[TS3] Discussion about releasing the latest update of L666 animations.

auema · December 10, 2016

What I was saying is that, while yes, the product shouldn't come "free" as it wasn't supposed to be, people can't pay for it anymore and I can't stress that enough... and then, there's the EA clause.

Also, I was under the impression that her Patreon supporters were giving money to get her animations early, not to get exclusive animations; at least, L666 stated here many times that anything she did was going to be posted here freely eventually.

Which makes the whole "No, don't post them, it's disrespectful" argument some people have made even weirder: if someone shares something they made freely, says "I will share this freely," and has a Patreon page that says "If you donate, you'll get my work earlier than if you wait until it's released for free," then (let's say) falls out of contact with everyone for some extended period of time...well, c'mon, guys. At some point it ought to be posted, if only because literally everything is pointing towards the intent to have that final version released here.

Like redabyss, I'm agnostic about when it should be posted, or by whom. And who knows, maybe L666 will pop back in tomorrow and all of this back-and-forth will be pointless. I just think the whole notion that if L666 never comes back at all, then the final version of her animations should vanish into a deep, dark hole, never to be seen again by anyone who wasn't subscribed to her Patreon before it got axed, despite the plain fact that this is not at all what was intended for it, ever. What's supposed to be respectful about that?

Shoshana · December 11, 2016

The Patreon platform is to provide the possibilty for artists (in every possible field imaginable) to devote their time in what they want to do. This means, the more supporters (the Patreons) the less they've to worry about their daytime job (everybody needs a living right). And if enough Patreons can support an artist where the artist her/himself no longer needs a day time job for a living but using Patreon support , able to devote all her/his time for her/his art.....the better, and sooner in the case of L666 animations for us to have.

I'm afraid a lot around here do not know how the Patreon platform actually works, and that's a pity.

BTW, I'm not angry just dissapointed about the disrespectful reaction for an artist who'd , unfortunately , vanished from the face to the earth.....for now

xx

December 11, 2016

The Patreon platform is to provide the possibilty for artists (in every possible field imaginable) to devote their time in what they want to do. This means, the more supporters (the Patreons) the less they've to worry about their daytime job (everybody needs a living right). And if enough Patreons can support an artist where the artist her/himself no longer needs a day time job for a living but using Patreon support , able to devote all her/his time for her/his art.....the better, and sooner in the case of L666 animations for us to have.

I'm afraid a lot around here do not know how the Patreon platform actually works, and that's a pity.

BTW, I'm not angry just dissapointed about the disrespectful reaction for an artist who'd , unfortunately , vanished from the face to the earth.....for now

xx

That's exactly what I'm being saying all around in this community: the Patreon page helps the artists, and I'm only happy to support them with money, that's the very least I can do in exchange.

No problemo at all in this. The problem is the last package, not L666's Patreon or herself!

BTW, I'm not angry just dissapointed about the disrespectful reaction for an artist who'd , unfortunately , vanished from the face to the earth.....for now

Problem is... there isn't much we can do about it.

I was VERY happy when she finally replied, you have no idea. I was willing to support with money her without nothing in exchange just to help her going on and rebuild everything, out of respect and because she was a person in a difficult situation. I also opened a whole thread to help her listing her Patrons, their emails and so on. But then she disappeared again.

Also... I fear that scanning the Internet for her wouldn't be a good idea, given her past problems with LL. What I'm trying to saying is that we need to leave her alone, in case she doesn't want to return, or do more animations. And that's what I've been implying all this time around.

I respect the reason of why you're disappointed, I can relate with you btw.

billyms100 · December 11, 2016

The Patreon platform is to provide the possibilty for artists (in every possible field imaginable) to devote their time in what they want to do. This means, the more supporters (the Patreons) the less they've to worry about their daytime job (everybody needs a living right). And if enough Patreons can support an artist where the artist her/himself no longer needs a day time job for a living but using Patreon support , able to devote all her/his time for her/his art.....the better, and sooner in the case of L666 animations for us to have.

I'm afraid a lot around here do not know how the Patreon platform actually works, and that's a pity.

BTW, I'm not angry just dissapointed about the disrespectful reaction for an artist who'd , unfortunately , vanished from the face to the earth.....for now

xx

We're well aware of what Patreon is for and many of us have already stated that we have no problem with it (I myself support some artists on there). However, some artists do abuse it, that's just reality.

zzz72w3r · December 11, 2016

The Patreon platform is to provide the possibilty for artists (in every possible field imaginable) to devote their time in what they want to do. This means, the more supporters (the Patreons) the less they've to worry about their daytime job (everybody needs a living right). And if enough Patreons can support an artist where the artist her/himself no longer needs a day time job for a living but using Patreon support , able to devote all her/his time for her/his art.....the better, and sooner in the case of L666 animations for us to have.

I'm afraid a lot around here do not know how the Patreon platform actually works, and that's a pity.

BTW, I'm not angry just dissapointed about the disrespectful reaction for an artist who'd , unfortunately , vanished from the face to the earth.....for now

xx

Most if not all people here understand how the Patreon platform works and many commenters are Patreon supporters ourselves.

However, the issue on hand has nothing to do with Patreon. LL is for free mods only. Early access for paid Patreon supporters are allowed on LL but not exclusivity. L666 animations was introduced here with its Patreon advertised here which places the animation packages as LL mods and should adhere to LL rules. The problem originated only because L666 has been very vague in his/her Patreon/LL disclosure. In accordance to LL rules responsible LL creators have stated very specific duration of preview window in their LL and Patreon pages which in theory places an expiration on the paywall in case of author's disappearance. Such disclosure does not exist for L666. Many people have correctly interpreted that OP is not wrong in volunteering to upload the package on LL where the mod is hosted and ONLY after enough time has passed that L666 is indeed unreachable. By keeping the said package permanently locked behind paywall even "out of respect" would be in violation of LL rule, not to mention as absurd given that the author has never indicated permanent paywall being the default intent (if anything the opposite is true) and that the means of paywall no longer exists.

LL is open to all but having access and being hosted to the site is still a privilege and not a right. Rules of Ashal and LL moderators should also be respected as one does for his/her championed artists on Patreon.

Khlas · December 11, 2016

So you agree with the hypothetic release?

Ofc, there is no need to disagreeing with something that was intended to be publicly released, clearly stated by her patreon page.

Dalon44 · December 11, 2016

Seems that the majority is now "no" (10-14).

I understand both sides ....you can send them to me if you want to..lol if Lady isn't working on them and her paysite not up...then I hope she is ok ..she did say she would update here always ...just saying

I'm sorry, I didn't quite grasp what you're saying. If you're asking me to send you the latest update, I can't unless I have proof that you have paid in November!

If you want to vote, please say just yes or no

ok now i'm confused you said to release update here but now only for ppl who paid for it and can prove it ? so you want to do the pay sites job?

December 11, 2016

Seems that the majority is now "no" (10-14).

I understand both sides ....you can send them to me if you want to..lol if Lady isn't working on them and her paysite not up...then I hope she is ok ..she did say she would update here always ...just saying

I'm sorry, I didn't quite grasp what you're saying. If you're asking me to send you the latest update, I can't unless I have proof that you have paid in November!

If you want to vote, please say just yes or no

ok now i'm confused you said to release update here but now only for ppl you paid for it and can prove it ? so you want to do the pay sites job?

Of course not! What are you understanding? XD

First of all... this is a discussion about wheter or not to release L666's last package. Now we're doing votes. Have you been reading replies around here?

Second of all... I've been unofficialy passing the last update to ex-Patreons who had paid in November but weren't able to download the update before L666's page got closed. I've been doing this on my own to help people. And that's it.

If you can prove you supported L666 'till November, I can give you the last package no prob!

Also... please... please keep in mind I'm just an average joe helping around. I am a nobody, I'm just doing whatever I can as a random LL member XD

Shoshana · December 11, 2016

Sorry for bringing this up dear, but at first you wanted to post all of L666 creation for everyone to download, while now you want to provide the files to all Patreons who didn't download the latest files, for what ever reason they were not able??

Just asking to be clear.

xx

bethiedoll · December 12, 2016

I guess if you're not a patreon subscriber u kick rocks

Shoshana · December 12, 2016

Well, I as a Patreon, already have all the files available of L666 , simply by reading my mail from Patreon................

xx

arrdubya · December 12, 2016

I believe this question should not be if but when. In order to absolve l666's potential legal issues vs EA, the work must be released to the public. Rather than it being considered disrespectful, it is the opposite to make sure an artist's work sees the light of day for all to enjoy.

I am also biased, being too poor to be a patron, but being poor does not mean I should be deprived of the opportunity to enjoy others' creations. Stumbling onto Animated Woohoo/Kinkyworld made TS3 much more interesting. The work that all these people have put into their various ideas has been a joy to see, and I thank them for sharing. Sharing is the key element to this, both morally and legally.

I vote yes

Sanmaeree · December 12, 2016

EA rule this, EA rule that.

I doubt people actually care about what ea says and pirate the game/dlc anyways but all of a sudden bring it up now. :dodgy:

Either eventually it gets released(in the absence of the creator 6 months to a year) or get permission if the creator was active recently in 3 months.

Theoretically this discussion should have started after next year not so recent, which maybe another agenda is at work.

SimJMFan · December 12, 2016

EA rule this, EA rule that.

I doubt people actually care about what ea says and pirate the game/dlc anyways but all of a sudden bring it up now.

Either eventually it gets released(in the absence of the creator 6 months to a year) or get permission if the creator was active recently in 3 months.

Theoretically this discussion should have started after next year not so recent, which maybe another agenda is at work.

There are two points of view in this Topic. The first one consider animations as a commercial activity and link the animations delivery to their payment. The second one consider creator as club members who can be supported by donators without receiving a monopsony of the animations.

The first category consider you should pay to get the mods. The second assume them to be free because they are promoted in LL.

Everyone agree that creating the animations take time and talent especially with the L666 creations. I am maybe wrong when I think there is a legal issue to get paid for animations creating from EA products.

There is also a morality dichotomy. I can understand some people considering that a thank you is not enough to get the animations only with a chronological constrain. After all, without donation this creator would not invest such a time for the animations we love. Then we should call it a payment and not a donation. The gratefullness shoud take a financial dimension. However, when you donate, you do not expect any advantages back.

It remains me the issue with organs donators. When someone need a transplantation, should the Hospital to give the organ only to the organs donators? Fortunately there is the law because the morality argument would never take its end.

I feel the connection between free animations and piracy founded on a shaky ground. This remark looks to me as an unfortunate morality / legality / offensive (or disrespect) mix.

December 12, 2016

Sorry for bringing this up dear, but at first you wanted to post all of L666 creation for everyone to download,

This is what we're determining in this thread, wheter is the case of doing such thing or not, strange that is not clear yet to some of you, and...

while now you want to provide the files to all Patreons who didn't download the latest files, for what ever reason they were not able??

Just asking to be clear.

xx

... this is what I'm already been doing, just to help around. No reason not to give to ex patrons what is rightfully theirs. Trust me there were PLENTY of ex patrons who couldn't download the last version in time... and supported for nothing.

I guess if you're not a patreon subscriber u kick rocks

Nope. You're misundestanding. You should have read the thread better

I'll rewrite for you all. Please this time get it right.

The purpose of the thread is to determine wheter or not we should release L666's TS3 sex animations S19 package publicly, in order to have all people, not just her ex patrons, being able to enjoy her animations.

That's what we're discussing back and forth, and that's why I proposed votes, because there was no majority, no bigger voice, only clashing point of view.

Why I'm doing this is just to help around and bring up a discussion that eventually would've been debated anyway.

What I'm already doing is passing that package around to ex patrons who could provide me proofs of their November payment. You can check this thread for more information: http://www.loverslab.com/topic/69601-ts3-lets-help-l666/

Hope doubt have been forever cleared.

Theoretically this discussion should have started after next year not so recent, which maybe another agenda is at work.

Maybe you're right, the thread was started too soon.

But if you look at the context, the fact that she disappear at such crucial time is strange.

zzz72w3r · December 12, 2016

Sorry for bringing this up dear, but at first you wanted to post all of L666 creation for everyone to download,

This is what we're determining in this thread, wheter is the case of doing such thing or not, strange that is not clear yet to some of you, and...

while now you want to provide the files to all Patreons who didn't download the latest files, for what ever reason they were not able??

Just asking to be clear.

xx

... this is what I'm already been doing, just to help around. No reason not to give to ex patrons what is rightfully theirs. Trust me there were PLENTY of ex patrons who couldn't download the last version in time... and supported for nothing.

I guess if you're not a patreon subscriber u kick rocks

Nope. You're misundestanding. You should have read the thread better

I'll rewrite for you all. Please this time get it right.

The purpose of the thread is to determine wheter or not we should release L666's TS3 sex animations S19 package publicly, in order to have all people, not just her ex patrons, being able to enjoy her animations.

That's what we're discussing back and forth, and that's why I proposed votes, because there was no majority, no bigger voice, only clashing point of view.

Why I'm doing this is just to help around and bring up a discussion that eventually would've been debated anyway.

What I'm already doing is passing that package around to ex patrons who could provide me proofs of their November payment. You can check this thread for more information: http://www.loverslab.com/topic/69601-ts3-lets-help-l666/

Hope doubt have been forever cleared.

Theoretically this discussion should have started after next year not so recent, which maybe another agenda is at work.

Maybe you're right, the thread was started too soon.

But if you look at the context, the fact that she disappear at such crucial time is strange.

AFAIK LL does not have an official stance on the duration of patron only preview window but Ashal mentioned somewhere that he personally considers over 6 months as unreasonable. With one exception I don't think there is any LL creator waited more than 2 months before releasing Patreon works to the public.

windpl · December 12, 2016

Maybe you're right, the thread was started too soon.

But if you look at the context, the fact that she disappear at such crucial time is strange.

She was harassed here, patreon fucked her over, and now this, how it is strange?

Tiger1337 · December 12, 2016

I think that you should realease it publicly here in loverslab and say that the author of the mod is l666 because you mentions it not your mod and also we love the mod. And also if he ever comes back you could just explain in the situation and also if l666 comes back and wants you to delete you should do it. But in this way you keep up his legacy. So just explain the situation in the description if you release it. I would like you to realease it because i like he's mod. So i hope you can realease it soon.

December 12, 2016

Maybe you're right, the thread was started too soon.

But if you look at the context, the fact that she disappear at such crucial time is strange.

She was harassed here, patreon fucked her over, and now this, how it is strange?

"And now this", this thread has been opened three weeks after she said she was in a difficult situation because of the closure of her Patreon and she didn't take action. Not right when she disappeared.

She disappeared on her own without a word.

Okay I opened it a little too early, but not without a valid reason.

Come on. Can you just read some posts and understand a little the context? Or is too bothersome?

This kind of replies are starting to really bother me, honestly.

Please focus on the debate. I'll ask to delete this thread if this happens again, or if anyone will be willing to take responsability of this, I'll pass the torch.

bethiedoll · December 12, 2016

vote yes

December 12, 2016

I'm really sorry. There are things that are not making me feel well about this thread. If anyone is willing to continue, you can do a separate list using the op of this thread.

Mariana Soprano · December 13, 2016

Hey @ all and redabyss!

Thanks for this „vote yes or no“ thread! I agree with some of the „yes“ and the „no“ arguments. This question is still difficult to degree and connect all ideas. So I agree with „this thread started too soon“. ;-)

I like to read this discussion and all the interesting arguments from the LL members. We like to take care and protect L666 and her work – big fat thanks to all of you for sharing your thoughts!

Remember: this is the internet, the web! If redabyss do not release the update, sometimes somehow and somewhere someone else will do this or share the file/s otherwise.

And if a member (maybe me) vote „no“ - what shall we do if we later (maybe in some weeks or month) find a release on other web sites? IMHO LL is the right and the best place for the release.

So at last I have to vote „yes“. But when is the best moment / point in time to do this?

December 13, 2016

Thanks for the reply, but as I said I'm no longer working on this thread - I don't want to have another person accusing me. Still, I'm leaving the list as it is if anyone is willing to continue!

Sarra1171 · December 13, 2016

I was a L666 Patreon and didn't get her last update. I logged in one morning and she was just gone. AND I'm pretty pissed in the fact that I paid that month and Patreon just wasted my money.

Tiger1337 · December 13, 2016

I vote yes.

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