Skyrim CTD problems

[arkhas]

I have encountered a problem where in some cases, the game crashes to desktop. Those situations are in particular: starting a SL animation( the characters get is position and afterwards it crashes), loading up a save( the game plays for 3-4 seconds before a crash) and starting a new game (the bethesda logo doesnt even show before the crash)

Here is my load order 
Skyrim.esm
Update.esm
Dawnguard.esm
HearthFires.esm
Dragonborn.esm
RSkyrimChildren.esm
SexLab.esm
SexLabAroused.esm
CreatureFramework.esm
RaceCompatibility.esm
ClimatesOfTamriel.esm
Schlongs of Skyrim - Core.esm
ZaZAnimationPack.esm
Heels Sound.esm
SOSRaceMenu.esp
XPMSE.esp
COCO3BBB.esp
RaceMenuMorphsCOCO.esp
AnubAnimObj.esp
[COCO] Mulan.esp
troublesofheroine.esp
[Melodic] Raven.esp
[Army]2B AI ver.1.esp
MoreNastyCritters.esp
FloppySOS.esp
FNIS.esp
[Army] Happy Easter.esp
[Army]Medusa Outfit (Sciamano240).esp
[COCO] Shadow Assassin.esp
[COCO]BattleAngels.esp
[COCO] Luscious Lady.esp
RaceCompatibilityUSKPOverride.esp
LykaiosReborn.esp
Schlongs of Skyrim.esp
BadDogSchlongCore.esp
LykaiosSchlongs.esp
RaceMenuPresetLoader.esp
ClimatesOfTamriel-Dawnguard-Patch.esp
ClimatesOfTamriel-Dragonborn-Patch.esp
better_torches_brighter_torchlight.esp
SexLabDefeat.esp
SexLab Aroused Creatures.esp
SOS - VectorPlexus Muscular Addon.esp
SLDrunk.esp
Apropos2.esp
QuieterDogs.esp
AmazingFollowerTweaks.esp
One With Nature - DG+DB.esp
Dogs-of-Skyrim.esp
SexLab_Dialogues.esp
troublesofheroineDG.esp
troublesofheroineDB.esp
PublicPlaything.esp
dc-untamed-000.esp
LykaiosNPC.esp
_GSPoses.esp
[Dint999] KSH's HDT.esp
[COCO]KDA_Ahri_Full.esp
UIExtensions.esp
AddItemMenuLE.esp
12FemaleBrows.esp
BD UUNP Dawnguard armor and cloth replacer.esp
BD-UUNP Dragonborn armor clothes replacer.esp
RaceMenuPlugin.esp
BD UUNP Armor and cloth replacer.esp
KS Hairdos - HDT.esp
SGEyebrows.esp
SkyUI.esp
SkyrimConfigMenu.esp
RaceMenuMorphsCBBE.esp
Eyes of Aber.esp
KS Hairdo's.esp
Moolgogi Follower Ahri.esp
RaceMenu.esp
SLAnimLoader.esp
SexLabMatchMaker.esp
Conditional Expressions.esp
SexLabTools.esp
SLALAnimObjBillyy.esp

Also, upon launching FNIS, its says that:
 

FNIS Behavior V7.6 XXL   20/05/2023 03:39:48
Skyrim 32bit: 1.9.32.0 - D:\SteamLibrary\steamapps\common\Skyrim\ (Steam)

Skeleton(hkx) female: Unknown (116 bones)   male: Unknown (116 bones)
>>Warning: Custom skeleton found. Select SKELETON patch.<<

So i assume it's some sort of a problem with the skeleton? Though i have failed in finding a solution so i figure i should ask for help.
 

[donttouchmethere]

28 minutes ago, arkhas said:

>>Warning: Custom skeleton found. Select SKELETON patch.<<

The hint is right there!

 

Open the FNIS generator, at the bottom you see various patches. Click the ones you have mods installed from.

Skeleton Arm fix is one of those.

[donttouchmethere]

31 minutes ago, arkhas said:

I have encountered a problem where in some cases, the game crashes to desktop. Those situations are in particular: starting a SL animation( the characters get is position and afterwards it crashes), loading up a save( the game plays for 3-4 seconds before a crash) and starting a new game (the bethesda logo doesnt even show before the crash)

But that doesn't happen all at the same time =D

Means you changed something to get those types of CTD.

Every one of those can have a different reason.

 

The crashing SL animation might be already a skeleton issue. Get FNIS error free first and check again.

34 minutes ago, arkhas said:

Skeleton(hkx) female: Unknown (116 bones)   male: Unknown (116 bones)

I'm also not sure if you have the right skeleton installed, there are usually more bones.

 

 

35 minutes ago, arkhas said:

loading up a save( the game plays for 3-4 seconds before a crash)

Either your save is broken from manipulating the LO while not cleaning the save.

Or you need: Crash fixes

 

What Crash fixes does and why you need it:

• Fixes various issues found here: How to debug CTD
• Fixes the vanilla Skyrim savegame string limit for more than 65535 strings. With mods installed that rise the string count significantly you will quickly find yourself over the 65k string count limit.
  • You can check your string count via FallrimTools.
  • Crash fixes changes the savegame format to archive this. To be able to still open the save game with a savegame cleaner use FallrimTools
  • More details about FallrimTools can be found on this blog page (?pending).
• Crash fixes comes also with a memory allocator function
• For more information about Crash fixes and hints to create a stable Skyrim setup read the Crash fixes page. More details about what Crash fixes does can be found in it's change log (spoiler at the end of the Crash fixes Nexus page)

 

[donttouchmethere]

37 minutes ago, arkhas said:

starting a new game (the bethesda logo doesnt even show before the crash)

Missing master can kill your game right away. Means for example you installed an addon to a main mod, but you never installed the main mod.

 

[arkhas]

27 minutes ago, donttouchmethere said:

The hint is right there!

 

Open the FNIS generator, at the bottom you see various patches. Click the ones you have mods installed from.

Skeleton Arm fix is one of those.

Done it, didn't fix any of the problems though, they still persist

[arkhas]

18 minutes ago, donttouchmethere said:

Missing master can kill your game right away. Means for example you installed an addon to a main mod, but you never installed the main mod.

 

The thing is, i didn't add any mods for quite some time, the only one i have was the CocoBody mod, although the game still worked fine for some time after that, it just started getting CTD's randomly later on.

[arkhas]

22 minutes ago, donttouchmethere said:

I'm also not sure if you have the right skeleton installed, there are usually more bones.

 

I am using xpmse which is a required mod for cocobody, however, when i disable cocobody in the mod list, fnis shows the normal amount of bones (126 i believe it was?) 

[arkhas]

26 minutes ago, donttouchmethere said:

Either your save is broken from manipulating the LO while not cleaning the save.

Or you need: Crash fixes

 

What Crash fixes does and why you need it:

• Fixes various issues found here: How to debug CTD
• Fixes the vanilla Skyrim savegame string limit for more than 65535 strings. With mods installed that rise the string count significantly you will quickly find yourself over the 65k string count limit.
  • You can check your string count via FallrimTools.
  • Crash fixes changes the savegame format to archive this. To be able to still open the save game with a savegame cleaner use FallrimTools
  • More details about FallrimTools can be found on this blog page (?pending).
• Crash fixes comes also with a memory allocator function
• For more information about Crash fixes and hints to create a stable Skyrim setup read the Crash fixes page. More details about what Crash fixes does can be found in it's change log (spoiler at the end of the Crash fixes Nexus page)

 

By crash fixes you mean the mod? if so, i already have it installed (Crash fixes v12)

[arkhas]

I personally think it could've been one of two things, or maybe both even.
It is either the cocobody mod(i have all the required masters installed), or the now uninstalled SLApproach redux from BakaFactory(and all it's masters) which as i said, have already uninstalled 

[arkhas]

Just now, arkhas said:

I personally think it could've been one of two things, or maybe both even.
It is either the cocobody mod(i have all the required masters installed), or the now uninstalled SLApproach redux from BakaFactory(and all it's masters) which as i said, have already uninstalled 

I just didn't add any other mods except these, but even with them both active, the game worked fine for some time, it just recently broke 

[donttouchmethere]

1 hour ago, arkhas said:

I just didn't add any other mods except these, but even with them both active, the game worked fine for some time, it just recently broke 

From the technical aspect you changed the LO by adding/removing mods.

What does "recently" mean? 10 hours game time or 100 hours? It takes a while for modding errors to start to express themself, depending on the reasons.

 

1 hour ago, arkhas said:

I personally think it could've been one of two things, or maybe both even.
It is either the cocobody mod(i have all the required masters installed), or the now uninstalled SLApproach redux from BakaFactory(and all it's masters) which as i said, have already uninstalled 

I agree. Did you try a new game after those changes?

If you did those changes on a running game did you at least clean your save from left overs with Fallrimtools?

If not, open your save with Fallrimtools and check for errors and left over scripts.

 

1 hour ago, arkhas said:

I am using xpmse which is a required mod for cocobody, however, when i disable cocobody in the mod list, fnis shows the normal amount of bones (126 i believe it was?) 

That sounds bad, maybe not overwrite XPMSE with the cocobody? Maybe it comes with an older skeleton?

Even worse: did you overwrite anything from MNC with the coco body?

MNC should overwrite XPMSE.

 

If COCO body modifies XPMSE and reduces bones I fear you break SL animations and/or creature skeletons.

We would need a coco specialist to solve that, but I wouldn't downgrade the skeleton and break animations for a coco body.

 

What I would try:

> clean save with fallrimtools (mainly for the removed SLapproach mod)

 

> About skeleton, I would follow this overwrite hierarchy:

Coco Body Mod (that seems to come with it's own skeleton)

XPMSE

MNC

(ABC-HDT)

 

 

Another thing that might be an issue:

Does the cocobody support HDT or SMP?

 

 

 

[donttouchmethere]

Another oddness.

While COCO body supports CBBE and UUNP, you need to decide if you want a CBBE or UUNP base body (COCO body  A=CBBE, body B=UUNP).

In your LO I see a mix of CBBE sliders and UUNP armors.

[donttouchmethere]

I don't get this one tho:

 

[Introductions]

★COCOBODY V6 and Skin patch installation priority > Higher than other physics plugins > Higher than XP32 maximum skeleton > Higher than Schlongs of Skyrim > Higher than other 3BBB body mods > Higher than Integrated MOD.

 

[arkhas]

1 hour ago, donttouchmethere said:

Another thing that might be an issue:

Does the cocobody support HDT or SMP?

 

 

 

It supports SMP physics i believe

[arkhas]

1 hour ago, donttouchmethere said:

From the technical aspect you changed the LO by adding/removing mods.

What does "recently" mean? 10 hours game time or 100 hours? It takes a while for modding errors to start to express themself, depending on the reasons.

 

I agree. Did you try a new game after those changes?

If you did those changes on a running game did you at least clean your save from left overs with Fallrimtools?

If not, open your save with Fallrimtools and check for errors and left over scripts.

 

 

 

A) It all happened within maybe 24 hours

B)I did try starting a clean new game even after disabling cocobody and building a normal UUNP body in Bodyslide to no avail, the same problem persists, so i doubt it's a corrupted save problem

[arkhas]

If this information helps, only manual saves get CTD's after 3-4 seconds, the last 3 autosaves can be used without a problem until a SL animation is used, then it crashes

[donttouchmethere]

3 hours ago, arkhas said:

It supports SMP physics i believe

The question is: what version did you install? HDT or SMP

 

3 hours ago, arkhas said:

A) It all happened within maybe 24 hours

You can play 24 hours in one go... maybe I can too with some Energy Drinks ^^

If you can Skyrim for 24 hours without CTD you have a very stable setup =D

Usually after 6-8 hours even the most stable Skyrim needs a break.

 

3 hours ago, arkhas said:

disabling cocobody

how do you disable it?

remember it overwrote files, the outcome depends how you install files

you are using a mod manager of some kind?

disable might not be enough, I fear you need to uninstall all the files.

 

3 hours ago, arkhas said:

so i doubt it's a corrupted save problem

The save gets corrupted if mods aren't installed correctly, for example the SKSE co save, which would explain:

3 hours ago, arkhas said:

only manual saves get CTD's

because autosaves might fail to save the skse co save if it's corrupted already

HDT values get saved in there too, which means if you have still overwritten files you will get further issues

 

3 hours ago, arkhas said:

until a SL animation is used, then it crashes

I still believe that during the install/uninstall of the coco body and related mods you have overwritten something critical

 

What mod manager you use or do you manual install?

 

What warnings can you see in FNIS.

Remember you need to rebuild FNIS files every time you manipulate body/animation/mesh related files

 

Maybe you need to repair your Skeleton and HDT installation

If you installed SMP you need to remove that too.

 

What you need for a working Sexlab (not all, some is optional. need to overwork that blog):

 

If you installed CBBE for Bodyslide, but you instead want to use UUNP you need to uninstall CBBE.

 

If you had ever a working mod combo before COCO you would need to backtrack what you had installed before or start from scratch.

 

If anything is wrong with your skeleton/HDT/FNIS Sexlab animations will fail.

If MNC skeleton was overwritten creatures can cause CTD too.

 

 

3 hours ago, arkhas said:

If this information helps, only manual saves get CTD's after 3-4 seconds, the last 3 autosaves can be used without a problem until a SL animation is used, then it crashes

 

Make a manual save even if it crashes.

Check the save with Fallrimtools for errors.

 

If there are non, check if the save is complete. Saves have 2 parts:

*.ess

*.skse

check if the skse co save was generated or has an odd size.

If there is no skse co save or it's very big

> check you HDT install

> is SKSE working and configured right (maybe the skse or HDT settings got overwritten)

 

Grab it from here:

• BethINI

BethINI is a great tool to reset/configure all your ini

Edited May 20, 2023 by donttouchmethere

[donttouchmethere]

You could also post your complete FNIS output in case it's an animation issue.

 

7 hours ago, arkhas said:

COCO3BBB.esp

Only disabling this esp won't help, because the coco body overwrote meshes and various other files that other mods will also read.

[donttouchmethere]

There are some other things. I was gone for quite a while and don't remember all the installation menus.

> Maybe you need to reinstall XPMSE if you needed to make body type related choices

> Maybe you need to reinstall Bodyslide if you haven't installed all body types with it

 

This also goes the other way around:

> maybe you had to choose 3BBB during XPMSE installation to have the right skeleton config for COCO

 

 

I just hope a coco guy/gal shows up and screams:

WRONG!

That's how COCO gets installed correctly... ?

[Miauzi]

Vor 19 Minuten sagte donttouchmethere:

Sie können auch Ihre vollständige FNIS-Ausgabe veröffentlichen, falls es sich um ein Animationsproblem handelt.

 

Nur das Deaktivieren dieses ESP hilft nicht, da der Coco-Body Meshes und verschiedene andere Dateien überschrieben hat, die auch von anderen Mods gelesen werden.

I admire your patience in helping out here

and by the way I'm also learning something about modding in Skyrim - thanks

 

 

[Miauzi]

Donttouchmethere sagte gerade:

Es gibt noch einige andere Dinge. Ich war eine ganze Weile weg und kann mich nicht an alle Installationsmenüs erinnern.

> Möglicherweise müssen Sie XPMSE neu installieren, wenn Sie körpertypbezogene Entscheidungen treffen müssen

> Möglicherweise müssen Sie Bodyslide neu installieren, wenn Sie nicht alle Karosserietypen damit installiert haben

 

Das geht auch umgekehrt:

> Möglicherweise mussten Sie während der XPMSE-Installation 3BBB auswählen, um die richtige Grundkonfiguration für COCO zu erhalten

 

 

Ich hoffe nur, dass ein Coco-Typ/eine Coco-Mädel auftaucht und schreit:

FALSCH!

So wird COCO richtig installiert... ?

if I read all that... I would reinstall my Skyrim if I had problems like this

and I've already done it - too much just broke and where to start with the "mending"??

I had such a mess 2-3 years ago with my Skyrim - only I wasn't here in the forum then

 

[donttouchmethere]

27 minutes ago, Miauzi said:

I admire your patience in helping out here

and by the way I'm also learning something about modding in Skyrim - thanks

 

 

It's just the beginning, pocking a bit in the dark here while also learning.

Body-wise I do always the same (UUNP). Just discovered that XPMSE install menu offers various options for various bodies.

So many possibilities to mess up.

 

[donttouchmethere]

26 minutes ago, Miauzi said:

if I read all that... I would reinstall my Skyrim if I had problems like this

and I've already done it - too much just broke and where to start with the "mending"??

I had such a mess 2-3 years ago with my Skyrim - only I wasn't here in the forum then

 

Basically only all body related mods need a reinstall, while all COCO body related files need to be deleted.

Or the other way around.

 

I fear if SMP sneaked in I would be in a total loss.

[Miauzi]

Donttouchmethere sagte gerade:

Es ist erst der Anfang, man tappt hier ein wenig im Dunkeln und lernt gleichzeitig.

Körperlich mache ich immer das Gleiche (UUNP). Habe gerade entdeckt, dass das XPMSE-Installationsmenü verschiedene Optionen für verschiedene Körper bietet.

So viele Möglichkeiten, etwas zu vermasseln.

 

I did a complete re-install to illustrate my current blog story...because the old one failed to install a mod important to the story.

After 3 weeks of work on the new setup... again I can't get the mod to work

I was on the verge of canceling the story that had been planned and prepared for months... until I had a "divine" prompt in the truest sense

and

could ask the mod author the crucial detail question ... and his answer made the "lamp in the head" shine

-> the loading order

My mod manager (Vortex) tended to change the loading order of his mod...so that an important mod was loaded instead of before -> after

and that's not how the "whole cheese" worked

Only with the knowledge today ... I could have repaired my old installation and saved myself a total of 4 weeks of work!

(of the 4 weeks, more than 3 weeks are the extensive tests I do after installing each new mod)

[Miauzi]

Vor 9 Minuten sagte donttouchmethere:

Grundsätzlich müssen nur alle körperbezogenen Mods neu installiert werden, während alle COCO-körperbezogenen Dateien gelöscht werden müssen.

Oder umgekehrt.

 

Ich befürchte, dass ich einen Totalverlust erleiden würde, wenn sich SMP einschleichen würde.

 

Only I fear that the questioner does not understand at all how incomplete and incomplete his knowledge of all the dependencies when using these mods is.

But he is currently doing the same - like me 3-4 years ago and I had already used mods in Skyrim for 6 years

It just worked... somehow... at least most of the time... or something like that

?