Master Update and ESM header

[Guest]

Hello,

 

- Could someone tell me what approximately a MasterUpdate does to my ESPs? I used it on FO3 as it was the key to achieve stability in my game, but people told me to not do it in New Vegas because "it can break mods".

- I thought it was changing the header, making an ESM from an ESP, is it what it simply does?

- If it's so, why I have read it breaks companions mods? or better, can a companion mod have problems in being an ESM?

 

I thank you and I wish you all a wonderful day

[jaam]

What it does is change ALL your esp by setting the ESM flag and building the ONAM structure.

But the consequences are that some scripts may break as the rules that variables follows are more permissive for "esp" than "esm". Also all references from an esp is considerered persistent by the engine, which is not true of an esm so some "things" may be resetted at the wrong time.

 

You are better off explicitly stting the flag on selected mods: Those that contains non caucasian new NPC  and, aparently, those that edits or create navmeshes. I don't know the exact issue here but Kendo2 as complained about it more than once.

 

[Guest]

Thank you jaam!

 

When I was writing this thread, I was feeling inside of me you were the one who answered me, since even the previous question I did few months ago you solved my doubts in a minute... it was about persistent references breaking when I changed to ESM

 

Well, concerning what you write, there's not much new from what I know, the persistent reference thing, navmesh and face / body misplaced colors.

But I didn't know about "variables follows are more permissive", could you tell me something more about this?

 

I would stick with an esp, BUT I both created a follower and created and edited navmeshes. Navmesh on a ESP is something more a navmeSS, it doesn't work correctly and there's no way to make it work if not flagging the esm header. I really would stick with ESM but I would like to understand which problems come out from those "variables more permissive"

[Guest luthienanarion]

MasterUpdate is a function created for Fallout 3's 1.5 patch which had a bug that crashed the game when saving if you were using plugins without the ESM flag set. That bug was fixed, and MasterUpdate is no longer necessary for any reason.

[jaam]

A script in an esp can use references that are not explicitly persistent. Compiling the same script in an ESM will fail. So if you run an esmified ESP with such references, said reference might be invalid at the time resulting in a "script crash". And some scripts once crashed cannot be restarted.

 

So most plugins will "survive" when they are marked as ESM, but the one that won't may generate erors that may show up way later in your game, and would be very hard to identify.

 

I recommend:

  Convert only when needed.

  Once converted, recompile all script in a dummy esp. That way you will know in advance if there is an issue.

[Guest]

jaam

 

yes that's the trick you already told me which persistent references flags I was missing few months ago after the esm process, since a script wasn't working. Compiling everything with PU active, and it was really a great success, something I always do now.

 

waffles

thank you, I didn't know that. now I understand why it's so useful with my FO3 installation!

[astymma]

I would stick with an esp, BUT I both created a follower and created and edited navmeshes. Navmesh on a ESP is something more a navmeSS, it doesn't work correctly and there's no way to make it work if not flagging the esm header. I really would stick with ESM but I would like to understand which problems come out from those "variables more permissive"

 

When you have functionality in a mod that requires both esp and esm behavior, the solution should be to create an esm for the esm content and an esp for the esp content that uses the esm as a master. Use the correct file type for the mod you're making. if that means two files, make two files

 

[Guest]

I also thought to that too, but I realized it wasn't the best solution in this case. That ESP will be the core (which I have to use in another mod too) while the ESM would be an added extra content, which still propagates its relationship on the esp. Dangerous thing, it's... capsided