Binding

[Talesien]

6 hours ago, Lazy Palm said:

 

No terribly surprising.  Everybody wants to make their packages run at the same time.  Maybe I can park the follower close (brute force with a moveto) during the blackout (that you never see) and start some forcedialog immediately or something.

 

I have only been testing with the most no script / no dialog followers I found on nexus.  It will be very helpful to have some examples to test against!  Thanks!

Did some more trial runs.

• Ashe - Crystal Heart: Can't be set as a Dominant or potential Dominant.
• ColdSuns Coralyne: Dito. (I suppose that's because neither is in the potentialfollowerfaction)
• Gwynesha - Healer Companion: Works, but might need help. I openly attack Fort Neugrad and the bandits were all over me, while Gwynesha stood well to the back and did what she is supposed to, heal me. This could've gone forever. I thrust her into the thick of things using the teleport option from NFF, but that fight would likely have taken ages even so. Her offensive capabilities aren't up to snuff. That might make her a bad candidate as potential dom, RP wise, given how it is phrased. Even so, it should not lock up things forever. At any rate, after "she" won, things progressed fine.
• Vermillion the Succubus: Works. Since she does not get added to NFF automatically I first tested her outside NFF, worked (she did get stuck in combat doing nothing, but I don't think that has anything to do with Bindings, will test further though). After winning, things progressed just fine (which kinda surprised me). Tried again after importing her into NFF (given the NFF is listed under recommended mods), she again got stuck in combat doing nothing, that aside things went fine after the battle was won. She did however first run to the nearby workbench and created some arrows before returning to me for the talk. One could say she was making a point that way, but I think you might wish to boost her bindings package a little. ^^

Long story short, I think you need to find a better way to have the follower win/end the fight. Relying on the follower to eventually win is not a good strategy, it can take forever or not happen at all, due to pathing issues, follower (or enemy) AI packages, etc.

[Lenore]

Just wanted to say that the use fake sleep option, at least for me, doesn't work .. he never wakes up. Maybe it's the go to bed mod?? I'll try it without. Also .. no matter if I have hood unchecked, it still sticks a hood on me. Honestly, I love that this mod puts furniture into use, I love that you can plop furniture down anywhere. If it weren't for the comments you added, I'd be sorely tempted to go to an earlier version.

Edited December 5, 2024 by Lenore

[Lazy Palm]

On 12/4/2024 at 10:38 PM, Kargano01 said:

It is a global issue. Makes no different wich DD is choosen from your Mod.

 

Direct apply DD works well ( if i put something in my inventory and put it on). 

 

And it was by me a Fresh game. After Pc create i go directly to my follower no other mods will fire up in this time. 

And with the older Version, all works fine. 

 

OK, I am going to try to add some more logging or an mcm option to spit out more information into message boxes as it tries to find and equip stuff in my next preview. I will keep working the problem until a solution is found!

[Lazy Palm]

On 12/4/2024 at 11:29 PM, Talesien said:

Long story short, I think you need to find a better way to have the follower win/end the fight. Relying on the follower to eventually win is not a good strategy, it can take forever or not happen at all, due to pathing issues, follower (or enemy) AI packages, etc.

 

Well, my original stab at this was to record a last safe area and teleport the group (via moveto) back to that area and then play the scene (even some of the dialogue is still written that way "I had to drag you out", so maybe mechanically it would be more robust to go back to that.  Thanks testing it so much!  Good to know, even if it needs to be changed.

[Lazy Palm]

15 hours ago, Lenore said:

Also .. no matter if I have hood unchecked, it still sticks a hood on me.

Is this for rules or throws one on during sleep or that chastise event?  I need to make that use hoods flag global I guess.  Sorry!

 

15 hours ago, Lenore said:

Just wanted to say that the use fake sleep option, at least for me, doesn't work .. he never wakes up.

This could also be a me re-enabling stuff with out testing it enough issue.  I will check it out and make sure it is not a game problem!

[Talesien]

7 hours ago, Lazy Palm said:

 

Well, my original stab at this was to record a last safe area and teleport the group (via moveto) back to that area and then play the scene (even some of the dialogue is still written that way "I had to drag you out", so maybe mechanically it would be more robust to go back to that.  Thanks testing it so much!  Good to know, even if it needs to be changed.

The venerable YMOYL tended to have you wake up at the nearest inn (also an option in many other Death Alternative mods). Given that, there seems to be some way to determine which one that is. Might be a better option, rather than the last safe place, which might be half a continent away. (Yes I use teleportation magic, usually Translocation, gives you some flexibility, especially in going home fast, without completely negating the need to travel by more mundane methods).

[DonQuiWho]

On 11/26/2024 at 1:15 AM, Talesien said:

Say, is there something in Bindings that on getting hit in combat, randomly puts out a notification "Fuck, that hit got something important.", locks up the player controls, adds around 20k health and some sort of night vision?
Just trying to find what mod does this, and I didn't add or update that many since my last game, which did not suffer from this.
 

 

I was wondering what was making my PC get a free 20K health boost, as she hadn't been known to pop steroids previously .....

 

That was using 1.5.97 and the Binding 0.1.10 v01 issue

 

I've read through the subsequent thread and I'll update Binding and have a go with later releases but one thing that I can't seem to see stated clearly is whether or not that will, or won't, still add the 20k health, even if you have no current dom, nor a potential one - so far I have never designated one.  Is there any clarity on that, pls? 

 

Fights, and mods like Defeat and its addons become pretty pointless, unuseable even, when your player is that unbeatable and seems to become so without any obvious way of your being warned about it

 

NB: This is not at all meant to be a criticism, as I realise that this is a very promising and ambitious, but consequently highly challenging, WIP!

 

DQW 

 

[Talesien]

2 hours ago, DonQuiWho said:

 

I was wondering what was making my PC get a free 20K health boost, as she hadn't been known to pop steroids previously .....

 

That was using 1.5.97 and the Binding 0.1.10 v01 issue

 

I've read through the subsequent thread and I'll update Binding and have a go with later releases but one thing that I can't seem to see stated clearly is whether or not that will, or won't, still add the 20k health, even if you have no current dom, nor a potential one - so far I have never designated one.  Is there any clarity on that, pls? 

 

Fights, and mods like Defeat and its addons become pretty pointless, unuseable even, when your player is that unbeatable and seems to become so without any obvious way of your being warned about it

 

NB: This is not at all meant to be a criticism, as I realise that this is a very promising and ambitious, but consequently highly challenging, WIP!

 

DQW 

 

Untick "Enable Pre-Enslavement Events" in Preferences and it won't (as far as my testing goes at least). If it's ticked, behavior is still a bit ... off, so it might happen. See my next post.
At any rate that Health boost always came with locked controls, so you gain nothing from the health pool and need to reload anyway. If you had controls and all that health, that's either a completely new twist to this bug or you unlocked your controls with the console or a mod. If the latter, well, just fix your health the same way.

[Talesien]

Stumbled upon another interesting bug with that pre-enslavement function. Had a follower, marked it as potential dom, got taken out, talked me out of it to gain a second chance and then ditched that follower (too passive in combat for some reason, yet overpowered if she was actually starting to fight).
So I'm in Fort Greenwall merrily beating up that bandid scum when all of a sudden my controls froze. Next my no longer a follower follower is teleported onto the scene, proceeds to burn the remaining bandits to ash, moves towards me and does nothing. Luckily, I was close enough to start a dialogue and 're-hire' her. Once an active follower again things progressed as normal. I'm not sure, though this is supposed to happen? I would hope not.


Edit: Just got the "Harsh Bondage" event, no devices got applied, but I got a message box "Valid Set []", something like that (sorry, been too hasty in clicking it away). I do have various items ticked in the harsh bondage setting, but it appears my general Bondage settings got reset and some point. So perhaps it was looking for that and found nothing selected and lacks a fallback if the user did not make his own choices?
 

Edited December 8, 2024 by Talesien

[Lazy Palm]

3 hours ago, Talesien said:

Stumbled upon another interesting bug with that pre-enslavement function. Had a follower, marked it as potential dom, got taken out, talked me out of it to gain a second chance and then ditched that follower (too passive in combat for some reason, yet overpowered if she was actually starting to fight).
So I'm in Fort Greenwall merrily beating up that bandid scum when all of a sudden my controls froze. Next my no longer a follower follower is teleported onto the scene, proceeds to burn the remaining bandits to ash, moves towards me and does nothing. Luckily, I was close enough to start a dialogue and 're-hire' her. Once an active follower again things progressed as normal. I'm not sure, though this is supposed to happen? I would hope not.


Edit: Just got the "Harsh Bondage" event, no devices got applied, but I got a message box "Valid Set []", something like that (sorry, been too hasty in clicking it away). I do have various items ticked in the harsh bondage setting, but it appears my general Bondage settings got reset and some point. So perhaps it was looking for that and found nothing selected and lacks a fallback if the user did not make his own choices?

Yeah, you probably were still sitting in the 2nd phase of that event (unless you nuked it with a safeword).  That said, how you described what happened was for sure not how it should mechanically work 🙂 Was this with a more complex or basic follower by chance?

 

Thanks for catching this bug!  The empty build your own sets should default back to the default stuff if they are empty.  SO, 100% for sure something is broken. I thought I had some safeguards but clearly I missed something.

[Talesien]

3 minutes ago, Lazy Palm said:

Yeah, you probably were still sitting in the 2nd phase of that event (unless you nuked it with a safeword).  That said, how you described what happened was for sure not how it should mechanically work 🙂 Was this with a more complex or basic follower by chance?

 

Thanks for catching this bug!  The empty build your own sets should default back to the default stuff if they are empty.  SO, 100% for sure something is broken. I thought I had some safeguards but clearly I missed something.

It was a simple follower.

[Lazy Palm]

On 12/5/2024 at 2:59 PM, Lenore said:

Just wanted to say that the use fake sleep option, at least for me, doesn't work .. he never wakes up.

 

Yeah, gets stuck at phase 100 for me also when camping.  I am going to attempt to get it fixed.  Thanks for letting me know!!

 

edit: well, I was wrong.  I just was not giving the dom follower enough time to sleep.  actually seems to be working fine for me.  I am going to with the go to bed mod (sp? - I will scroll back up in a minute and get the for sure name) and see!

 

edit: another update - so I added go to bed, and it is wild, when you try to do the sleep dialog with the hotkey, it just bounces around the camera angle.  The fake sleep does work on camping, and no beds (with furniture), but not with no beds (hogtied).  I was still using the hidden bedroll for that one.  I will add fake sleep to that mode also, and test it a bunch more!

 

Sorry it has taken so long to get a handle on this one!

Edited December 8, 2024 by Lazy Palm

[Lazy Palm]

36 minutes ago, Talesien said:

It was a simple follower.

 

Crap.  Oh well, this thing is going to get some overhaul tomorrow I think 🙂

[Lazy Palm]

7 hours ago, DonQuiWho said:

I was wondering what was making my PC get a free 20K health boost, as she hadn't been known to pop steroids previously .....

 

That was using 1.5.97 and the Binding 0.1.10 v01 issue

 

I've read through the subsequent thread and I'll update Binding and have a go with later releases but one thing that I can't seem to see stated clearly is whether or not that will, or won't, still add the 20k health, even if you have no current dom, nor a potential one - so far I have never designated one.  Is there any clarity on that, pls? 

 

Fights, and mods like Defeat and its addons become pretty pointless, unuseable even, when your player is that unbeatable and seems to become so without any obvious way of your being warned about it

 

NB: This is not at all meant to be a criticism, as I realise that this is a very promising and ambitious, but consequently highly challenging, WIP!

 

DQW 

 

4 hours ago, Talesien said:

Untick "Enable Pre-Enslavement Events" in Preferences and it won't (as far as my testing goes at least). If it's ticked, behavior is still a bit ... off, so it might happen. See my next post.
At any rate that Health boost always came with locked controls, so you gain nothing from the health pool and need to reload anyway. If you had controls and all that health, that's either a completely new twist to this bug or you unlocked your controls with the console or a mod. If the latter, well, just fix your health the same way.

 

Thanks @Talesien for the suggestion on this one!  I am going to re-work this whole thing so hopefully this will be a moot point by the next dev release.

 

Tis the season for bugs around here 🤣

[DonQuiWho]

5 hours ago, Lazy Palm said:

 

 

Thanks @Talesien for the suggestion on this one!  I am going to re-work this whole thing so hopefully this will be a moot point by the next dev release.

 

Tis the season for bugs around here 🤣

 

@Talesien

 

Thanks to both of you for that help

 

And yes, the redoubtable Console Fixer is my best friend in all of Skyrim .... 😉

 

DQW

[Lazy Palm]

12 hours ago, Talesien said:

Edit: Just got the "Harsh Bondage" event, no devices got applied, but I got a message box "Valid Set []", something like that (sorry, been too hasty in clicking it away). I do have various items ticked in the harsh bondage setting, but it appears my general Bondage settings got reset and some point. So perhaps it was looking for that and found nothing selected and lacks a fallback if the user did not make his own choices?

 

So I bumped into this one also.  I did leave the valid sets debug message box there, oops, but it did equip the default items when I tried.  Now that I am writing this though, maybe I need to create and clear a set to test also... Will try that.

 

Yeah, and sorry if stuff got reset, I think I have been messing with the storage mechanisms a bit between releases.

[Lenore]

8 hours ago, Lazy Palm said:

Sorry it has taken so long to get a handle on this one!

 

I'm sorry. I just have been so busy that I haven't had time to mess with it myself. But it's nice to see you're making progress!  

Go to Bed

Edited December 8, 2024 by Lenore

[Talesien]

2 hours ago, Lazy Palm said:

 

So I bumped into this one also.  I did leave the valid sets debug message box there, oops, but it did equip the default items when I tried.  Now that I am writing this though, maybe I need to create and clear a set to test also... Will try that.

 

Yeah, and sorry if stuff got reset, I think I have been messing with the storage mechanisms a bit between releases.

Out of curiosity, what version of DD are you running? I'm on DD5.2 + NG 0.3.9b2. I kinda doubt it makes a difference, given that the options in Bindings are mostly the ol' reliables that should not have changed since 5.0 beta, but you never know ...

[Lazy Palm]

1 hour ago, Talesien said:

Out of curiosity, what version of DD are you running? I'm on DD5.2 + NG 0.3.9b2. I kinda doubt it makes a difference, given that the options in Bindings are mostly the ol' reliables that should not have changed since 5.0 beta, but you never know ...

 

5.2 with no NG on this dev computer.  My AE test computer that I am running 5.2 + NG on is currently not launching NG, throws up some version is not compatible with SKSE error (made sure both were the latest), and I have not had the energy to debug it more.  Guess I need figure that out.

[Lazy Palm]

4 hours ago, Lenore said:

 

I'm sorry. I just have been so busy that I haven't had time to mess with it myself. But it's nice to see you're making progress!  

Go to Bed

 

Same one I am testing on.  Thanks for confirming!

[Talesien]

1 hour ago, Lazy Palm said:

 

5.2 with no NG on this dev computer.  My AE test computer that I am running 5.2 + NG on is currently not launching NG, throws up some version is not compatible with SKSE error (made sure both were the latest), and I have not had the energy to debug it more.  Guess I need figure that out.

Given DD NG should be compatible with about any version from 1.5.97 up to 1.6.1179 that sounds kinda odd ...

[Talesien]

12 hours ago, Lazy Palm said:

 

So I bumped into this one also.  I did leave the valid sets debug message box there, oops, but it did equip the default items when I tried.  Now that I am writing this though, maybe I need to create and clear a set to test also... Will try that.

 

Yeah, and sorry if stuff got reset, I think I have been messing with the storage mechanisms a bit between releases.

In same vein, I wondered why the Dom considered a rule all the time, but never added one. Ok, Skyrim RNG is shitty, and the chance was only 20%, still seemed odd. Until I checked and noticed that the "Rules enabled (for Dom controlled)", also seem to have gotten reset. Again, seems not to have a working fallback, at least for me.

Also, Binding still seems to lose against NFF's sandboxing. Like say, I kneel at an Inn, Mistress starts to move to me, then turns around and gets another drink. Priorities I'm sure. 😛 
(Ok, pretty much the same issue as with the crafting during the enslavement scene, that I already reported, still thought it might be worthwhile mentioning.)


Edit: How long is the whipping (using Pama's Beatup) supposed to go? The Pama setting is 35 secs, I found no setting in Bindings to that end, but Mistress is beating me up for 10 min (real time) straight now and every time I hit the action key it just states that she is not done with me yet. Safewording also did not help, it ended the event ... according to the MCM, but the whipping continues. (Resetting Pamatronics Beatup from its MCM did end it, at least ... I will probably need multiple potions of ultimate healing now. I shall send the bill for them your way. 😛)

Finally, I got several notifications that I received a point, yet the MCM still shows zero points. Might be due to Dom controlled being active. Still it should either show the correct number of points, or not show any notifications that you gained one. Either is fine with me, but the current state is ... confusing.

 

Edited December 9, 2024 by Talesien

[Lazy Palm]

2 hours ago, Talesien said:

In same vein, I wondered why the Dom considered a rule all the time, but never added one. Ok, Skyrim RNG is shitty, and the chance was only 20%, still seemed odd. Until I checked and noticed that the "Rules enabled (for Dom controlled)", also seem to have gotten reset. Again, seems not to have a working fallback, at least for me.

 

Yeah, more debugging messages I forgot to clear out.  Sorry!  I will add that to the list!  So it zeroed out the chance the rule gets added % between 0.01.10 and 0.02.01 preview? I revamped the rules engine, so that could be a side effect.

 

2 hours ago, Talesien said:

Also, Binding still seems to lose against NFF's sandboxing. Like say, I kneel at an Inn, Mistress starts to move to me, then turns around and gets another drink. Priorities I'm sure. 😛 
(Ok, pretty much the same issue as with the crafting during the enslavement scene, that I already reported, still thought it might be worthwhile mentioning.)

 

Yeah, NFF sand boxing is the bane of my existence.  I actually know how to overpower it now, I just have a dozen places where I still need to make that happen. Was this during any certain event?

 

3 hours ago, Talesien said:

Edit: How long is the whipping (using Pama's Beatup) supposed to go? The Pama setting is 35 secs, I found no setting in Bindings to that end, but Mistress is beating me up for 10 min (real time) straight now and every time I hit the action key it just states that she is not done with me yet. Safewording also did not help, it ended the event ... according to the MCM, but the whipping continues. (Resetting Pamatronics Beatup from its MCM did end it, at least ... I will probably need multiple potions of ultimate healing now. I shall send the bill for them your way. 😛)

 

Pama should go after you for 5 to 10 game minutes (RNG), then give you the "hurts so much" message where the action key should give you the ask to end it messagebox.  Clearly that is not working you.  You can send my damage bill High Hrothgar, Wulfgar probably owes me one 🙂

 

I am thinking that maybe I need to add a heartbeat option to the pap logging and timestamp it, so we can see how long the cycles for this are hanging on the 10,000,000 mod super list.  I am wondering if it is just starved, but maybe not since you are getting that message when you press action.  Let me go look at it all again.

 

3 hours ago, Talesien said:

Finally, I got several notifications that I received a point, yet the MCM still shows zero points. Might be due to Dom controlled being active. Still it should either show the correct number of points, or not show any notifications that you gained one. Either is fine with me, but the current state is ... confusing.

 

This is a new one for me.  I will check it out!

[Talesien]

7 hours ago, Lazy Palm said:

Yeah, NFF sand boxing is the bane of my existence.  I actually know how to overpower it now, I just have a dozen places where I still need to make that happen. Was this during any certain event?

Both, at first it Inspection, while that pretty much worked I had the impression that NFF's "buy booze" had delayed the Doms repsonse. So I tried again just kneeling down a bit away and sure enough after a few initial steps she turns around and gets more booze, did I mention she was already knackered? Really as a Dom you've a responsibility, you should not get intoxicated!
 

7 hours ago, Lazy Palm said:

Pama should go after you for 5 to 10 game minutes (RNG), then give you the "hurts so much" message where the action key should give you the ask to end it messagebox.  Clearly that is not working you.  You can send my damage bill High Hrothgar, Wulfgar probably owes me one 🙂

 

I am thinking that maybe I need to add a heartbeat option to the pap logging and timestamp it, so we can see how long the cycles for this are hanging on the 10,000,000 mod super list.  I am wondering if it is just starved, but maybe not since you are getting that message when you press action.  Let me go look at it all again.

I remember seeing that message with the ZAP whipping, but might have been the earlier version. Gonna test. (I'm starting to wonder if at least some of my problems are connected to having upgraded Binding without starting a new game?)

I doubt it is script lag, it happened in a player home, so not much going on in the cell. I can try again with the latency tester running later today, but last time I had it going in that player home it stuck at 80ms, which according to Elephant's Script Latency Tester is pretty much the baseline for SE.

I tend to check my LO's for script lag before starting using them in earnest. While things can of course change due to faulty update or some mod getting added/swapped it's been a long time I experienced any script lag that's not also accompanied by stack dumps.

 

7 hours ago, Lazy Palm said:

Yeah, more debugging messages I forgot to clear out.  Sorry!  I will add that to the list!  So it zeroed out the chance the rule gets added % between 0.01.10 and 0.02.01 preview? I revamped the rules engine, so that could be a side effect.

No, it removed the rules I had selected to be available in the drop-down. The chance was (at least according to the MCM) still 20%. I guess I will find out later if rules get added now that I've enabled some again.

Edited December 9, 2024 by Talesien

[Lazy Palm]

1 hour ago, Talesien said:

I remember seeing that message with the ZAP whipping, but might have been the earlier version. Gonna test. (I'm starting to wonder if at least some of my problems are connected to having upgraded Binding without starting a new game?)

 

I would not discount the possibility of all the different versions piling up on an existing save having strange output.  Had I known what I know now when I put this thing out the door, I probably would have settled some of the more basic storage data structures and mechanics before I ever released it, vs. bolting parts on the car as it drives down the road.  The code from 0.1.01 and 0.2.01 through a diff would probably only have the same script name...  The other hindsight thing I would have done was keep a long running save game myself and apply all the different versions as I released them.  I guess I could do that with a new save, but don't feel like it would have the same result.  A lot of my testing is on really new-ish saves to get the cleanest slate for seeing what is malfunctioning.

 

1 hour ago, Talesien said:

I doubt it is script lag, it happened in a player home, so not much going on in the cell. I can try again with the latency tester running later today, but last time I had it going in that player home it stuck at 80ms, which according to Elephant's Script Latency Tester is pretty much the baseline for SE.

 

This sounds like a tool I really need.  I am bit obsessed with "does (x) cause any script slowdowns?"

 

1 hour ago, Talesien said:

No, it removed the rules I had selected to be available in the drop-down. The chance was (at least according to the MCM) still 20%. I guess I will find out later if rules get added now that I've enabled some again.

 

If it was between 0.1.10 and 0.2.01, I did some pretty significant changes to that part and that is another storage area getting restructured situation. Switched all the hard limit blocks to the small rules set to that disable what you want dropdown under the mcm (and under settings under the action menu), knowing those in-dev rules would make the pool get a lot larger.  And I didn't want to have to restructure the MCM every time something is added.  Also, I figured people that are using this mostly as a tie up framework to support other mods might not want all of the D/s rules.

 

If it was cleared between the first and second previews, I probably need to look at something 🤣