How to get more realistic breast sag from gravity?

[bong_water]

Hey guys,

 

I'm trying to wrap my head around the way HDT physics affect breast sag and gravity. Basically, I want some relatively saggy, realistically drooping breasts, especially with larger ones. I would ideally like to have breast sagginess be mostly a function of physics instead of the faux-sag that the sagness slider in Bodyslide provides.

 

The default HDT xml settings seem to make the breasts "sticky," for lack of a better term; it's like they're squished flat against the body instead of being pulled downward. This looks fine in the idle position, but when sneaking or with the character bent over, it's like they're being pulled toward the belly and slightly toward the ground instead of directly toward the ground like they would in reality.

 

My cursory forum/google searches and investigations into the pinned tutorials haven't been too helpful; the general answer I've found is that gravity is affected by several different parameters at once. Would appreciate any help with what these parameters are, what each of them does, and how I might best edit them to my liking. I'm pretty new to this, and I'm not even sure if this is entirely an HDT problem in any case. Thanks in advance.

[jlttsmiley30]

Just trying to help:

It can be a long journey learning exactly what combination of slider to get your desired look , because it not just the gravity slider that just lowers current slider settings.

What I have learn is 1st the slider are not limited to 0 - 100 , changing the value by typing the desired value can be 200 or lower than 0 aka -30.

Using a program than opens .xml files like Microsoft office you can copy and change or tweet a bodyslide preset to your preference.

 I would recommend browsing current or already created bodyslide preset , find the body parts you like and combined them to create your ideal base body to work with.

  or just load them one after the other and picking the sliders for the body you like and combining with others.

 I copied all the sliders onto a notebook page then added the values from the presets that I like , for example.....

This is mcombination of 4 bodyslide preset. small to large settings

 

Leyenda body preset -base body, small breast

ALSL body preset - waist thighs large

datjellyman's bodyslide preset uunp-cbbe 1 - legs 

evilreflex bodyslide - breast large

 

Plus some small adjustments by me

 

These authors have already more or less address the weight gravity of there breast via comments from users of there preset,

So using  there preset as a base helps avoid some weird Breast or body physic also using extreme physic settings can cause breast to bounce like water bags....I normally stay with normal to light settings so they have a more natural mechanic. Be sure to try more than one hdt physic mods each is different. I like both bounce and jiggle and hawt physic

(Normal settings)

 

 

My advice browse through bodyslide preset others have created and learn how they created there bodies what slider combination they used to created your custom unique body

Hope this helps

Small

Large

Nipple sliders 125 plus tit kit

Edited December 2, 2021 by jlttsmiley30

[bong_water]

17 hours ago, jlttsmiley30 said:

Just trying to help:

It can be a long journey learning exactly what combination of slider to get your desired look , because it not just the gravity slider that just lowers current slider settings.

What I have learn is 1st the slider are not limited to 0 - 100 , changing the value by typing the desired value can be 200 or lower than 0 aka -30.

Using a program than opens .xml files like Microsoft office you can copy and change or tweet a bodyslide preset to your preference.

 I would recommend browsing current or already created bodyslide preset , find the body parts you like and combined them to create your ideal base body to work with.

  or just load them one after the other and picking the sliders for the body you like and combining with others.

 I copied all the sliders onto a notebook page then added the values from the presets that I like , for example.....

This is mcombination of 4 bodyslide preset. small to large settings

 

Leyenda body preset -base body, small breast

ALSL body preset - waist thighs large

datjellyman's bodyslide preset uunp-cbbe 1 - legs 

evilreflex bodyslide - breast large

 

Plus some small adjustments by me

 

These authors have already more or less address the weight gravity of there breast via comments from users of there preset,

So using  there preset as a base helps avoid some weird Breast or body physic also using extreme physic settings can cause breast to bounce like water bags....I normally stay with normal to light settings so they have a more natural mechanic. Be sure to try more than one hdt physic mods each is different. I like both bounce and jiggle and hawt physic

(Normal settings)

 

 

My advice browse through bodyslide preset others have created and learn how they created there bodies what slider combination they used to created your custom unique body

Hope this helps

Small

Large

Nipple sliders 125 plus tit kit

Thanks for the reply. I'm moreso looking for advice on how the settings in the HDT physics xml affect breasts rather than bodyslide — up until recently I was pretty satisfied with my presets and how they looked (thank god for BreastSH and BreastSSH), but I found myself annoyed by the "sticking" I described in the OP. Looks great when standing up, but looks strange when the model is in doggystyle or another anim/pose where she's bent over.

 

I've been playing around with JFF since and have learned a bit. Loosening the Z constraint on the PreBreast + Breast joint seems to be the right starting point. A higher maximum and lower minimum lets the breast dangle more when bending over and sag a bit more when idle. I'm still working out how inertia, friction, and elasticity affect the Breast bone to give it a nice, tight bounce instead of the jello-y jiggle it has when you only edit the constraints, and I've found a new issue where the nipples seem to be working on a slower timescale than the rest of the breast despite the fact that the TimeFactor parameter is unedited. It's like they drift back into position after the initial bounce, sometimes poking out at an off angle relative to what their natural resting position should be (collision issue?). Might just be because I'm only editing one breast at the moment for the sake of easy comparison to the default, but I dunno.

 

Will post gifs when I have the chance as a visual aid. Also, forgot to mention it in the OP, but I'm running Clams of Skyrim, which has its own xmls and a few differences to the default HDT's. Mostly the presence of a "Breast1" node — no idea what it's supposed to affect.

[Roggvir]

I did some experiments some time ago.
Here is the related post where i mentioned the rough idea.

Basically, what you need is to build the body/outfits using a BodySlide preset that has the boobs pointing forward in straight horizontal line.
Kinda like you can see on the naked body "Corset" picture in my old post linked above (you may want to make the breasts even longer, like more stretched forward - you will have to experiment to find best shape and length that works with the XML you then use).

Then you need to use XML with some very soft physics, and maybe increased gravity values.

I can't find the XML i made, nor the BodySlides presets to give you as an example, and i don't remember the values, so you will have to make yourself familiar with the HDT settings and experiment (obviously you will need to use different XMLs for naked body and for outfits).

The result was not 100% perfect, but it was pretty good.
There were two small drawbacks:

1. Compromise between better breast shape and better gravity effect
   You cannot have both - a 100% perfect breast shape you prefer, and perfect gravity effect - one or the other will suffer a bit, depending on the BS preset you use and the XML settings.
   You need to find a compromise that works for you.
    
2. Breast physics inappropriate for skiny NPCs
   Saddly, because HDT doesn't have a mechanic allowing it to use different XML files based on NPC weight, all NPCs will use the same XML for the given body/outfit.
   So, any skinny NPC with small breasts, will have the same HDT physics, moving the small breasts around in a pretty exaggerated unnatural way.
   The only way to make this less apparent, is to increase the breasts size on the 0 weight used by those skinny NPCs.
   And if using BodyGen, you will probably have to adjust its values related to breast sliders (i am not using it, so i can't tell you any more).

 

So, yeah, its posible.

Edited December 18, 2021 by Roggvir

[Roggvir]

30 minutes ago, Roggvir said:

I can't find the XML i made, nor the BodySlides presets

 

I did find some remnants, which don't seem like the "finished" version, but maybe you can still use it as a rough example.
It contains BodySlide presets and XMLs for different NPC weights i used during some point in my experiments.
Maybe you can have a look at the XML and compare it with the default one, but i give no guarantees that this will be useful in any way.

 

Roggvir's HDT Gravity Experiment.7z

[valenandy]

Not sure if this is what you're looking for, but the current configurations that come with the latest BHUNP and CBPC already include gravity. Both ask on the FOMOD if you wish to activate it. Since both bring the same xml config files, I have set BHUNP to overwrite CBPC since it has the most options for jiggle or elasticity.

i find the result from the stock XMLs pretty good. I.e. when a character is lying on her back, the breasts are flattened or drop to the side depending on the position. Also seem larger like stretching if the char is bent over. 

I'm using at the moment SSE/AE 1.6.342 + BHUNP 2.42 + CBPC 1.4.14 and Faster HDT-SMP. It's been a rough ride since AE but the BHUNP and CBPC maintainers are updating like never before and including more settings than ever. 
 

Hope this helps. 
 

[WoLfN7]

Is there any physics for legendary like 3ba ? 

I'm looking for more saggy and physics , ty

[donnerwetter]

19 hours ago, tomcat101 said:

Is there any physics for legendary like 3ba ? 

I'm looking for more saggy and physics , ty

 

There's BHUNP, which has an LE version. If you're feeling adventurous, nothing's stopping you from backporting CBBE 3BA to LE. The Full SMP version works fine when backported.

[WoLfN7]

2 hours ago, donnerwetter said:

 

There's BHUNP, which has an LE version. If you're feeling adventurous, nothing's stopping you from backporting CBBE 3BA to LE. The Full SMP version works fine when backported.

No idea about converting to legendary , 3ba and all options be great legendary .

[donnerwetter]

13 minutes ago, tomcat101 said:

No idea about converting to legendary , 3ba and all options be great legendary .

 

There's plenty of tutorials on backporting on LL. It's really easy with SSE Nif Optimizer, literally one click

[WoLfN7]

40 minutes ago, donnerwetter said:

 

There's plenty of tutorials on backporting on LL. It's really easy with SSE Nif Optimizer, literally one click

Bodyslide be issue , we need sse bodyslide in le version , modding not thing , I used nif optimiser before but esp was issue 

[WoLfN7]

Found this 

https://coco2048.blogspot.com/2021/11/coco-body-v6-3bbb-standalone-for-skyrim.html?showComment=1646676866520

[WoLfN7]

5 hours ago, tomcat101 said:

Found this 

https://coco2048.blogspot.com/2021/11/coco-body-v6-3bbb-standalone-for-skyrim.html?showComment=1646676866520

Waste time , memory patch in crashes game , previous patch spells don't work 

[t.ara]

The body set-up of coco was too much complex for LE.

It ´s instead easy to put the basic caliente body CBBE PHYSICS (originally SE) into LE. And then on top of this you can then add the CALIENTE CBBE SMP aka 3BBB with SMP-PHYSICS-working aside with the CBBE HDT (original SKYRIM CBBE, the CBBE PHYSICS body of original SE and also the 3BBB body ALL together inside of SYKRIM LE.

 

p.s-the smp jiggling can be switched to step through different weights of breasts as well...compared with coco´s options...btw. are cocos HDT-PE settings of the 3B jiggling very very bad. She made some nice sliders additions but they were not perfect as the functions scaled also the nipples bigger...

 

Some changes of the physic´s filles and of racemenu´s morph-file can support all three bodies at one, CBBE HDT, CBBE PHYSICS (SE) and CBBE SMP (3BBB). To me this is all working perfect with all skins, which have also the vag-texture inside. That ´s about SKYRIM LE.

 

I´ll later see if I can share this-I still am checking this out on a TEST partition...at the moment it is solid working.

[t.ara]

The problem, if one wants more gravity-force onto the body-parts, the creation of the body is not anymore suiting to the result in game under the physic´s conditions. It is very important, that the base shape shall one made in BS would stay to become looking like the result in game. Means also for the gravity, that you are in a massive restriction as higher parameters will smallen the breast distance to the body. And the skeleton´s additional bones maybe do not offer those constraints, to allow this moves-inside of the body....a collision between breast and body has to deny it same time...and it has to run smooth...is not worth the effect as there are only some few laying poses, on beds and laying down...not really necessary.

 

The breast will be clipping with the body with the actual possibilities and that ´s a no go.

[t.ara]

On 3/26/2022 at 5:08 PM, MiiTy said:

Bodyslide be issue , we need sse bodyslide in le version , modding not thing , I used nif optimiser before but esp was issue 

I use same Bodyslide for LE which I use also in/for SE-same functions to convert clothing -but everything of the body-mods of caliente have to become backported! ESP of the morph-racemenu-content has to become recreated. Also the physics have to be "optimized" and this needs little different configuration. CBBE HDT uses HDT-PE, CBBE PHYSICS needs also HDT-PE and CBBE SMP (3BBB) is using HDT-SMP and offers all features like it does in SKYRIM SE.

3BA is no option for LE as it has too many and complex sliders and it´s integration into BS, I also do not like. It´s not ideal to work inside of LE from what I have read all about it. Some may let run it also inside of LE, but I will not do that.