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Can we talk about 'Gamergate' ?

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Jayleia

Jayleia

Posted
Posted

I'm surprised there isn't more support for #GamerGate here, given that our opponents want to remove sexually attractive women from video games.

Umm...no.

 

At least, most of the Anti-gaters that I know do not want that.  But...there is a debate to be held about how women and minorities are portrayed in games, and how women and minorities in gaming are treated.  I don't mind sexually attractive women in games either...I play them myself.

 

And given the sort of allies that the gaters have gathered and many of the actions taken under their banner...I want nothing to do with them.  Unfortunately, they want to claim to speak for people like me, a gamer, and, should people like me not support them completely, say we are NOT gamers...and possibly dox us, threaten us etc etc

 

No.  I'm not going to support them.  There is very little short of them committing mass seppuku that would get me to support anything they do...and I would enthusiastically support it if they decided to do that.

 

Yes, I do lots of sexy things (even sexually submissive things) because I added them into my game.  But Skyrim is a great example of the sort of game many of the anti-gaters like.  It shows powerful characters of both sexes and doesn't overly glorify sexiness (yes, even in the vanilla game, there is a bit of sexiness but its not hammered into the ground, i.e. its not a T&A driven game)

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mike20599

mike20599

Posted
Posted

 

I'm surprised there isn't more support for #GamerGate here, given that our opponents want to remove sexually attractive women from video games.

Umm...no.

 

At least, most of the Anti-gaters that I know do not want that.  But...there is a debate to be held about how women and minorities are portrayed in games, and how women and minorities in gaming are treated.  I don't mind sexually attractive women in games either...I play them myself.

 

And given the sort of allies that the gaters have gathered and many of the actions taken under their banner...I want nothing to do with them.  Unfortunately, they want to claim to speak for people like me, a gamer, and, should people like me not support them completely, say we are NOT gamers...and possibly dox us, threaten us etc etc

 

No.  I'm not going to support them.  There is very little short of them committing mass seppuku that would get me to support anything they do...and I would enthusiastically support it if they decided to do that.

 

Yes, I do lots of sexy things (even sexually submissive things) because I added them into my game.  But Skyrim is a great example of the sort of game many of the anti-gaters like.  It shows powerful characters of both sexes and doesn't overly glorify sexiness (yes, even in the vanilla game, there is a bit of sexiness but its not hammered into the ground, i.e. its not a T&A driven game)

 

 You have been completely misinformed about GamerGate, most likely by the corrupt journalists that we are fighting.

 

GamerGate does not claim to speak for you, and GamerGate does not claim you aren't a gamer.

 

Every prominent voice in GamerGate is against harassment, death threats, and doxxing. But you can't say the same for the other side.

 

I would be willing to bet that the "actions taken under our banner" you speak of were committed by trolls like GNAA or by anti-GG themselves just to smear us. There are proven examples where this has occured.

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redeyesandlonghair

redeyesandlonghair

Posted
Posted

I'm surprised there isn't more support for #GamerGate here, given that our opponents want to remove sexually attractive women from video games.

 

But I thought the "opponents" of GamerGate were unethical game journalists who were writing biased reviews?  Oh wait, that's right, GamerGate shifted focus to target any woman who dares to give her opinion about video games.  Well you know, I just can't get behind that, because I think women should certainly be afforded the right to give their opinions (even if those opinions are in some cases hilariously ignorant, biased, and/or blatantly deceptive featuring game footage that features a "player" engaging in activities that the game mechanics of said game directly discourage).

 

The reason many of us don't support GamerGate is because that title has basically come to mean, due to the actions taken in its name, a movement whose sole purpose is to silence women who want to talk about video games by threatening them with bodily harm.  While I may not agree with everything that certain women have to say, I absolutely support their right to say it.  I do not support peoples' actions when they threaten someone with bodily harm just for saying something they don't agree with.

 

Also I think they just want women to have better, broader representation in video games (even if some of them go about it in hilariously misguided ways), something I'm totally for.

 

I mean seriously, does GamerGate stand for anything other than "Shut up bitch!" at this point?  See that's the problem with "taking up a banner"... aaaaaaall sorts of people line up under it, and you're powerless from having them define it.  Ironically, feminism made the same mistake... and then so did you.

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Jayleia

Jayleia

Posted
Posted

 

 

I'm surprised there isn't more support for #GamerGate here, given that our opponents want to remove sexually attractive women from video games.

Umm...no.

 

At least, most of the Anti-gaters that I know do not want that.  But...there is a debate to be held about how women and minorities are portrayed in games, and how women and minorities in gaming are treated.  I don't mind sexually attractive women in games either...I play them myself.

 

And given the sort of allies that the gaters have gathered and many of the actions taken under their banner...I want nothing to do with them.  Unfortunately, they want to claim to speak for people like me, a gamer, and, should people like me not support them completely, say we are NOT gamers...and possibly dox us, threaten us etc etc

 

No.  I'm not going to support them.  There is very little short of them committing mass seppuku that would get me to support anything they do...and I would enthusiastically support it if they decided to do that.

 

Yes, I do lots of sexy things (even sexually submissive things) because I added them into my game.  But Skyrim is a great example of the sort of game many of the anti-gaters like.  It shows powerful characters of both sexes and doesn't overly glorify sexiness (yes, even in the vanilla game, there is a bit of sexiness but its not hammered into the ground, i.e. its not a T&A driven game)

 

 You have been completely misinformed about GamerGate, most likely by the corrupt journalists that we are fighting.

 

GamerGate does not claim to speak for you, and GamerGate does not claim you aren't a gamer.

 

Every prominent voice in GamerGate is against harassment, death threats, and doxxing. But you can't say the same for the other side.

 

I would be willing to bet that the "actions taken under our banner" you speak of were committed by trolls like GNAA or by anti-GG themselves just to smear us. There are proven examples where this has occured.

I have been misinformed about gamergate...by gamergaters?  You are making the assumption that I am not a gamer (exactly the same thing you claim gamergaters don't do in the next sentence)...and only know what the media tell me about gamers.  On a forum about video games.  I'm in the gamer culture every day of the week, I've watched gamergaters in action directly, I've read their forums, and their reactions in their forums.  Not what the media told me about them...but what they say and do amongst themselves. 

 

I have watched gamergaters speak for the poor oppressed...white male neckbeard demographic, engaging in, not slightly off-color jokes among friends, but organized campaigns of harassment against "SJWs", often using rather unpleasant language (which would be appropriate in a mod here...that you choose to install in your game).

 

I've seen some of those prominent voices...and sometimes in the same sentence, they accuse the other party of setting them up or being "professional victims", or saying that its unfortunate that people have been driven to those extremes by those horrible SJW etc...condemning it, and simultaneously forgiving and/or justifying the harassment.

 

But lets not forget what really kicked the whole gamergate bullshit into high gear...a man accused his ex of being a whore for good reviews.  Oh wow, a woman being accused of whoring...lets start it with a classic misogynistic trope.  EXCEPT THE PUBLICATION NEVER REVIEWED THE GAME IN QUESTION, THE WHOLE DAMN FIGHT FOR ETHICS IN GAME JOURNALISM IS FOUNDED ON A LIE.

 

Are there conflicts of interest in game journalism?  I'm not stupid, of course there are...look at what Ubisoft just did with the review embargoes of Assassin's Creed until AFTER THE GAME WAS RELEASED.  Or with Shadow of Mordor having preferred partners that basically required them to give the game a tongue bath on twitter and YouTube?

 

Is GG making a fuss about that?  Maybe...I haven't seen it if they have, but they've been all over anyone they've identified as an SJW though.

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Mewwt

Mewwt

Posted
Posted

 I say it's changing, and has been for some time. And I think it has much more to do with gamers like me than it ever does Sarkeesian or Leigh Alexander at Gamasutra and their ilk. I and lots of female gamers like me actively participate, we compete, and once in a while we get to bust some myths. That's how you change things, not from an opposite podium.

 

I really don't care about that stuff. I don't know why would anyone treat a woman any differently from a man (in games and such, of course), it's not like you're going to be able to get to bang her or anything. The same applies with all that "rape in games" stuff I've seen people argue so much about. If you want to rape half of whiterun in your skyrim game and it's not hurting anyone, why wouldn't you be able to do that?

 

Anyways, all that women vs men in internet stuff is really tiring. It's not like women have to demonstrate anything all like "hey, we're useful, look at me, I can kill stuff as well as a man in battlefield!". If you really have to do that to "change things", that proves how wrong your point of view is. The problem is on the people who flip their shit on a tit (all these women who call anything rape, objectizing and disrespecting women) and men (in this case, when I say men I mean kids or mentally immature people) who will "fall for the bait" and will argue with them.

 

From my point of view, it's not much different from getting butthurt over a 13 year old who fucks your mom everytime you kill him in call of duty. It's on your hand to start insulting him back or just keep playing ignoring him and drown in his own poop.

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Derpakiin

Derpakiin

Posted
Posted

-feminism causes drama

-drams sells games

-feminism is the anti-fanservice fanservice

 

your mind will explode in 3 2 1

 

-Only idiots buy into drama

-They feel cheated when they give money to Nigerian princes, charge their iPhones with iWAVE and oh... buy shitty games.

-Create Gamergate

-Gamergate creates more drama

-Gamergate isn't any different to feminism or SJWs. They are just the male version of professional victims.

 

Mind blown in 3...2...1...

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circ

circ

Posted
Posted

I'm on no particular 'side' in this, but I have been following the GG side of things for about a week and have been doing 'research' retroactively and I have no idea where this harassment and hate narrative from the anti-GG side comes from, other than the anti-faction's imagination. I've seen lenghty, sourced posts and videos disseminating and countering arguments - sometimes using parody - from the GG side, whilst at the same time from the anti-GG side I see women, men, minorities and the disabled being patronized, ridiculed and downright put down with an endless barrage of insults and other ad hominems. Entitled individuals that expect apologies when they are in the wrong and when that apology for no logical reason still appears - lament the fact that they didn't grovel enough. Lately it's become more about some off-shoots of feminists having issues with certain things than what it originally was about - ethics in media, but that's been pushed forward by the anti-GG side more than anything. When a GG talks about equality, for all sexes - because it's been forced into the discussion, and the other party responds with hateful speech, I think there's something wrong with you.

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Guest

Guest

Posted
Posted

 

 I say it's changing, and has been for some time. And I think it has much more to do with gamers like me than it ever does Sarkeesian or Leigh Alexander at Gamasutra and their ilk. I and lots of female gamers like me actively participate, we compete, and once in a while we get to bust some myths. That's how you change things, not from an opposite podium.

 

I really don't care about that stuff. I don't know why would anyone treat a woman any differently from a man (in games and such, of course), it's not like you're going to be able to get to bang her or anything. The same applies with all that "rape in games" stuff I've seen people argue so much about. If you want to rape half of whiterun in your skyrim game and it's not hurting anyone, why wouldn't you be able to do that?

 

Anyways, all that women vs men in internet stuff is really tiring. It's not like women have to demonstrate anything all like "hey, we're useful, look at me, I can kill stuff as well as a man in battlefield!". If you really have to do that to "change things", that proves how wrong your point of view is. The problem is on the people who flip their shit on a tit (all these women who call anything rape, objectizing and disrespecting women) and men (in this case, when I say men I mean kids or mentally immature people) who will "fall for the bait" and will argue with them.

 

From my point of view, it's not much different from getting butthurt over a 13 year old who fucks your mom everytime you kill him in call of duty. It's on your hand to start insulting him back or just keep playing ignoring him and drown in his own poop.

 

You know virtually nothing at all about me, what my experiences have been, how I handle myself, or what motivates me. You have little or nothing to go on other than a quote that you took completely out of context. Go you!

 

You won't be the first internet blowhard to tell me to get a clue while appearing to not have one themselves, and I'm sure you won't' be the last. 

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torlok

torlok

Posted
Posted

The way I see it is this...feminism as a whole HAS aided the common woman in a lot of ways, WHEN IT IS USED IN THE PROPER MANNER. The proper manner being to promote and encourage women to try their hands at various things, and not let others tell them they cannot do something. That being said, from what I have gathered on the GG movement, it strikes me as an extremely inflammatory use of feminism. Perhaps it could even be said that they are just using feminism as a guise to strike out and cause dissent in the gaming community as a whole. Honestly, I fully expect to be called chauvinistic and various other unsavory terms for holding that opinion. But lets face facts here people: This isn't the 40's, 50's, 60's, or even the 70's. Women are no longer treated as second class citizens. In a lot of ways, women hold more rights (and yes more power) than men do. "What??!! Are you delusional? No woman any where holds as much power as men do!" you say? Need I point out the court system these days, and that a woman's word is more often than not believed over a man's any day of the week?

 

As far as women in gaming goes, I can personally say I have enjoyed many MANY hours of gaming in various genres with women. In fact, I would say certain genres women are so good at as to make it hard for a man to compete...MMO's being one of the top ones. Some of the strongest players, with the best gear and most in game currency I have ever seen were women. My theory is that they have more patience for the grinding than most men do to get to that point. And I cannot tell you how many times I had my arse handed to me in various FPS games by...you guessed it....very skilled women gamers. Are there various people out there who cannot handle losing in a game to a girl because they have the misguided notion that it makes them seem weaker? Sure, there are millions like that. But it isn't limited to gaming, as some of the GG movement members would have you believe. Case in point: Danika Patrick, the FEMALE nascar driver and how she was treated when she first entered the nascar circuit. It was a, shall we say, less than warm welcome.

 

 

If you ask me (and in a way you did w33beast1e, lol), they are simply trying to take one tiny part in SOME games (i.e. = nudity, sex, and the depiction of the worlds oldest profession), and blow it so out of proportion as to make the proverbial mountain out of a mole hill. And yes, if you dig back a ways, you will find a very caustic article about Lovers Lab by one of the GG movements members (whose name escapes me at the moment, but I will look it up when I get a chance and edit this post with it). She slammed LL for having so many prostitution and slavery mods, saying basically that we do not value nor have any respect for women in general and should be shut down.

 

I could go on for hours about this extremist movement in the guise of feminism, but I won't. To sum it up, I equate what the GG movement in general is saying of in their words "all male gamers" with politicians stating that violent video games make children commit violent acts. That being there is just enough truth in their wave of hot air as to hide the overall falseness of their generalizations. But I DO applaude you, w33, for picking a very thought provoking topic for discussion. Kudos!

 

 

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Guest corespore

Guest corespore

Posted
Posted

Really cringeworthy commercial though.

 

 

Yeah, I wasn't impressed either.

 

Sony should be allowed to run whatever commercials they want, that said, it's a bit insulting to think that they assume we are interested in their shitty Vita in the the first place. 

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Guest corespore

Guest corespore

Posted
Posted

Man the more he reports on GG the more stressed and worn-out he looks. And the harder he tries to deny it the more he becomes one of us. 

 

 

 

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