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Maybe i do VORB for skyrim...


VadersApp

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I am very happy about the great looking female meshes done by 2pac4eva7 and Caliente and also the first walk animation from Edoin.

 

But designing a new mesh leads to the problem that every clothes mesh has to be redesigned to fit to the different body types. For sure more Body types will come in the next months. They all need clothes and armor thats fits to them.

 

So i wonder if the way i did it with VORB (VadersApps Oblivion Real Bodies) would be possible for skyrim.

 

This is what a Skyrim version could do:

It adds several new bones to the female and male body meshes. For example a "breast bone" or a "belly bone". also those bones where added to the skeleton.nif files. The new added bones could be scaled and transformed.

 

The main difference between Oblivions and Skyrims skeleton.nif files on a VORB perspective is that Skyrim does not suffer from the headbanging bug if new bones are added to spine, spine1, spine2, neck, etc... So it is possible now to add those bones to skeleton.nif and scale and transform them like i want. I made some tests and got a fat bard singer.

 

 

FatBard.jpg

 

 

This is done only by editing added bones of the skeleton.nif file.

 

Maybe this could be the better way to get diversity and sexy girlies to skyrim.

 

If this is possible in the future depends on how many bones could be added with additional weightpainting. Oblivion as i remember only supports 4 different weightpaintings per vertice. If Skyrim supports more it will be very easy to add different regions on the body that could be scaled.

 

Also this system could be used to add BBB to all the meshes if an animation is made for it.

 

I would like to check it out and do some tests BUT i do not know how the easiest way is to get the mesh with bones and weightpainting into blender or 3d max. Please 2pac4eva7 and Caliente would you be so kind and help me out?

 

 

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I thought VORB was a pretty slick idea, and it added for an equal amount of sexiness and immersion. However, since I only became aware of it late in the game, I never felt like I used to its potential. But with Skyrim, I think this could be groundbreaking if introduced early on. At least that's what I think, as a layman.

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I fully support this message and/or service. Variety (and customization, definitely) is tons better than one static form for everyone. One would hope the game makers themselves would eventually figure that out.

 

Hell, swg back in the day had more advanced character customization that modern games (well, EVE's chargen is close, but way too polygon heavy), and you were actually able to create unique-looking characters.

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VadersApp, I really hope you decide to port VORB to Skyrim, it would make a HELL of a difference starting early like this, I haven't even picked it up yet, I'll wait till after the CS is released and it's been patched, maybe wait till the GOTY edition comes out. :D

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I support this :)

Sounds pretty straightforward. I haven't tried dealing with bones and animations yet, so I don't know max bones per vertex ... Right now its however many the exporters support, I suppose.

My priority for such a system is breast bones for bouncing animations (Wonder if there's any hope for procedural physics animations due to the anim sys being havok)

 

Scaling is also good for some things, although not everything. A flat scaling of breasts, for example, can create some weird results. But, thighs, arms, waist, belly, calves, feet and hands are great opportunities for this nonlinear scaling system you've proposed.

 

At this point, getting weighted meshes into blender is a matter of making the scripts think they're working with Fallout 3 objects. 2pac was the one who filled me in on the details, and I hope he won't mind me sharing a few pointers to help you out.

 

1) set your nifskope startup version to 20.2.0.7

2) in a file you want to export, set the Userversion to 11 and userversion2 to 34 in the NiHeader

3) Delete any BSLightingShaderProperties.

4) import with default settings.

 

You'll have bones and weights and be all set. The skeleton that comes with the mesh seems a little off though -- it was offset a little from x=0, so testing deformations can be a problem until that's corrected.

 

Exporting again is pretty straightforward. Make sure you assign a image map material to the vertexes before exporting to preserve UVs, and disable stripify in the settings (Default otherwise).

-The exporter will create a bunch of shader stuff that's outmoded, and you can delete all of that, and copy a shader node from another skyrim nif.

- Undo the userversion changes from step 1) (The skyrim version is Userversion1= 12 and userversion2 83.)

- in nitrishapedata, set num_uv_Sets to 1. For body meshes, set 'has normals' to no. For non-body meshes, have nifskope create face normals.

 

HOpe that helps a little, let me know if you have questions.

 

 

 

 

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Vorb needs to be implemented early IMO so it gets adopted by the moding community and used from the start.

 

I want armor that shows the fact that the skinny girl has small breasts but the busty vixens chest obviously has a huge rack and I don't see that happening without a VORB system.

 

Earlier it gets implemented the more likely it will become the staple and used as the standard.

 

Obviously I love your work!

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Thanky!

 

I have added NPC L Breast [LBrs] and NPC R Breast [LBrs] with test weightpainting to the female nif. it exported fine. BUT i also have to add those new Bones to the skeleton.nif file. Adding new Bones is no problem, but adding names to the Bones is not possible for me in nifskope. I don´t understand how it works. i only can choose from numbers, but i don´t know how i can add a new number with the correct bone name. Any hint on that?

 

edit: Arghh, that was simple! I only have to click on txt to edit the bone name. lololol!

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Cool. I still have nightmares from trying to work with Fallout and Oblivion's skeletons, so I'm weary about playing with them in skyrim. Sounds like it has been much cleaned up for this version, which is promising.

 

How are you doing animation/bone scaling? Havok's 3ds tools?

 

 

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If i do it like i did with oblivion i change the path to the skeleton.nif for every single npc to a special skeleton.nif file that has added special scale bones with and/or without weightpainting.

 

I tried to export from blender your body mod with added Breast Bones.

Opened it with latest Nifskope alpha, changed the version numbers but then it was trial and error. never got the mesh loaded up correctly ingame. :( Do not know what i am doing wrong.

 

I will try again after i finished my little speak recognition mod for my own fun. Maybe i ll release it if it is good enough. Now adding Dragonshouts, working fine at the moment.

 

 

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How difficult do you think it would be to make a complete set of body morphs for specific areas of the body much like the Poser or DAZ studio morphs. Essentially creating custom sliders that plug into different morph/blendshapes such as: Glute size, chest size, waist width, nipple size etc... which would enable to player to build the body they desire thus eliminating the need for any other body mods... This may just be crazy talk but I wonder if it could be done? Like VORB but where the body has enough customization options to form any body type from within the games character creation menu. I'm sure this would mean that the skeleton would have to be modified... any way just food for thought as it would really mean the end of individual body mods. Another thing I was thinking was the ability to scale your character using a slider adjusting their height...

 

Thoughts?

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  • 4 weeks later...

I don't know if anybody noticed this, but there is a built-in animation called weaponadjustment.hkx that is used to adjust the bones for the weapons during the morphing. ( there are different versions for male and female )

These anims could be used with the new bones to have morphing work without any scripting.

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An ambitious proposition to be sure. An alternate path to such an undertaking might include:

 

Setting body meshes up as unplayable armors. This way neither you nor the NPC will be able see them or remove them from the NPC's inventory ingame. The result would be that when you strip their gear, the alternate body remains.

 

note: the body (clothe/armor) should have an armor rating and value of 0, this is so they will first opt to wear the garments in their inventory. These alternate bodies should be attached to a biped slot like any other apparel. Popular ones used in the past include necklace or tail slots.

 

Alternate bodies of course would have to point to their respective skin locations. The body texture path replacement would have to happen in "body section" the nif file itself, so this means every armor and clothing that uses the alternate skin would have to be adjusted to point to the new location.

 

We had all kinds of bodies running around simultaneously in Oblivion, and although Skyrim's paths and file structures have changed somewhat, many basic principles still seem to hold. We've not implemented this ourselves as we're up to our nostrils in code working on other large projects for the community, but from what we've seen so far... it should work.

 

Good luck, as there are many great creators who deserve equal time for their efforts. We'd like to see them all get the recognition they deserve. Your efforts might accomplish just that.

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  • 5 weeks later...

 

Sorry as much as i like to do any kind of VORB for Skyrim, real life things have to be done, so there won´t be a VSRB in the next months. Maybe some one else of you talented modder would grab the idea and do it?

 

So i explain how different real bodies with clothes fitting to them could be achived:

 

1. find out how to change the skeleton path for individual npcs and change those with the help of an esp file.

 

2. Add new bones with weightpainting to the bodyparts that should be scaled and transformed to the skeleton.nif file.

 

2.1. you also can add new scale bones between the existing bones. If you scale them the bones before and after will be scaled. so the next bones have to be scaled different. By doing this new weightpainting is not nescessary, but bodyforms are more limited.

 

3. change scale and transform data like you want to. save it to a new nif file. point the path of the npc you wanted to change to the new skeleton.nif file.

 

4. Add new bones and weightpainting to any clothes and armor. Converted armor will change look on different npcs.

 

I don´t know if skyrims new bodysystem could be enhanced by morphing different regions of the bodies. If there is a way it might my less work intense to do it this way.

 

Maybe adding different scale animations to the npcs will be easier than adding new skeleton.nif files with different scale information.

 

Maybe the great bodyslider tool could be enhanced with a function to change different regions and save those to alternativ bodytypes. If Clothes and armor using the bodyslider information, different bodyforms at the same time would be possible.

 

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I would rather see skinny-muscular than skinny-fat sliders for skyrim. Fat people ain't gonna survive in the harsh wilderness!

 

I just hate it when people come up with this argument because its just complete bullshit.

 

Morbidly obese couch potatoes wouldn't survive in skyrim' date=' but "fat" people would be completely fine. There's no reason at all why a strong dude which also sports a beer gut or a woman with some fair extra meat on her bones wouldn't be able to survive.

 

Its actually even the complete oposite. In such an harsh environment all those super ripped body builders and barby dolls would succumb to cold and disease in no time because their bodies have absolutely no reserves.

 

For example take a look at record holder in channel swimming Alison Streeter. If I recall right her bodyfat is between 35/40%, which basically is also a prerequsite, because otherwise you aren't resilient enough.

 

Some other dude who's also a world class swimmer tried to compete with her but failed miserably because he was "just" at 12/14% body fat (which is already way too much to have visible abs btw.) at his first attempt. Then after he fattened himself to over 25% body fat, he finally managed to at least cross the whole distance without aborting midway.

 

 

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Yeah but considering what you do in Skyrim, that is lots and lots of running, and in most cases quite a lot of sword wielding or sneaking, it's probably likely that you'd be rather muscular than fat, if you want to go by realism. Same goes for combat-oriented NPCs.

 

But in any case I think we can all agree that it'd be awesome if we could have all sorts of body types in Skyrim, from slender to voluptuous, and from lean and athletic to big and muscular (and different bone structures, hip widths, breast sizes, skins... well one can dream :)). And VadersApp's proposal would make life a lot easier in that you wouldn't have to convert every piece of clothing for every possible body type individually. So I really hope some talented modders will take up that project.

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Yeah but considering what you do in Skyrim' date=' that is lots and lots of running, and in most cases quite a lot of sword wielding or sneaking, it's probably likely that you'd be rather muscular than fat, if you want to go by realism. Same goes for combat-oriented NPCs.[/quote']

 

If you want to you can go almost everywhere by cart or horse and you can also play the game without ever picking up a weapon and instead use magic and staffs.

 

Also, just because you have lots of physical exercise doesn't mean you have to be lean and thin, you just have to stuff yourself with more food then you can burn, something which shouldn't be a problem for the more wealthy people in skyrim, including the player character who's got more money then he can possibly spent ;)

 

Don't get me wrong, I'am not arguing against muscular pc's and npc's, I just hate it when people say "no don't make any fat people and instead make Arnold Schwarzeneggers because otherwise its unrealistic".

 

 

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If you want to you can go almost everywhere by cart or horse and you can also play the game without ever picking up a weapon and instead use magic and staffs.

 

Also' date=' just because you have lots of physical exercise doesn't mean you have to be lean and thin, you just have to stuff yourself with more food then you can burn, something which shouldn't be a problem for the more wealthy people in skyrim, including the player character who's got more money then he can possibly spent ;)

[/quote']

 

I've mentioned this in another thread, but my dream Skyrim would have body types that evolve seamlessly based on your activities, kind of like in the Sims.

 

Do lots of two-handed sword combat and sprinting? You slowly become more muscular.

 

Do mostly sneaking, running and jumping? You become lean and athletic.

 

Do heavy combat but also lots of eating and drinking? You become big and burly.

 

Eat a lot and avoid all exercise? You become fat.

 

Avoid exercise but also keep a diet? You become slender.

 

 

But I suppose that would only be feasible with a single body system with several sliders. Which apparently isn't possible. Though maybe with a complete overhaul of the body mesh system? I have no idea how this works.

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Sorry as much as i like to do any kind of VORB for Skyrim' date=' real life things have to be done, so there won´t be a VSRB in the next months. Maybe some one else of you talented modder would grab the idea and do it?

 

[/quote']

 

Really sorry to hear that. VORB was fantastic and I had high hopes for VSRB.

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As much as I'd love to see this done, I can get why time would be an issue.

 

 

Still, if anyone does it, there's a lot of folks out there who would be very appreciative. Myself being merely one. I've long been frustrated by the... sameness... of every character in the game.

 

My merchant- fat, lazy, wine-swilling bastard he is, should not look as buff and macho as my Nord Berserker!

 

My perfectly toned Harlot should not bear a striking resemblance to my wandering minstrel!

 

Still... who knows. Maybe someone will pick this up.

 

(Now if only someone could give my Khajiit girl an appropriate number of breasts for a feline. Wouldn't want her kittens to go hungry.)

 

 

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