I don't like New Vegas. Help?

[polluxval]

i never said fallout 3 had a master mind story background. but atleast the very beggining its more interesting than NV. we can argue all day, but still i think fallout 3 was better in many ways. NV has too many bugs in the story wich u can brake very easily. and do not mention mods to fix that, becouse im talking about console versions. the DLCs seems nice but the main game its the one that we are interested in. taking apart the "factions" everybody its talking about, fallout NV seems empty and very bad designed. i didnt find any interesting place to explore other than vaults wich was classic in fallout 3. and please dont tell me the story make u cry becouse its one of the dullest i ever see. "a carrier wich somehow transforms himself into a killing machine from day to night"

[joesims]

"a carrier wich somehow transforms himself into a killing machine from day to night"

 

I find it incredibly hard to believe that the Courier, someone who makes a living WALKING ALONE over vast distances making deliveries from town to town, wouldn't already have some form of advanced weapons training.

 

He might not be ranger worthy with the weapons, but it would be impossibly unreasonable to assume that he wasn't already a pretty damn good shot. With how dangerous the entire world is you think he just moseys out into the wastes by himself with no way of defending himself with Raiders, gangers, Legion, slavers, Deathclaws and other rapid animals out there?

 

Yeah it's a little hard to believe that he alone essentially turns the tide of the entire Mohave, but aren't the feats of nearly every video game/movie character always against insurmountable odds?

 

For instance, are we really supposed to believe that the Galactic Empire really left a tiny loophole to destroy their massive, advanced battle station using just a small fighter on TWO separate occasions? And then that small creatures resembling teddy bears are able to overwhelm their military forces in high tech walking death machines using only their grit, determination, and a few trees?

 

Maybe a bad example, but hopefully you get the point.

 

Either way, I thought the factions were a pretty good way to do things. It gave various stories and ways to finish the game. You could befriend, and gather forces to aid in the final battle. I know for one, I had a pretty decent team including Enclave Remnants, the Boomer's bomber, Brotherhood of Steel Forces, and the NCR military all defending the Dam from Caesar's Legion in the end. When you think that a lot of those folks in the Legion are running around with spears against forces with automatic rifles, laser weapons, explosives, and Vertibirds, it wasn't just the Courier alone doing everything.

 

I will agree with other people that yes, New Vegas did lack the feeling of post apocalyptia that Fallout 3 had. I really did miss that (and found it baffling that Vegas was essentially a pigsty that I had to download mods to clean up).

 

Also to another point, is it any harder to believe that the Courier becomes a "death machine" than the Lone Wanderer? I mean, the Courier presumably grew up in the cruel reality of the post war world. The Lone Wanderer was a 19 year old kid who had just left a vault where he had lived since shortly after birth. He leaves in search of his dad into the Capital Wasteland and becomes just as much of a death machine. It's like a light switch that way. Some people have it, others don't. And those that don't, are the people you find named Beru and Owen, burned to death near the town hall of Nipton.

[gregathit]

Joesims, very eloquent post!

 

As to Beru and Owens fate.....well add the legionnaires with their dogs to that....

 

(mutters....if they didn't want to be charbroiled they shouldn't have gone and given me the idea by burning everything in site......)

[hinugundam]

Compare to the First 2 game of the series, courier is actually under-toned compared to the earlier protagonists.

 

In fallout, The Vault Dweller single handily defeated the Master and his army.

In fallout 2, The Chosen One again single handily defeated the Enclave by blowing up their main operation base.

While in FONV, the courier is only noticeable because he/she was picked by Mr.house as his agent, and all other faction want Mr.house off the picture. And you only won the war by playing the main faction against each other, and in case of independent Vegas, your securitrons.

[polluxval]

joesims

 

i think u dont get my point. so, what was doing the courier before he get the shot in the head? how is that he didnt get any powerfull before that incident. also, there is no background. i know what everybody will say: "u can imagine and get the background u want". but i see it like a lack of imagination from the creators of the game. it could be interesting to find some tips from ur past or something like that. also, if someone can be that cool... why the hell he just became a courier??. he could be a soldier if he wanted to. maybe a legionare or an elite ranger or something like that. also, none of the factions DO NOTHING if you dont participate and make a hundred of quests for them. but im tired of this, we are getting to nowhere. ill stand my ideals and opinions till the end. in NV they had the chance to fix some errors they left in fallout 3, so u can easily say NV its better. and for godsake, i visited LAS VEGAS twice, i get in love with the city and once saw NEW VEGAS in the game, i hated the game and developers. they really could done a better job.

 

also, im sorry if im not very "elocuent". english its not my native language and i did learned by myself. but i can write a very elocuent post in spanish if you like. writing in english its very tiresome for me.

[Guest Loogie]

If you know many soldiers in real life, and if you take a look at the soldiers in the NCR, it's really a thankless, boring job when you're not getting shot at. And it would be a terrible career for someone with an independent streak like the Courier.

 

It really isn't possible to claim that Fallout 3 had a superior story to New Vegas, given the giant plotholes. Sure, there's some fridge logic to NV, but the thing hangs together much better than, "I lived a sheltered life for 19 years, then I barged into a post-apocalyptic wasteland in an overwhelming desire to hug my traitor dad and became the ultimate killing machine. Oh by the way, I killed the remnants of the US government for the lols despite the fact they were wearing power armor and had energy weapons because I'm so badass, yeah!"

[polluxval]

maybe ur dad changed ur genetics while u were a baby to bacame the ultimate destruction weapon?

 

also, the courier still could became a ranger. they have a lot of action, if not, they couldnt become veterans with that cool suit.

[Guest Loogie]

While the Courier probably would have made a badass ranger, I got the impression that they're from north of Legion territory from the tidbits I picked up and from Lonesome Road.

 

Also, if you side with the NCR you're pretty much taking the role of a lone NCR ranger, much like when you're working for Caesar's Legion you're fitting the job description of a frumentarii.

[polluxval]

i would like to see a fallout 4 with an encounter of the courier and the lone wanderer.

[joesims]

@polluxval: I'm sorry if you thought my post was calling you out specifically or demeaning your opinions. That wasn't my intention, and your writing is just fine for English being a second language. I respect your opinion, of course. I love Fallout 3. I'm in the process of another playthrough currently.

 

Also, to your point about not knowing anything about the Courier's past, that is fair. We don't really know what he's doing. From some dialogue with Cass, it seems that being a courier in the post war world is a pretty swell gig. For one, the caps seem to be pretty good, and if adventure is your thing, why not become a courier and get to travel around from place to place, delivering packages. Also, based on a potential dialogue option that a male Courier can have with the Lonesome Drifter, it doesn't seem like the Courier is too keen on settling down with a family, so roaming from place to place might seem like a slice of heaven for his type.

 

The fact of the matter is that basically any character from movies or video games is always beefed up to accomplish extraordinary feats against impossible odds, like I said in my previous post.

 

John McClane, from the movie Die Hard (I only like the first one so that's my example this time around), is a New York City police detective. Yet, he alone stops a band of international bandits. That would be pretty impossible in real life.

 

If you've ever seen the television series, Stargate SG-1, a group of three pals from Earth and their unlikely alien ally set out into the galaxy with next to no advanced technology and yet they alone wipe out a centuries old galactic regime of alien slavers.

 

Solid Snake, from the gaming series Metal Gear Solid, alone goes into sneaking missions. He alone takes down numerous, paranormally enhanced super villains, and then on foot usually with just a rocket launcher destroys massive bipedal war machines that could crush him in half a second if they had a capable pilot (I'm looking at YOU Liquid Snake.) Not to mention the mess that was MGS4 where his genetic makeup, being a clone and all, is breaking down and he's prematurely aged to about 60 and still kicks more ass than your average strapping space marine from any number of games on the market.

 

Anything Master Chief has ever done in the Halo gaming franchise is FAR beyond impossible.

 

That's just for the sake of the main character for story purposes, and I'm not sure why you are calling out only New Vegas on it. That's something that's been going on for as long as story telling has existed. You want to root for the main character, and people love it when they overcome tear-inducing odds and save the day.

 

But regardless, I've said my piece. I don't want you to take offense from anything I've said. Despite it's flaws, I think Fallout 3 is still a great game, I'm just trying to understand more what it is you don't like about New Vegas, since I think it's a great addition to the series.

[Daguy]

Loogie, i'm curious, what makes you say that Bethesda are 'no-talent hacks'? I think thats a little extreme, especially considering we are all still playing their game six years after its release, whether for the mods or not. (Or, at least some of us are. I'm unsure if you are NV-only these days). Personally I think they are one of the few game developers that are still passionate at what they do, and good at it. Watching the 'Making of Oblivion' its obvious that they are passionate and wanted to make a great game. I feel they did, but thats a matter of opinion I suppose.

 

I watched the New Vegas, and frankly i've seen more passion at a funeral. they said all the right things, but the staff were clearly just 'at work'. And I can feel that in the game. I still feel like NV should be my favorite game on my Steam list, but much like other Obsidian product t just lacks spirit. And feels incomplete. Soooo many boarded up or just plain scenery-onry doors. I don't see much point on debating Bethesda, since we obviously just have differing views and thats cool, I just notice you have an almost amazing amount of bile for them and wonder where it orignally started. I've personally enjoyed every game they have released, though as I mentoned in another thread it did take me time to warm up to FO3. I'm not attacking you, I just honestly can't understand it.

 

And to be fair that summary of Fallout 3 was pretty bad, hopefully on purpose since i'd hate to think you were judging the story without looking into your gripes first. Reading your posts, that doesn't seem like you. There are in-story reasons for the story problems you state, take a closer look at Autumn before he passes out if you ever play the game again. When it comes to the nineteen-year-old killing power armored foes, bear in mind that your first encounter is set up with the intent you *run* and not fight. After that, you can be in power armor yourself. The skill difference is no different to any sort of story where a lone main character takes on a trained military force.

 

I'll certainly agree that their first step into Fallout was far from perfect, however. The Elder Scrolls though I feel is pretty damn awesome, if only for the Lore. The depth of it gives most long-running fantasy series' a run for their money, and its mostly stuffed into the ingame books. The general story has been buidling up to Skyrim since Daggerfall at least, with Nirn's defences being taken down one by one, and then the pact with Akatosh/Alduin broken by the destruction of the AoK. Have their been misteps? Sure, but I appreciate what is there and think the games are well worth their cost, and are my number one series to follow.

 

[Guest Loogie]

Loogie' date=' i'm curious, what makes you say that Bethesda are 'no-talent hacks'?[/quote']

 

The inability to create a coherent story or a logically laid out world space, for starters. The fact they're ruining the integrity of their own RPG franchise after running their founder and its creator out on a rail, to replace him with Todd Howard, whose only experience is racing games and first person shooters. Todd Howard, who considers Modern Warfare to have RPG elements. He's in charge of turning Skyrim into the console shooter/brawler it's going to be, and I hate to see what he plans for Fallout 4.

 

I think thats a little extreme, especially considering we are all still playing their game six years after its release, whether for the mods or not.

 

I never played Oblivion prior to learning about Lovers mods. All playing Oblivion has done is convince me that Fallout 3 never had a chance to be a good game - without the sex mods, Oblivion is garbage and plagued with most of the same problems as their Fallout.

 

Personally I think they are one of the few game developers that are still passionate at what they do, and good at it. Watching the 'Making of Oblivion' its obvious that they are passionate and wanted to make a great game. I feel they did, but thats a matter of opinion I suppose.

 

They don't want to make great games - they want to make superficial games that appear deep at first glance to appeal to as many people as possible in order to rake in huge stacks of cash. Most people I know in real life who have bought Bethesda games feel like they were misled by the advertising hype. At best, they thought Bethesda products were fun but forgettable. I have a friend who was a big fan of Fallout 3, and now that I've introduced her to the originals and New Vegas, she now despises Fallout 3.

 

I watched the New Vegas, and frankly i've seen more passion at a funeral. they said all the right things, but the staff were clearly just 'at work'. And I can feel that in the game. I still feel like NV should be my favorite game on my Steam list, but much like other Obsidian product t just lacks spirit. And feels incomplete. Soooo many boarded up or just plain scenery-onry doors. I don't see much point on debating Bethesda, since we obviously just have differing views and thats cool, I just notice you have an almost amazing amount of bile for them and wonder where it orignally started. I've personally enjoyed every game they have released, though as I mentoned in another thread it did take me time to warm up to FO3. I'm not attacking you, I just honestly can't understand it.

 

Tomorrow, when I'm not so tired, I'll make a list of everything that makes New Vegas a Fallout game and everything that made Fallout 3 an incoherent corporate cash-grab. Fallout has never been about exploring every corner of a map so you can shotgun mutants in the face and has always been about deep, interactive stories.

 

And to be fair that summary of Fallout 3 was pretty bad, hopefully on purpose since i'd hate to think you were judging the story without looking into your gripes first. Reading your posts, that doesn't seem like you. There are in-story reasons for the story problems you state, take a closer look at Autumn before he passes out if you ever play the game again. When it comes to the nineteen-year-old killing power armored foes, bear in mind that your first encounter is set up with the intent you *run* and not fight. After that, you can be in power armor yourself. The skill difference is no different to any sort of story where a lone main character takes on a trained military force.

 

All you see in that chamber is Autumn dying. My contention is, in a well-written game, which is what Fallout is supposed to be, you wouldn't have a cop-out, one-dimensional enemy who have no choice but to fight. Also, every single major plot point in Fallout 3 was lifted directly from Fallout 1 or 2 and shoe-horned into the purifier arc. You could feel the desperation in that maneuver, in addition to adding the Brotherhood and super mutants, to make the game appeal to old time fans. The poor handling of these things just made old time fans convinced Bethesda lacks imagination.

 

I'll certainly agree that their first step into Fallout was far from perfect, however.

 

They're first step into Fallout was Oblivion with guns. I don't know if you've ever had a piece of art that changed your world view and made you a better person literally shat on before your eyes, but with the release of Fallout 3, I did. Now that Tim Cain, the original creator of Fallout, has joined Obsidian, Bethesda, if they actually gave a fuck about creating great games - which they do not - would make Obsidian Zenimax's Fallout studio kind of like how Bungie was made Microsoft's Halo studio.

 

But, I'm more optimistic than that. When someone asked Chris Avellone, years ago, what his advice to someone looking to make a Fallout sequel would be, his answer was, "Don't do it. Make something better." Fallout was created because Tim Cain couldn't get the license to Wasteland; then, they created SPECIAL because they couldn't get the GURPS license. Hopefully Tim Cain and his coworkers from Black Isle that are now at Obsidian will go ahead and make something even better than Fallout.

[ElvenScoundrel]

Daguy, if you haven't played Morrowind, DO IT NOW. That's when Bethesda was at the top of their game. Morrowind is unlike ANYTHING out there. It has good writing, actual RPG mechanics, a very alien and fleshed out world, etc. Also facial hair.

 

Oblivion is SO watered down, especially when you put it side by side with Arena, Daggerfall or Morrowind, you have to wonder if they were thinking straight. They promised a LOT of things in Oblivion, and none got through. You have a game so horribly unbalanced, that if you don't build your character correctly, you will be overpowered by BEARS. And WIll-o-Wisps. And Daedra.

 

Not to mention they broke lore and made the Cyrodiil a boring, generic province. Where's the Roman influence in the Imperials? What's up with the Mer having the same shitty voice? When you play Morrowind and you hear those Dunmer with their badass raspy voice and insulting you in their own language, and then you get to Oblivion and they're all wimpy fucks, you know they didn't do the game justice.

 

I can't believe everyone's looking forward to Skyrim. The game has LESS stuff than Oblivion. Morrowind had throwing knives, darts, shurikens, crossbows, spears, staves that you could whack people with, medium armor, shoulder armor that was detached from the torso piece, different ways to attack, more skills...

 

People still shouted about wanting MORE stuff in Skyrim. I must admit, I dislike how Oblivion, and Fallout by extension, has become Second Life with shooter elements. But making your character YOUR character is a big thing about Bethesda games, and their equipment is a reflection of their personality. When you remove some of that element, it becomes stale.

[Daguy]

@Loogie: Thanks, I disagree with nost of your feelings on Oblivion and TES, but I doubt thats going to change. No biggie. At least now I know. =D

 

 

Daguy' date=' if you haven't played Morrowind, DO IT NOW. That's when Bethesda was at the top of their game. Morrowind is unlike ANYTHING out there. It has good writing, actual RPG mechanics, a very alien and fleshed out world, etc. Also facial hair.[/quote']

 

Why does everyone always assume that if you like Oblivion, you haven't played the holy relic they feel is Morrowind? =P

 

I've actually played through the whole series. And in the end, I prefer to play Oblivion. I loved the story of Morrowind and the setting was facinating, however it was a chore to play for me due to the gameplay and graphics. They looked bad even for their time. Texture/Graphic mods have fixed that, but the clunky gameplay and limited interaction with the world stop me from becoming as immersed in the game as with Oblivion.

 

 

Oblivion is SO watered down' date=' especially when you put it side by side with Arena, Daggerfall or Morrowind, you have to wonder if they were thinking straight. They promised a LOT of things in Oblivion, and none got through. You have a game so horribly unbalanced, that if you don't build your character correctly, you will be overpowered by BEARS. And WIll-o-Wisps. And Daedra.[/quote']

 

Arena was okay, but I'd personally hardly call it a contender with Oblivion, Daggerfall, and Morrowind. It was the first game and it shows. I agree that certain things were watered down, but a lot of that actually happened between Daggerfall and Morrowind. I felt that Daggerfalls combat was practically perfect with its combat, magic, and books. However, the world was utterly empty aside from repeatable quests, artifacts and the MQ.

 

I liked Morrowind but honestly, I feelt hat if you paired off its story and feel with the gameplay of Oblivion, it would be clsoe to the perfect game in my opinion.

 

The levelled combat system was by biggest gripe with the game, and even Bethesda have acknowledged that fact and fixed it for Skyrim, supposedly. Only time will tell.

 

 

Not to mention they broke lore and made the Cyrodiil a boring' date=' generic province. Where's the Roman influence in the Imperials? What's up with the Mer having the same shitty voice? When you play Morrowind and you hear those Dunmer with their badass raspy voice and insulting you in their own language, and then you get to Oblivion and they're all wimpy fucks, you know they didn't do the game justice.[/quote']

 

 

I miss the Dunmer voices, and the lore 'breaks' were annoying, however they have retconned the province whether was a good choice or not. They are the designer, sadly they can write and rewrite lore to their hearts content. However none of this ruined the game for me, because it is still TES, the same themes and story is still there, and you have sixteen square miles of beautifully created alnd to explore, and still facinating quests to take part in.

 

The quests are the big things for me I think. While I love Morrowinds MQ, the guilds let me down. However, I loved each guild questline in Oblivion. The Shivering Isles in my view also beat the crap out of Bloodmoon as far as epicness went.

 

 

I can't believe everyone's looking forward to Skyrim. The game has LESS stuff than Oblivion. Morrowind had throwing knives' date=' darts, shurikens, crossbows, spears, staves that you could whack people with, medium armor, shoulder armor that was detached from the torso piece, different ways to attack, more skills...[/quote']

 

They have streamlined more, but overall the game potentially has more actual content. Beleive it or not, they seem to have listened to peoples complaints about Oblivion, and took the best of both games. We won't know til release of course, but thats the feel i've been getting. I'm greatly looking forwards to Skyrim, but i'm not going to judge it as great before it comes out.

 

 

People still shouted about wanting MORE stuff in Skyrim. I must admit' date=' I dislike how Oblivion, and Fallout by extension, has become Second Life with shooter elements. But making your character YOUR character is a big thing about Bethesda games, and their equipment is a reflection of their personality. When you remove some of that element, it becomes stale.

[/quote']

 

Heh, if you mean by the virtual world and interaction with it, then I think that is were the divide is. I LOVE that about TES and FO3. Infact, they are the reason I play the games. They give me a base to roleplay and interact with a fully realised fantasy world that no table-top or irc roleplay ever could.

 

From what i've been reading, yes they merged body and lowerbody armor, but they have actually added much more armor to the game this time around. It was also for a reason; so they could get more NPCs on screen, so you don't have another Nerevarine charging up Red Mountain solo after working his ass off to become War-Leader of all Morrowind, or another Battle of Bruma with the Grand Army of Ten Guys.

 

 

[polluxval]

fallout 3 own just by having Liam Neeson voice acting.

[ElvenScoundrel]

pollux, I give you that. As a heterosexual male, I think Liam's voice is fucking divine. Chief Hanlon's voice is pretty badass too.

[Guest Loogie]

Of course Chief Hanlon's voice is awesome. He's voiced by Kris fucking Kristoferson!

[Dreamer102]

also' date=' im sorry if im not very "elocuent". english its not my native language and i did learned by myself. but i can write a very elocuent post in spanish if you like. writing in english its very tiresome for me.

[/quote']

 

1. Your english is better than many people who are born in the United States.

 

2. For having learned English yourself, you have done remarkably well.

 

 

[Dreamer102]

Grrr..

 

Typical "Bethesda" game lifespan. All their games work okay until you get to level 7-8 of your character, then the whole f'n thing corrupts and you have to start all over again.

 

This must be their sick dememted twisted idea of "replayability"...

You never get to the end of the damned game because you have to reinstall every month.

 

Once my install corrupts I'm going to delete and move on to another game.

 

I only loaded FONV because my Oblivion install corrupted.

When the FONV install corrupts I'm loading up "Bionic Commando 2010"

 

I'm so sick of Bethesda crap-games. If it wasn't for xLovers I wouldn't even bother with their $#!+ coded games.

 

 

EDIT: And no...I will NOT be buying "Skyrim"....Bethesda can get on all fours and lick my brown skyRIM for all I care!

[iron_jack]

Dreamer: are you quick-saving a lot? I hear that can give your game a case of the blow-uppies.

[Chase Roxand]

Am I the only one who's never had a save corrupt? I save all the time. Normal saves, autosaves, quicksaves. Oblivion, Fallout 3, and New Vegas. Not a single save issue that wasn't directly related to mods.

[Guest Donkey]

Save game corruption seem to be system dependent, and is different for everyone. some can play forever while others getting constant crashes !!

 

Save game corruption was valid for older patches, but i thought they already fixed that. i don't use any of the auto feature, since i never trusted that alone.

 

there is also one save game bug when you load you will be stuck sometimes loading a previous save game and use the kill option on your character will be able to fix the bug..

[Daguy]

I too have, as of yet, never faced a save-game courruption - except amusingly in New Vegas. I think that was due to bloating however, as I was using a mod that spawned aliens all over the Mojave.

[Mailamea]

When i finished vanilla blivion, fo3 and nv i use auto save and quick save and it never crashed. Also i always play with the latest patches on.

+

When my game is cluttered with like 9k+ mods lol only 63 atm. Turning off autosave greatly reduces crashes.

[Dreamer102]

I have autosave and quicksave turned off. I use "CASM" to do my saving and I guess I will be loading up the FNV version of WRYE-Flash tonight to try and fix the game.

 

Currently, I'm experiencing crashing in the nipton collapsed tunnels.

I'll try to load that game and then kill my character with the console to see if that fixes it.