Editing unp body in blender and getting it into Skyrim

[gooboo]

Sorry if this question has been asked before, but I didn't see a thread elsewhere on the forums.

 

Basically what I wanted to do was edit the mesh of the unp body more to my liking in Blender (not trying to add bbb yet or anything like that) and be able to play it in Skyrim. I added polygons to the mesh to add more details to certain parts of the body, but otherwise everything is mosly the same. I still use the same uv map and everything. I've been following this tutorial here-

 

http://wiki.tesnexus.com/index.php/Creating_an_armour_for_Skyrim._Part_2

 

I figured editing the bodymesh would pretty much be the same thing this author is talking about, so I followed the instructions in this tutorial, but when I load up the body in Skyrim something has clearly gone wrong. The body doesn't move and the textures aren't showing up. I don't know where I've gone wrong or what to do to fix it- I'm sure that's not really helpful given how long that tutorial is. 

 

If anyone can help me out, or point me in the direction of an easier method of editing the unp mesh, I would greatly appreciate it. Here is what the body looks like in-game. Thanks!

 

 

[xD3c0yx]

If you added anything to the mesh you'll have to weight paint and all that again, I believe. Try just moving vertices around instead of adding. Then you keep all the settings in tact. Use mirror when doing that so it is symmetrical. Check out nightasy on YouTube to see how he does it.

 

Since his videos are lengthy, I'll give a quick how-to. Use the soft selection tool, set fall off to 10, then 'move' in the proper direction. I think you'll have to make it an editable mesh first, since you've saved the nif. Then when you're done. Skin wrap, and add your BS dismemberment again. Export and then you're done.

[xD3c0yx]

The reason a body loads, but doesn't move with the bones is because the weight wasn't set to the poly's you added. did you make sure and select what you added, then join it with the body itself before you did or didn't follow up with skin wrapping the new parts and setting the BS dismember? The whole body must be weighted for it to move.

[b3lisario]

I don't know how to use blender and the operations needed after exporting.

 

For the non moving body: Load your model in NifSkope and check NiTriShape / BSLightingShaderProperty / Shader Flags 1. "SLSF1_Skinned" has to be checked for armor / bodies.

 

Or copy-paste the entire BSLightingShaderProperty node from the original file.

[gooboo]

As for weighting, I followed the example in the tutorial where you simply copy the weight data from an existing model. I copied the weights from an unmodified unp body- is that the problem? In blender I had the entire body highlighted, and it took a long time to copy the weights over so I know that it did something, whether it was correct or not remains to be seen. Then in nifskope I did the bsdismember thing and changed BP_TORSO to 32 like it said in the tutorial I linked above.

 

EDIT- I also forgot to mention in the original post that I'm using the maximum compatibility skeleton, as I would like to add bbb at some point in the future. Don't know if it's important or not so I thought I'd mention it. 

[gooboo]

Copying the BSLightingShaderProperty node from the original body seems to have done the trick. I tried to edit mine to look like the original, but I guess it's just better to copy and paste it instead. 

[xD3c0yx]

So you're using blender? When you were finished, did you click apply ok the modifier tab, or "make real"?

 

In max it would be "collapse all" to have the same effect.

 

That sounds right, what you did.. The only thing I can think of is not actually applying the modifier after editing. But like I said. Any poly you added has to be joined with the original mesh (ctrl +j) and then you have to skin wrap/weight paint/BS dismember. I don't think it'd play successfully unless the body was a whole piece all connected and weighted to the proper bones.

[xD3c0yx]

That is why it might be best to start from scratch and just move vertices with soft select and mirror modifier. Then it stays as one piece and you copy the donor body again. Less of a hassle. So how much modifying did you do exactly?

 

With what you have, you could just remove the modifiers, join the parts as one editable mesh again, and copy the same way really. That's if you're satisfied with the way the shape turned out.

 

Sorry I was late to respond. But if you still have progression files of your work, you might try what I explained. Glad you figured something out tho.

 

As far as that tutorial goes.. I've seen mixed emotions on the maximum compatibility skeleton. Some say use it; others say don't. It really shouldn't effect the outcome of the product if you work in the right order in either direction.

[gooboo]

The body turned out fine. I think the problem I was having was with NifSkope and not with blender, since I only change the BSLightingShaderProperties and everything worked fine. As for the modifying I added more anatomical structure to the body, such as knee caps and hips, and made some other shape changes. I attached a picture of the body in case anyone is interested.

 

I'm actually running into a new problem now- when I'm trying to edit the meshes or armor. When I play the armor I've edited in game I can get the meshes to appear and move properly on the body, but they're solid black, even though I copied the BSLightingShaderProperty of the original meshes. I figured this might be because I didn't unwrap the UVs in blender, but when I reload the meshes in blender and unwrap the uv the placement is off. I even loaded the original nifs with no modifications at all and unwrapped them and the uv is still wrong. I'm not sure what's going wrong here, as the textures are the originals, straight from the bsa. The second picture illustrates what I'm talking about. When I edited my bodymesh all I did was unwrap it and use the original dds texture, so I'm not sure why this isn't working too. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

 

 

[b3lisario]

for the black body, try this:

 

- NiTriShapeData / Has Vertex Colors --> yes

- NiTriShapeData / Vertex Colors --> mouse right click --> Array --> Update

[gerra6]

If I am looking at that correctly, it appears that Blender is displaying the wrong texture in the UV window for the currently selected item.  Is this correct?

 

The solution depends on exactly what is going wrong.

 

First, make sure that the correct material is selected for the object.  The material is found in the Links and Materials section of the Editing pane of the Button Window.

 

Next, make sure that the material itself is associated with the correct texture.  Go to the Texture section of the Shading pane of the Button Window.  Ensure that the correct texture selected here.  Check the Image section in the Shading Pane to be double check the texture path.

 

As an aside, you mentioned wanting to eventually add BBB weighting to the meshes.

 

To add BB weightpainting to a mesh from scratch, grab this script: Automated BB Weightpainter

 

To copy BB weightpainting (or any other weightpainting) from an existing mesh, grab this script:  Boneweight Copy 2.3.a

 

If you have any questions about using them, let me know.

 

[gooboo]

No the uv texture I have in there is correct one. It's the banded iron texture for the pauldrons, and the stormcloak cuirass texture for the cuirass. They just aren't lined up properly with the meshes. 

[gerra6]

Ah, so when you mentioned rewrapping earlier, did that include a UV rewrap?

 

If so, that's what happened.  In general, the only time that you want to rewrap the UV is when you are getting ready to create a texture.  Once you have the texture and the UV is properly wrapped, you generally don't want to touch it other than tweaking vertices and or faces a bit.

 

I *think* there is a way to copy that data between meshes in Nifskope.  At some point, I'll write a Blender script that will copy UV mapping between meshes, but I won't get started on that until after I am done with my current batch of scripts.

 

Now, you can also attempt to fix the UV by hand.  The process for that is pretty ugly.

 

First, you'll need to define your edge seams, then do a Blender seam unwrap, then drag and rotate the nodes around in the UV map editor until everything is more or less in the right place.  I can give you more detailed instructions on that horrible process if you like (I once remapped a Roberts body to HGEC...I still have nightmares), but I'll warn you, it will take more time than just reverting to an earlier state and redoing your modifications.

[gooboo]

I figured fixing the uv by hand would be a nightmare- I'm trying to avoid that as much as I can. I'm not sure what you mean by rewrapping, as I don't recall pressing any kind of rewrap button.

 

Are you saying that I should do all of my modifications first, then unwrap the texture? Or not unwrap it at all since I'm not actually going to change the textures? I'm a little confused.

 

 

[gerra6]

Without looking over your shoulder and watching you work, I can't be certain, but I believe that when you say that you 'unwrap the texture', you're talking about doing a UV unwrap.  

 

http://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Doc:2.4/Manual/Textures/Mapping/UV/Unwrapping

 

If that's what you are doing, then that is something that you *do not* want to do. As I mentioned previously, it's something that you generally do when you create a new mesh, but once you have a good UV map, you generally don't want to touch it.

 

If not, then what are you referring to?

[gooboo]

This is from the tutorial I was looking at-

 

I went through the whole uv thing because it had it on there. If I'm just moving vertices/faces around, and not adding/removing anything to the mesh, is it even necessary to do this step? 

 

 

1. To create a material, in the Editing(F9) area press on the New button (the button encircled in the image Adding a material).

2. Next, in the Shading (F5) area press the red ball (Material buttons), and that will open the area that is shown in the picture Adding a texture. Here you can change the name of the materials on the Links and Pipeline tab, change the material properties and add a texture. The material properties can also be modified in NifSkope and it is easier to do it there, so in this screen we are only going to add a texture to the material. To do so press on the Add New button on the Texture tab.

3. Once you've added the texture two new tabs will appear: Map Input and Map To. Go to the Map Input tab and select UV as shown in the Map Input: UV picture. This is important so that the mesh interprets that the texture will follow the positions of the vertices of the UV map.

4. The last step is to associate the texture you've just created to a texture image. Right now you can associate any texture to it, it doesn't have to be the right one as this will be done later in NifSkope. To associate the texture image press the Texture buttons (F6) as shown in the Associating an image to the texture picture, and in the Texture type drop down list select Image. A window will pop up where you can select the texture dds image and, as I've explained before at this moment you can associate any dds file you have as we will associate the right one in NifSkope later.

Add a UV map

UV/Image Editor

Once your armour has the shape yo want and at least you've added one material, you have to colour it or it will be seen as transparent in game.

To do this the first step is to create the UV maps. The UV maps are projections in 2 dimensions of the mesh that is a 3 dimensional object. With the UV maps you are telling the mesh what part of the texture (that is a 2 dimensional image) has to be painted on each of the faces of the mesh.

To create the UV map:

1. Subdivide Blender screen in two screens: right double click on the top of the screen and select Split area from the pop up menu. Then move the line until it is more or less in the middle of the screen, separating it in two sections of the same size.
2. Select UV/Image Editor on the right screen as shown in the picture.
3. On the left screen, where your armour is, do the following:

For objects or parts of the armour with simple shapes

• in Edit Mode select the faces of the armour that you want to paint togheter.
• select the menu option Mesh -> UVUnwrap and you'll see a pop up window like the one shown in the UVUnwrap window picture. Select the option to generate the UV maps that works better for you. I usually select Unwrap or Project from View but you can try the different options and see which one fits your needs. If you use Project from View first move the armour until you see all the
• faces you've selected as you want them to be projected in the UV map because this option will paint them as they are shown on the screen.

[gerra6]

That looks like a few steps from a tutorial that has you create an entirely new object in Blender. This makes it a good reference, but as you've noticed, many of the steps are unnecessary (or even harmful) if all that you are doing is editing an existing mesh.

 

For what you're doing, I'd recommend reviewing this tutorial

 

http://tesalliance.org/forums/index.php?/tutorials/article/114-creating-skyrim-armor-in-blender-part-4-modifying-an-existing-nif-in-blender/

[gooboo]

Ah thanks, that's much closer to what I'm actually trying to do. 

[gooboo]

Ugh just when I think I had everything worked out somebody throws a wrench into my plans.

 

After doing some game testing of the working body mesh I noticed that the wrists didnt quite line up with the hands- I probably moved them around a little bit accidentally while sculpting. I loaded up the body, moved the vertices back into place, did all of the export and nifskope stuff and loaded it up in skyrim and now my bodymesh isn't showing up with any textures. It moves around properly, unlike the first time however.

 

 

 I loaded up the nif after exporting it and doing the 12/83 change, plus removing the NiTriShapes from the 0NiNode, like you're supposed to, but then I noticed some things were missing.

 

The mesh NiTriShapes didn't have any NiMaterialProperty, NiSpecularProperty, or BSShaderPPLightingProperty nodes with it. Granted you're supposed to delete these anyways, but it makes me think something went wrong with the texture in Blender perhaps. Also the NiTriShapesData node didn't have the Num UV Sets at 4097 and the Has Normals at yes like it usually does before you  change it. Again I changed these values to 1 and no, respectively. The BSDismemberSkinInstance worked fine, and I copy and pasted the BSLightingShaderProperty node from the original unp mesh like I did with the first body I got working. I don't know if any of these things missing is a big deal, but I thought it was a sign maybe I did something wrong, and someone could help me out. 

 

 

I decided to see if the UV stuff was wrong in blender. I opened the file up as it was before I exported it and the mesh lined up with the uv map just fine, as shown in picture 3. The texture appears to work just fine in Blender, but whenever I export it I get the missing nodes mentioned above with the result being the blue body in-game. I tried doing the unwrap thing again but this time the result is like what you see in picture 4 with the mesh not lining up at all with the texture.

 

 

 

I'm at a complete loss as to why this is happening. I'm not even totally sure how I got it to work the first time, as I might have accidentally saved over the original blender file that I ultimately exported successfully. Thanks in advance for everyone's help!

 

 

[gerra6]

Well, unfortunately I mostly mod Blender and don't have much direct experience with Skyrim outside of a mostly theoretical understanding of what is required. So while I can generally look at a Blender file and make a decent guess at what needs to be done, I make no guarantees outside of Blender.

That said, I think your diagnosis is correct.

Take a look at this tutorial. I think it covers the cleaning that your nif will probably need.

http://tesalliance.org/forums/index.php?/tutorials/article/115-creating-skyrim-armor-in-blender-part-5-clean-up-the-nif-in-nifskope/

As an aside, you mentioned an issue with seams. One of the very first scripts I wrote for Blender was a script that completely eliminates mesh related seams between meshes (texture differences will remain, if present)

Seam Mender
 

[me3]

DONT REMOVE NiTrShapes !!! u have to remove the NiNode´s children first then the NiNode itself as shown in this pictures : http://wiki.tesnexus.com/index.php/File:SkyrimArmourTut_9.jpg

http://wiki.tesnexus.com/index.php/File:SkyrimArmourTut_10.jpg

 

follow the tutorial and most things are very clear

 

belisario mentioned the SF skinned thing thats a nasty error,did that myself when inserting blocks in nifskope instead of copying a working BSLightningShaderProperty,

and for the UV stuff,i hope u have a backup from before doing the unwrap thing,im not sure if u can revert that now,picture 3 has the right UV coordiantes showing.....

[anubis]

Ugh just when I think I had everything worked out somebody throws a wrench into my plans.

 

After doing some game testing of the working body mesh I noticed that the wrists didnt quite line up with the hands- I probably moved them around a little bit accidentally while sculpting. I loaded up the body, moved the vertices back into place, did all of the export and nifskope stuff and loaded it up in skyrim and now my bodymesh isn't showing up with any textures. It moves around properly, unlike the first time however.

 

import the hands mesh as well, so you can clearly see if there is a gap by accidentally moved the arm whether you do it manually or with sculpting. on export, you can just delete the hand mesh (make sure you save the blend first.) 

 

 

 I loaded up the nif after exporting it and doing the 12/83 change, plus removing the NiTriShapes from the 0NiNode, like you're supposed to, but then I noticed some things were missing.

 

removing the nitrishapes from 0Ninoe ? and why would you do that ? well if this nitrishape is your edited UNP mesh. Just make sure that before you export it you already give it texture and set it with UV in Map input section, then export with your usuall export setting.

in nifkope, these what i usually do :

 

- Highlight the Nitrishape of edited mesh expand its tree and RMB the BSShaderPPLightingProperty -> Block -> Convert -> Bethesda -> BSShaderProperty.

 

- Highlight the Nitrishapedata, in block details set "Num Uv Sets" to 1.

 

- Highlight the Nitrishape of edited mesh, in block detail search down "num Properties" and change the value into "0". Right under that value there is a green recycle icon that line with "properties" section, just click the icon twice. bsshader, nispecular, nimaterial etc will automaticly detach from the nitrishape. then change user version 1 and 2. then i save it. 

 

- Open the original file of non edited mesh, and copy branch the BSLightingShaderProperty and paste branch on my edited file. link it up with setting the properties number in block detail with coresponding number of  BSLightingShaderProperty that i just paste branch.

 

 

I decided to see if the UV stuff was wrong in blender. I opened the file up as it was before I exported it and the mesh lined up with the uv map just fine, as shown in picture 3. The texture appears to work just fine in Blender, but whenever I export it I get the missing nodes mentioned above with the result being the blue body in-game. I tried doing the unwrap thing again but this time the result is like what you see in picture 4 with the mesh not lining up at all with the texture.

 

If you have set everything right, then i guess there is no way for a missing node(s) unless there is some export issue or bad script export. 

 

and trust me you dont want to unwrap it again, its tedious to fit it with the texture. i'm also using my own edited UNP, mesh modified not using any of that slider tool. so at first in blender i decided to convert triangles to quads first to make the vertices much easier to modified and the stupid thing is i didnt even thought about opening UV image editor for seeing the UV map after i converted to quads, because some vertices are joined/missaligned. still havent fix it yet..

[gooboo]

Perhaps I didn't make myself clear, let me try to clarify what's going on. I'm not getting rid of NiTriShapes,  just unparenting it from 0NiNode, like the tutorials tell me to. The thing is when I expand NiTriShapes there ISN'T any BSLightingShader properties to remove, only the NiTriShapes data and the DismemeberSkins block.

 

 

Furthermor, the NiTriShapes data doesn't look the way it does when everything is working well- there isn't a 4097 to change to 1 and there isn't a yes to change to no. Now I don't know if that's ultaimtely important, what I saw was that instead of the 4097 it was 0 and the no was already there. 

 

 

I figured none of this should be a problem since I can just copy-block and paste from a working unp nif file, but then I get the results I showed in my skyrim screen shot. So I'm not sure if it's nifskope that is the problem or Blender. But I might be leaning on Blender here-

 

As for Blender, I took a look at the file again that has the properly aligned uv settings, as shown in the third picture in my previous post. When I went to the materials tab I saw that it was 0 Mat 0. I think it's saying there isn't any material assigned to the object, but you can clearly see the texture working fine on the object. Am I just not understanding this, or could this be the problem? Despite the fact that, in Blender, the texture appears fine is there not actually a material assigned to the mesh, hence its lack of texture in Skyrim? 

 

[me3]

well im a blender noob myself,doing taht for 2 weeks now but im sure u ve to add a material,then add map and klick the UV button,

then load a textur,then split screen and export the UV.tga,just follow the tutorial.

 

look in ur nif,the NiTriShapeData should have UV sets and there should be uv coordinates like X 0,9865 Y 0,35345

and many of em,if not the nif cannot show textures .

 

id say,do the basic stuff first a few times untill u know everything out of memory,like import and export nifs and see if they work like their originals ingame,

then u can start manipulate em,and normaly errors are avoided by urself,

 

hope this makes any sense .....

 

Edit: with UV sets i dont mean the Num UV sets ,look more to the bottom.

 

the optional files have a video,explains everything pretty well

http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/3790

 

GL

[anubis]

then it clearly you dont set the texture for your mesh. Yes you can see the texture shown on your mesh because it was loaded into blender...and i mean by loaded its not mean it was "set" to your mesh....how do i know that ? your third screenshot right besides the "0 mat 0" there is no colour box, which mean there are no material is attached to your mesh..example of mesh with material  see the difference ? 

 

your third screenshot was only show your mesh with selected texture from UV/Image Editor. 

 

so you'll need to assign textures to your mesh as well, since i'm trying to upload screenshot to give you how to assign texture but bloody hell my google chrome is kinda lame right now it just wont let upload...

 

so guess you might wanna check this tutorial..

 

just straight down to "Add a material" and "Add a UV Map" section, and below are the references picture from it..

 

http://wiki.tesnexus.com/images/6/69/Sword_1_add_material.jpg

http://wiki.tesnexus.com/images/1/1e/Sword_2_add_texture.jpg

http://wiki.tesnexus.com/images/7/7a/Sword_3_Map_input_UV.jpg