Papyrus Log questions

[Violence6884]

I recently updated a large number of mods I was running. Once I was done, Skyrim started crashing during loading screens(Which are missing text and images, completely blank except my level indicator). I activated Papyrus and while I have no idea what I'm looking at, there is an insane amount of either :

"...Cannot be bound because [...] is not the right type",
"Cannot be initialized because the script no longer contains that property",
"Cannot be initialized because the value is the incorrect type",
"ERROR: Unable to bind script JaxonzStringUtil to JaxonzNamedSaveQuest (4A032C40) because their base types do not match(As an example, since I am using Jax's Utilities)",
Or finally... "Cannot open store for class "CDXSlavery_Functions", missing file?".

 

So I was wondering what do these messages indicate and how do I deal with it? :'X My load order is exactly what it was before updating my mods, and generally I haven't touched anything. I cleanly removed each single mod and replaced it with its updated version in more or less the same order I had done so originally, and cleaned my Save as well, which was made in an interior cell with no NPCs. Before this, my set up was working wonderfully.

[Guest]

"...Cannot be bound because [...] is not the right type"

A mod had an object or a property associated with a script with a specific name and now the script has a different type.

"Cannot be initialized because the script no longer contains that property"

A property was removed but in the savegame it is still filled (you can ignore this, just a bad way to update a script by the mod author)

"Cannot be initialized because the value is the incorrect type"

Same as the first. In some cases is a problem. Most of the time can be ignored.

"ERROR: Unable to bind script JaxonzStringUtil to JaxonzNamedSaveQuest (4A032C40) because their base types do not match(As an example, since I am using Jax's Utilities)",

Better to uninstall the mod, cleanup the save (by removing all references to the mod scripts and forms) and then reinstall it.

[Violence6884]

Then I will work through my LO from the start, cleaning as I go. This is going to be painfull.

[Violence6884]

Oh but what about the last line, what does that indicate? That was  "Cannot open store for class "CDXSlavery_Functions", missing file?".

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, Violence6884 said:

Oh but what about the last line, what does that indicate? That was  "Cannot open store for class "CDXSlavery_Functions", missing file?".

Can be many things.

Probably a significant change in the mod that completely changes some dependencies of the mod.

In this case better to remove, clean the save, then reinstall.

[Violence6884]

So, another quick question; Should I worry that I can't even start a new game as things are? By the way thanks for the  help, I'm quite new to errors of this kind, especially so many.

[Psalam]

While I hate to interrupt CPU (who admittedly knows far more than I do) did I understand you to say that you changed your mods (upgraded) and now can not load past the main screen? If so, could I impose upon you to download your load order and the text from the upper half of FNIS when you run it (the part that doesn't have tick boxes in it).

[Violence6884]

That would be exactly what's happening, in short. I currently have no back up of the LO I was going to use(After I was done updating) except from before any update, meaning some ESPs will be all over.

EDIT - I should rephrase that; This LO is with all the new versions installed, so their ESPs are out of place. I was planning to use my previous LO, then manually move what needed to be moved... And put my merges back(Which is why you'll notice all my clothes are 0).

EDIT 2 - English is hard!  I do hope you understand what I'm saying.

 

LoadOrder4.txt

FNIS.txt

[Psalam]

I'm afraid that your problem is likely that you have too many animations for your Bugthesda engine to handle (over 18k). You need to remove animation packages to get this number down below at least 12k (preferably below 10k). Once you've done that you should be able to get the game to start again.

[Violence6884]

20 minutes ago, Psalam said:

I'm afraid that your problem is likely that you have too many animations for your Bugthesda engine to handle.

It is probable that one of the newer versions of the animation packs I use, now offers more than before. That said FNIS now handles up to 20K, in fact it was able to, even from before its latest version(On XXL Beta which I was using).

 

Its description : "Behavior Files and Generators - Allows for 20,000 animations - ATTENTION: Might result in longer generation times and more frequent load CTD" and while it does mention potential CTDs I had never experienced any with its Beta. I was definitely running a very similar number of animations. Furthermore now the crashes are too consistent to be considered merely "More frequent".

 

In essence this could be an issue but wouldn't the Papyrus log mention it's all caused by FNIS, in some way? Right now all the error lines I get, definitely aren't from mods which involve animations. Some are, but you get the point. I'm worried the amount of animations nearing FNIS's limit isn't the issue, or at least not the main issue by far.

[Violence6884]

Unrelated to this(And I will understand if it is ignored since it is another matter);

 

Installing a merge prompts me to overwrite certain files that come from each individual mod in the merge- Whether their ESPs are active in my LO or not. Should I allow that? So far I don't, but I feel now is the right time to ask about this as well.

 

Also is it recommended to run BodySlide, Dual Sheath, FNIS ETC while each individual ESP is active in my LO or is it fine if I do all that after I have activated a merge and disabled each individual ESP?

[Psalam]

On the first issue related to animations, what FNIS tells you is how many animations that FNIS can handle, not how many the crummy Bugthesda engine can handle. Fore says that his setup can handle 20k animations but he also admits that those animations are pretty much the only mods that he runs. As a practical matter most people with decent computers and a reasonably heavily modded game (certainly one that includes merging plug-ins) can only handle between 10-12k animations. There is more information on this in my blog if you want to look at it (the link is in my signature), but you can also find multiple threads on too many animations here in the Skyrim Technical thread.

 

I understand that it is preferable that you run Bodyslide and FNIS on the unmerged files. Overall, however, I don't understand why it would make a difference (Bodyslide should see all the "armors" and FNIS should see all the animations either way).

[Violence6884]

11 minutes ago, Psalam said:

On the first issue related to animations, what FNIS tells you is how many animations that FNIS can handle, not how many the crummy Bugthesda engine can handle. 

 

I understand that it is preferable that you run Bodyslide and FNIS on the unmerged files. Overall, however, I don't understand why it would make a difference (Bodyslide should see all the "armors" and FNIS should see all the animations either way).

Shouldn't this be easy to verify? Disable the animation packs, run the game and see what happens? Or am I going to break something else somewhere else? :$ This situation has made me a bit paranoid...

 

I see, about BS, FNIS and such. Thanks. What about the overwriting part? I hope I've been doing it right by not allowing that, I can't find any info on that particular question even on GamerPoet's relevant video.

[Psalam]

Spoiler

6 minutes ago, Violence6884 said:

Shouldn't this be easy to verify? Disable the animation packs, run the game and see what happens? Or am I going to break something else somewhere else? :$ This situation has made me a bit paranoid...

 

I see, about BS, FNIS and such. Thanks. What about the overwriting part? I hope I've been doing it right by not allowing that, I can't find any info on that particular question even on GamerPoet's relevant video.

 

 

Yes it is VERY easy to verify. Turn off enough animations that when you run FNIS the total animations (character + creature) is less than 10k. Then try running your game. Make certain that 1) you have not eliminated an animation pack that is required for another mod and 2) that you run LOOT after changing your load order by removing animation packs.

 

Once you have the game running you can add animation packs one at a time. There is no hard and fast rule about how many you will be able to run. If 10k works then you can add a pack. If 11k works you can add a pack, and so on. When it doesn't work eliminate a pack and you will know (about) what your personal limit is.

 

My understanding is that you want to avoid having one mod overwrite another. It is not always a game killer (in fact, many mods are designed to do just this - you see it for instance in mods that use Devious Devices) but can be when a mod is calling something that can't be found. The more likely something is to be called the more likely it is to give you an issue. This is the reason you want to be certain that NOTHING overwrites your skeleton.

[Violence6884]

48 minutes ago, Psalam said:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

 

Understood, I was hoping the answer for merges would be more specific at least as far as clothes, armour, hair packs and such simpler stuff are concerned. I avoid merging more complex mods. I suppose I could let the merge overwrite its individual components and see what happens, taking any precautions I can.

By the way, I just realized that the bulk of the extra animations may be coming from ZAZ Animation Pack 8 Plus, reading thoroughly it seems it would have been fine if I had upgraded to 8 from my older version. I never even wanted any furniture animations and it seems that's all the Plus version offers. Come to think of it, I'd prefer to avoid it altogether but I am pretty sure it is listed as required by some other mods I am running.

 

EDIT - You were right, I can definitely load the game but the results are rather... Exotic shall I say. And that's being as generic and polite as I can be. So now knowing it's most likely the amount of animations, I'll attempt to organize my LO as reasonably as I can(LOOT doesn't take into account many individual changes that have to be made). Perhaps after I'm done all the stranger things I just saw will never meet my eyes again.

[Psalam]

ZAP is required by many mods although you can usually get by with one of the older versions that have fewer animations. Unlike some mod authors T.ara has left the older versions available just for that purpose.

 

About the merges. I've asked someone with more experience with them to answer. Hopefully, she's got the time.

[worik]

1 hour ago, Violence6884 said:

Understood, I was hoping the answer for merges would be more specific at least as far as clothes, armour, hair packs and such simpler stuff are concerned. I avoid merging more complex mods. I suppose I could let the merge overwrite its individual components and see what happens, taking any precautions I can.

It might help a lot, if you would post

• what is this "merge" and what mods where merged
• how did you merge them
• what does it want to overwrite.

In general:

• I have a mod that wants to overwrite something
• I still have to decide on my own if I like that or not
• I merge this mod together with others
• It will still want to overwrite the same thing, and I still have to decide if I like it or not.

It sounds a bit like your are using mod organizer, am I right?

 

 

[Violence6884]

1 hour ago, Psalam said:

ZAP is required by many mods although you can usually get by with one of the older versions that have fewer animations. Unlike some mod authors T.ara has left the older versions available just for that purpose.

 

About the merges. I've asked someone with more experience with them to answer. Hopefully, she's got the time.

You have my gratitude. Thank you for all your help.

[Psalam]

I take it that it worked. You're welcome.

 

Worik appears to be happy to help you with merges if you are still interested. Her knowledge in this regard far exceeds my own.

[Violence6884]

1 hour ago, worik said:

 

 

Greetings. Thank you as well for taking a look at my questions. So then... It's strictly clothing, weapons or at most hair, brows, beards and such, not in the same merged Plug-In of course. I use MergePlugIns to compile them. When I activate what I pack together in NMM, I am asked whether or not that pack should overwrite the original individual mods. It doesn't seem to matter if their ESPs are ticked.

 

For example, I want to save up ESP space in my LO so through MergePlugIn I combine Mod A and Mod B, which are both just sets of clothes, into Mod X. Upon adding and activating that, I'm asked if I should allow X to overwrite Mod A and B. I am not sure how much better I could explain the procedure or what I wish to learn... :$

[Violence6884]

18 hours ago, Psalam said:

I take it that it worked. You're welcome.

^_^'' I haven't yet mustered the stamina required to start arranging my LO, but I'm definitely in a much better position :3 And it does look like it'll be fine. Any strangeness that greeted me on load must have been the product of a temporarily messy installation.

 

EDIT - All is working fine ❤️

[worik]

15 hours ago, Violence6884 said:

When I activate what I pack together in NMM, I am asked whether or not that pack should overwrite the original individual mods. It doesn't seem to matter if their ESPs are ticked.

Ok, I am sorry. I can't really help for NMM .

Rant:

Spoiler

I dumped this abomination of a "tool" years ago. .. and two years of wasted lifetime too late.

*sigh* I feel better now! Please ignore me

15 hours ago, Violence6884 said:

For example, I want to save up ESP space in my LO so through MergePlugIn I combine Mod A and Mod B, which are both just sets of clothes, into Mod X. Upon adding and activating that, I'm asked if I should allow X to overwrite Mod A and B. I am not sure how much better I could explain the procedure or what I wish to learn... :$

In an MO setting (just in case this helps you at all?), ... you would do:

1. order your mods , priority order and load order
2. Test: can you play your game now without any problems? Test thoroughly! Yes: goto 3; no: goto 1
3. Merge the mods into the merged mod. Do the whole lot, full copy options active. Leave nothing behind!.. as if you would delete the merged mods in 5 minutes
4. positioned the new mergemod now immediately behind the merged ones and activate it. Do both steps In both panels, left and right, prority order and load order!
5. untick the merged mods, MO will ignore them from now on, leave your priority oder as it is, MO will cleanse your load order from the deactivated mods -> Now, the merge mod will not collide with the merged ones
6. test the merged mod, if everyhting is fine: enjoy; if not: the merge failed and is probably unmergable in this combination

[Grey Cloud]

17 hours ago, Violence6884 said:

I haven't yet mustered the stamina required to start arranging my LO

Are you not using LOOT?

We may not be talking about the same thing here so be careful - does the NMM message mention 'versions'? If so then 'yes to overwrite' will replace the original version with your merged version. If you choose 'no' then you will end up with the original and your merge installed. I repeat, I am not sure we are talking about the same thing here.

 

Your other option is to think through your mods and get a load order that does not require merges and patches.

 

My advice would be to remove all your merges, run LOOT. Start a new game and play to see if your game is stable. Once you have a stable game then think about merges if you must.

You could post your LOOTed LO here and we could probably offer some advice.

[Violence6884]

8 hours ago, worik said:

 

Rant:

  Reveal hidden contents

I dumped this abomination of a "tool" years ago. .. and two years of wasted lifetime too late.

*sigh* I feel better now! Please ignore me

 

The procedure is very similar for NMM, identical actually, and I have had no issues except not knowing if I should allow the overwriting I mentioned... Which doesn't seem to matter but then again who knows... Ahhh, perhaps there's no such prompt when using MO so all that is left is to thank you for your help either way.

^_^