Gameplayer Posted June 21, 2022 Posted June 21, 2022 (edited) Fallout 4, listen to me you will use all 8 Cores 16 threads, only 6200Mb of my shittiest RAM I could find, and you will love my modest overcloak and beg for more! Now on your Knee's Fallout 4, this is the might of my EVGA SR-2 Motherboard from the year 2009! You will bow! YES, YES, YES You will bend the knee to my 1080p stand on 60FPS from 2009! Down on your belly! AND EAT IT! EVGA SR-2 Motherboard, Windows 7 Ultimate Edition! SR-2 1200 Watt PSU Twin Paired w5580's 3.2 Ghz base clock, 3.4Ghz Boost factory clock ...Overclocked base 3.5Ghz a whole 300Mz extra in BIOS❤️, did not shut down boost clock (12-25) 6X2 Gb of Kingstone 240pin (10096) 1333Mhz RAM (thats right a whole 6 sticks baby) BIOS Overclocked to base 773xTripple Channel baby speed 2319! Geforce GTX 1080 factory clock settings 1 Terabyte SSD....derp? Cooling system original custom Custom Case on roller wheels. Eat it suckers, you all thought years ago my board was done. Edited June 21, 2022 by Gameplayer
Gameplayer Posted June 21, 2022 Author Posted June 21, 2022 16 minutes ago, Nuka Cherry said: What next? Cyberpunk 2077 on a Pentium? 1440p is next. Might replack my texture replacers and mesh replacers into BA2 formats.
Gameplayer Posted June 21, 2022 Author Posted June 21, 2022 9 minutes ago, ebbluminous said: Hide contents HAHA awesome, no I'm ok really....Its only 51C on the CPU cores. NICE PIC! I love it!
Gameplayer Posted June 21, 2022 Author Posted June 21, 2022 (edited) 2560 x 1440 resolution Just walked past BunkerHill on my way into Downtown Boston to see if I can keep 60 frames per second in 1440. Its really hard to see the screen icons on Desktop >< but in game looks great. Had no idea about Overclocking the RAM before this, and it appears to be the key factor in Fo4's performance by quite a margin bear in mind I am using an ENB and ENB is set to use 12,000 Mb for smoothing out the performance, the CPU RAM is clocking at 2300 speed and the game itself is using the listed RAM in picture at this moment its jumped up quite a bit since entering the city. Yes I am using a factory clocked GTX 1080, gotta remember that its generation GDR5 and much faster by a country mile than my DDR3 RAM. Any unused VRAM will be used up first by ENB for smoothing out performance....Well actually it appears that the RAM itself has a big impact on just more FPS not so much smoothing it out but speeding it up. EDIT, Got over to GoodNeighbor, Right in that alleyway with the Mutants, and the alley outside the entrance the FPS goes down to as low as ~45, usually its ~51-55, if I stand still for a second it shots up to 60. Resolution, 2556 x 1440 cap 60Hz Temps on CPU Cores are climbing in Downtown was ~50C, now its ~59 still plenty safe and a lot of headroom for the CPU's. It was not easy getting a screen cap of ~40's it does not stay long. But we all knew it was going to happen, although I did change the resolution from 1080p to 1440 a pretty big jump on this old system. I have some idea's on what to do next to improve the FPS but save that for another time. Edited June 21, 2022 by Gameplayer
Indarello Posted June 21, 2022 Posted June 21, 2022 7 hours ago, Gameplayer said: Fallout 4, listen to me you will use all 8 Cores 16 threads, only 6200Mb of my shittiest RAM I could find, and you will love my modest overcloak and beg for more! Now on your Knee's Fallout 4, this is the might of my EVGA SR-2 Motherboard from the year 2009! You will bow! YES, YES, YES You will bend the knee to my 1080p stand on 60FPS from 2009! Down on your belly! AND EAT IT! EVGA SR-2 Motherboard, Windows 7 Ultimate Edition! SR-2 1200 Watt PSU Twin Paired w5580's 3.2 Ghz base clock, 3.4Ghz Boost factory clock ...Overclocked base 3.5Ghz a whole 300Mz extra in BIOS❤️, did not shut down boost clock (12-25) 6X2 Gb of Kingstone 240pin (10096) 1333Mhz RAM (thats right a whole 6 sticks baby) BIOS Overclocked to base 773xTripple Channel baby speed 2319! Geforce GTX 1080 factory clock settings 1 Terabyte SSD....derp? Cooling system original custom Custom Case on roller wheels. Eat it suckers, you all thought years ago my board was done. Great, but: 1) gtx 1080 is not from 2009 2) try enable scripted physics like ocbp/ocbpc and run benchmark for 1 min running around dimond city and check 1% low fps, because 60 fps in single screenshoot actually means nothing to gameplay
Nuka Cherry Posted June 21, 2022 Posted June 21, 2022 1 hour ago, Indarello said: Great, but: 1) gtx 1080 is not from 2009 2) try enable scripted physics like ocbp/ocbpc and run benchmark for 1 min running around dimond city and check 1% low fps, because 60 fps in single screenshoot actually means nothing to gameplay Well... jiggle physics is no benchmark for gaming unless we are going full Weaboo and that is skyrim, tbh. Very impressive, regardless.
Indarello Posted June 21, 2022 Posted June 21, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Nuka Cherry said: Well... jiggle physics is no benchmark for gaming unless we are going full Weaboo and that is skyrim, tbh. Very impressive, regardless. So you are going to play without physics ? I am suggesting it because for me system goes from ~50 fps 1% low to ~10-15 fps if I remember correctly And I have i5 10500 Edited June 21, 2022 by Indarello
Gameplayer Posted June 21, 2022 Author Posted June 21, 2022 5 hours ago, Indarello said: Great, but: 1) gtx 1080 is not from 2009 2) try enable scripted physics like ocbp/ocbpc and run benchmark for 1 min running around dimond city and check 1% low fps, because 60 fps in single screenshoot actually means nothing to gameplay Correct, GTX 1080 was from May of 2016....A proper 2009 card would be the GTX 580Ti, only got one of those, and it would not be as much fun as GTX 1080. For the run I wanted to pull out as many stops as I could and see why my computer was doing so poorly with games such as Fallout 4 and SkyrimSE. What I think I have actually demonstrated is that those games are RAM starved. My base clock puts the RAM at 1500 speed and the OC brought the RAM up to 2301 speed... People looking at 1500 RAM speed vs 2300 RAM speed probably are not realizing that is a plus 800 difference in RAM speeds an increase of over 50% effective speed. That was the most massive impact on my actual in game performance probably more than the GTX 1080 itself, and I dont have too many Cards to swap around that would work on Fallout 4 to prove that out, got a EVGA GTX 1060TI SC that was in there before, however the difference in overall performance of that card to the 1080 ~65%. So that might be enough of a performance swap out to really highlight the effectiveness of jumping up RAM speeds for Bethsada games. I am a Mod Author here are almost all the popular outfits done in Atomic Beauty OCBP that I have done, https://www.loverslab.com/files/file/19277-bodyslide-outfits-for-atomic-beauty-and-ikaros-android-race-ocbp-3bbb/ Yes OCBP physics is a real hit to the performance. It is currently in my game and the boob shake issue that people report all the time about it well that is pretty much gone, although I have seen it at least once or twice last night and if I was not looking for it likely would not have seen it. I will make my way over to Diamond City, I'll get some snaps and I'm still learning about these testing tools aw mostly because I wanted to test my OC and do it right, there is quite a bit of literature to go through on that department still. 4 hours ago, Nuka Cherry said: Well... jiggle physics is no benchmark for gaming unless we are going full Weaboo and that is skyrim, tbh. Very impressive, regardless. Well uh....This playthrough is being done with quite a few mods....Quite a few of those Weaboo mods >< Correct a proper Benchmark would not have much in game mods if any only the absolutely required ones to get the game running. Thank you.
Gameplayer Posted June 23, 2022 Author Posted June 23, 2022 (edited) More EVGA SR-2 grandpa Motherboard madness, So today my new ehem uh probably refurbished memory came in, Gkill RipJaws X 6x4GB DDR3 1600 PC3 12800 Quite a nice step up from having 6x2 Kingston 1333 Previously I was wrong about the aforementioned clock on my memory there was a clock but it was only x2 not x3, DDR ---means Double Data Rate, so CPUz gives you a number for speed its listed say 666 but its really 666x2=1333. CPUz will report 1600 speed as 800 basically. Yes I can overclock these but after having done a lot more reading since I put the order in...Hindsight is 20/20 vision right...I should have gotten an order of 4x8Gb at best available RAM speed which I think was 2400. Now it gets iffy, its not that my MotherBoard would just run them at that speed nope have to Overclock that socket and the higher ceiling gives good barrier against problems. Also I went ahead while I had the MOBO up on the workbench to go ahead and check every plug, that is when I noticed I had not plugged in the aux power cables for OC the CPU's, basically my prior OC was based entirely on the voltages fed by the main lines. There are aux lines that allow for more Voltage, dont think I need them just yet the main lines are already delivering up to around 1.35volts and the OC group is saying 1.40ish is about where to stop anything past that is chancy on this model. Also from my reading I may actually want to experiment with lower voltage for the particlar model CPUs and the frequency setting is low for current voltage. What is the point? Well from what I have found is that Fo4 benefits quite a bit from having the following, Good CPU GHz, good ram speeds, and more RAM. I have also found that 1 thread is always hit real hard while all other threads stay real low. -Possible Solution? Remove HyperThreading, my CPU's each have 4 Core and 8Threads, yes Fo4 uses both CPU's. -Removing Threading, should mean that the COREs will apply more brute force and that single annoying thread should work better. -I have not tested that yet. TLTR notes, Removed Boost Setting, Removed Vdroop, Bumbed base clock ~3.8GHz, swapped RAM sticks to 6x4Gb 1600 DDR3 My shitty snapshot of Downtown Boston in 1440p FPS ranges about ~55-60 FPS now. Adjusted the ENBlocal VideoMemorySizeMb=32000 YES ENB has quite an effect on steady FPS, and yes you can get non-graphics enhancement version from ENB BOOST version! YES you should be using ENB BOOST without a doubt! Boris Tool for detection says I can go to 64000Mb in that setting now but I wanted plenty of excess for background programs, I suspect though I could and probably should put in 48000Mb there. Note present 4K big screen only goes to 60Hz, so that is why I am trying to nail down ~59 FPS rather than trying for huge numbers. Findings so far, more/faster computer memory gives good gains for FPS in Fo4, the effect is really quite easy to observe. Everything you can do to therefore minimize the size of the information that has to be fed into and through the memory will also do a lot to help the performance, so IF you are using 2K/4K texture packs, loads of enhanced meshes it is ideal to get them packed in BA2 archive rather than "loose" do not simply say I have graphics card X and this is what I should have. Edited June 23, 2022 by Gameplayer
Gameplayer Posted June 23, 2022 Author Posted June 23, 2022 (edited) BUT Gameplayer!? Shitty hardware why test it on Shitty Hardware? Uh, its not shitty hardware but its not the newest hardware either, Plus new end hardware is not really ideal for show casing just how extreme a difference changing out some parts can make. In my experiment I have found that although a GTX 1080 was pretty good the GTX 1060Ti model was just fine, The main linchpin for gameplay FPS to be consistent and high was in fact the amount of physical RAM thrown at the game and the speed of the RAM as well. Being able to overclock the CPU and the RAM helped illustrate this even more, as I could dial in significantly higher settings without a worry about this particular board going to shit, check out those temps well under threat range, plenty of overhead to go higher but I wont because I want to get a better cooler before doing any 4.4Ghz runs in OC. Now here is another thing, If I can show you that I can easily get ~55-60 FPS at 1440p in downtown Boston than you can pretty much figure that most everywhere else in the game I can easily push well above 60FPS in 1080p, sorry but that should be obvious what might not be obvious is that if your following Youtube all those video's are actually recorded and displayed at 1080p....Sure you see some saying well its in 1440 or 4K but at the end of the day those are 1080p video's because that is mostly the bulk of what is uploaded there unless you are a vendor and most of the influencers are not vendors. BUT Gameplayer? I get XYZ amount for Fo4! So there and my Favorite Youtber gets this XYZ amount so there! Uh buddy, you are on a modding Site, most likely a lot of the people here are running a lot of mods, this was a modded run and not too shabby amount of mods was put in there plus its running at a nice resolution and FPS amount in the Shittiest test location. This was never a well I want 1,000,000 FPS or go home kind of thing. It was, Run Modded, run at 2K resolution, and run as well as possible in Downtown at 60FPS on Bigscreen. Find the hardware issues that hold that back... The issue is having enough excess RAM and at least good speed RAM...Also a GTX 1000 series card is required because 2K resolution. People coming into threads, saying "Well I just turn off ENB and I get instant boost." They dont know what they are talking about, ENBBoost is an actual thing, if I can show that throwing more RAM at the problem solves the issue with an ENB Preset running than you have no excuse to not use ENB Boost. Can throw more VideoMemorySizeMb in there, Can go all the way up to around 64,000 if I want presently to smooth out my low end and keep lower FPS numbers higher on the low side if I need too as a direct result of having more excess RAM memory available to play with. Edited June 23, 2022 by Gameplayer
Gameplayer Posted June 23, 2022 Author Posted June 23, 2022 More on RAM memory So you have nice new shiny DDR4 RAM @3200 speed, oh nice shiny....Oh boy your going to bring doom upon us all! Not so fast there little whipper snapper, did you open that computer case to check and see that its not a single 8GB stick? Cause if it is that stick is only doing at best 1600 speed...AT BEST. Simple solution to fix this problem is to open the case and look inside, 1 stick your fucked until you pair it with a matched partner...By matched I mean the same brand and model, if you can not find one online you will likely have to spring for a matched pair and just ebay that single to some other sucker, or maybe someone that happens to have that same RAM stick model all alone in which case for them Also note that, and this is important your DDR4 3200 speed RAM is coming in stock under-clocked....Derpy Derp WAIT WHAT? Yes its under clocked more than likely, You have to enter the BIOS of the PC, you get there by pressing DEL or F1, or F11 on a computer before its done bragging about its basic information before the Windows screen pops up. Best if you go online and find a real guide for how to fix this for your PC, dont assume nothing about your RAM speeds until you know for certain about it use an application such as CPUz, AIDA64, Elite Tuner to find out your speed on your own. If that CPU in there is an AMD CPU chances are its also downthrottling another 1/2 its listed speed, Only way to know for certain is to just look up your CPU and its specifications. It may only be rated for 2333 or speed lower than 3200. >< ouch entering DDR3 territory right there. DDR4 RAM uses high speeds to overcome its bad CAS Latency, basically CL is your responsiveness of your RAM to change tasks. DDR4 RAM with 3200, has 30-30-30-48 CL DDR3 RAM with 2400 has ~11-11-11-28 CL If your DDR4 3200 is kneecapped at 2333 speed and your latency is still near the same or higher than my example DDR3 your computer is not responsive and its not as fast as last generation. DDR4 RAM at 2400 speed needs to have better CL than best DDR3 RAM to begin justifying having it in your Board. DDR 3 RAM can come in at 2666 speed with a low CL! It does require more voltage than DDR4 though which also you have to check your Board specs to be sure it can get enough power! Or you have to have a Board meant for Over Clocks. Imagine 2666 speed with CL values that beat the heck out of DDR4 3200, well its possible yes...And no one trying to sell you on DDR4 3200 ever compares DDR 2666 with 10-10-10-28 CL values its always, Lets compare DDR3 2400 vs DDR4 3200, They always pick the worst case or most common installed case to compare to the new thing they want you to purchase with your cash. Even then I would expect the DDR4 in proper speeds and timings to do really well vs ideal DDR3 2666. Why bring it up? Because not every gamer has DDR4 3200, a lot of them have a lot less than that, DDR4 ~2333 is more likely plus they have bad CL rating (lower CL better) You could have bad speed plus bad CL because you never checked your BIOS even though your part says its DDR4 3200! If that is the case your FPS in your games is doing way worse than my Muscle PC build from 2009! How does any of that matter GAMEPLAYER Im not an Esports Guy! It matters more to you than the Esports young modder. Because we are not playing vanilla SkyrimSE or vanilla Fallout 4! We are throwing mods at this game and the typical mega modder has ~200-700 Gigs of Mods installed on their game. Then we turn around and demand 60FPS stable on 2K resolution and then cry on the Forum about how our Geforce 2080 doesnt get the job done! Meanwhile Gamplayer is getting 60FPS 1440p with 250 Gigs of mods installed and an ENB preset too boot on a PC build from 2009 to really rub the salt in the wound. Another Case Scenario We have the new modder using modern hardware but in this example they have at least proper speeds and timings. There are two most often problems, #1 They got enough RAM for playing games which means they have 16Gigs. #2 They have a high speed HDD that is rotary disk. #3 They have Win10 installed Alright so its great gaming machine plays all the other titles and even pulls a respectable ~35-60 FPS in Cyberpuke 2077. All your gamer friends are jeally of your amazing PC. Problems? Yes. #1 You have enough RAM to play games but do you have enough RAM to play a monster load order? No you dont, you need more RAM to hold all that info....There are ways around that but you could not be bothered to pack the mods into proper BA2 formats because superior computer! Go YOU Better would be that you had loads of RAM with super low CL value so your RAM could dump the information faster and pick up new information faster...Also at least decent speed for SkyrimSE and Fallout4....Its not real hard to get decent speed plus low CL for DDR3 RAM. Too surmount that and kick DDR3 user between the legs you would need to tweak it out properly and there are loads of guides on doing just that but even then you still should have way more RAM than you were told online by the vendors because you are playing modded. 16GB modded not enough sadface. #2 Its 2022 dude....HDD as your gaming drive, let alone as the drive you boot from.....Derp, still happens. SATA II : 300Mb/s 2way SATA 3 : 600Mb/s 2Way USB 3 : 500Mb/s. 1Way PCIe 2.0 : 500Mb/s 2 way PCIe 3.0 : 980Mb/s 2way From my reading there are some special versions of PCI 2 and 3 that offer better speeds than my ballpark figures. Understand your rotary drive has an additional mechanical layer that limits its speed for DTR data transmission rate. Best options as a Mod User is to use SSD, PCIe 2 or 3 drives. SSD is 2 to 3 times faster than HDD because HDD uses mechanical parts that have a speed rating rather than direct energy like an SSD. PCIe 3.1 can go 16 to 32 times faster than SSD but only with specific MotherBoard and gear. PCIe 3.0 with the right storage device will be best solution to negate this issue at present time and may be effective enough in a PCIe 2 slot. #3 Windows 10 installation, You are literally kneecapping your amount of available RAM in the Gigs department. Not sure I have to really say too much more but we are talking about 1-3 Gigs more RAM usage than a gamer on Win7. Before moving on, Playing Fallout 4 with a monitoring program I have easily seen it use 16Gb of RAM, meaning if your on Win10 using 4 to 6 GB of your 16 Gig RAM pool.... Modded games need more than listed RAM pool available for high FPS. Simple Solutions, 1) Cut Back on your Mods....LOL who does that! 2) Pack your loose files into BA2 format....Lol who does that! 3) Buy more RAM.....Say what willis? ENB Boost, "Oh my god, I such amazing FPS with this turned off," "I have tried that an it sucks" "It dont work." Ehem....Uh it dont work because you dont have enough spare RAM cache to make proper use of it, or dont have enough RAM to cover the 200,000,000 Gigs of Mods you installed... There is actually a whole perfect storm of possible issues that can rob your computer of performance and if you dont account for your RAM budget, your mods added into the game will only hurt your FPS limits. IF we plan for excess RAM above our needs than that additional RAM can be used by ENB Boost or ENB Preset with negligable impacts and even performance gains in regard to ENB Boost default itself. This really ended up a lot longer than I wanted it too ><
tecckblade Posted June 24, 2022 Posted June 24, 2022 He wasnt down town so who cares, anyone could do 60 fps out in the world you do 60 fps near DC an a 2009 pc then we can talk
Gameplayer Posted June 24, 2022 Author Posted June 24, 2022 Where are the best spots in Downtown to go... How about the top of that Tower, Strong is in maybe.... There are the bridges can have a run over there and see how it does.
Keats Posted July 3, 2022 Posted July 3, 2022 (edited) On 6/24/2022 at 2:36 AM, Gameplayer said: DDR4 RAM uses high speeds to overcome its bad CAS Latency, basically CL is your responsiveness of your RAM to change tasks. DDR4 RAM with 3200, has 30-30-30-48 CL DDR3 RAM with 2400 has ~11-11-11-28 CL If your DDR4 3200 is kneecapped at 2333 speed and your latency is still near the same or higher than my example DDR3 your computer is not responsive and its not as fast as last generation. If you find yourself running DDR4 3200 and CAS 30, you should RMA either the RAM or your motherboard because it's running way out of spec. The slowest JEDEC standard for 3200MHz is CAS 24, and most modules sold will be 22 or 20. And if you have XMP enabled, it'll probably be CAS 16 or even 14. If your RAM is running at 2400MHz, CAS should be 15 at most. Edited July 3, 2022 by Keats 1
Gameplayer Posted July 3, 2022 Author Posted July 3, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Keats said: If you find yourself running DDR4 3200 and CAS 30, you should RMA either the RAM or your motherboard because it's running way out of spec. The slowest JEDEC standard for 3200MHz is CAS 24, and most modules sold will be 22 or 20. And if you have XMP enabled, it'll probably be CAS 16 or even 14. If your RAM is running at 2400MHz, CAS should be 15 at most. Good point, and I did see a lot of performance DDR4 3200 with great CAS while learning up on RAM and thinking up a future build. In fact DDR4 3200 came at great price points in 16Gbx2 way better than most other stuff I looked through while thinking up my next build. Edited July 3, 2022 by Gameplayer 1
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