Apropos - Feature Request and Descriptions Submission

[WaxenFigure]

The mod could also hunt for \n sequences and reset it's own internal counter so that when you know you're going to do a message with a line break you can control where the break occurs.

[gooser]

The mod could also hunt for \n sequences and reset it's own internal counter so that when you know you're going to do a message with a line break you can control where the break occurs.

 

Yep. Apropos is using JContainer's JString.wrap method. Earendil?

[Guest]

Actually, setting up 2nd person in my db won't work, because of 3rd person. Since it's written as 1st person voyeur, it would be disjointed if the PC's own sex acts were from a different perspective.

 

The only fix I can think of would be to make a separate db file for 2nd person. Is that even something people want? I suppose I could make one and just check the download figures...

[foxyvixen21]

Hello all I am back, I am currently testing for Female to Female integration.

 

I need a few people to help me out with tests, if you have Apropos installed it will give you a log file. I am trying to see which actor is giving oral in animations, so far my tests have concluded it is actor[0]

 

examples:

Kneeling BJ - Jonna was giving oral.

[0]: Jonna, female 

[1]: Player, female 

 

Arrok Lesbian - player was giving oral.

[0]: Player, female 

[1]: Jonna, female

 

I think the only exception is the Arrok 69 where Jonna was on top for the first part.

[0]: Jonna, female 

[1]: Player, female 

 

I need people to test this in multiple ways and situations to see if this is true. If anyone is interested I need to know :

* Female to female animations

* Which actor is giving oral (actor[0] or actor[1])

* Which animation it was

* If it was consensual 

 

If you have Apropos installed the log file will give you all the information you need. In game you can press ~ to see what the animation was called and which actor was [0] and [1].

[gooser]

Please take the poll if you have time:

 

http://www.loverslab.com/topic/30629-which-follower-framework-do-you-use/

[Earen]

RE: Line breaks

 

It looks like the line is being broken by whatever you have the segmentation set to even if there's a line break.

 

So if you have a 90 character line and you insert a line break at 45 characters, you get the line break at 45 then one at 70. So instead of 2 lines at 45 you get 3 lines with a line at 45, a line at 25 (the 70 character break), and a line at 20 (the remainder).

 

I may experiment and see if I can set the line break at like... 100 and THEN break it at 50 and see what I get for a result.

 

I also think I want to look for an editor that will tell me in real time how many characters I have and what position I'm at.

'Cause counting them sucks

 

we need mooore resources. can you post examples?

 

 

The mod could also hunt for \n sequences and reset it's own internal counter so that when you know you're going to do a message with a line break you can control where the break occurs.

 

Yep. Apropos is using JContainer's JString.wrap method. Earendil?

 

Am.. i have nothing to say. wrap function accounts \n as spaces - just split whole string using spaces and \n as separators and then magick begins..

Maybe i didn't got the idea, but i think that using linebreak is wrong way as real message length is unknown

[chajapa]

Earendil,

 

Right now it looks like Apropos counts characters in the string TOTAL ... regardless of whether there a \n in it or not. The output to debug.notification then gets a VERY small font because it sees a very long string. I believe that's a function built in to Skyrim and not something Apropos does as I seem to recall gooser saying there was no control over font size, time on screen, etc. 

 

Anyways.... the font size for a 45 character string is still very readable. The font size for a 100 character string is almost impossible to read because it's so small. 

 

I tried turning segmentation off and just using the \n to break the lines. It worked, but with extremely small font as it was still being seen as a single string with total character count making the font small.... OR... the notification area is just using the smallest font because it doesn't know how long the string is?

 

I don't know. I don't have the tools to check all of this. 

 

I purposely left in a couple of lines that are 95 characters long. Segmentation at the default of 70. Apropos broke the line into 3 lines (as it should) and the font size was good. AS THOUGH each segment was being counted as a line for character count. I'm getting confused.

 

I know that gooser mentioned an SKSE plugin that should give access to a new screen area with much more control, so I'm not sure this display thing is worth the time to chase it down.

 

HOWEVER.... Apropos most critical function is to describe what's happening. Getting it to describe WELL (and readable) probably SHOULD be at the top of the list. 

It's such a great mod and has added a lot of enjoyment. Maybe we accept the trade-off for now of shorter strings if you want to be able to read it.

 

And see what can be done later to improve the display when the SKSE plugin comes out.

 

 

[gooser]

Earendil,

 

Right now it looks like Apropos counts characters in the string TOTAL ... regardless of whether there a \n in it or not. The output to debug.notification then gets a VERY small font because it sees a very long string. I believe that's a function built in to Skyrim and not something Apropos does as I seem to recall gooser saying there was no control over font size, time on screen, etc. 

 

Anyways.... the font size for a 45 character string is still very readable. The font size for a 100 character string is almost impossible to read because it's so small. 

 

I tried turning segmentation off and just using the \n to break the lines. It worked, but with extremely small font as it was still being seen as a single string with total character count making the font small.... OR... the notification area is just using the smallest font because it doesn't know how long the string is?

 

I don't know. I don't have the tools to check all of this. 

 

I purposely left in a couple of lines that are 95 characters long. Segmentation at the default of 70. Apropos broke the line into 3 lines (as it should) and the font size was good. AS THOUGH each segment was being counted as a line for character count. I'm getting confused.

 

I know that gooser mentioned an SKSE plugin that should give access to a new screen area with much more control, so I'm not sure this display thing is worth the time to chase it down.

 

HOWEVER.... Apropos most critical function is to describe what's happening. Getting it to describe WELL (and readable) probably SHOULD be at the top of the list. 

It's such a great mod and has added a lot of enjoyment. Maybe we accept the trade-off for now of shorter strings if you want to be able to read it.

 

And see what can be done later to improve the display when the SKSE plugin comes out.

 

When Segmentation is used, each line is a separate call to Skyrim's notification system, and will possibly be scaled differently, depending upon how long each segment is. In a perfect scenario, a sentence is broken up into equal segments, and they all appear in the same font size. Skyrim scales the font size dynamically and we have no control over that. Apropos isn't doing any 'counting' of character lengths at this point. I just hand off the complete string to JContainers and I get a list of segments back. Each segment is played through Skyrim's notification system, and we hand off complete control to Skyrim. We have no say when the message gets displayed, what font, shoot - its even possible they wont show at all! Its non-deterministic.

 

There's not much more that can be done Chajapa with Apropos (until I finish the new display system). Quite frankly, i'm surprised we have as good a display as we currently do. I'm pretty sure no other mod does this (breaks up text, sequences the segments). Now we can talk about how to interpret the line breaks in a different way possibly, but as I've said in the original post, editing the descriptions is for the adventurous - that is why the original database they were quite short - through my in-depth research, I found that the notification system was quite anemic and very limited.

 

I understand your points, but as this point I'm not going to do any more to this area of the mod for the time being. I have different priorities than yours.

[chajapa]

I hope you aren't taking any of what I said to be a criticism of your work. What we have is marvelous and I applaud you. I'm just tossin' stuff out there 'cause I was always the first kid on the block to bring a screwdriver when anybody came home with a new toy.

 

I'm not a programmer. I'm just an old hacker. I just figured if I reported what I could SEE... then YOUR genius might spot something actually useful. No criticism from me. I'm honestly just trying to be helpful and hope I haven't overstepped. 

 

 

[gooser]

I hope you aren't taking any of what I said to be a criticism of your work. What we have is marvelous and I applaud you. I'm just tossin' stuff out there 'cause I was always the first kid on the block to bring a screwdriver when anybody came home with a new toy.

 

I'm not a programmer. I'm just an old hacker. I just figured if I reported what I could SEE... then YOUR genius might spot something actually useful. No criticism from me. I'm honestly just trying to be helpful and hope I haven't overstepped. 

 

No problems. If you would like to attach some screenshots, i wouldn't mind looking at them to see if I have overlooked something...

[Guest]

I can't think of any way to make a single db file that works with 2nd & 3rd person modes, and still has the 3rd person voyeur messages. If I set 2nd party, then 3rd person messages will seem disjointed because the perspective will switch to 1st. Needless to say, the 3rd person will not make sense when used to describe what the PC is actually doing if they describe watching someone else.

 

I suppose I could make a separate db file without the voyeur messages, and just c/p the existing messages and change the tense? That would be a lot of work though, and would be a hassle to maintain as well as my own db file with the voyeur messages. I might do that when I have some spare time and see how popular it is.

[gooser]

I'm not sure I understand what you are attempting to do with Apropos. Can you give me an example of what 'voyeuristic' messages are that you are trying to generate?

[Guest]

Essentially, I hopped on board the fact that you've made Apropos trigger the 3rd person messages when NPCs go at it.

So, what I did was write the 3rd person messages as, instead of 3rd person narrative, to be 1st person messages of the PC observing the act.

 

So, instead of simply writing "{PRIMARY_NAME} has sex with {ACTIVE_NAME}", I can write "I watch {PRIMARY_NAME} have sex with {ACTIVE_NAME}.",

 

This means the PC is still involved even if not an active participant, and I can describe the PC's reaction (shock, arousal, disgust, whatever) to the act.  "I can't believe she's doing that", "I should help her", "Dibs on next", etc.

 

I'm aware this is not quite the original intent of the 3rd person messages, but the entire db file was written around the PC.

 

What this means though, is that because the 3rd person lines are written from the 1st person about a 3rd person, anyone using the 2nd person lines with my db will notice a disjointed combination, with lines about the PC referring to 'you' and lines about NPCs using 'I'.

 

That being said, anyone using Arousal (which I assume is everybody) will always have a disconnect, since Arousal uses the same messaging system and always uses 1st person ('I need to have sex').

[gooser]

Essentially, I hopped on board the fact that you've made Apropos trigger the 3rd person messages when NPCs go at it.

So, what I did was write the 3rd person messages as, instead of 3rd person narrative, to be 1st person messages of the PC observing the act.

 

So, instead of simply writing "{PRIMARY_NAME} has sex with {ACTIVE_NAME}", I can write "I watch {PRIMARY_NAME} have sex with {ACTIVE_NAME}.",

 

This means the PC is still involved even if not an active participant, and I can describe the PC's reaction (shock, arousal, disgust, whatever) to the act.  "I can't believe she's doing that", "I should help her", "Dibs on next", etc.

 

I'm aware this is not quite the original intent of the 3rd person messages, but the entire db file was written around the PC.

 

What this means though, is that because the 3rd person lines are written from the 1st person about a 3rd person, anyone using the 2nd person lines with my db will notice a disjointed combination, with lines about the PC referring to 'you' and lines about NPCs using 'I'.

 

That being said, anyone using Arousal (which I assume is everybody) will always have a disconnect, since Arousal uses the same messaging system and always uses 1st person ('I need to have sex').

 

Why don't add formal support for this in Apropos?

[Guest]

If you do so, that would be excellent dude. Although if you want full 2nd support in a single db file, I'd need two slots; one for 1st person voyeur (I watch them have sex) and one for 2nd person voyeur (you watch them have sex).

 

Third person voyeur may be tricky, because you'd need an additional tag; {PRIMARY_NAME}, {ACTIVE_NAME} and something for the PC. Unless you can think of an easy way to do this, may be simpler to leave 3rd person as using the 3rd person messages as normal for voyeur.

[chajapa]

Devil's advocate here...

 

Sounds to me like this is just a question of how the player wants to USE what's already there.

 

3rd Person can either actually BE 3rd person OR it can be written as 1st Person Voyeur.

 

I actually have both types of lines in my 3rd Person

 

"I watch Sally slurping Sam"

"Bob and Betty are going at it like bunnies"

 

*shrug*

 

To MAY toes

To MAH toes

 

.... or.... I'm missing the point

 

[Grimbold the unlovely]

I have been writing my own custom messages for a while now, and am moving away from the whole 1st, 2nd, and 3rd person distinctions. The crucial thing is that there are THREE CATEGORIES of messages. How we use them is completely up to us. I use them in this way:

 

Category 1: used for rough, disrespectful sex with strangers. Not rape, not non-consensual, but does include name calling. I use 1st, 2nd, 3rd person messages in this group, as well as direct speech.

 

Category 2: used for recreational one night stands. Same mix of persons and direct speech.

 

Category 3: reserved for spouse. Romantic messages. Same mix of grammatical persons and narrative/direct speech.

 

I find this adds variety within categories and clear distinctions between categories, on the things that really matter.

 

No criticism intended of the mod. Quite the contrary. I am grateful to Gooser for making all this possible. The beauty of Apropos is that it lets us follow our own imaginations and visions of what a sex mod should be. For me, grammatical voices are there to serve the story, not the other way round. I change categories to suit the kind of encounter I want.

[chajapa]

That's kind of funny. You could get pretty creative just with what we have already.

You could have different adjectives based on which "person" you were in. You could have derogatory adjectives and you could have complimentary adjectives. And just use the proper adjective token in the text.

 

 

[gooser]

Who wants FF support still?

[Grimbold the unlovely]

Who wants FF support still?

 

I do. I have basically abandoned my female character in favour of a male one, mostly due to this great mod. It would be nice to be able to use both my characters with Apropos!

 

Thanks, Gooser, for all your tireless work. It is very much appreciated.

[nutluck]

Who wants FF support still?

 

By FF I assume you mean girl on girl. If so well yeah, would be nice if everything was eventually covered including creatures.

[Guest]

I plan on updating to the latest SexLab tonight, and once that's done I'll fire up a new character and spam FF acts to get Foxyvixen a bunch of logs.

[chajapa]

Some new animations in SexLab 1.54.

 

1 for horse where female PC stands next to the horse (who has a giant boner) and fondles herself, then fondles the horse, then gets underneath him and strokes and licks the manlly bits (or horsely bits, as the case may be)

 

2 new ones for giant. One where he holds female PC out and eventually probes her a bit by hand, and another where giant pokes female PC deeper and deeper into her pussy with his giant thing, eventually pushing her down hard and filing her up.

 

Apropos has no apparent issues with 1.54 but 1.54 itself is giving me some issues. Lack of reliable alignment controls is the biggest one for me right now. And at least one of the new 3-way animations seems kinda broken.

 

2 SexLab MCM menues (only 1 of which works) in save games, but if I start a new character, I have only 1 SexLab MCM menu.

 

 

 

 

[Earen]

 

RE: Line breaks

 

It looks like the line is being broken by whatever you have the segmentation set to even if there's a line break.

 

So if you have a 90 character line and you insert a line break at 45 characters, you get the line break at 45 then one at 70. So instead of 2 lines at 45 you get 3 lines with a line at 45, a line at 25 (the 70 character break), and a line at 20 (the remainder).

 

I may experiment and see if I can set the line break at like... 100 and THEN break it at 50 and see what I get for a result.

 

I also think I want to look for an editor that will tell me in real time how many characters I have and what position I'm at.

'Cause counting them sucks

 

we need mooore resources. can you post examples?

 

 

The mod could also hunt for \n sequences and reset it's own internal counter so that when you know you're going to do a message with a line break you can control where the break occurs.

 

Yep. Apropos is using JContainer's JString.wrap method. Earendil?

 

Am.. i have nothing to say. wrap function accounts \n as spaces - just split whole string using spaces and \n as separators and then magick begins..

Maybe i didn't got the idea, but i think that using linebreak is wrong way as real message length is unknown

 

 

btw, just found recently that game doesn't removes extra spaces in the middle of the string e.g. it's possible display such kind of texts:

 

 

(had to add image as quoted text length doesn't looks properly)

[Guest]

Some new animations in SexLab 1.54.

 

1 for horse where female PC stands next to the horse (who has a giant boner) and fondles herself, then fondles the horse, then gets underneath him and strokes and licks the manlly bits (or horsely bits, as the case may be)

 

2 new ones for giant. One where he holds female PC out and eventually probes her a bit by hand, and another where giant pokes female PC deeper and deeper into her pussy with his giant thing, eventually pushing her down hard and filing her up.

 

Apropos has no apparent issues with 1.54 but 1.54 itself is giving me some issues. Lack of reliable alignment controls is the biggest one for me right now. And at least one of the new 3-way animations seems kinda broken.

 

2 SexLab MCM menues (only 1 of which works) in save games, but if I start a new character, I have only 1 SexLab MCM menu.

 

The giant animation doesn't really affect Apropos, but the new horse one does. Any chance we could get a separate Horse Oral file? Existing horse sex messages really don't make sense when you're clearly not fucking the horse.