I believe it's more plausible that Nat is Piper's daughter not sister - let me explain

[katrina.balanchuk]

Nat is usually said to be around 9 or 10 years old.

Piper in vanilla , appears late 20s. Call it 27 or 28 years old.

So there is an age differnence of approxmiately 18 or 19 years between Piper and Nat.

 

So when Nat was born Piper was 18 or 19 years old. That is biologically among the most active child bearing years of a woman and among the most likely years to give birth without complications and no  medical help needed

 

If Nat had been born to Pipers mother; well we know nothing about Pieper's mothers age, but if we presume normal 50s culture style years (and in the postapoc waste land it would not be older!) Could be maybe late teens to late 20s years of age as a most common age for childbirth.

 

So we are looking at a likely age around 40 years (or more!) of age for Piper and Nats mother to have birthed Nat, if Nat was Pipers sister..

At a time when Piper was maybe 18 to 19..

How plausible is that in the post apoc wasteland with no OBGYN?

 

Or put another way: a 18 /19 year old and a 40-45 year old woman ,live in the same house... a baby appears: Who is more likely to have given birth??

 

Isnt it more likely that Piper's ways of freely traveling around by herself got her in trouble,  captured by some raiders who kept her for a night, or a week or a month, for some fun and when she was released she was pregnant with Nat?

 

There are a lot of precedents in the real world for mothers to raise grandchildren of a young daughter that had a child in unfortunate circumstances, to claim that grandchild as their own child to avoid social stigma to their daughter and/or grandchild..

 

If we are looking at what is plausible, Piper's risk taking nature, the ages of Nat and Piper and the nature of the wasteland,  I just believe it is more likely and plausible that Nat is Piper's daughter and not sister.

 

Maybe a mod to change Nats appearance to differ drastically from Pipers say a blue eyed blonde, or mixed asian or black, appearances?

Since it is much easier for a daughter to look drastically different form her mother due to very different looks that fathers could have, than it is for a sister to look very different, since both parents are presumed shared.

 

I dont know if this line of thinking is interesting to anyone since its mostly guys on here who dont think much about stuff like that, but maybe it could lead to a mod vignette of some kind, changed dialogue on affinity with Piper, but it's something that has been tugging at my heartstrings for a while.

Edited March 26, 2025 by katrina.balanchuk

[South8028]

What subtle thoughts.😁

It is unknown how old Piper is, but Nora is ~27 years old (only if she studied at the law academy for 5 years, in fact less). She met Knight in her final year at Suffolk County School of Law in 76. She gave birth in 77. Overall, Nora is approximately 24 to 27 years old. She's really young. Also... Piper and Nat were raised by their father. Nothing is known about the mother. They may have different mothers.

But the idea is interesting. 👍

[Nivea]

I mean, my grandma actually had her son really late in life (a oops I thought I couldnt get pregnant anymore because of my age baby). So its not impossible. But its as good a theory as any since we know next nothing about those two's family really.

Edited December 21, 2024 by Nivea

[Guest]

18 hours ago, South8028 said:

Nora is approximately 24 to 27 years old.

Don't you mean 237 years old...doesn't Codsworth tell Nora she 210 years late for Supper/Dinner??   

I always thought the dialogue script should have been proof read better but maybe some of the inconsistencies are deliberate.

 

@katrina.balanchuk Nice theory, got me to thinking about it anyway.  

Edited December 22, 2024 by Raven 54

[katrina.balanchuk]

To spin this further, when the player m or f, ever gets piper naked there could be a single tatoo or raiders property  mark on her body and when he asks her about it ,she confesses the whole thing but begs him to keep it secret from Nat.

Edited December 22, 2024 by katrina.balanchuk

[Guest]

21 hours ago, katrina.balanchuk said:

To spin this further

You should make a mod to that effect, a whole Piper backstory.   

[katrina.balanchuk]

5 hours ago, Raven 54 said:

You should make a mod to that effect, a whole Piper backstory.   

I know, I could totally write a complete proper backstory beyond Vanilla.

And it would be grounded and plausible, but very salacious and entertaining to both men and women.  

 

But my technical skills are near zero.

I barely know how to turn on the game and adding the AAF mods and get them to work took me maybe 40 hours.

And getting bodyslide to work maybe another 20 and coaching by members via PM.

 

Of coruse that was 2 years ago and I am a lot better now,  but I am still not really a computer perosn.

Even now ,when people tell me after I make a ask and they say "oh, good idea, easy fix just do x y z in FO4 Edit" I thank them but i can never even hope to get it done. 😌

 

Edited December 23, 2024 by katrina.balanchuk

[Guest]

17 minutes ago, katrina.balanchuk said:

 

But my technical skills are near zero.

 

17 minutes ago, katrina.balanchuk said:

I know, I could totally write a complete proper backstory beyond Vanilla.

 

17 minutes ago, katrina.balanchuk said:

And it would be grounded and plausible, but very salacious and entertaining to both men and women.

I think you should make a post asking for someone to make this mod with you, write up an Outline, main topics, quest events, write out the story, and then you can send a copy to whoever responds to work with you.

I think you have thought about this more than anyone has, hence you would be the one to do this.

I only have four years of modding behind me with little skills or I would try to help.

I would like to see this story unfold and have access to it, I think it is a great idea.

     

[katrina.balanchuk]

43 minutes ago, Raven 54 said:

 

 

I think you should make a post asking for someone to make this mod with you, write up an Outline, main topics, quest events, write out the story, and then you can send a copy to whoever responds to work with you.

I think you have thought about this more than anyone has, hence you would be the one to do this.

I only have four years of modding behind me with little skills or I would try to help.

I would like to see this story unfold and have access to it, I think it is a great idea.

     

 

Thank you so much for the kind words!

I should have some time after Christmas

[Midnight19]

don't mean to Necro but what if Pipers Mom died and her dad had Nat with another Woman ?

that's also plausible. 

[katrina.balanchuk]

On 2/15/2025 at 11:07 AM, Midnight19 said:

don't mean to Necro but what if Pipers Mom died and her dad had Nat with another Woman ?

that's also plausible. 

Your explanation is also posisble

But i belive my explanation is among the most plausible plus it has potential for , well, some addtion to Piper.

[Lemurion287]

On 2/25/2025 at 5:07 PM, katrina.balanchuk said:

Your explanation is also posisble

But i belive my explanation is among the most plausible plus it has potential for , well, some addtion to Piper.

For what it's worth, I greatly prefer your idea of Nat being Piper's daughter to them simply having different mothers. It adds so much more to both their relationship and to Piper's story. It's definitely become my headcanon.

[katrina.balanchuk]

4 hours ago, Lemurion287 said:

For what it's worth, I greatly prefer your idea of Nat being Piper's daughter to them simply having different mothers. It adds so much more to both their relationship and to Piper's story. It's definitely become my headcanon.

 

Thank you!

It's my headcanon too that Nat is Pipers daughter from some spicy misadventure.  

 

And probably Nat doesnt know?

Unless we had a mod to change Nats appearance to look significantly differnt from Pipers, say asian or black ..

 

Then it would be obvious to anyone that that Nat is not Pipers sister.

Edited March 26, 2025 by katrina.balanchuk

[Andy14]

I think Piper and her sister are synths.
The evil Institute 😈 gave them the memory that they were supposedly sisters.
And to make the cover perfect, Piper is investigating against the Institute. lol

😅

[Miauzi]

Am 27.03.2025 um 09:51 Uhr sagte Andy14:

Ich glaube, Piper und ihre Schwester sind Synthesizer.
Das böse Institut 😈 gab ihnen die Erinnerung, dass sie angeblich Schwestern waren.
Und um das Cover perfekt zu machen, ermittelt Piper gegen das Institut. lol

😅

 

And of course, she doesn't know that the mayor himself is a synth... just as the population of the entire D.C. settlement has been "replaced."

So if it's a conspiracy theory, let's get it right.

 

But why would the Institute do something like that?

And, above all, which faction within the Institute would approve such an elaborate experiment?

 

---

 

Am 21.12.2024 um 02:21 Uhr sagte katrina.balanchuk:

Nat wird normalerweise auf etwa 9 oder 10 Jahre geschätzt.

Piper in Vanilla sieht aus wie Ende 20. Sagen wir 27 oder 28 Jahre alt.

Zwischen Piper und Nat besteht also ein Altersunterschied von ungefähr 18 oder 19 Jahren.

 

Als Nat geboren wurde, war Piper 18 oder 19 Jahre alt. Das gehört biologisch gesehen zu den aktivsten Jahren der gebärfähigen Frau und zu den Jahren, in denen eine Geburt ohne Komplikationen und ohne medizinische Hilfe am wahrscheinlichsten ist.

 

Wenn Nat von Pipers Mutter geboren wurde, wissen wir zwar nichts über das Alter von Pipers Mutter, aber wenn wir von den normalen Jahren im Kulturstil der 50er Jahre ausgehen (und in der postapokalyptischen Wüste wäre er nicht älter!), könnte das häufigste Alter für die Geburt eines Kindes vielleicht Ende Teenager bis Ende Zwanzig sein.

 

Wir gehen also davon aus, dass Piper und Nats Mutter Nat wahrscheinlich im Alter von etwa 40 Jahren (oder mehr!) zur Welt gebracht haben, wenn Nat Pipers Schwester war.

Zu einer Zeit, als Piper vielleicht 18 oder 19 war …

Wie plausibel ist das in der postapokalyptischen Einöde ohne Gynäkologen?

 

Oder anders ausgedrückt: Eine 18/19-Jährige und eine 40-45-jährige Frau leben im selben Haus... ein Baby taucht auf: Wer hat mit größerer Wahrscheinlichkeit ein Kind zur Welt gebracht??

 

Ist es nicht wahrscheinlicher, dass Piper durch ihre Art, frei und allein umherzureisen, in Schwierigkeiten geriet und von Räubern gefangen genommen wurde, die sie zum Spaß eine Nacht, eine Woche oder einen Monat lang festhielten und bei ihrer Freilassung mit Nat schwanger waren?

 

In der realen Welt gibt es viele Präzedenzfälle, in denen Mütter die Enkel einer jungen Tochter großziehen, deren Kind unter unglücklichen Umständen geboren wurde, und dieses Enkelkind als ihr eigenes Kind beanspruchen, um einer sozialen Stigmatisierung ihrer Tochter und/oder ihres Enkelkindes zu entgehen.

 

Wenn wir uns ansehen, was plausibel ist, Pipers risikofreudige Natur, das Alter von Nat und Piper und die Beschaffenheit des Ödlands, halte ich es einfach für wahrscheinlicher und plausibler, dass Nat Pipers Tochter und nicht ihre Schwester ist.

 

Vielleicht ein Mod, um Nats Aussehen so zu verändern, dass es sich drastisch von Pipers unterscheidet, beispielsweise als blauäugige Blondine oder mit einem gemischten asiatischen oder schwarzen Aussehen?

Denn es ist viel einfacher, dass eine Tochter aufgrund des unterschiedlichen Aussehens ihrer Väter drastisch anders aussieht als ihre Mutter, als dass eine Schwester sehr anders aussieht, weil beide Eltern vermutlich dasselbe sind.

 

Ich weiß nicht, ob diese Denkweise irgendjemanden interessiert, da hier hauptsächlich Leute sind, die sich über solche Sachen nicht viele Gedanken machen, aber vielleicht könnte sie zu einer Art Mod-Vignette führen, zu einem geänderten Dialog über die Affinität zu Piper, aber das ist etwas, was mir schon seit einiger Zeit am Herzen liegt.

 

I'm still wondering how anyone came up with such a young age for "Piper's" sister?

If she were that young... she'd be sitting in school with the other children!

 

Based on "Nat's" behavior -> I'm assuming she's 14-16 years old.

 

And even if she were, an age difference of about 20 years between siblings is nothing unusual - even with the same mother.

The life stage of a woman in which she can bear children is 25-30 years... and this isn't new to our time.

 

In a German church, there's an oil painting - dating back to the Middle Ages... it shows a family -> a mother with her more than 50 children,

all of whom she bore herself... also documented by the local church register (baptism records).

Why do I mention this?

Because, given the external circumstances, the average lifespan of an inhabitant of this post-nuclear, extremely violent world is probably similar to the European Middle Ages!

 

So, with all due respect to your reasoning... but these considerations are treading on thin ice.

But ultimately, the entire plot of "Fallout 4" is also very patchy and implausible in many places.

As the creator of a blog story, I've been "stumbled upon" almost constantly over these very gaps... either "covering" them up or "filling" them in with meaningful content takes a lot of work... and this work is then missing from the actual plot... which is why the project has been in place for two years!

[Count Chocula]

What would be Piper's motive to lie about her relationship to Nat? That she (Nat) is the result of a "spicy misadventure?" That's a weak motive in my book. The only place it's likely is in your head canon, OP. And why would Nat having an East Asian, South Asian or African ethnic appearance mean they could not be sisters? As someone noted, if you're going to go down a rabbit hole, what's to say they're not half-sisters?

[Andy14]

17 hours ago, Miauzi said:

But why would the Institute do something like that?

 

If you want your opponent to do what you want, take over the leadership of the opinion and present it as wrong.
Result: Everyone is pissed off by the newspaper, and they act as if synths were just an invention of Piper and her newspaper.
Oder auf Deutsch: Politik über Bande 😉
 

 

17 hours ago, Miauzi said:

And, above all, which faction within the Institute would approve such an elaborate experiment?

What is an elaborate experiment about it and who approves all the other experiments?
 

[Count Chocula]

33 minutes ago, Andy14 said:

 

If you want your opponent to do what you want, take over the leadership of the opinion and present it as wrong.
Result: Everyone is pissed off by the newspaper, and they act as if synths were just an invention of Piper and her newspaper.
Oder auf Deutsch: Politik über Bande 😉
 

 

What is an elaborate experiment about it and who approves all the other experiments?
 

The Institute is nothing but elaborate and pointless activities designed by Rube Goldberg on crack. If you view them from an in-universe point of view, the Institute's actions don't make a lot of sense. The only way they make sense is from a meta-gaming view, i.e., they are the way they are for game-play purposes. As has been observed by many, if the Institute wanted to take over everything, nothing or no one could stop them. That's one way FO4 fails as fiction when examined too closely. The game presents the 4 main factions as being roughly balanced against each other. But the Institute is more power than all three of the others combined. The Minutemen and Railroad bring almost nothing to the table, so it's pretty much BoS vs. Institute. The BoS is whatever they have squeezed onto the Prydwen, plus their giant robot, I guess. The Institute has the Fallout equivalent of an army of White Walkers ready to set loose upon the Commonwealth.

[Miauzi]

Vor 23 Minuten sagte chocula:

Das Institut ist nichts weiter als aufwendige und sinnlose Aktivitäten, erdacht von Rube Goldberg auf Crack. Aus der Perspektive des Universums betrachtet, ergeben die Aktionen des Instituts nicht viel Sinn. Sie ergeben nur aus Metagaming-Sicht Sinn, d. h., sie sind so, wie sie sind, um das Spiel zu ermöglichen. Wie viele bereits bemerkt haben, könnte nichts und niemand das Institut aufhalten, wenn es die ganze Macht übernehmen wollte . Das ist ein Punkt, in dem FO4 bei genauer Betrachtung als Fiktion versagt. Das Spiel stellt die vier Hauptfraktionen als etwa ausgeglichen dar. Aber das Institut ist mächtiger als alle drei anderen zusammen. Die Minutemen und die Railroad bringen fast nichts auf den Tisch, also ist es im Grunde BoS gegen Institut. Das BoS ist das, was sie auf die Prydwen gequetscht haben, plus ihren riesigen Roboter, schätze ich. Das Institut hat das Fallout-Äquivalent einer Armee von Weißen Wanderern, die bereit sind, auf das Commonwealth loszulassen.

 

The Institute can take over the entire Boston area at any time?

My view is the exact opposite... it simply can't - otherwise, it would have done so long ago... the bottleneck is the energy supply - which severely limits the production of synth and weapons.

In practical terms, the Institute lives "hand to mouth" - what do their synth groups do on the surface -> collect scrap?

(In my engineering studies, in addition to planning factory processes, I also learned the basics of "extended" economics.)

 

All it can do -> to effectively paralyze the people on the surface through sabotage and espionage.

Of course, the player is also systematically monitored – even the list found in the vanilla game is quite extensive.

 

Ultimately, the Institute's effect is achieved through the more or less "subtly" generated terror – you can see the absurdity of the trader Myrna's paranoia, especially in her role as a trader (“a synth would respond the same way”)

 

These are precisely the facts that "Murphy" addresses in the plot of "Depravity." His line of reasoning is very coherent to me!

https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/35513

 

Yes, of course – in the vanilla game, we, as players on the "evil path," help the Institute fascists solve their energy problems and take over "the place" with a now-produced mass army of synths.

 

But there's no real agenda for what they want to do with the power they've gained.

 

---

 

Why doesn't the Institute completely shut down the "Railroad"?

In my opinion, the Institute needs a kind of "pressure relief valve" – because the rule of the "eggheads" over their human "slaves" is anything but perfect.

 

So a certain "depletion" of synths is tacitly tolerated... they're just not the fully programmable biological robots they'd like to have!

To recognize that – you have to be able to read "between the lines."

[Count Chocula]

11 hours ago, Miauzi said:

These are precisely the facts that "Murphy" addresses in the plot of "Depravity." His line of reasoning is very coherent to me!

https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/35513

 

But there's no real agenda for what they want to do with the power they've gained.

 

---

 

Why doesn't the Institute completely shut down the "Railroad"?

In my opinion, the Institute needs a kind of "pressure relief valve" – because the rule of the "eggheads" over their human "slaves" is anything but perfect.

My opinion is that the only reason the Institute has not taken over is simply a game-play thing.  And you hit the nail on the head with the "no real agenda" comment. The Institute seems to have no coherent agenda and exists simply to be the "bad guy" faction in the game.

 

If the Railroad were a "pressure relief valve," why does Shaun eventually ask the PC to destroy the Railroad? Do they no longer need that pressure relief valve? You are engaging in the kind of mental gymnastics required to make poorly thought out fiction make sense. And that's not a slap at FO4 because it's a game, not a novel. And it entertains me as a game, which is what I expect from it.

 

I think we see eye to eye with the various explanations Thuggysmurf, et al, give in their mods. They address the parts of the FO universe that make no sense and try to give an in-universe explanation for them, with varying degrees of success. I don't recall there being much resolution to the question posed by Murphy or Rayna about why the Gunners took over Quincy and then shut it down. Maybe there is one, but I don't recall it. And I don't fault Thuggysmurf. He tried to make the nonsensical vanilla lore make sense, and he mostly succeeded. My favorite is the quote in my avatar text, courtesy of Club Snuggle bartender Sawyer. For me and for many (perhaps including you), the huge amount of debris and garbage in places where people who are not junkies or raiders live is a real immersion-breaker. It looks like the bombs fell 2 years ago, not 200 years ago.

[Miauzi]

Vor 1 Stunde sagte chocula:

Ich denke, wir sind uns mit den verschiedenen Erklärungen, die Thuggysmurf und Co. in ihren Mods geben, einig. Sie sprechen die Teile des FO-Universums an, die keinen Sinn ergeben, und versuchen, eine universelle Erklärung dafür zu finden, mit unterschiedlichem Erfolg. Ich kann mich nicht erinnern, dass es eine große Antwort auf die von Murphy oder Rayna gestellte Frage gab, warum die Gunners Quincy übernommen und dann geschlossen haben. Vielleicht gibt es eine, aber ich erinnere mich nicht daran. Und ich mache Thuggysmurf keinen Vorwurf. Er versuchte, der unsinnigen Überlieferung des Originalspiels einen Sinn zu geben, und das ist ihm größtenteils gelungen. Mein Favorit ist das Zitat in meinem Avatar-Text, mit freundlicher Genehmigung von Club Snuggle-Barkeeper Sawyer. Für mich und viele andere (vielleicht auch für Sie) ist die riesige Menge an Schutt und Müll an Orten, wo keine Junkies oder Raider leben, ein echter Immersionskiller. Es sieht aus, als wären die Bomben vor 2 Jahren gefallen, nicht vor 200 Jahren.

 

Yup - this quote (which adorns your avatar) is also one of my favorites from this mod.

-
They tried hard to preserve this ruined look - but the deadly radiation levels have been gone for about 150 years.

-

The topic of settlement building is also such a half-hearted, not really well-thought-out part of the game... and if I start telling a story, then I can no longer view the game (which provides the background for my images) as a game -> but as a narrated story.

-

Since I naturally view everything through my own eyes and my own mind, I have to find an acceptable solution for the things I don't like or that bother me.

-

I'm still undecided on how I want to "take over" the Institute - the most sensible approach is the one from the "Valkyrie" mod... but I don't like turning the Institute into a tourist trap.

It's important for me to understand that there are several quite distinct factions among the "eggheads"... and without the "Office for Security" (which has long since acted like the German "Gestapo"), "Father" wouldn't be able to implement his plans.

-

But the institute is just a "sideshow" - just a platform for the topic "What is a human being?"

 

---

 

Quincy sollte als Handelsknoten für die Überland-Karawanen aus dem südlichen Gebieten ausgeschaltet werden ... wer jetzt deren Funktion übernimmt.

Faktisch wird hier eine "geheime" zusätzliche Fraktion eingeführt - ohne diese genauer zu benennen.

Mehr gibt das ganze Vanilla-Konstrukt um diesen Ort nicht her ... übrigens lasse ich inzwischen die Flüchtlinge in dem Museum.

Dieser ganze Handlungsstrang um Preston und diese "Musketen"-Miliz ist für mich so absurd - dass ich ihn seit Jahren komplett verbannt habe.

 

---

 

Vor 2 Stunden sagte chocula:

Wenn die Eisenbahn ein „Überdruckventil“ wäre, warum bittet Shaun den PC dann schließlich, die Eisenbahn zu zerstören? Brauchen sie dieses Überdruckventil nicht mehr? Du betreibst die Art von Denksportaufgabe, die nötig ist, um schlecht durchdachte Fiktion verständlich zu machen. Und das ist kein Angriff auf FO4, denn es ist ein Spiel, kein Roman. Und es unterhält mich als Spiel, was ich auch erwarte.

 

 

After solving the institute's energy problems, the "eggheads" can finally realize their "wet dream" and return to the surface as "liberators of humanity."

This eliminates the need for the "overpressure" valve I described – since the normal Synths 3.0 also have to be deployed aboveground in large numbers.

Has anyone even considered how to feed them underground?

 

As I wrote before – I view "Fallout 4" as a platform for my own narrative... so my perspective is somewhat different.

 

I have no idea how many hours I've spent in the game since its release... maybe close to 2,000 (or more).

And of course, I've been using mods for the game practically since day one.

[Count Chocula]

29 minutes ago, Miauzi said:

It's important for me to understand that there are several quite distinct factions among the "eggheads"... and without the "Office for Security" (which has long since acted like the German "Gestapo"), "Father" wouldn't be able to implement his plans.

There doesn't seem to be much differentiation in the vanilla Institute in terms of factions. To turn again to Thuggysmurf, those mods do make an attempt to show us different factions.

[South8028]

5 hours ago, chocula said:

My opinion is that the only reason the Institute has not taken over is simply a game-play thing.  And you hit the nail on the head with the "no real agenda" comment. The Institute seems to have no coherent agenda and exists simply to be the "bad guy" faction in the game.

 

If the Railroad were a "pressure relief valve," why does Shaun eventually ask the PC to destroy the Railroad? Do they no longer need that pressure relief valve? You are engaging in the kind of mental gymnastics required to make poorly thought out fiction make sense. And that's not a slap at FO4 because it's a game, not a novel. And it entertains me as a game, which is what I expect from it.

 

I think we see eye to eye with the various explanations Thuggysmurf, et al, give in their mods. They address the parts of the FO universe that make no sense and try to give an in-universe explanation for them, with varying degrees of success. I don't recall there being much resolution to the question posed by Murphy or Rayna about why the Gunners took over Quincy and then shut it down. Maybe there is one, but I don't recall it. And I don't fault Thuggysmurf. He tried to make the nonsensical vanilla lore make sense, and he mostly succeeded. My favorite is the quote in my avatar text, courtesy of Club Snuggle bartender Sawyer. For me and for many (perhaps including you), the huge amount of debris and garbage in places where people who are not junkies or raiders live is a real immersion-breaker. It looks like the bombs fell 2 years ago, not 200 years ago.

I think the Institute is so poorly written not because of the initially bad plot, but because little was left of the plot during the game's assembly. There are a number of signs indicating that before 2015, nothing existed except asset libraries. In 2014, havok finished hct2014, in 2015, a new 64-bit engine was assembled, and all the levels were assembled in ~ half a year. During this drive, only what was left of the plot allowed it to be in time for release.We see an illogical story because the events are taken out of context.

Edited April 9, 2025 by South8028

[Count Chocula]

1 hour ago, South8028 said:

I think the Institute is so poorly written not because of the initially bad plot, but because little was left of the plot during the game's assembly. There are a number of signs indicating that before 2015, nothing existed except asset libraries. In 2014, havok finished hct2014, in 2015, a new 64-bit engine was assembled, and all the levels were assembled in ~ half a year. During this drive, only what was left of the plot allowed it to be in time for release.We see an illogical story because the events are taken out of context.

I prefer your meta-game explanation to attempts by some people to try to wring out a plausible in-universe explanation (and that is not a veiled swipe at Miauzi, because I agree with them as well at nearly every turn).

[Lixiaoyao2077]

I think it's reasonable