jeti66 Posted November 1, 2014 Posted November 1, 2014 So i recently started a new fresh new skyrim and i'm getting ctd when scrolling through hairs. I've tried using the disable facegen and the precache killer but no luck, btw this only happens with custom hair mods apachi hair, sg hairs etc... My loadloader using loot
Varithina Posted November 1, 2014 Posted November 1, 2014 Only thing I can spot that might be giving you problems is, racemenupluginxpms.esp 2A and racemenuplugin.esp 43 From what I am aware off you should only have 1 of those two active, assuming you have xpms extended skeleton installed that is the one you should have active and the other should be deactivated, xpms does mention that when using its installer, well it does using nmm anyway. Though maybe having the racemenuplugin.esp after racemenu.esp may be part of the problem as well, as in my load order its before racemenu.esp It might also be worth checking in your skse\plugins folder to see if the precache killer dll is where its supposed to be as well. Other than that nothing really jumps out saying there is anything wrong with the load order.
jeti66 Posted November 1, 2014 Author Posted November 1, 2014 Only thing I can spot that might be giving you problems is, racemenupluginxpms.esp 2A and racemenuplugin.esp 43 From what I am aware off you should only have 1 of those two active, assuming you have xpms extended skeleton installed that is the one you should have active and the other should be deactivated, xpms does mention that when using its installer, well it does using nmm anyway. Though maybe having the racemenuplugin.esp after racemenu.esp may be part of the problem as well, as in my load order its before racemenu.esp It might also be worth checking in your skse\plugins folder to see if the precache killer dll is where its supposed to be as well. Other than that nothing really jumps out saying there is anything wrong with the load order. Thanks for the quick reply, but no dice, i tried both solutions and even using the the regular racemenuplugin and not the xpms one
Zabuzed Posted November 2, 2014 Posted November 2, 2014 Skyrim is a bitch when it comes to handling lots of mods, especially if you try out a lot, delete stuff and add stuff. If you use NMM, you're done. That software even can't delete 3 files correctly, if you installed a monster like 3DNpc with almost 45000 files and uninstall it via NMM, you can be pretty sure there are LOTS of files left. Try Wrye Bash and Tes5Edit. Even if you don't want to edit things with those programs, they can help a lot with finding issues. The installer tab of Wrye Bash indicates conflicting mods, TES5Edit gives you a long list of what happens when Skyrim starts - including all the errors and warnings. Last but not least: A Papyrus log can help sort out stuff. As the racemenu is the first script normally called, it is possible to disturb it with other scripts. Add [Papyrus] fPostLoadUpdateTimeMS=500.0 ***** delays the loading so Skyrim gets a chance to load every crap bEnableLogging=1 ***** that's the most important point bEnableTrace=1 bLoadDebugInformation=1 ***** that gives a lot more details to skyrim.ini in your documents folder, run skyrim, and after you exit (or CTD...) take a look at the log in \Documents\My Games\skyrim\Logs\Script Papyrus.0.log being the most recent always. You MAY ignore the warnings in the log, but you can't ignore the errors. Aaaand if you get the message "VM is freezing" followed by "VM is frozen", you're done, Papyrus crashed. An autosave-mod can help as the VM tries to restart after a SAVE "VM is thawing", but there is no guarantee it won't freeze again.
Varithina Posted November 2, 2014 Posted November 2, 2014 Bugger was my thought Next idea I have is going to be tedious. Get yourself into a small area, one with few or no npc's, breezehome works well for that save your game, then Un-check all the hair mods, re-load your save game and see if you can scroll through the hairs, if you can then add the hair mods one by one checking to see if you can scroll through them. Hopefully that will give you the mod that's causing problems, then re-download that hair mod, checking for any requirements that mod has, re-install that mod an hopefully problem solved, otherwise I am stumped as to your problem.
bradleyh Posted November 2, 2014 Posted November 2, 2014 You do have an SKSE.ini with the first Block being changed from 256 to 512MB, or at least SSME?
jeti66 Posted November 2, 2014 Author Posted November 2, 2014 Skyrim is a bitch when it comes to handling lots of mods, especially if you try out a lot, delete stuff and add stuff. If you use NMM, you're done. That software even can't delete 3 files correctly, if you installed a monster like 3DNpc with almost 45000 files and uninstall it via NMM, you can be pretty sure there are LOTS of files left. Try Wrye Bash and Tes5Edit. Even if you don't want to edit things with those programs, they can help a lot with finding issues. The installer tab of Wrye Bash indicates conflicting mods, TES5Edit gives you a long list of what happens when Skyrim starts - including all the errors and warnings. Last but not least: A Papyrus log can help sort out stuff. As the racemenu is the first script normally called, it is possible to disturb it with other scripts. Add [Papyrus] fPostLoadUpdateTimeMS=500.0 ***** delays the loading so Skyrim gets a chance to load every crap bEnableLogging=1 ***** that's the most important point bEnableTrace=1 bLoadDebugInformation=1 ***** that gives a lot more details to skyrim.ini in your documents folder, run skyrim, and after you exit (or CTD...) take a look at the log in \Documents\My Games\skyrim\Logs\Script Papyrus.0.log being the most recent always. You MAY ignore the warnings in the log, but you can't ignore the errors. Aaaand if you get the message "VM is freezing" followed by "VM is frozen", you're done, Papyrus crashed. An autosave-mod can help as the VM tries to restart after a SAVE "VM is thawing", but there is no guarantee it won't freeze again. Alright so i did what you asked and here is my Papryus log
jeti66 Posted November 2, 2014 Author Posted November 2, 2014 Bugger was my thought Next idea I have is going to be tedious. Get yourself into a small area, one with few or no npc's, breezehome works well for that save your game, then Un-check all the hair mods, re-load your save game and see if you can scroll through the hairs, if you can then add the hair mods one by one checking to see if you can scroll through them. Hopefully that will give you the mod that's causing problems, then re-download that hair mod, checking for any requirements that mod has, re-install that mod an hopefully problem solved, otherwise I am stumped as to your problem. Ok, so i tried doing everything you asked, and i'm standing near the the guardian stones, and nothing still crashed
jeti66 Posted November 2, 2014 Author Posted November 2, 2014 You do have an SKSE.ini with the first Block being changed from 256 to 512MB, or at least SSME? Ok, so i didn't have a SKSE.ini before and i just added it but still crashes
Alpia Posted November 2, 2014 Posted November 2, 2014 does it happen with all custom hair mods or is it only occuring on specifc parts KS-Hairdos 256 is causing ctd's for some users. Otherwise you simply run out of memory using the precache killer is helpfull since you allready do that what are your system specs? Please take a look into this guide: http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/50214/?the parts intresting for you are Shensons memory patch and Memory blocks log it would be great if you could use the memory blocks log and provide a log that contains that you open the racemenu. Also just a little thing to add it looks like you used NMM for the load order screenshots if so you have a option in NMM on the plugins tap you see below the green button another slightly visible button with that you can export your loadorder to a textfile or to the clipboard. Dunno how problematic this error in your log is, but well its a racemenu error that I don't know: [11/02/2014 - 11:29:37AM] Error: Array index 128 is out of range (0-127)stack: [RaceMenuPluginWeapons (2B000803)].RaceMenuPluginWeapons.AddSlider() - "RaceMenuBase.psc" Line 331 [RaceMenuPluginWeapons (2B000803)].RaceMenuPluginWeapons.OnSliderRequest() - "RaceMenuPluginWeapons.psc" Line 649 [RaceMenuPluginWeapons (2B000803)].RaceMenuPluginWeapons.OnMenuInitialized() - "RaceMenuBase.psc" Line 225[11/02/2014 - 11:29:37AM] Error: Array index 129 is out of range (0-127)stack: [RaceMenuPluginWeapons (2B000803)].RaceMenuPluginWeapons.AddSlider() - "RaceMenuBase.psc" Line 331 [RaceMenuPluginWeapons (2B000803)].RaceMenuPluginWeapons.OnSliderRequest() - "RaceMenuPluginWeapons.psc" Line 652 [RaceMenuPluginWeapons (2B000803)].RaceMenuPluginWeapons.OnMenuInitialized() - "RaceMenuBase.psc" Line 225
jeti66 Posted November 2, 2014 Author Posted November 2, 2014 does it happen with all custom hair mods or is it only occuring on specifc parts KS-Hairdos 256 is causing ctd's for some users. Otherwise you simply run out of memory using the precache killer is helpfull since you allready do that what are your system specs? Please take a look into this guide: http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/50214/?the parts intresting for you are Shensons memory patch and Memory blocks log it would be great if you could use the memory blocks log and provide a log that contains that you open the racemenu. Also just a little thing to add it looks like you used NMM for the load order screenshots if so you have a option in NMM on the plugins tap you see below the green button another slightly visible button with that you can export your loadorder to a textfile or to the clipboard. Dunno how problematic this error in your log is, but well its a racemenu error that I don't know: [11/02/2014 - 11:29:37AM] Error: Array index 128 is out of range (0-127) stack: [RaceMenuPluginWeapons (2B000803)].RaceMenuPluginWeapons.AddSlider() - "RaceMenuBase.psc" Line 331 [RaceMenuPluginWeapons (2B000803)].RaceMenuPluginWeapons.OnSliderRequest() - "RaceMenuPluginWeapons.psc" Line 649 [RaceMenuPluginWeapons (2B000803)].RaceMenuPluginWeapons.OnMenuInitialized() - "RaceMenuBase.psc" Line 225 [11/02/2014 - 11:29:37AM] Error: Array index 129 is out of range (0-127) stack: [RaceMenuPluginWeapons (2B000803)].RaceMenuPluginWeapons.AddSlider() - "RaceMenuBase.psc" Line 331 [RaceMenuPluginWeapons (2B000803)].RaceMenuPluginWeapons.OnSliderRequest() - "RaceMenuPluginWeapons.psc" Line 652 [RaceMenuPluginWeapons (2B000803)].RaceMenuPluginWeapons.OnMenuInitialized() - "RaceMenuBase.psc" Line 225 Ok, so i used the memory blocks and the Shensons memory patch, yet i still get the ctd here is thepapyrus log and the load order. I think i'm going to stop being lazy and actually learn how to use mod organizer.
Alpia Posted November 2, 2014 Posted November 2, 2014 Again I would like to see your memory blocks log if you installed like the guide recommended its in the data/SKSE/plugins MemoryBlocksLog The racemenu error occurse also in your papyrus2 file I have no real programming knowledge so I don't know if the error "Error: Array index 128 is out of range (0-127)" is a problem. Also to MO: Ok, so i used the memory blocks and the Shensons memory patch, yet i still get the ctd here is thepapyrus log and the load order. I think i'm going to stop being lazy and actually learn how to use mod organizer. MO is no magical program that solves a problem like this the opposite is the case its just another error source your skyrim data folder might be clean and vanilla, but he dosen't have to be clean even if there is data left you did not delete properly skyrim dosen't give a shit about what leftover files are in the data folder if they are not releated to some active plugin. Really people are hypting MO so high it gets anoying these are the only real advantages of MO: - Easy switch active plugin list (only usefull if you are using diffrent saves with diffrent mods) - Easy install and deinstall mods (well deleting files by hand is sure such a hard thing to do... not) What MO dosent do, but people seem to think it does: - Increasing stability it simply can't stability issues are problems with scripts in your savefiles with or without MO you have to deal with leaftover scripts etc. in savefiles. - Magically fixing problems and incompatibility it adds virtual folders not magic wands.
jeti66 Posted November 2, 2014 Author Posted November 2, 2014 Again I would like to see your memory blocks log if you installed like the guide recommended its in the data/SKSE/plugins MemoryBlocksLog The racemenu error occurse also in your papyrus2 file I have no real programming knowledge so I don't know if the error "Error: Array index 128 is out of range (0-127)" is a problem. Also to MO: Ok, so i used the memory blocks and the Shensons memory patch, yet i still get the ctd here is thepapyrus log and the load order. I think i'm going to stop being lazy and actually learn how to use mod organizer. MO is no magical program that solves a problem like this the opposite is the case its just another error source your skyrim data folder might be clean and vanilla, but he dosen't have to be clean even if there is data left you did not delete properly skyrim dosen't give a shit about what leftover files are in the data folder if they are not releated to some active plugin. Really people are hypting MO so high it gets anoying these are the only real advantages of MO: - Easy switch active plugin list (only usefull if you are using diffrent saves with diffrent mods) - Easy install and deinstall mods (well deleting files by hand is sure such a hard thing to do... not) What MO dosent do, but people seem to think it does: - Increasing stability it simply can't stability issues are problems with scripts in your savefiles with or without MO you have to deal with leaftover scripts etc. in savefiles. - Magically fixing problems and incompatibility it adds virtual folders not magic wands. Sorry i forgot to add the file, here it is
blabba Posted November 2, 2014 Posted November 2, 2014 Really people are hypting MO so high it gets anoying these are the only real advantages of MO: - Easy switch active plugin list (only usefull if you are using diffrent saves with diffrent mods) - Easy install and deinstall mods (well deleting files by hand is sure such a hard thing to do... not) What MO dosent do, but people seem to think it does: - Increasing stability it simply can't stability issues are problems with scripts in your savefiles with or without MO you have to deal with leaftover scripts etc. in savefiles. - Magically fixing problems and incompatibility it adds virtual folders not magic wands. Your right, MO doesn't magically fix user errors. And yes it's complicated for some of the more advanced mods like FNIS and SKSE sometimes. However your missing probably the BIGGEST feature of MO: It tells you what files are where and to what mod they belong. AKA: An Overwrite list for all files. Which is more or less the biggest cause for compatibility conflicts and figuring out if a user even installed the mod correctly. As well as other minor features that are nice as well: force loading BSA's without the need for dummy .esp's, keeping exported files self contained etc.... edit: For OP, if your getting a script error with the racemenu weapon placement scripts, then either a. you didn't install latest XPMSE correctly or b. you didn't install latest racemenu correctly. edit2: Disable the racemenuXPMSE plugin .esp if you don't care about skeleton and weapon node sliders (or to test). If Racemenu still crashes after that then you screwed up racemenu install. If not, then you just screwed up the install for XPMSE.
Alpia Posted November 3, 2014 Posted November 3, 2014 Again I would like to see your memory blocks log if you installed like the guide recommended its in the data/SKSE/plugins MemoryBlocksLog The racemenu error occurse also in your papyrus2 file I have no real programming knowledge so I don't know if the error "Error: Array index 128 is out of range (0-127)" is a problem. Also to MO: Ok, so i used the memory blocks and the Shensons memory patch, yet i still get the ctd here is thepapyrus log and the load order. I think i'm going to stop being lazy and actually learn how to use mod organizer. MO is no magical program that solves a problem like this the opposite is the case its just another error source your skyrim data folder might be clean and vanilla, but he dosen't have to be clean even if there is data left you did not delete properly skyrim dosen't give a shit about what leftover files are in the data folder if they are not releated to some active plugin. Really people are hypting MO so high it gets anoying these are the only real advantages of MO: - Easy switch active plugin list (only usefull if you are using diffrent saves with diffrent mods) - Easy install and deinstall mods (well deleting files by hand is sure such a hard thing to do... not) What MO dosent do, but people seem to think it does: - Increasing stability it simply can't stability issues are problems with scripts in your savefiles with or without MO you have to deal with leaftover scripts etc. in savefiles. - Magically fixing problems and incompatibility it adds virtual folders not magic wands. Sorry i forgot to add the file, here it is MemoryBlocksLog.log Thank you now its easy logging of blocks enabled logging max values only Timer disabled Block1 Block2 512MB 512MB 85 8 85 8 85 9 85 10 85 11 .... 508 112 509 112 510 112 511 112 512 112 This is your log you hit the 512mb and 512mb is the limit of the block as soon as you hit the 512mb you are crashed its really that simple. You now have the choice to deinstall some hairs or install the precache killer below or you increase the size of your memory block. http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/33226/?please try installing it If you want to increase the size of your memory block really read carfefull the following since you allready seem to do it wrong. This is your skse.ini what it should look like now. [General] ClearInvalidRegistrations=1 [Display] iTintTextureResolution=2048 [Memory] defaultHeapInitialAllocMB=768 to increase your block change this value to a higher since you allready have 768 try 1024 scrapHeapSizeMB=256 you shall not change this unless you know what you are doing in your skse it seems to be 512 since it is what you see under block 2 in your log this should be 256mb. You have to increase the block until you don't hit the limit anymore (really use the precache killer regardless if you heard you don't need it) the AllocMB= are put togheter from 768-256 (scrapheapsizeMB) so if you want your memory block bigger than the actual 512 allways add the 256 scrapheapsizemb to it so if you want to have your first block 768mb you have to calculate 768+256=1024 just as an example. Edit: you can really see it yourself this is your limit its in the memory blocks log the first lines: Block1 Block2 512MB 512MB 509 112 510 112 511 112 512 112 As soon as the max value in your logfile hits the limit in that case we see the 512 under Block1 you are running out of memory and crash. Memory consuming mods are Textures (hairs obviously) but also landscape textures etc. so if you have a lot of hd packs and ctd in a big area its also most likly the memory you are running out of, but in your case its obvious since it only occures on racemenu and the values explode when you open it you can see it stays a while at 85mb and than starts climping until you crash at the limit.
jeti66 Posted November 3, 2014 Author Posted November 3, 2014 Again I would like to see your memory blocks log if you installed like the guide recommended its in the data/SKSE/plugins MemoryBlocksLog The racemenu error occurse also in your papyrus2 file I have no real programming knowledge so I don't know if the error "Error: Array index 128 is out of range (0-127)" is a problem. Also to MO: Ok, so i used the memory blocks and the Shensons memory patch, yet i still get the ctd here is thepapyrus log and the load order. I think i'm going to stop being lazy and actually learn how to use mod organizer. MO is no magical program that solves a problem like this the opposite is the case its just another error source your skyrim data folder might be clean and vanilla, but he dosen't have to be clean even if there is data left you did not delete properly skyrim dosen't give a shit about what leftover files are in the data folder if they are not releated to some active plugin. Really people are hypting MO so high it gets anoying these are the only real advantages of MO: - Easy switch active plugin list (only usefull if you are using diffrent saves with diffrent mods) - Easy install and deinstall mods (well deleting files by hand is sure such a hard thing to do... not) What MO dosent do, but people seem to think it does: - Increasing stability it simply can't stability issues are problems with scripts in your savefiles with or without MO you have to deal with leaftover scripts etc. in savefiles. - Magically fixing problems and incompatibility it adds virtual folders not magic wands. Sorry i forgot to add the file, here it is MemoryBlocksLog.log Thank you now its easy logging of blocks enabled logging max values only Timer disabled Block1 Block2 512MB 512MB 85 8 85 8 85 9 85 10 85 11 .... 508 112 509 112 510 112 511 112 512 112 This is your log you hit the 512mb and 512mb is the limit of the block as soon as you hit the 512mb you are crashed its really that simple. You now have the choice to deinstall some hairs or install the precache killer below or you increase the size of your memory block. http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/33226/?please try installing it If you want to increase the size of your memory block really read carfefull the following since you allready seem to do it wrong. This is your skse.ini what it should look like now. [General] ClearInvalidRegistrations=1 [Display] iTintTextureResolution=2048 [Memory] defaultHeapInitialAllocMB=768 to increase your block change this value to a higher since you allready have 768 try 1024 scrapHeapSizeMB=256 you shall not change this unless you know what you are doing in your skse it seems to be 512 since it is what you see under block 2 in your log this should be 256mb. You have to increase the block until you don't hit the limit anymore (really use the precache killer regardless if you heard you don't need it) the AllocMB= are put togheter from 768-256 (scrapheapsizeMB) so if you want your memory block bigger than the actual 512 allways add the 256 scrapheapsizemb to it so if you want to have your first block 768mb you have to calculate 768+256=1024 just as an example. Edit: you can really see it yourself this is your limit its in the memory blocks log the first lines: Block1 Block2 512MB 512MB 509 112 510 112 511 112 512 112 As soon as the max value in your logfile hits the limit in that case we see the 512 under Block1 you are running out of memory and crash. Memory consuming mods are Textures (hairs obviously) but also landscape textures etc. so if you have a lot of hd packs and ctd in a big area its also most likly the memory you are running out of, but in your case its obvious since it only occures on racemenu and the values explode when you open it you can see it stays a while at 85mb and than starts climping until you crash at the limit. Thanks if seemed to have work , i set it to 1024 but i kept crashing, so i just kept raising it until it didn't and ended up with 8192 which seems stupidly high (atleast to me) hopefully it doesn't mess any other things up.
Rayblue Posted November 3, 2014 Posted November 3, 2014 Again I would like to see your memory blocks log if you installed like the guide recommended its in the data/SKSE/plugins MemoryBlocksLog The racemenu error occurse also in your papyrus2 file I have no real programming knowledge so I don't know if the error "Error: Array index 128 is out of range (0-127)" is a problem. Also to MO: Ok, so i used the memory blocks and the Shensons memory patch, yet i still get the ctd here is thepapyrus log and the load order. I think i'm going to stop being lazy and actually learn how to use mod organizer. MO is no magical program that solves a problem like this the opposite is the case its just another error source your skyrim data folder might be clean and vanilla, but he dosen't have to be clean even if there is data left you did not delete properly skyrim dosen't give a shit about what leftover files are in the data folder if they are not releated to some active plugin. Really people are hypting MO so high it gets anoying these are the only real advantages of MO: - Easy switch active plugin list (only usefull if you are using diffrent saves with diffrent mods) - Easy install and deinstall mods (well deleting files by hand is sure such a hard thing to do... not) What MO dosent do, but people seem to think it does: - Increasing stability it simply can't stability issues are problems with scripts in your savefiles with or without MO you have to deal with leaftover scripts etc. in savefiles. - Magically fixing problems and incompatibility it adds virtual folders not magic wands. Ahem. Yes, MO isn't a magic program but for a stable system to work it has to read the same sheet of music with SSME/SKSE 1.7.1 and ENB's memory management. And of course careful study before using it. It's still better off than push-button NMM or messy manual installation (only if you're a goddamn masochist).
Alpia Posted November 3, 2014 Posted November 3, 2014 Thanks if seemed to have work , i set it to 1024 but i kept crashing, so i just kept raising it until it didn't and ended up with 8192 which seems stupidly high (atleast to me) hopefully it doesn't mess any other things up. Glad I could help you and it is way too high are you sure you have the precache killer installed correctly? even with tons of 4k hd packs you would never reach such a value such a high value can only reached because the hairs get prerendered in your vram thats what the precache killer is for so it only loads one hair at a time and don't place it inside the vram. Even if it works now I really recommand checking the precache killer again. The "problem" with such a high value is that skyrim reserves now 8192 mb ram at a time meaning that other programs or the system maybe dosen't get enough memory so its good when it works stable, but I would not recommand such a high value. This value again can only be reached because all the hairs get loaded into your ram which is not neccesary and not possible with a working precache killer. Edit: Don't know about you, but I don't change my hairs very often if the same applies to you you could change the value back after choosing your hair, but that would be a bit inconvenient. For the other guys It's still better off than push-button NMM or messy manual installation (only if you're a goddamn masochist). Maybe I got a bit to enraged about MO I don't hate it I hate the fact that people recommand it here in the support thread to people with problem as if it could fix anything. I have also a completly fine running Skyrim using manual installation following is not mean offensive, but if you have a normal working brain manual installing isn't hard and also is no diffrence to NMM since NMM does nothing else than copy pasting the stuff in like the manual installation. For people with a common sense you have a backup if you want to restore the overwriten files copy paste them in its not hard.. deleting a mod just delete the files you copyd in its not that hard seriously I should stop now I allways get way to upset about such little things. I tell you just one more thing if you have a working Skyrim its absolutly useless to set up your whole skyrim again with all the hundrets of mods you use just to install MO If you have a fresh skyrim or just begin modding I personaly would also recommand MO, but only because if you start new it dosen't matter how you install your mods with MO or without it so I would recommand it, but it is a waste of time to reinstall your modded skyrim just to use MO
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