How can I really start fresh and clean and stay that way?

[JimmyCow]

I've been frustrated by, despite being pretty careful of modding, having to restart repeatedly. Recently I simply gave up as result of a pretty much unidentifiable cause of game breaking errors. Some scripts were killed and it broke AT LEAST: Whatever raises the teleporting chalices during Dawnguard Auriel's bow in darkfall passage AND the dwemer elder scroll reader's buttons. When I pressed the buttons, they did nothing and seemed to be missing scripts when I examined things further. So you can probably see my concern as it's probably not knowable what caused this, and I also have no chance for recovery and I don't know what else is borked.

 

I've come back to Skyrim after a long break but I really don't want to just start a new save and only break it later. As for what caused those aforementioned scripts to be deleted I still don't even know.

 

Are there some under-the-radar new shiny things that people use now which will be really helpful to me?

What I want is ABSOLUTE control and security over modding issues...

 

Are there any good mod packages or setups that people know? If there aren't changes to how mods are managed (or maybe any guides to be a better at managing mods) I think mainly what I want is a solid and secure LL setup of standard LL mods, especially because LL mods have often been the least stable mods for me to have.

[Just Don't]

Mod Organizer. Install the game, use MO and any mods that go under the Data folder will never touch your original game files. That way you can install and remove mods without worrying about backups and overwritted files (from other mods or from the original game). You will have total control over every file from every mod, you can pick and choose which texture/mesh/script is the one used by the game in case you have several mods providing the same files.

 

As for solid and secure mods... no, even mods in active development and with frequent updates, can have bugs and nobody can warranty your game will be bug-free. The only thing you can do is choose carefully, taking a look at the description and support thread of the mod, you'll have an idea of how stable it may be.

[JimmyCow]

I should have mentioned that I use MO2 religiously.

I'm a fairly savvy modder. But that doesn't mean I run into issues.

[Just Don't]

Then your game should be intact and whatever issue you're having is among the mods you use. Although I got to say, having parts of the vanilla game breaking like you describe is not something I'd expect from a clean install and mod setup. If you still have those issues and don't know where do they come from, you should start clean by deleting all your mods and doing a minimal install (bug fixes, skyui, bodyslide/body mods, fnis) just to check if everything is in order. Then you can add more, trying to keep things simple, trying one mod at a time and avoid removing mods in a savegame you plan to use for the long term.

[JimmyCow]

Um I'm not sure you're understanding my OP very well. In any case what you suggested is helpful but redundant as I'm aware of all that. I have been modding for years.

[Just Don't]

That's why I said

1 hour ago, dontknowdontcaredontask said:

having parts of the vanilla game breaking like you describe is not something I'd expect from a clean install and mod setup.

If you're having these issues and don't know where do they come from, you're doing something wrong, even if you've been doing it for years. There are no tools to do all the work or solve every issue automatically, if that's what you're asking. The best thing you can do now is start fresh and know exactly what you're installing and why. If you want to reduce the chances of bugs, avoid mods that have not been updated in years, check the comments to see if people have issues and so on. Check Fallrim Tools, it could help you keep an eye on your saves and see if there are issues with your mods in a current save.

[Ankahet]

42 minutes ago, JimmyCow said:

Um I'm not sure you're understanding my OP very well. In any case what you suggested is helpful but redundant as I'm aware of all that. I have been modding for years.

Vanilla quest-lines breaking like that will most likely happen if you have a mod that alters it. As far as the scripts being removed, are they actually removed? Have you tried a game without any mods in it and it still does it? First thing I would be doing is diabling all mods, running it completely vanilla to see if the problem persists. If not, then its a mod. Then I go one by one with a save before the event, and when it breaks, I will know which one is doing it, so I remove that mod.

 

Furthermore, you are probably not going to get much additional help if you are being rude to the people trying to help you. There is also a difference between being a mod user, and a modder. Modders usually create them, mod users utilize them. There are different skillsets for each. Not to say a person cannot be both. But simply being one or the other, or even both does not mean you will necessarily know everything there is to know about every mod you have installed.

 

There are a number of things to do to test, or, try and reproduce the issue at hand, and it seems that you are not really trying any of them, simply asking for someone to point you towards an answer.

[JimmyCow]

I'm not being rude. I tried to explain he is misunderstanding me. I am definitely not trying to do that if you think that.

 

I'm not asking for an answer and avoiding testing. My question was more about geting updates on the current tools... I don't know if it wasn't very clear.

I have done enough testing, that I've had enough of testing and retesting. Maybe there are newer things people do or newer programs etc that I missed when I was gone for a while.

[Just Don't]

2 hours ago, JimmyCow said:

I don't know if it wasn't very clear.

Not really. You were very vague about what would be new to you, like you say in your 1st post. You could've listed all the tools you're familiar with and others could tell you if there are any updates or new tools to replace the ones you use.

 

Personally I use MO2 as manager, LOOT (+ manual sorting in some cases), zEdit (similar to the classic TES5Edit, much more lightweight and with its own patcher for certain things), also BethINI (I just run it once to load a clean preset and then do manual edits to my taste). ENB is still a thing, even if you don't want the post-proccessing the VRAM management is better than the one from the default engine. I've already linked Fallrim tools to check your save files. And I think people still use Wyrebash for some stuff.

[JimmyCow]

Ok. I will try to clarify.

1. I was wondering about new things i missed out on that might help me out? Let's say something like... MO3 came out and I had no idea

2. Specifically, asking if anyone knew much about stable mod pack configurations

 

I haven't tried Fallrim, I could check that out. I haven't ever tried TES5edit because I'm not too modding savvy and I find it a bit difficult to get into..

[GenioMaestro]

The modding tools not change in 3 years. Only launch new version for optimize it and solve problems.

 

You already know the answer to your question. Use a mod manager and be carreful. Is the only way.

Is indiferent the manager, you can use NMM, Vortex, MO... All the managers give you a diferent way for make the same. Have a woking modded game. The rest is in your hands.

 

As you not mention CTD I presume you have the Stability Tools (SKSE Memory Manager, Crash Fixes 12, ENB with Boost mode, BethIni) and your only problem can be the mods.

If you have a problem in the game must be caused by a bad mod => disable mods until locate them.

We not have other way for know WHAT mod is causing the problems => disable mods until locate them.

Only you can locate the bad mod because only you have your exact mod list in that exact order.

 

If you have a specific problem whit "the teleporting chalices during Dawnguard Auriel's bow in darkfall passage" only you can discover WHAT mod is causing the problem => disable mods until locate them.

Another totally diferent thing is WHY that mod is causing the problems but that is a question for the developer of the mod and probably you can not solve the problem. You only can locate it.

 

 

Reading your words again seems that the only tool that you miss is ReSaver from FallrimTools.

If you never use ReSaver in 3 years I can understand WHY you make that question and WHY you are soo desperated about the game because every time you have a problem you must disable the problematic mod and start a New Game because, theorically, we can not remove mods from a running game.

But that is not true from 3 years ago thanks to ReSaver and from 5 years ago thanks to Savegame Cleaner and from 6 years ago thanks to Savegame Scalper.

 

The only think that you must make is locate the problematic mod, disable it, load you Savegame, accept the message about faulting pluging, save the game again, clean the new savegame with ReSaver, load the cleaned savegame and continue playing. I make that every week whitout any problem.

 

Finally, the only way for not have problems in the game is make a good selection of mods.

Not use incompatible mods, or old mods, or new mods, or mods with a very low number of downloads...

And follow my golden rule: If the game not works as expected NOT save it. Load the last stable savegame and repeat. If you find a repeteable and consistent problem disable mods until locate the bad mod.

[xSill]

maybe just follow mods like these doods do, for example this guide i read recently after i came back modding again lately...

 

I read sintargamingLE guide, maybe he has SSE as well. he posted some package mod to install... and with a hint on how it will end, tho mostly just the visuals...

 

Though i dont like doing it that way and use my own choice, and ofc ended up with problems here and there coz of it lul.

 

I suggest u just google sintargaming LE guide, he told stability guide as well, maybe just what u need...

[JimmyCow]

9 hours ago, GenioMaestro said:

 

 

As you not mention CTD I presume you have the Stability Tools (SKSE Memory Manager, Crash Fixes 12, ENB with Boost mode, BethIni) and your only problem can be the mods.

If you have a problem in the game must be caused by a bad mod => disable mods until locate them.

We not have other way for know WHAT mod is causing the problems => disable mods until locate them.

Only you can locate the bad mod because only you have your exact mod list in that exact order.

[...]

Reading your words again seems that the only tool that you miss is ReSaver from FallrimTools.

If you never use ReSaver in 3 years I can understand WHY you make that question and WHY you are soo desperated about the game because every time you have a problem you must disable the problematic mod and start a New Game because, theorically, we can not remove mods from a running game.

But that is not true from 3 years ago thanks to ReSaver and from 5 years ago thanks to Savegame Cleaner and from 6 years ago thanks to Savegame Scalper.

 

 

Thanks. Weirdly enough I have savegamecleaner but NOT any of the tools you mentioned like SKSE memory manager, crash fixes 12 or etc.

I have not recently dealt with crashing but what happened is that scripts associated with various quests which have not been modified are completely missing, which I think is not a recoverable issue. That is why pressing buttons in some quests for instance did not work at all; the buttons were dead.

 

 

OH right. Guys so.. would you recommend LE or SSE? I switched to SSE thinking it was definitely better. Now while I have little CTD issue its mod support is really quite awful. It seems like LL mods are very focused towards LE and I care quite a bit about the mods offered here... Any suggestions? I'm starting fresh anyway so I was thinking LE could be worth it.

[GenioMaestro]

13 hours ago, JimmyCow said:

Thanks. Weirdly enough I have savegamecleaner but NOT any of the tools you mentioned like SKSE memory manager, crash fixes 12 or etc.

You need the Stability Tools for have a stable game. If you not have it your game can make CTD in any moment and a lot of people call that as "Random CTD" but today the game is stable as a rock.

 

13 hours ago, JimmyCow said:

that scripts associated with various quests which have not been modified are completely missing

That is totally imposible because the vanilla script are inside the original BSA's files of the game.

Another diferent thing is when a mod cause interferences with the vanilla game and the vanilla scripts not fire.

That is your work => search that mod => disable yours mods by groups, load your savegame and verify if the shirines works. If fail, remove more mods until locate the problematic mod because 99% of the problems in the game are recoverables. Only a very very very small number of mods cause a permanent damage to the game.

 

13 hours ago, JimmyCow said:

would you recommend LE or SSE?

That is a question in the air for 3 years.

For one side, SSE is a 64 bits game with DirectX 11. Not have any memory problem and have more graphical power. But have less mods, some mods from LE are not converted to SSE.

For the other side, LE is a 32 bits game with DirectX 9. Not have any memory problem if you configure it correctly, have enougth graphical power for play at 4k resolution with 4k textures and have much more mods availables.

 

Not think that LE is a CTD generator. That was true a lot of years ago. Today is totally false.

Not think that SE never have CTD. Every time a mesh is bad converted from LE to SE you have CTD. Every time Beth update the game all the mod with DLL are broken and you can not play yours mods in some days or weeks until the new versions of the dll's are published.

[JimmyCow]

ohhhh..... tyvm