[WIP] Spectator Crowds and Guards (Oct 28th 2013)

[andrea fin]

i have been using the .7 original. i liked it as far as it went, although i agree with many people that it would be nice for spectators to try and join in or get so aroused they start their own action while watching. i just want to throw out some ideas on the morality guard only dealing with the player, and why this is pretty much ok to stay as it is (i disable morality guard anyway, but i had some thoughts. i would also love if there was some mod that made npcs approach each other for sex based on their arousal, since it doesnt seem lovers comfort or lovers victim are doing this for my game. i hope this beta, which i want to try,might help a bit)

 

its ok for morality guard to only pull up the pc for a number of reasons in my opinion; at the start of the game you are an outsider, and guards always watch strangers more closely. as the game progresses through the main quest, your fame grows, and you become a thane in many places where the average person is not. this means you are STILL watched closely; while you can say 'i am the thane' and get leniency, you are not setting a good example given your position in society. so guards will still rush in for you. what you do is newsworthy, but lesser known npcs its just gossip rather than scandal!

 

also, they probably grew up with the other citizen npcs and they would more likely take them aside in private afterwards to warn them about their conduct; the pc is unlikely to witness this. besides which it was YOUR lewd behaviour triggered the spectacle in the first place which led to npcs having sex watching, so you are the cause.

 

finally, the crowd may contain guards (i could relate at least one real life incident of public sex where a police officer in my country lost his job because he joined in with a couple!), the crowd mentality has an effect; it might be the crowd outnumbers the guards, in which case they will not challenge everyone, just the ones who began the whole crowd thing (the PC) because to do otherwise might cause a riot...rather than a crowd of disappointed and sexually frustrated onlookers.

 

you could concievably add an 'assessment' of the crowd mentality to the morality guard. just some sort of random numbers one for his assessment and one for the crowd mood (basically 1 is safe for guard to intervene and stop it, 2 is unsafe. guard would guess which number it is 1 or 2), if he judges the crowd might turn nasty he might wander off whistling pretending not to notice, or he might misjudge the mood and try to intervene and be stopped by ugly comments by the crowd (or even some spectators pulling out weapons) and THEN wander off with some comment about some urgent report of a crime, and how lucky everyone is he has not got time to deal with this. or if the crowd is safe and he sees it is, he actually intervenes, and the crowd are just disappointed.

 

(i dont think the mod wants to go too far on options like this for morality guards, unless you want that any guards around come running if someone draws a weapon, or guards in the crowd draw weapons, to support the one who misjudged the mood. but i am not the one doing any more modding, maybe these ideas appeal to ppl. although naked guard spectators stopping sex and breaking up the crowd would be interesting.)

[andrea fin]

i am getting ctd on any save i try cleaning to work with the new spectators...looks like i cant clean my saves since both save cleaners i have seem to clean things that i need in the savegame for SOS for some reason.

im going to try it anyway see what happens with uncleaned savegame. 

 

EDIT: i got it working. practically everyone in whiterun showed up (well 11 people including the guards). one minor moment after we had dressed and tried to move on, the crowd all started to disperse and showed up again running towards me.

 

i seem to have lost the sexlab approach dialogue for when NPC approach the PC. normally they should say something like 'hey, what about you and me in a pile of hay?', but all i get is a stock random line of their dialogue and a menu opens for my response but with no acceptance. i can still use hey handsome/excuse me lady options from the menu, but its always me approaching them that way. i am going to play some more see if this was just a temporary glitch from start of game, and if loading a savegame now will sort it. i will also try other mods i have installed for creatures and so on see if they still work.

 

i couldnt get any previous save to work with the beta, but i didnt have any without the old spectator crowds mod installed. so maybe it just breaks save games (for ppl who arent skilled at cleaning saves manually) with the old mod in. new game started with no ctd. i has sexlab disabled until after leaving helgen though. hope some of this info is useful.

 

[wpg97541]

Thanks for the update

I've translated it in French, if your are interested by localized mod.

Yes I certainly am. One way this can be accomplished is since the dialogue quests are independent of the rest, I can probably put the English ones into a separate esp file and require people to install the mod plus a language pack. Then others could be made available. People could conceivably make their own "dialogue packs" even in English that add more dialogue to the base mod just by setting up esp files with quests like the mod's dialogue quests and using the factions that the mod adds.

[wpg97541]

i am getting ctd on any save i try cleaning to work with the new spectators...looks like i cant clean my saves since both save cleaners i have seem to clean things that i need in the savegame for SOS for some reason.

im going to try it anyway see what happens with uncleaned savegame.

 

EDIT: i got it working. practically everyone in whiterun showed up (well 11 people including the guards). one minor moment after we had dressed and tried to move on, the crowd all started to disperse and showed up again running towards me.

 

i seem to have lost the sexlab approach dialogue for when NPC approach the PC. normally they should say something like 'hey, what about you and me in a pile of hay?', but all i get is a stock random line of their dialogue and a menu opens for my response but with no acceptance. i can still use hey handsome/excuse me lady options from the menu, but its always me approaching them that way. i am going to play some more see if this was just a temporary glitch from start of game, and if loading a savegame now will sort it. i will also try other mods i have installed for creatures and so on see if they still work.

 

i couldnt get any previous save to work with the beta, but i didnt have any without the old spectator crowds mod installed. so maybe it just breaks save games (for ppl who arent skilled at cleaning saves manually) with the old mod in. new game started with no ctd. i has sexlab disabled until after leaving helgen though. hope some of this info is useful.

Hi, glad to hear you got it working. I would advise going into the save cleaner and manually clearing them rather than automatic mode. The scripts to delete all start with mf_ and a couple qf_mf_

 

Clearing those should not impact other mods unless mainfct used that prefix for other mods.

[wpg97541]

i have been using the .7 original. i liked it as far as it went, although i agree with many people that it would be nice for spectators to try and join in or get so aroused they start their own action while watching. i just want to throw out some ideas on the morality guard only dealing with the player, and why this is pretty much ok to stay as it is (i disable morality guard anyway, but i had some thoughts. i would also love if there was some mod that made npcs approach each other for sex based on their arousal, since it doesnt seem lovers comfort or lovers victim are doing this for my game. i hope this beta, which i want to try,might help a bit)

 

 

 

 

its ok for morality guard to only pull up the pc for a number of reasons in my opinion; at the start of the game you are an outsider, and guards always watch strangers more closely. as the game progresses through the main quest, your fame grows, and you become a thane in many places where the average person is not. this means you are STILL watched closely; while you can say 'i am the thane' and get leniency, you are not setting a good example given your position in society. so guards will still rush in for you. what you do is newsworthy, but lesser known npcs its just gossip rather than scandal!

 

also, they probably grew up with the other citizen npcs and they would more likely take them aside in private afterwards to warn them about their conduct; the pc is unlikely to witness this. besides which it was YOUR lewd behaviour triggered the spectacle in the first place which led to npcs having sex watching, so you are the cause.

 

finally, the crowd may contain guards (i could relate at least one real life incident of public sex where a police officer in my country lost his job because he joined in with a couple!), the crowd mentality has an effect; it might be the crowd outnumbers the guards, in which case they will not challenge everyone, just the ones who began the whole crowd thing (the PC) because to do otherwise might cause a riot...rather than a crowd of disappointed and sexually frustrated onlookers.

 

you could concievably add an 'assessment' of the crowd mentality to the morality guard. just some sort of random numbers one for his assessment and one for the crowd mood (basically 1 is safe for guard to intervene and stop it, 2 is unsafe. guard would guess which number it is 1 or 2), if he judges the crowd might turn nasty he might wander off whistling pretending not to notice, or he might misjudge the mood and try to intervene and be stopped by ugly comments by the crowd (or even some spectators pulling out weapons) and THEN wander off with some comment about some urgent report of a crime, and how lucky everyone is he has not got time to deal with this. or if the crowd is safe and he sees it is, he actually intervenes, and the crowd are just disappointed.

 

(i dont think the mod wants to go too far on options like this for morality guards, unless you want that any guards around come running if someone draws a weapon, or guards in the crowd draw weapons, to support the one who misjudged the mood. but i am not the one doing any more modding, maybe these ideas appeal to ppl. although naked guard spectators stopping sex and breaking up the crowd would be interesting.)

 

 

At the moment I have no plans for the morality guards. I left them in in so that it would still be available to people. Not that I am not interested in updating the morality guard but have some major features to add to spectator crowds first (multi threads for multiple simulaneous sex acts and masturbating spectators). Those new features will not come until after this beta has been debugged and become a stable release.

[andrea fin]

cool. i am not terribly interested in morality guards myself although the idea of the crowd intimidating one from interfering and him wandering off whistling has a certain comical attraction and if someone likes those ideas enough they can always use them in their own mod.

 

i have been getting a lot of secondary sex acts starting when crowds have gathered or are dispersing. i have been approached (using the sexlab approach mod) after or during an event with spectators and even seen a guard approach as if to spectate but veer off to the event which was the trigger. so i am thinking the arousal triggering secondary sex encounters is working (at least with the PC if they were not participating in the event that attracted the crowd).

 

i am having problems with the crowd not resuming the normal activity afterwards. in the bannered mare i triggered an npc to masturbate with matchmaker, and just as that ended, the crowd began to wander off. someone then approached me and we began a scene and got another crowd. but after it ended, and i walked away from where it was, some of the crowd suddenly ran toward and surrounded me again and then stood around there.

           even the ones who looked about to resume their normal activities stoppes and stood about. i was still able to talk to hulda (actually i got spammed with random npc speech lines as soon as they surrounded me but only 1 line each) and book a room and sleep. but they were stuck in the bannered mare, even after i left it and entered the drunken huntsman.

 

there was an encounter begun with a dog (i placed with another mod) outside that ended while i was in the drunken huntsman, and the crowd seem to have dispersed back to normal, but another encounter began with the dog while i was outside the bannered mare (i had checked to see if the occupants were still standing about and they were) and a crowd gathered, and during this i was approached. after both scenes ended i noticed the crowd had 'stuck' again as if they began going back to wandering about, but then just stopped and stood around. only one stall holder went back to her place. carlotta was still inside the bannered mare, so nobody at her stall. olfred battle born and a guard were stood on the steps heading towards the gildergreen not moving. if i had begun a sex scene i am pretty sure they would have gathered again but they seem to only begin to go back to what they usually do then stop as if they have no movement AI afterwards, except to stand where they are. you can get random speech lines if you pass them, talk to them, approach them for sex, but for example, where the guards should patrol they no longer do so.

 

have you any idea why this might be? the only change i made mod wise is to remove lovers victim since the npc on npc doesnt do anything (i think it needs updating to work with latest framework 1.59 maybe) and i have more than enough ways to make my pc have sex already. after removing it, the sexlab approach dialogue came back, but it had worked fine with lovers victim previously, so i am unsure if spectators plus lovers victim was causing that problem or it was just a skyrim mod glitch.

[wpg97541]

I had this issue once or twice before but could not consistently reproduce it. I may possibly have a fix, but it won't fix the currently stuck spectators. I'm making a "Spectator Zapper" spell that should reset those characters when you fire it at them. WIll post when it is done.

[germanicus]

Beta version now available for download!

 

I have finished all my changes to the mod. Along with the previously increased limit of 128 spectators per sex act and NPC support added, here are the new updates.

•  AggroDistance is working
•  Spectator notifications are now a toggle (thanks judge0)
•  NEW! Immersive Reactions (aka Spectator AI) feature:
  • NPCs now react differently depending on their sexual orientation and the one displayed in the sex act. I went through and added a slew of new dialogue and removed some of the old dialogue to make this possible. For instance, gay characters will say different things than lesbian characters watching the same sex act.
  • Even if a sex act is marked prohibited (wrong) like city sex, not everyone will say things like "get a room". There is an override of arousal and/or sexlab purity that allows you to configure above what arousal level prohibited sex acts will be cheered on by the NPCs. NPCs above this override threshold while cheer while the others deride you for what you are doing.

It is now a workable beta ready for slightly more widespread testing.

 

It still only supports one sex act at a time and the morality guards feature is limited to the player only. Multiple sex acts simultaneously is a feature that will be added once this has undergone further testing.

 

Love the idea and the update. just one question before install it: does MCM menu still contain possibility to disable sex in public as a crime?

 

[wpg97541]

germanicus, yes of course, but download this new version that will hopefully fix the issue that  andrea fin encountered.

 

Andrea fin - download this new version - In case it does not fix the issue, I have added a spectator zapper spell - if you run into stuck spectators, you can zap them and they should return to normal.

 

NOTE: I have edited my beta version post above so that it has the same file as this link.

SpectatorCrowds.7z

[germanicus]

thank you wpg97541

[WaxenFigure]

I had this issue once or twice before but could not consistently reproduce it. I may possibly have a fix, but it won't fix the currently stuck spectators. I'm making a "Spectator Zapper" spell that should reset those characters when you fire it at them. WIll post when it is done.

 

Just make a MCM menu option to reset and release all spectators, a new spell is not really a good way to handle that.

[wpg97541]

The spell is only temporary, I wouldn't keep it there. Yes I will do an MCM menu option but wanted to get a quick fix to the one user who needed it.

[Ripcat]

Beta version now available for download!

 

Glad someone is working again on this mod, you should create a separate thread to make it easier to follow (like radient prostitution)

 

Anyway, thanks for your work!

[wpg97541]

I will make a separate thread, I wanted to check with mainfct first who made the original mod if that would be OK with him since in here it basically means posting a new download. Also, people could get confused between his mod download and my updated version. Unless he links his to mine, I might have to change the name slightly? I'd certainly rather not, it would be better if he could update his download page to point at the new download page.

[wpg97541]

Andrea Fin - can you confirm whether that has fixed the issue with the stuck spectators? That's a top priority item for me to fix if it's still present, as I don't want people to have to use the zapper spells, they are just there as a just-in-case. I was careful to program in logic originally to ensure that all new sex acts are ignored until all old spectators are cleaned up from their factions. However, I didn't have my sex act in progress flag set early enough, so sex acts starting close together could cause the issue.

[germanicus]

Wpg - I would gladly inform you if this (beta fix) working, but I'm in the middle of the process of testing two other mods and because of that, I decided to wait until you add this in MCM menu as W.F. suggested. Sorry.

[andrea fin]

i have used the targetted spell on one stuck spectator and he eventually returned to normal. i will keep testing but i have been in bleak falls barrow and just got back to riverwood. only one of the spectators that i could tell seemed stuck. although there was also a chicken watching. (and a fox watched a wolf rape a farmer in the wild which i find really funny ) but initially the spell seems to work. i will keep testing see if i can nail down what exact circumstances might cause the crowd issue. i was thinking it seemed to occur in situations when another sex act begins during a spectator event, i would like to see if that was just a coincidence, or not.

[wpg97541]

Andrea Fin - That is what I think I had fixed in the last version I posted, which you have already. Try cleaning your save game, specifically clean the mf_SpectatorCrowdsMainScript, mf_SpectatorCrowdsThread00 and mf_SpectatorCrowdsThreadBase scripts from your save game if they are present. It could be that your game is caching the script from before my update. Cleaning those three scripts from your save game ought to refresh them.

 

And yes, the creature spectators are normal. I did not block creatures the way I set up this version of the mod, I might add an MCM menu option for people who don't want creature spectators.

 

Regarding the MCM menu, I am about to move into a new house halfway across the country, so I'm not going to be able to work on the mod for the next week and a half. I didn't want to leave Andrea Fin and potentially others hanging during that period, that's the only reason I did it as a spell. I knew how to make it work as a spell would have had to research how to add it to the MCM menu as an option, since it would have to find all the current faction members and remove them, and also find people with the package overrides and remove them.

 

 

[andrea fin]

thanks for the spells. a lot of the problems have disappeared and the spells help although its not 100%; i think it may be some rare examples or as you say some script hangovers that i can live with while you are moving.

 

as an example of the rare situation, i was in a stormcloak camp and slept on a pile of hay, and dangerous nights mod triggered an encounter which brought me out of sleep but CTD. i reloaded and slept again and it triggered a spider encounter, which played out with all the stormcloaks including the wounded ones, running out to watch. after that ended the normal stormcloaks resumes their patrols or other routines, but the wounded did not return to their sick beds. even using the spell didnt do it. i left the camp and did some adventuring for an hour or so and i was near the rift watchtower and i heard a stormcloak make a battle cry. when i came out of rift watchtower the male wounded stormcloak was staring at me! i used the spell but he didnt run off. my GUESS (i have little knowledge of specific ai stuff here) is that they dont have much of an AI and its specific to them, since all they do in game is lie or sit on beds making groans and speech lines about the pain. so when released by the mod there is no bed where they stand and the AI doesnt have any way to move them back? but then why did one run halfway across skyrim to stare at me...

 

anyway in my opinion the mod is fun and useable, and i will keep using it while you move and try and find something more helpful in pinpointing this. i will try again to clean scripts, but last time i used the save cleaners they cleaned a lot of schlong scripts for a custom addon which kind of wrecked the save. every attempt bar one to load cleaned save CTD and the one time it had disabled SOS as i said. i will try just cleaning those 3 scripts see what happens lol. and thanks for the work on the mod in case i havent said already, to you and the original author.

[wpg97541]

WaxenFigure - there does not appear to be a papyrus function to list all NPCs in the game that are members of a given faction. Without that, I do not believe it is even possible to implement a cleanup in the MCM menu except as a targeted thing - but then that would only allow cleaning one spectator at a time and you'd have to go back and forth to the MCM menu. The only way I could do a mass removal without being able to list faction members, I'd have to store a duplicate copy of the faction membership lists somewhere else in a file or something using PapyrusUtil to allow the cleanup routine to work. Then the faction lists in the file could conceivably get out of sync with the faction memberships in the game itself if some threading related issue causes it to add the player to the faction another thread removes them again from the faction before they are added to the file...

[wpg97541]

I have setup a new topic for my new version that we can move discussion to:

 

http://www.loverslab.com/topic/35611-spectator-crowds-ultra-edition-with-morality-guards/

[WaxenFigure]

Haven't looked through the thread to see if this has been mentioned, but one thing that came up for me is that the morality guard thing doesn't make much sense if the person they catch me with is another guard.  You'd think they would ignore their comrades getting a little service, or at least let them finish before accosting me.

You didn't look for the new thread for the new version of this mod either.

 

You need to be in the habit of reading at least the last few posts.

[4arl1]

hi,

 

wouldnt it be possible to add an option to let the nearby NPC notice you being naked and also start cheering, apploud or even going to follow you while you re naked? haha would be awesome and immersive.

 

 

peace