Better NPC Support for Devious Devices

[Kharos]

I was wrong, I found some more small optimizations (nothing really big though).
 

Version 0.2 beta 3
- Some more small optimizations

 

[DonQuiWho]

3 minutes ago, Kharos said:

I was wrong, I found some more small optimizations (nothing really big though).
 

Version 0.2 beta 3
- Some more small optimizations

 

 

LMAO

 

I spend more time updating my set up than I do playing ....

 

....but thanks again!

[El_Duderino]

Thanks much for updating and improving this fantastic mod for the latest DD!

 

I've been using the slow-down version from the thread, with really great in-game results and not a single crash or stack dump in the log (not even when entering the DCL-9 Whip and Chain) -- I take it the new version with its specific DD5.1 optimizations will be a better choice now (esp. now that we can configure it to process the NPCs slower, too).

 

Thank you for your wonderful effforts in making Skyrim even more devious and allowing the NPCs to properly partake in the fun, too.

[DonQuiWho]

2 hours ago, Kharos said:

I was wrong, I found some more small optimizations (nothing really big though).
 

Version 0.2 beta 3
- Some more small optimizations

 

 

Hi again

 

Another quick query

 

Is it safe to use :

 

Corsec's AIO variant of the Populated series mods

+

Corsec's NON-Devious Devices Patch for that AIO mod

+

Your Better NPC Support Patch latest version

 

?

 

Reason for asking is that most of the time, the DD effects that I want to maintain and control are related to their application to followers, eg restricting their combat weapons handling etc

 

Having the combo set out above would, at first glance, possibly give all the other NPCs some required 'restraints as eye candy', but further reduce the overhead required in making them, so to speak, 'fully functional' unnecessarily.  Especially if adding restraints via Corsec's patches to Immersive Wenches, Hydra Slavegirls, SD Cages prisoners etc

 

If not - say if, eg, your mod would still go through all the NPCs anyway, regardless of the DD or Non DD states of their NPC restraints - fine

 

But I thought I'd ask ... ?

 

[Kharos]

2 hours ago, donkeywho said:

I spend more time updating my set up than I do playing ....

 

Really? Updating my mod with MO should take you about 15 seconds: Click "Choose Mod" -> select the zip -> click "Install" -> click "Replace". I am doing this all the time when I am making modifications to the mod (I don't modify the installed version, I modify it in the source git repo and then install the modified version).

 

1 hour ago, El_Duderino said:

I've been using the slow-down version from the thread, with really great in-game results and not a single crash or stack dump in the log (not even when entering the DCL-9 Whip and Chain)

 

Yes, with the MCM there is no longer a need for a slow-down version, you can make it slow yourself if necessary. Just go to the MCM and reduce either the scanner frequency, or how many NPCs are processed per 3 seconds. I do not know for sure which of these two will have a greater effect; if I have to guess then I would say the processed NPCs per 3 seconds is the larger effecr.

[Kharos]

9 minutes ago, donkeywho said:

 

Hi again

 

Another quick query

 

Is it safe to use :

 

Corsec's AIO variant of the Populated series mods

+

Corsec's NON-Devious Devices Patch for that AIO mod

+

Your Better NPC Support Patch latest version

 

?

 

Reason for asking is that most of the time, the DD effects that I want to maintain and control are related to their application to followers, eg restricting their combat weapons handling etc

 

Having the combo set out above would, at first glance, possibly give all the other NPCs some required 'restraints as eye candy', but further reduce the overhead required in making them, so to speak, 'fully functional' unnecessarily.  Especially if adding restraints via Corsec's patches to Immersive Wenches, Hydra Slavegirls, SD Cages prisoners etc

 

If not - say if, eg, your mod would still go through all the NPCs anyway, regardless of the DD or Non DD states of their NPC restraints - fine

 

But I thought I'd ask ... ?

 

 

I have no idea honestly, I don't know enough about how the non-DD AIO works. You need to try it out.

 

If you take the latest beta you can enable papyrus logging in MCM. All papyrus log lines from my mod start with "[DDNF]", and they all include the name and the form id of the NPC that was modified. So it should be easy to find out after playing for a while if my mod was triggered or not, just search the papyrus log for "DDNF".

[DonQuiWho]

6 minutes ago, Kharos said:

 

Really? Updating my mod with MO should take you about 15 seconds: Click "Choose Mod" -> select the zip -> click "Install" -> click "Replace". I am doing this all the time when I am making modifications to the mod (I don't modify the installed version, I modify it in the source git repo and then install the modified version).

 

 

I guess that your L/H pane doesn't have 2900+ entries ... ?

 

Don't ask!

[Kharos]

Just uploaded the "final" non-beta version 0.2. Cumulative changes since 0.1 are:
 

Version 0.2 beta 1
- Add a simple MCM with the following options:
  * enabled/disable processing of NPCs (can be used to temporarily disable the mod)
  * frequency of NPC scanner (default: scan for NPCs every 8 seconds)
  * how fast to process NPCs (default: 3 NPCs every 3 seconds)

Version 0.2 beta 2
- Optimizations after testing with Devious Devices 5.1
- Add flag for papyrus logging to MCM

Version 0.2 beta 3
- Some more small optimizations

Version 0.2
- Support pahe dwemer slave suit and dwemer pet suit as a soft-dependency (they needed special handling)

 

Apart from support for the pahe dwarven devices, 0.2 beta 3 is identical to the final 0.2, so there is no need to upgrade if you are on 0.2 beta 3 and not using the pahe dwarven stuff.

[donttouchmethere]

I updated to newest Better NPC Support for Devious Devices 0.2.7z for a while now and it works well.

Less lag if I rise the time BNSfDD processes the bound NPC.

 

I still use Corsec's (real) DD patch for HSG slaves (= lots of bound NPC in cities and taverns and ... everywhere) and your mod is essential by now to have working DD animations on NPC.

Also very useful to keep followers in DDs without them trying to fight with their hands out of the armbinder.

And useful in case something breaks the DD idles on followers, in that case BNSfDD will restart the DD idles.

 

BNSfDD is now in my LO for 650 hours and still rocks. Now it rocks even more, because way less lag.

[Kharos]

Version 0.3 beta 1
- Add option to fix the NPC under the crosshair to MCM
- Optimization: Change handling of animations, should now recognize when animations are still applied after loading screen and not re-apply them

 

Now trying to actually detect if animations are broken instead of just assuming that they are broken after each loading screen. In practice only some loading screens will break them and require a full animation reset (e.g. Whiterun city gates). This should reduce the amount of work when travelling with followers (or PAHE slaves).

 

The logic to detect this is very new, so leaving this as a beta in additon to version 0.2 for now.
 

[DonQuiWho]

16 minutes ago, Kharos said:

Version 0.3 beta 1
- Add option to fix the NPC under the crosshair to MCM
- Optimization: Change handling of animations, should now recognize when animations are still applied after loading screen and not re-apply them

 

Now trying to actually detect if animations are broken instead of just assuming that they are broken after each loading screen. In practice only some loading screens will break them and require a full animation reset (e.g. Whiterun city gates). This should reduce the amount of work when travelling with followers (or PAHE slaves).

 

The logic to detect this is very new, so leaving this as a beta in additon to version 0.2 for now.
 

 

Thanks for keeping going with this

 

Much appreciated

[Tlam99]

tested with SE, no problems as only scripts.

esp-fe works, too.

A little issue, the dummy weapon has no critical effect applied (stays undefined, error xedit)

Inserted an effect to reduce magica to prevent problems.

[Kharos]

5 hours ago, T-lam said:

tested with SE, no problems as only scripts.

esp-fe works, too.

A little issue, the dummy weapon has no critical effect applied (stays undefined, error xedit)

Inserted an effect to reduce magica to prevent problems.

 

Happy to hear that it works. I have no experience with SE at all. Can you elaborate?

 

The dummy weapon itself should never be used for attacking btw, its purpose is to be an "invisible weapon" that prevents bound NPCs from equipping other "visible" weapons out of combat (or during combat in case they are helpless, i.e. either bound combat is disabled or they are wearing fetters). Bound NPCs who are in combat will use the unarmed style because I apply a special unarmed combat package.

[Tlam99]

I will test it.

I know the dummy will never be used.

But I prefer to have no not referenced elements.

They can become the reason for hard to find bugs.

 

[Kharos]

1 hour ago, T-lam said:

I will test it.

I know the dummy will never be used.

But I prefer to have no not referenced elements.

They can become the reason for hard to find bugs.

 

 

I agree that any XEdit warnings/errors should be fixed, even if they do not seem to cause issues. It's just cleaner. TES5Edit for LE does not show me any warnings/errors, though, and I have no experience with SE (it is not even installed).

LE has an 'unarmed' weapon (id is 000001F4). What settings does this have for critical data in SE? If you copy these settings into my dummy weapon, will the warning go away? If yes then I should probably do the same in my next release.

[Tlam99]

 

unarmed is in but

SE has critical data, this shows an error, as it is not referenced.

Assume, it's the transfer from LE to SE.

Spoiler

here what I changed

 

Edit:

btw, the MCM did not show up before this fix and esp-fe'd it.

 

[Kharos]

4 hours ago, T-lam said:

 

unarmed is in but

SE has critical data, this shows an error, as it is not referenced.

Assume, it's the transfer from LE to SE.

  Reveal hidden contents

here what I changed

 

Edit:

btw, the MCM did not show up before this fix and esp-fe'd it.

 

 

I tried to fix the issue without actually adding a critical effect. Does my change fix the issue (attached file, only the esp is different, everything else is the same)?
If it does not fix the issue then I will add a critical effect instead.

Better NPC Support for Devious Devices 0.3 beta 1.7z

[Tlam99]

Some feedback

Seems to work in SE

Actually, I tested the version I fe'd.

Did not check the version with nullreference (assume, that's what you did)

will do it now.

 

[Kharos]

4 hours ago, Adetu said:

Is there a plan to provide a similar mod for the devices - cuffs and yokes - from ZAZ Animation and/or Heretical resources ?

 

 

No plan from my side for now.

[Kharos]

New beta, changes compared to the previous one:

Version 0.3 beta 2
- Improve the fix for corrupt devices (devices sometimes get "bad" when they are stored in a container for a long time)
- Detect rendered devices being unequipped while NPC is loaded and try to fix the issue
- Prevent prisoners from using bound combat even if not wearing fetters (use membership in dunPrisonerFaction)

 

I am not yet sure what exactly causes devices to become "corrupt" in long playthroughs. It manifests as devices that just won't work. No menu when interacting with them in player inventory, and nothing happens to them when putting them on a NPC. Technically it looks like the game somehow loses the script that is attached to the device. My current solution is to delete the device, spawn a new identical one, and then equip it on the NPC. The detection is a bit experimental and is logged in the papyrus log.

 

The third one is a generic fix as dunPrisonerFaction is a vanilla faction, but it should especially fix PAHE prisoners throwing themselves into combat when wearing heavy bondage without fetters. Now they will try to flee instead, unless they have been told to fight - in that case they should continue using bound combat (not that there is a reason to keep combat slaves bound).

[Kharos]

Version 0.3 beta 3
- Change handling of dummy weapon to prevent bug causing all equipped items to be unequipped

 

If this works well then it will become the final version 0.3.

 

Also a question, currently this installes a bunch of loose files into /Data (5 scripts + 5 script source files). Is this ok or would people prefer a .bsa archive?

[donttouchmethere]

4 hours ago, Kharos said:

Version 0.3 beta 3
- Change handling of dummy weapon to prevent bug causing all equipped items to be unequipped

 

If this works well then it will become the final version 0.3.

 

Also a question, currently this installes a bunch of loose files into /Data (5 scripts + 5 script source files). Is this ok or would people prefer a .bsa archive?

Thank for the new beta!

Gonna install right now =D

 

About installing:

I still use NMM and if you add a folder /data to your mod zip, NMM has no issues to install Better NPC Support for Devious Devices (so far worked for all versions)

[donttouchmethere]

Not sure what the /FOMod folder is for. It doesn't start a FOMOD with NMM that way.

Is that a MO thing? I thought that would need a meta.ini

Or is it an option for future versions that work with LE and SE?

 

 

 

[Kharos]

9 minutes ago, donttouchmethere said:

Not sure what the /FOMod folder is for. It doesn't start a FOMOD with NMM that way.

Is that a MO thing? I thought that would need a meta.ini

Or is it an option for future versions that work with LE and SE?

 

It doesn't? It starts a very tiny FOMOD installer with MO2 (and always has, from the first version that I ever did):

 

 

The meta.ini is then created by MO automatically after installation.

[donttouchmethere]

14 minutes ago, Kharos said:

and always has, from the first version that I ever did

Interesting ^^

It never worked with NMM, but because everything that is needed is added via the /data folder already, I didn't even missed it.