[Sugestion] Player sexuality shoul be calculated only by CONCENSUAL sex

[theHatzel]

The number of MODs that use the sexual preference of the player by the SexLab framework is growing, so I think it's can be the time to discuss the way that this is calculated. The point is that aways bothered me that no matters how is your role play, the sexuality of your character will aways be calculated by the general times that the player had sex with people of some gender, not by the times that the player CHOSE one gender to like. I'm taking for example that some woman or guy can turn from homo to hetero just because they where forced to make sex with somebody. I prefer to not enter in much details about it because I think that I could miss the point, which is to bring a little more role play for the game.
And I don't think that this is to hard to do, because is just change one variable on the calculation.

[Kuロi]

Depends on what kind of character you role-play. You've got people who want their character strictly hetero/homo, but then you've also got people who like that sexuality change as if the character had become a broken sex addict.

 

I say making it an option should be best, and probably easy to integrate into sexlab itself, considering it can already make the difference between rape and consensual sex.

[theHatzel]

Yes, in that case, the toggable option should be better. Now this post must reach some of the devolpers of Sexlab xD

[AlerictheNord]

Totally agree.

 

It is a bit odd being captured by bandits as a straight female, then leaving/escaping the bandit camp as a full on lesbian just because my captors were mostly female. :/

[Ashal]

Current development builds of SexLab tracks non-consensual as a 1/3 of what consensual counts towards sexuality. 

[Mdy]

What about only having non-consensual sex and role playing as a straight person for example?

The toggle option would be useful.

[Aliris]

This seems a little unnecessary at this point, as from what I've seen the 'sexuality' that Sexlab displays for you is mostly just a bit of flavor text, and has no actual impact on any mods (that I've seen).  Most mods that have the ability to alter functionality based on a defined sexuality allow you to select that in MCM, rather than assuming from Sexlab's history.

 

Perhaps a better suggestion might be to allow a selection in Sexlab's MCM that lets you define your base sexuality, and then let others draw from there?

[AlerictheNord]

Current development builds of SexLab tracks non-consensual as a 1/3 of what consensual counts towards sexuality. 

 

But why should it count at all?

 

If a Lesbian is raped by a man, she isn't going to become 'less lesbian.'

[traveller_phi]

 

Current development builds of SexLab tracks non-consensual as a 1/3 of what consensual counts towards sexuality. 

 

But why should it count at all?

 

If a Lesbian is raped by a man, she isn't going to become 'less lesbian.'

 

 

I suppose it depends on how traumatic the rape was. While it is not really how rape works in the real world, in sexlab rape basically triggers a sexlab animation and both parties receive pleasure. That it started as rape has little influence on how enthusiastically the victim participates or how much satisfaction they gain from it. If we think within that framework, it seems to fit more of a coerced sex than the violent rape most people have as a default image of "rape". Still rape, but I could imagine a lesbian that is somehow forced to enjoy lots if hetro sex while experiencing a dry spell in female partners might become a little more openminded about her future choices in sexual partners. This sort of forcing would have to be at the very light end of rape, for example drinking to much and then giving in to the advances of a guy, rather than some guy forcing himself on a woman actively fighting back against him. 

 

Its probably best though to think of the sexlab "sexual orientation" as sort of a diary indicator of the sort of sex the player has been having, rather than a label for the player's "true" sexuality. A more "practical orientation" than "desired orientation". For example, taking rape out of the picture entirely, imagine a female PC who would classify herself as bisexual, but with a preference for women. But as it happens, nearly all her opportunities for sex involve males. Sexlab would classify her as straight, which would not be correct from a desire perspective.

 

[theHatzel]

This seems a little unnecessary at this point, as from what I've seen the 'sexuality' that Sexlab displays for you is mostly just a bit of flavor text, and has no actual impact on any mods (that I've seen).  Most mods that have the ability to alter functionality based on a defined sexuality allow you to select that in MCM, rather than assuming from Sexlab's history.

 

Perhaps a better suggestion might be to allow a selection in Sexlab's MCM that lets you define your base sexuality, and then let others draw from there?

 

 

Actualy I already saw two or more mods that use the SexLab Sexuality. So, it is starting to make some difference, the time to change this is now... And even that "rape influences only 1/3" of player sexuality is totaly wrong. But if It could be toggable it would be better, make the player decides if rape will influence -10%(traumas), 1/3, 100% or 0%.

[AlerictheNord]

 

 

Current development builds of SexLab tracks non-consensual as a 1/3 of what consensual counts towards sexuality. 

 

But why should it count at all?

 

If a Lesbian is raped by a man, she isn't going to become 'less lesbian.'

 

 

I suppose it depends on how traumatic the rape was. While it is not really how rape works in the real world, in sexlab rape basically triggers a sexlab animation and both parties receive pleasure. That it started as rape has little influence on how enthusiastically the victim participates or how much satisfaction they gain from it. If we think within that framework, it seems to fit more of a coerced sex than the violent rape most people have as a default image of "rape". Still rape, but I could imagine a lesbian that is somehow forced to enjoy lots if hetro sex while experiencing a dry spell in female partners might become a little more openminded about her future choices in sexual partners. This sort of forcing would have to be at the very light end of rape, for example drinking to much and then giving in to the advances of a guy, rather than some guy forcing himself on a woman actively fighting back against him. 

 

Its probably best though to think of the sexlab "sexual orientation" as sort of a diary indicator of the sort of sex the player has been having, rather than a label for the player's "true" sexuality. A more "practical orientation" than "desired orientation". For example, taking rape out of the picture entirely, imagine a female PC who would classify herself as bisexual, but with a preference for women. But as it happens, nearly all her opportunities for sex involve males. Sexlab would classify her as straight, which would not be correct from a desire perspective.

 

 

 

So...what your saying is that when a Female PC gets captured by a group of bandits and raped...it is not necessarily a traumatic event? O_o

 

Again, if I'm role-playing a Lesbian PC, she shouldn't suddenly decides she likes guys because she was captured and raped during an adventure gone wrong, it is neither immerssive nor logical.

[traveller_phi]

 

 

 

 

 

Current development builds of SexLab tracks non-consensual as a 1/3 of what consensual counts towards sexuality. 

 

But why should it count at all?

 

If a Lesbian is raped by a man, she isn't going to become 'less lesbian.'

 

 

I suppose it depends on how traumatic the rape was. While it is not really how rape works in the real world, in sexlab rape basically triggers a sexlab animation and both parties receive pleasure. That it started as rape has little influence on how enthusiastically the victim participates or how much satisfaction they gain from it. If we think within that framework, it seems to fit more of a coerced sex than the violent rape most people have as a default image of "rape". Still rape, but I could imagine a lesbian that is somehow forced to enjoy lots if hetro sex while experiencing a dry spell in female partners might become a little more openminded about her future choices in sexual partners. This sort of forcing would have to be at the very light end of rape, for example drinking to much and then giving in to the advances of a guy, rather than some guy forcing himself on a woman actively fighting back against him. 

 

Its probably best though to think of the sexlab "sexual orientation" as sort of a diary indicator of the sort of sex the player has been having, rather than a label for the player's "true" sexuality. A more "practical orientation" than "desired orientation". For example, taking rape out of the picture entirely, imagine a female PC who would classify herself as bisexual, but with a preference for women. But as it happens, nearly all her opportunities for sex involve males. Sexlab would classify her as straight, which would not be correct from a desire perspective.

 

 

 

 

 

So...what your saying is that when a Female PC gets captured by a group of bandits and raped...it is not necessarily a traumatic event? O_o

 

Again, if I'm role-playing a Lesbian PC, she shouldn't suddenly decides she likes guys because she was captured and raped during an adventure gone wrong, it is neither immerssive nor logical.

 

 

What I meant to say is that due to the limitations of the game engine, rape may not be a traumatic event. While there are a few forceful animations, none of them seem to show "struggling to get away from attacker", more of a "I think you are being a little rough". Even those usually start of mild and are only rough at the end. I can't really fault sexlab for that, I don't think I would want to watch a realistic portrayal of rape myself. Working backwards from how the animations went to what could have lead to it, it seems more realistic that the victim was simply pressured into having sex rather than forcably beaten into submission.

 

But really, I think the best way to look at the sexlab orientation is that the PC has had the sexual experience of X, not that X is what the PC actually desires in his/her heart. This can be an issue if other mods read that stat and assume the latter interpretation is correct.

 

[Ashal]

The word "rape" shouldn't be any part of this. It's by no coincidence that the word rape doesn't appear a single time anywhere in SexLab's settings or code. It was a very conscience choice to label scenes as "aggressive" because how that can be interpreted is entirely up to the author of the individual sexlab mods and their users.

 

I find the 1/3rd credit to be enough compromise between the two camps, allowing one to exist without forcing itself outright onto the other. Adding yet another toggle to the already cluttered MCM for such a minor thing that 99% of users will never notice or care about is not a worthwhile investment in my opinion.

 

If a mod author disagrees, than SexLab's API is at their disposal to remove any credit given towards sexuality after aggressive animations started by their mod.

[afa]

 

This seems a little unnecessary at this point, as from what I've seen the 'sexuality' that Sexlab displays for you is mostly just a bit of flavor text, and has no actual impact on any mods (that I've seen).  Most mods that have the ability to alter functionality based on a defined sexuality allow you to select that in MCM, rather than assuming from Sexlab's history.

 

Perhaps a better suggestion might be to allow a selection in Sexlab's MCM that lets you define your base sexuality, and then let others draw from there?

 

 

Actualy I already saw two or more mods that use the SexLab Sexuality. So, it is starting to make some difference, the time to change this is now... And even that "rape influences only 1/3" of player sexuality is totaly wrong. But if It could be toggable it would be better, make the player decides if rape will influence -10%(traumas), 1/3, 100% or 0%.

 

Which mods are those? and what does PC sexuality affects in those mods?

[AlerictheNord]

 

 

This seems a little unnecessary at this point, as from what I've seen the 'sexuality' that Sexlab displays for you is mostly just a bit of flavor text, and has no actual impact on any mods (that I've seen).  Most mods that have the ability to alter functionality based on a defined sexuality allow you to select that in MCM, rather than assuming from Sexlab's history.

 

Perhaps a better suggestion might be to allow a selection in Sexlab's MCM that lets you define your base sexuality, and then let others draw from there?

 

 

Actualy I already saw two or more mods that use the SexLab Sexuality. So, it is starting to make some difference, the time to change this is now... And even that "rape influences only 1/3" of player sexuality is totaly wrong. But if It could be toggable it would be better, make the player decides if rape will influence -10%(traumas), 1/3, 100% or 0%.

 

Which mods are those? and what does PC sexuality affects in those mods?

 

 

Without checking, I can think of a few mods that use Sexuality, actually.

 

- SexLab Submit uses sexuality as a factor in its dialogue option.

 

- SexLab Arousal uses sexuality in determining arousal levels of the NPC and PC.

 

- SexLab Attraction checks Sexuality to determine attractiveness.

 

- SexLab Romances takes gender preference into account.

[ylenard]

 

 

- SexLab Submit uses sexuality as a factor in its dialogue option.

 

- SexLab Arousal uses sexuality in determining arousal levels of the NPC and PC.

 

- SexLab Attraction checks Sexuality to determine attractiveness.

 

- SexLab Romances takes gender preference into account.

 

 

Attraction actually only checks NPCs sexuality when calculating attraction, but it almost always returns Bisexual, so I made an alternative option - most NPCs count as straight.

[Tentacle Love]

I say that the player's sexuality should be chosen by the player.

 

If YOU want to say that getting raped by a bunch of people changes your sexuality, that's ok, because it's your character, but the default should NOT be that everyone else gets to determine your sexuality.

That's an infinitely huge can of worms and it needs to be fixed.

[shane4244]

I would say ask the mod authors of the mods your using to change how it is calculated in there mod or just get rid of sexuality all together in Sexlab and just use your imagination. I would rather Ashal spend time on things that are beyond the mod authors control that have to be done in the framework rather than wasting time on features that he has already included ways for us to change.

[Ashal]

Meh, the more I think about it the more I think maybe it'd be best to just make the players sexuality a toggle, and leave the calculating it for npcs.

[nutluck]

Meh, the more I think about it the more I think maybe it'd be best to just make the players sexuality a toggle, and leave the calculating it for npcs.

 

That is likely the easiest solution.

[Aliris]

I'm pretty sure several of those mods listed are using their own settings, not simply importing your sexuality from Sexlab's listing - I know Submit specifically lets you toggle if you see the dialogue options with a given gender (same/opposite/both), rather than deriving it.

 

Letting people toggle the setting in Sexlab is probably best, even if it may make for some humorous incongruities with their actions....

 

[WaxenFigure]

 

Kill the poll, the decision was made.