[spoilers] Game of Thrones . . . wtf man

[snaz2000]

 

It was far from out of the blue. Hints of coming betrayal for Robb where all over the place if you're paying attention and/or already know it's coming.

 

well I guess If i knew it was coming, then yeah it wouldn't be out of the blue.

 

On the other hand, of course there was betrayal in the air, always has been... but that level of betrayal was out absolutely unwarned.

 

 

the foreshadowing actually came from Catelyn when she told Robb he was too busy frakking Talisa to win a war... he didn't read, The Godfather... he thought going to the mattresses meant honeymooning... Robb didn't have a good wartime consigliere... the Stark's are dumb-asses

[sushi]

Best episode of the series so far.  Loved it.

[snaz2000]

... when really the Starks are nothing more than our primary eyes and ears for the real story going on all throughout the world.

 

this is what makes it a WTF moment or as one person put it, "out of the blue"... the Starks are the fools in the play who through their constant bumbling (like returning Jaime) , land on their feet... you don't anticipate the storyteller to be slain... esp. the fools who bring insight, and a connection to the past... the Follie with the Freys and Red Wedding is unpalatable on so many fronts...

[Monsto Brukes]

 

... when really the Starks are nothing more than our primary eyes and ears for the real story going on all throughout the world.

 

this is what makes it a WTF moment or as one person put it, "out of the blue"... the Starks are the fools in the play who through their constant bumbling (like returning Jaime) , land on their feet... you don't anticipate the storyteller to be slain... esp. the fools who bring insight, and a connection to the past... the Follie with the Freys and Red Wedding is unpalatable on so many fronts...

 

 

I can't say that I'd have released him, but as a parent i can absolutely tell you something like that would not be a decision lightly made... release an enemy to get your own children back. Not saying I agree, but I understand and definitely wouldn't call it a 'bumble'

 

The foolish part of that was assuming that any of the lanisters would be honorable enough to accept such an unprompted and one-sided (theirs) trade.

 

And the 2 girls aren't bumbling. . . they're 12 and 14 . . . any more than anyone else at that age. They're basically being pushed around by people bigger (in all respects) than they are. 

[formel]

Yeah, I stopped watching the moment the axe fell on Sean Bean's neck.  It was that point I knew that the books were written by an angry nerd, for angry nerds.

 

I watch fantasy to, you know, fantasize.  Not to watch unrequited injustice performed week after week in a makebelieve world.  It's exhausting.  Stories need catharsis.  It's not a complicated equation.

 

But, hey, I'm proved wrong by the popularity.  So there you go.  About the best I can say is that those who love Game of Thrones totally deserved this last episode.  *grin*

 

Seriously you were suprised by that? I mean a charcter played by Sean Bean that did not die at some point is like to deny gravity. It is simply a determinism Sean Bean has to die everytime.

 

 

3:41 minutes with Sean Bean dieing. May contain spoiler, if you want to call it so in case of Sean Bean

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I already knew this was going to happen and yet I was still a little surprised especially on how brutal the stabbing of Jeyne(or talisa call her what you want) also I wouldn't call Rob a minor character , if he hadn't been betrayed he might have actually gotten casterly rock and the war might have taken a different turn . If you ask me the entire fault was Edmure's .

 

Well as Ashal already pointed out in the books Rob appears never as main charakter (I mean with main chrakter that the story is told out of his perspektiv). In the book the reader only knows about Rob's actions through Catelyn Stark or through reports and messages other receive. He maybe a character with greate influence but that is Tywin Lenister as well and he may be appealing figure but no main charcter, Martin did not build the story around him.

 

@elalquimista

 

Your comparison is a little bit flawed. In the Lord of the Ring, or Star Wars you have a story of black and white, the absolute good against the absolut evil. In a Song of Ice and Fire you have only shades of grey. When you want to search for a equivalent for Sauron in this world you have to look at the White Walkers but not the Lenisters or other humans. In the books it is quite well communicated that for the most common people it dosen't matter if a  Targaryen, a Baratheon or a Lenister sit on the throne. For them everything stays almost the same. Additionaly in the books you get to know that every side in this war no matter if Stark or Lennister commited war crimes by sacking villages, stealing food and raping women etc. So like in real mediveal age it only matters for small group of nobels who rules. In the great scheme of things it dosen't matter.

 

But as the story continues you will find that some deeds of poetic justice will happen...but more I won't tell

[snaz2000]

 

as a parent i can absolutely tell you something like that would not be a decision lightly made... release an enemy to get your own children back. Not saying I agree, but I understand and definitely wouldn't call it a 'bumble'

 

The Starks have consistently made emotional decisions based on so-called wrongs to their family members... it started with Bran's paralysis... seeking retribution requires being calculated and waiting...

 

everyone is also aware of the Lannister's treachery... to suggest the Stark's expected the Lannister's to follow their rules, or some traditional code of honor, reminds me of the parable of the Scorpion and the Frog...

 

even GRRM's premise that you can lose your throne by the revelation of an incestuous relationship in times when incest is viewed as a quasi-norm esp. amongst royalty, is a bit weak, imho... to this day, I'm still miffed about Bran being run down, and being pushed out a window... as a precursor to war... but, that's another topic 

 

yes, as a parent, my initial inclination would be to do whatever is in my power to save my child, but there are times, as a parent, that you need to realize that you are powerless to prevent a child's crucifiction...

 

they're bumblers because they are not disposed to forebearance...

 

It's not a surprise "betrayal" because the Starks were weary of the Freys... a tactician would've assured the "oath of hospitality" was upheld esp. given that noble families are prone to engaging in private feuds after a showing of increased disrespect for royal authority... and whose entire army celebrates a wedding anyway?...

 

for me, those two Starks were lovable losers who I could laugh at at their expense... who's left to fit that role?...

[lordofthedread]

http://global3.memecdn.com/when-watching-the-latest-got-episode_webm_1603083.webm

 

nuff said ...

[cretin]

 

Yeah, I stopped watching the moment the axe fell on Sean Bean's neck.  It was that point I knew that the books were written by an angry nerd, for angry nerds.

 

I watch fantasy to, you know, fantasize.  Not to watch unrequited injustice performed week after week in a makebelieve world.  It's exhausting.  Stories need catharsis.  It's not a complicated equation.

 

But, hey, I'm proved wrong by the popularity.  So there you go.  About the best I can say is that those who love Game of Thrones totally deserved this last episode.  *grin*

 

Seriously you were suprised by that? I mean a charcter played by Sean Bean that did not die at some point is like to deny gravity. It is simply a determinism Sean Bean has to die everytime.

 

I LOL'ed.  I remember seeing that death reel, and you're right, he always gets the axe.  Plus I saw it coming from the book.  But for some reason I kept thinking "ah, they'll change it.  He'll be a ghost or sum'mit, or he'll have a twin, maybe this time he'll have a long-running role as a protagonist in a beloved TV series!  I mean, who the hell are all these other people?  Sean Bean!"  No such luck.  Charlie Brown didn't get to punt the football after all.

 

 

 

Losing their tentpeg actor sucked enough that I lost interest, but for some reason Gabriel Byrne getting bled out by Ragnar in The Vikings didn't bother me as much, mostly because he was a right bastard, that one, and it was prophesied.  And Floki is freaking awesome.  But I digress.

 

 

 

Truth be told, I shouldn't have seen Sean Bean there, I should have seen Ned.  But it was early, and the show hadn't established its characters, so all I had holding my interest were the actors.  And once the characters *were* established, they were all just horrific parodies of humanity, either blind fools or nerveless killers like Vlad the Impaler on PCP.  And the impalers, torturers, betrayers and murderers are all cleaning house.

 

And I don't see shades of grey.  I see random pulses of honor and dishonor, with an emphasis on *random*.  Any time a character exhibits *consistency* in their actions, they get their throats slit.  But that observation would suggest that I watch the show, when I've already stated that I don't. 

 

/closet GoT watcher

[Monsto Brukes]

 

 

as a parent i can absolutely tell you something like that would not be a decision lightly made... release an enemy to get your own children back. Not saying I agree, but I understand and definitely wouldn't call it a 'bumble'

 

The Starks have consistently made emotional decisions based on so-called wrongs to their family members... it started with Bran's paralysis... seeking retribution requires being calculated and waiting...

 

everyone is also aware of the Lannister's treachery... to suggest the Stark's expected the Lannister's to follow their rules, or some traditional code of honor, reminds me of the parable of the Scorpion and the Frog...

 

even GRRM's premise that you can lose your throne by the revelation of an incestuous relationship in times when incest is viewed as a quasi-norm esp. amongst royalty, is a bit weak, imho... to this day, I'm still miffed about Bran being run down, and being pushed out a window... as a precursor to war... but, that's another topic 

 

yes, as a parent, my initial inclination would be to do whatever is in my power to save my child, but there are times, as a parent, that you need to realize that you are powerless to prevent a child's crucifiction...

 

they're bumblers because they are not disposed to forebearance...

 

It's not a surprise "betrayal" because the Starks were weary of the Freys... a tactician would've assured the "oath of hospitality" was upheld esp. given that noble families are prone to engaging in private feuds after a showing of increased disrespect for royal authority... and whose entire army celebrates a wedding anyway?...

 

for me, those two Starks were lovable losers who I could laugh at at their expense... who's left to fit that role?...

 

 

did you mean "weary", meaning tired of? or did you mean "wary", meaning suspicious of.

 

TBPH, I have a hard time following a weekly show ever since Lost and Battlestar. What I usually wind up doing is torrenting the entire series and then marathoning it. Did that with a number of series over the years. It's much EASIER to follow a story when you're watching 2-3-4 eps a day for a few weeks.

 

You're probably talking about shit that I would have seen had I been marathoning. When Frey was going on about things when they first showed up, I was like . . .

 

"wait... is this the guy that kills all his sons? No that guy was north of the wall and he is dead... No wait, it's that Theon guys dad... no wait, he's on an island."

 

I actually had to pause the show and consider who the hell it was. . . all I knew was that I had a bit of a suspicion that could be less that straight up.

 

And that's probably one of the problems with the show vs the book... keeping the names and relationships straight is a lot harder to present visually. So yeah, if I thought about the show more than 2 hrs a week (which is what happens when you read the book), I'd have probably seen it coming too. 

 

Is there a mind map of it somewhere?

[Monsto Brukes]

oh another thing . . .

 

whoever it was that said "the Corleone's would have seen it coming" was absolutely right. Vito absofuckinglutely. Even in GF 3, Mike would have seen it coming.

[Pkatt]

As a person who has read and loved all the books, here are some thoughts-

 

- If I had not read the books, I think I would be totally lost.  You've got so far about 2500 pages crammed into 30 one hour episodes, so far.  They are doing a good job keeping with the overall themes, and obviously they can't deviate too far from  any of the major things that happened in the books.  But there was so many little things that happened, that are not even mentioned in the TV series, for lack of time and pacing I would suppose; but all those little things and internal dialogs really add to the story, and I think the TV viewers are missing a lot of the story because of this.  Jaime and Clegane wouldn't seem quite so out of character if the viewer knew more of these things.   I am constantly having to pause the show and explain something in more detail to my wife, because I know why its happening, but they just never delve deep enough on the series to show the viewer that.   Also, some things are happening in a different order, and I think this throws the viewer off a little also.  The original order of some events was very well done, and I'm just not sure why they changed it.   Sometimes its almost like watching Firefly out of order like Fox did it, as opposed to the way Whedon originally wanted it. LOL

 

- In the books, this happened about midway through the 3rd book.   I'm wondering now if they are going to try to cram the rest of it into this final episode of the season, or if they are going to split book 3 into season 3 and 4.  

 

-Mogie just so you know, Book 6 is not the end.   Martin is projecting it to go to 7 books, and his significant other has said that she doesn't think he will be able to do it in 7 books, she thinks it will be 8.   She did correctly predict that book 4 would be split up into book 4 and 5 because he had so much material, which was exactly what happened.   He takes a LONG time between books too.   Most of the readers' fear  that he is going to die or something before finishing the last book, that we are all hoping to be that happy resolution.    At least maybe the TV series will spur him on because at some point the series will catch up with the books, if he keeps writing at his current pace.    But yeah, what I've heard him say, is that his plan is to write 6 books, where each book picks up right where the last one left off, and then finish the series with one more final book, that will be 5 years after the events of book 6.

[Monsto Brukes]

As long as he's got an outline or at least a basic sketch of the story, like most writers do, then someone will be able to finish it. From what people have said, the hbo show is more faithful to the books than expected, so I would think that 'the family' would be able to get it written at least faithfully if not in the same style. Bottom line is that there's a number of economic entities (read: corporations) that would benefit more from a decent completion than any other scenario.

 

I wouldn't let the fear of his death affect anything if I were you.

[Veta]

More spoilers on what's coming , by Goeorge R.R Martin .

 

 

 

[formel]

  I read the books and can confirm everything he says in the video expect of course the cast for Daenerys: First I was a bit shocked and thought that's bs but now I accustomed to the changes and think it gave the whole story a new intresting twist. I mea they were the whole time on the post apocalyptic earth and didn't realize it, how cool is that.

[NalfeinDoUrden]

  I read the books and can confirm everything he says in the video expect of course the cast for Daenerys: First I was a bit shocked and thought that's bs but now I accustomed to the changes and think it gave the whole story a new intresting twist. I mea they were the whole time on the post apocalyptic earth and didn't realize it, how cool is that.

 

Yeah but what about the end of book 5, when Bran finally wakes up and realizes that it was all in his mind?

[Pkatt]

Hodor.

 

 

 

[deadmetal]

Lets put it this way....in game of thrones either you win or you die....and there is a ton of losing to be had

[Veta]

On a random not I have a guess on who Jon Snow's parents are , keep in mind I have not read the books so bare with me (Even though it's under spoiler it's just an assumption not 100% sure)

 

 

'Rhaegar Targaryen and Lyanna Stark ' "why do you say that veta" some of you may ask , firstly because Ned would never cheat on his wife and second because it's pretty obvious especially in Ned's dream , what I find strange with this though is the fact that Jon has already joined the nights watch and the black is for life , considering the fact that by heritage he is the rightful king of Westeros can he leave the nights watch ? .

 

[Veta]

He lied because reveling the truth would put Jon's life in danger , Robert wanted all Targeryans dead and if he had heard that his betrothed had a child with Rhaegar then he would have gone mad .