialogue with your follower. ("Lets talk about our activity" and "Lets talk about cows"). You can adjust this with: Set MM2HelloPercentChance to <whatever value between 0-100>

 

MM2PassiveCommentsChance - default is 15. Non-intrusive. Make and female NPCs may comment about your magnificent rack, but they don't stop you from doing whatever else you're doing. I don't recommend a higher setting as it also affects what happens when you simply try to talk to an NPC. As long as the random roll comes up less than 15% they may just comment on your tits until they run through the random comments. Again... set MM2PassiveCommentsChance to <whatever value you want 0-100>

 

Quest variables and factions and how they affect things:

Quest variable HelloME is either 0 (off) or 1 (on). It is on by default. My goal is to make that like a master switch for anything that would interrupt the player.

Quest variable MakeCows is either 0 (off) or 1 (on). Default is off.

Quest variables are adjusted in console differently than Global variables. You use setPQV (set player quest variable) like this:

setPQV <quest> <variable> <value> so as an example : setPQV MM2_MainQuest MakeCows 1 .....would turn on making cows.

 

Factions:

MM2Milkable - you need to be in that faction to be a valid target for random milking

MM2Fillable - you need to be in that faction to be a valid target for random sex

Manually setting the quest variables and factions is really only necessary if you don't have a female follower to talk to as these all get handled through dialogue.  

 

So that's as far as I've gotten to date. Oh, and I implemented SLIF for those that have it with NIOverride fallback for those that don't. There are still a couple of things done with NiOverride whether you have SLIF or not and I'm still not sure how CBBE bodies will react to that. I use BHUNP.

I'm out of town until next week so no more work on this until then, but that's where it stands right now.

 

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I'd prefer it without SLIF. I'd like to try Milk Maid and other related mods without the body change stuff, just for the "humiliation roleplay" aspect of the thing and the cool devices.

I'm just not sure if NiOverride causes script lag. We need mods with as light script as possible, considering how script heavy some mods here are.

 

Hope it helps you to decide. I'm not a modder neither a coder, so I don't know how hard those things are, this is just my vision as an user.

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On 7/27/2022 at 4:46 PM, Dervecna said:

I'd prefer it without SLIF. I'd like to try Milk Maid and other related mods without the body change stuff, just for the "humiliation roleplay" aspect of the thing and the cool devices.

I'm just not sure if NiOverride causes script lag. We need mods with as light script as possible, considering how script heavy some mods here are.

 

Hope it helps you to decide. I'm not a modder neither a coder, so I don't know how hard those things are, this is just my vision as an user.

 

 

Ah, Milk mod economy already comes with options to disable physical changes to characters.

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  • 2 weeks later...

I liked almost Everything about your Original "Milk Maid" mod, except:

1. Having women approach, whom then you have no choice but to make into milk maids.

2. Having to turn off Comments in MME to try to prevent this, (still got it some times)

3. The nude suit that TMM added making it very difficult to convince your Maids to ever wear clothing again. (Immersion breaking when you and your followers are periodically    forced to make new maids.)

 

I like the males approach for milk or sex, including the flirting and posing that goes with it.

Definitely liked being able to choose your availability.

Would love to see a voiced version using the new Voice synth tech.

I also liked being able to use SLIF to undo the TMM body changes, if they didn't fit the character.

 

Thank you. I am looking forward to this mod.

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16 hours ago, wulfhybrid said:

I liked almost Everything about your Original "Milk Maid" mod, except:

1. Having women approach, whom then you have no choice but to make into milk maids.

2. Having to turn off Comments in MME to try to prevent this, (still got it some times)

3. The nude suit that TMM added making it very difficult to convince your Maids to ever wear clothing again. (Immersion breaking when you and your followers are periodically    forced to make new maids.)

 

I like the males approach for milk or sex, including the flirting and posing that goes with it.

Definitely liked being able to choose your availability.

Would love to see a voiced version using the new Voice synth tech.

I also liked being able to use SLIF to undo the TMM body changes, if they didn't fit the character.

 

Thank you. I am looking forward to this mod.

I appreciate your comments. Milk Maid 2 (MM2) has more control over approaches that require the player to be interrupted. The original Milk Maid mod relied heavily on the NPCCommentsChance from MME. A female follower may carry on soliciting a good milking (or sex) and/or being solicited, but the player is separate. Milking and sex are controlled separately so you can have one without the other for followers and also for PC. There are also what I'm calling "passive comments" which are comments made by NPCs that are just comments with no further action.
TMM didn't add a nude suit actually. It set the default outfit to an empty outfit containing no clothes. In MM2 the follower will unequip everything, but it won't be removed. If you do absolutely nothing after a follower becomes a milkmaid and is naked, when you change cells, they'll be in their default outfit. I also use Nether's Follower Framework to give them outfits for standard wear, or in a town. With MM2 I have been able to equip someone that had their outfit set to an empty outfit and they keep that equipment after leaving the cell and returning.

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 8/13/2022 at 8:21 AM, chajapa said:

I appreciate your comments. Milk Maid 2 (MM2) has more control over approaches that require the player to be interrupted. The original Milk Maid mod relied heavily on the NPCCommentsChance from MME. A female follower may carry on soliciting a good milking (or sex) and/or being solicited, but the player is separate. Milking and sex are controlled separately so you can have one without the other for followers and also for PC. There are also what I'm calling "passive comments" which are comments made by NPCs that are just comments with no further action.
TMM didn't add a nude suit actually. It set the default outfit to an empty outfit containing no clothes. In MM2 the follower will unequip everything, but it won't be removed. If you do absolutely nothing after a follower becomes a milkmaid and is naked, when you change cells, they'll be in their default outfit. I also use Nether's Follower Framework to give them outfits for standard wear, or in a town. With MM2 I have been able to equip someone that had their outfit set to an empty outfit and they keep that equipment after leaving the cell and returning.

MM2 sounds Excellent! I'm looking forward to it.

If TMM isn't using a nude suit, How can I change their default outfit back from empty? They refuse to put on any clothes I put in their inventory. Is there a Console Command?

(I've been using BBLS's "About your outfit" function, but adding all those assigned outfits bloats my save."

By the way, I'm still using JUGs with TMM, because I really like some of the more detailed dialogue it contains. I'd love to see it in MM2.

Thanks again for the great work. Waiting with Thirst.

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On 8/29/2022 at 1:01 PM, wulfhybrid said:

MM2 sounds Excellent! I'm looking forward to it.

If TMM isn't using a nude suit, How can I change their default outfit back from empty? They refuse to put on any clothes I put in their inventory. Is there a Console Command?

(I've been using BBLS's "About your outfit" function, but adding all those assigned outfits bloats my save."

By the way, I'm still using JUGs with TMM, because I really like some of the more detailed dialogue it contains. I'd love to see it in MM2.

Thanks again for the great work. Waiting with Thirst.

TMM doesn't use a nude suit. It sets their default outfit to an empty outfit that has nothing in it. I use Nether's Follower Framework and use that to dress up my girls. For NPCs that have been made into cows or milk maids that are not following, I use console ... equipitem.ID-of-Item with the NPC targeted.
I haven't looked at JUGs in a very long time. If I get a chance I'll open it up and have a look at the dialogue and see if there's something there I can pull over.

 

Right now though... I just spent $2,000 at the veterinarian for one of my dogs and she may die anyways, my wife's brother was found dead in his living room (natural causes) and I've somehow been volunteered to take care of his 13 year old diabetic cat that needs insulin shots twice a day. Lots going on. Not much time for modding.

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 8/30/2022 at 8:25 PM, chajapa said:

TMM doesn't use a nude suit. It sets their default outfit to an empty outfit that has nothing in it. I use Nether's Follower Framework and use that to dress up my girls. For NPCs that have been made into cows or milk maids that are not following, I use console ... equipitem.ID-of-Item with the NPC targeted.
I haven't looked at JUGs in a very long time. If I get a chance I'll open it up and have a look at the dialogue and see if there's something there I can pull over.

 

Right now though... I just spent $2,000 at the veterinarian for one of my dogs and she may die anyways, my wife's brother was found dead in his living room (natural causes) and I've somehow been volunteered to take care of his 13 year old diabetic cat that needs insulin shots twice a day. Lots going on. Not much time for modding.

 

take your time with the mod... It will be great by the end.,

Edited by SilentOption
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8 hours ago, Anunya said:

Personally I've never gotten around to install SLIF successfully. If you redo this mod to require SLIF it may be what pushes me over the edge to try to install it... but so far I've been doing okay without it.

It's not really going to be a requirement. At least not at this point. But the expansion transitions and body changes are much nicer when using SLIF. It's also a lot easier for ME. As it is right now I write for SLIF and then also for no SLIF. It also gives you more control as a user. If you think my "adjustments" are too much or too little, you can adjust them to your liking within SLIF. And you can control not just size, but shape. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

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