Hi Gloss Texture / Specularity After Making New Normal?

[C5Kev]

Hi folks. Some of you may have noticed a couple of my retex mods...and one I'm working on now is giving me problems.  After making new textures and a new normal, when I go in-game the textures have a high gloss / super specular thing going on and it's apparently due to the normal map(s) I made. If the textures have transparency, I save the normal in DXT 3 or 5. If no transparency, I save the normals as DXT 1. When this does happen and I replace my normal with the original one and POOF!  The high gloss / super specular thing goes away.  ???  

 

I'm pretty good with graphics, but aren't all that familiar with the workings of the game. I've tried fooling with settings in NifSkope, but that's been "pissing in the wind" so to speak. So I was hoping someone could give me some insight as to why or what is causing this high specularity nonsense and how I might get rid of it.

 

Sincerely, Confused.

[Vioxsis]

The gloss map for skyrim is stored in the alpha channel of the normal map.

The new normals you made are probably missing the alpha or just set to white.

You can make yourself one to insert in to the normals alpha (adding some detail as you like), or just add one and fill it with a dark grey (black is none glossy white is high gloss).

[C5Kev]

9 minutes ago, Vioxsis said:

The gloss map for skyrim is stored in the alpha channel of the normal map.

The new normals you made are probably missing the alpha or just set to white.

You can make yourself one to insert in to the normals alpha (adding some detail as you like), or just add one and fill it with a dark grey (black is none glossy white is high gloss).

 

Ahhhh, that makes sense. I'll check that out - thanks a bunch!

[C5Kev]

17 hours ago, Vioxsis said:

The gloss map for skyrim is stored in the alpha channel of the normal map.

The new normals you made are probably missing the alpha or just set to white.

You can make yourself one to insert in to the normals alpha (adding some detail as you like), or just add one and fill it with a dark grey (black is none glossy white is high gloss).

 

Nope, I don't think this is the issue.

[Vioxsis]

Hmm.. If its not the normal then i can only really make guesses as to what it could be.

It would go much quicker if you could link me the nif and textures as well as your retexture of it so i can check it out for myself.

[Andy14]

It's the normalmap, the alpha - I'm sure.
For example - look in normalmaps of hair, almost completely transparent.

 

DXT3 should only be used for hard transition of alpha-not alpha.
There is no soft alpha blending with DXT3.
Better is DXT5 or without compression in RGB8A.

[C5Kev]

38 minutes ago, Vioxsis said:

Hmm.. If its not the normal then i can only really make guesses as to what it could be.

It would go much quicker if you could link me the nif and textures as well as your retexture of it so i can check it out for myself.

 

25 minutes ago, Andy14 said:

It's the normalmap, the alpha - I'm sure.
For example - look in normalmaps of hair, almost completely transparent.

 

DXT3 should only be used for hard transition of alpha-not alpha.
There is no soft alpha blending with DXT3.
Better is DXT5 or without compression in RGB8A.

 

I should back up from what I said to Vioxsis earlier.  Yes, I agree it's the normal - in fact I KNOW it's the normal - but I can't figure out what's going on or what I'm doing wrong. If I save as a DXT1 (say the texture has no transparency), it happens. If there's transparency to the texture, it happens when I save DXT5. I've used both Crazy Bump and / or ShaderMap 4 to create the normals. If I take a normal when this happens and open it in Photoshop, then add a black alpha channel (which I wouldn't think I'd need to do anyway), it still happens. Aarrgghh...

 

[Andy14]

Black alpha channel is a problem.

DXT is an ancient compression of Savage (S3) and can differ in detail in different programs.

 

You should save the normalmaps in RGBA with the programs with which you create the normalmap.
Then open with PS or Gimp and save from there in DXT5.

[C5Kev]

2 hours ago, Vioxsis said:

Hmm.. If its not the normal then i can only really make guesses as to what it could be.

It would go much quicker if you could link me the nif and textures as well as your retexture of it so i can check it out for myself.

 

1 hour ago, Andy14 said:

Black alpha channel is a problem.

DXT is an ancient compression of Savage (S3) and can differ in detail in different programs.

 

You should save the normalmaps in RGBA with the programs with which you create the normalmap.
Then open with PS or Gimp and save from there in DXT5.

 

OK, can you guys tell me the diff between these two normals?  The original is fine (no gloss / specular issue), mine is giving me problems.

Mine_n.dds

Original_n.dds

[Vioxsis]

Your alpha (gloss map) is white.

Spoiler

 

[par6six6]

On 12/10/2017 at 12:18 AM, c5kev said:

Hi folks.

....

So I was hoping someone could give me some insight as to why or what is causing this high specularity nonsense and how I might get rid of it.

 

Sincerely, Confused.

Yeah there's definite confusion going on here and it may be your understanding of textures.

 

If the textures have transparency, I save the normal in DXT 3 or 5. If no transparency, I save the normals as DXT 1.

Normals have nothing to do with transparency. Zip. Zero. Nada.
Vioxsis answered your question. The alpha channel of a normal is for gloss/specularity.

 

After making new textures and a new normal, when I go in-game the textures have a high gloss / super specular thing going on and it's apparently due to the normal map(s) I made.

Yes, yes it is. All that white in your alpha channel will make it super glossy. White = specular, black = no specular, greyish = controlling the level of specular.

 

If I save as a DXT1 (say the texture has no transparency), it happens. If there's transparency to the texture, it happens when I save DXT5.

More confusion. The transparency of a texture is stored in the main texture alpha channel, not the normal map. You do have the formats correct though.

 

So, like this;

main.dds, no transparency = DXT1
main.dds, alpha channel for transparency = DXT5

main_n.dds, no gloss/spec = DXT1
main_n.dds, alpha channel for gloss/spec = DXT5

 

Not sure what outcome you want/expect but if you don't want any specularity, then you don't need an alpha channel and save as DXT1. Or why not just use that original normal?

[C5Kev]

4 hours ago, par6six6 said:

Yeah there's definite confusion going on here and it may be your understanding of textures.

Normals have nothing to do with transparency. Zip. Zero. Nada.

Vioxsis answered your question. The alpha channel of a normal is for gloss/specularity.

Yes, yes it is. All that white in your alpha channel will make it super glossy. White = specular, black = no specular, greyish = controlling the level of specular.

 

More confusion. The transparency of a texture is stored in the main texture alpha channel, not the normal map. You do have the formats correct though.

 

So, like this;

main.dds, no transparency = DXT1
main.dds, alpha channel for transparency = DXT5

main_n.dds, no gloss/spec = DXT1
main_n.dds, alpha channel for gloss/spec = DXT5

 

Not sure what outcome you want/expect but if you don't want any specularity, then you don't need an alpha channel and save as DXT1. Or why not just use that original normal?

 

I believe the wording in my post was a bit off from what I was trying to describe and / or what I was doing.   Normals have nothing to do with transparency.  Yes, I know. Vioxsis answered your question. The alpha channel of a normal is for gloss/specularity.  No, not really. My question wasn't what the alpha channel of a normal is used for - although I wasn't aware that specular info was stored in the normal alpha.   The transparency of a texture is stored in the main texture alpha channel, not the normal map.   Again, I know that.  ...why not just use that original normal?  Well, because I want to create a new one that's a bit different. 

 

But I DID discover what the problem was. The frickin' nif. Because the original normal was very transparent, the nif had the specular / gloss cranked way the Hell up. Why I didn't look at that in the first place is beyond me - other than I'm new at this.  So when I made my new normal (with all the white as Vioxsis pointed out), the specular shot WAY up.  Wow...well, I guess this is how one learns shit.

 

Thank you all for everyone's 2 cents, I very much appreciate it.