Proper load order to avoid brown face bug?

[casma164]

If using looksmenu, looksmenu CC and ANY OTHER texture replacer/standalone (basefemalehead.dds, eyes, brows, etc.), where should they be in the load order in relation to each other?

 

[Just Don't]

That bug has nothing to do with loadorder. People recommend to use standard resolution textures instead of those 4k-8k high res. Or just restart the game (save/load or save/exit and start it again) and the problem goes away sometimes. Try to play without texture replacers and see if you have the issue, then add texture replacers to see if it produces the bug and make your own decisions about which textures are worth using.

[casma164]

Well, I can certainly vouch that the problem does not go away with a reload(or exiting the game).

I will try a reinstall of CBBE and have it overwrite everything.

[Just Don't]

32 minutes ago, casma164 said:

Well, I can certainly vouch that the problem does not go away with a reload(or exiting the game).

I will try a reinstall of CBBE and have it overwrite everything.

Check the 1st reply here, there is a mention to loadorder when you have mods changing the facegen of NPCs (which seems to be the main reason if you are having issues with mods, because it can also happen without any mods at all). I don't know what else to say, I had that bug once and changing my texture replacers (with no esp attached to worry about loadorder) was enough to solve the bug.

[Di3sIrae]

I said a bit about it in the reupload i did of Real HD 2K ba2 on Nexus, why it can happen, and how to fix. Here.

I'll copy paste what i wrote there here and add to the discussion below:

 

Spoiler

There are two things that can cause rusty/black/brown face:

 

One is when loading a save game. The game for any reason don't load the texture right and thus gives the rusty face. This can even happen when changing cells or worldspace. It is random, can be fixed by disable/enable in console or even with a load game, or a game restart.
This is what Rusty Face Fix [Nexus ID: 31028]... well, fix.

 

The other problem is entirely texture related.
One cause could be corrupted, missing or wrong texture file. The other is that Beth harcoded the texture files to be all in the same size. So if you have one file in 2K, all other (face) files of the same type must be 2K too. Original game uses 512 _s files, and HD DLC uses 1024 _s files, that's why people had rusty face issues when the HD DLC was released. They were using texture mods for the face that were using 512 _s files.
HD DLC still uses 1024 _d and _n files, and Real HD face uses 2048 (2K) size for these, so everything is incompatible.

 

When using a mod that retexture *face* files to bigger resolutions, you must take away all other mods that change anything related to face, including tints - makeup. Only hair and eyes are safe, but brows suffer from this aswell, if i'm not mistaken.

 

Note: DeLuxe Makeup is an example of an incompatible mod. I tried upscaling it to 2K to use here but i just can't get it to work. Maybe the author can give some insight or help with this, i'll send a pm.

 

Spoiler

Possible Fixes:

- Disable any mod that changes makeup, tints, freckles, warpaints and other face related textures. Eyes (not eyebrows) and hair are fine. LMCC have it's own 2K patch... i guess you read that in description.

- Install Real HD loose Face Textures from original mod page. Not the Main, only one of the face textures. This will overwrite any 1K face file from other body textures.

- Give up on your old body texture, and install one without face files - like the 8K one -, or delete manually the face files from it. Please download manually the loose files from Real Face HD original mod page to look what is used, pay attention, and delete the same files from your Data folder or from the texture mod if using MO. You'll want to do this if the loose files from Real HD brings performance problems.

- Be aware that any mod that edits NPCs, or add NPCs, and include standalone textures for them will NOT be compatible. I mean, if they have 1K face files, they will have rusty face. If that's the case, you have a follower mod or a mod that changes vanilla followers, you may want to replace their face files and tints with 2K ones.

- If only your character still have Rusty face and you don't know what is causing it, open LooksMenu (slm 14) and save a preset of the character. Or just make a hard save of the game before editing, so you can go back.

Open the tab to change makeup, scars and everything else, and disable EVERYTHING. If your character face returns to normal color, then you may want to check the addons one by one. Maybe it is an eyebrow, maybe a freckle, maybe a scar or a face paint.
If your character still have rusty face, pray.
I mean, well, try a different preset or a new game and see if it fixes the problem. If not, give a shout here and i can pray with you. Or try to help.

So, to make it clear:

 

Random brown face happens, you can use console command disable/enable or enter slm and edit anything to re-load face, save and load or restart the game. Any will fix the issue.
The mod Rusty Face Fix fixes this almost all the time.

 

When the brown face is consistent, then you must take a look on all your face textures, including brows, makeup, grime/dirt, tattoo, face paint. Eyes and hair are excluded from this, also teeth.

 

Vanilla: if i'm not mistaken, diffuse and normal are 1024 and specular, 512.
HD DLC: diffuse, normal and specular are all 1024.
Real HD (example): normal and diffuse 2048 and specular 1024.

 

What does this mean?

 

All make up, face paint, etc files must have the same resolution as face.
If you are using vanilla, you can't install a mod for makeup with 2K.
IF using HD DLC, you can install a mod for makeup, for example, as they are in 1024 (for vanilla), but a body texture that comes with face textures for vanilla will cause problem (because they have 512 specular).
If using 2K face, mods for makeup must be 2048, and if you install another face texture, it must be for 2K, with 1024 specular.

 

Does Load Order matters? Yes AND no.

 

If your textures are all loose files, then NO.
If you have textures packed in ba2, then YES. But this will only happen if you pack it yourself, or if you install a lot of things that you doesn't even know what they are. Chances are minimal. So... usually, load order doesn't matter at all. In any case, load the ba2 with face textures as low as possible to avoid problems, if that's the case.

 

Just remember thar some mods that replaces NPCs can cause problems on their own, and if you use them, it will be more difficult to solve. For vanilla NPCs and player character, not touched by replacer mods, it is easy to fix.

 

You just need to actually remove all texture mods that touch face and re-install them, keeping in mind what exactly is your goal.

IF vanilla, just remove everything, and reinstall them looking if they are for vanilla or HD dlc or 2k face. CBBE, any body texture, mods like DeLuxe makeup and etc, all fine.

For HD DLC, you'll have to be more carefull. Install CBBE, the body texture you want and etc, and then you'll have to run a program that will convert the speculars to 1024, there is a few on nexus but i never used them myself. Makeup, tints and brows for vanilla will work fine.

For 2K face, then things must be strict. You'll have to install CBBE, then any body texture you want, and then the face files for 2K. If using face files in a ba2 (like the one i provided), you'll have to delete the face files from character assets manually.
After that, carefully install makeup and tint mods that have 2k patch. No patch, no install.
What i recommend is installing Looks Meny Customization Compendium with it's patch for 2K.

Now, about load order... it shouldn't matter, but my LooksMenu and LMCC plugins are at the top of my load order, just below the esl plugins. Some time ago i was having some problems and they ended going up there, i don't remember why.
(brown face bug, Unique NPCs... I made a patch for Unique, but only after i removed it from my game i discovered that my ba2 was corrupt, and probably the cause of my issues was it lol)

 

Sorry for extensive reply, hope it helps.

Edit: Holy Cow! Is it just me or editing in LL is messed up? I tried using [spoiler tag and everything went to hell. Now i fixed with the proper spoiler button but my text is going out of the text box lol
Edit2: Had to make another comment and delete the other. What just happened.. ?

[casma164]

Okay, I did a clean wipe, fresh install and update.

Im using HD DLC

The ONLY mods that are installed are...

   F4SE

   Looksmenu

   LMCC

   CBBE

   BS/OS

 

up to here everything is fine

 

   Now I install oni asian face parts(no brown face cause it shouldn't but the "nose" parts are not working, the "eyes" and "mouth" work as intended)

 

   Then I install a oni face required preset.  None of the other prerequisite mods were installed so I knew I wasn't going to get the correct to screenshot face, but when I select it at character creation, I get the brown face bug.

 

   So I guess my question is why did the preset cause the BF bug?

[casma164]

I'm reading everything you posted, DL'd the LMCC patch and will try the Real HD Face texture.

[Di3sIrae]

Yes, your question should be why the preset is causing brown face.
A link to it would help, so we can know exactly what you're using.

Since you said you did a fresh install, there are probably no leftovers, but it would be good to know:
Are you using NMM? Or maybe Vortex? Have you really deleted Data folder before installing again?
If using MO2, then no problem.

The preset can be trying to load something that is not in your game, or in a different position, thus failing to load and causing the problem. Isn't it an old preset using old version of LMCC (and maybe something that was removed)(i don't know?)?
I have never used Oni face, and i never used other presets, aside from the ones i create and load myself, so i don't understand much about how they work.

My bad ba2 was causing the game to fail to load the dirt and grime from vanilla, and i was getting brown face on NPCs using it, and also on presets that had them.


You said you're using HD DLC. I don't remember which files for tints have specular, but have you searched for some HD DLC black face fix on Nexus to convert your files to 1024?
Or better, have you installed LMCC patch for HD DLC?

[casma164]

Vortex

Deleted the contents of the Fallout 4 file(yes, this means EVERYTHING, data folder and all).

Oni asian face parts mod is not a texture replacer, it replaces certain .tri files.

This was the initial preset I was testing https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/30844  (got the brown face bug, I had not installed the valkyr texture yet)

 

You linked me to the Real HD face texture replacer, so I decided to use this preset instead https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/34475

Never got the brown face bug after this point.

Speaking of presets, I've used a lot of them and most of the time I never had the prerequisite texture replacers, never got the brown face bug, they just did'nt look like their respective screenshots.

 

What caused my initial problems was an NPC replacer(IIRC, it was a SimSettlements leader mod).

My versions of LMCC is the latest and patched it with both the HD DLC fix and LMCC 2k face texture(although looking at it now, it seems like the HD DLC fix wasn't needed if you use the LMCC 2k face textures).

 

 

[Di3sIrae]

Nice that you got the problem fixed by using the 2k face.
It's true, LMCC 2k patch has everything you need, the fix for HD DLC would only be useful for things made for vanilla. If you only install mods for 2K face you'll be fine.
The first preset uses LMCC, and you were using HD DLC, so maybe the problem was with you not having the patch?

The second preset does not use LMCC, so a lot of things may look different. Also it requires 2K with mods that appear to NOT be for 2K (lol?). DeLuxe makeup is definetely not compatible with 2K. Strange.

In the end it's mostly a question of something not being patched correctly, either for the HD DLC or 2K face.

[corridian]

On 11/7/2019 at 3:10 PM, Di3sIrae said:

I said a bit about it in the reupload i did of Real HD 2K ba2 on Nexus, why it can happen, and how to fix. Here.

I'll copy paste what i wrote there here and add to the discussion below:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

There are two things that can cause rusty/black/brown face:

 

One is when loading a save game. The game for any reason don't load the texture right and thus gives the rusty face. This can even happen when changing cells or worldspace. It is random, can be fixed by disable/enable in console or even with a load game, or a game restart.
This is what Rusty Face Fix [Nexus ID: 31028]... well, fix.

 

The other problem is entirely texture related.
One cause could be corrupted, missing or wrong texture file. The other is that Beth harcoded the texture files to be all in the same size. So if you have one file in 2K, all other (face) files of the same type must be 2K too. Original game uses 512 _s files, and HD DLC uses 1024 _s files, that's why people had rusty face issues when the HD DLC was released. They were using texture mods for the face that were using 512 _s files.
HD DLC still uses 1024 _d and _n files, and Real HD face uses 2048 (2K) size for these, so everything is incompatible.

 

When using a mod that retexture *face* files to bigger resolutions, you must take away all other mods that change anything related to face, including tints - makeup. Only hair and eyes are safe, but brows suffer from this aswell, if i'm not mistaken.

 

Note: DeLuxe Makeup is an example of an incompatible mod. I tried upscaling it to 2K to use here but i just can't get it to work. Maybe the author can give some insight or help with this, i'll send a pm.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Possible Fixes:

- Disable any mod that changes makeup, tints, freckles, warpaints and other face related textures. Eyes (not eyebrows) and hair are fine. LMCC have it's own 2K patch... i guess you read that in description.

- Install Real HD loose Face Textures from original mod page. Not the Main, only one of the face textures. This will overwrite any 1K face file from other body textures.

- Give up on your old body texture, and install one without face files - like the 8K one -, or delete manually the face files from it. Please download manually the loose files from Real Face HD original mod page to look what is used, pay attention, and delete the same files from your Data folder or from the texture mod if using MO. You'll want to do this if the loose files from Real HD brings performance problems.

- Be aware that any mod that edits NPCs, or add NPCs, and include standalone textures for them will NOT be compatible. I mean, if they have 1K face files, they will have rusty face. If that's the case, you have a follower mod or a mod that changes vanilla followers, you may want to replace their face files and tints with 2K ones.

- If only your character still have Rusty face and you don't know what is causing it, open LooksMenu (slm 14) and save a preset of the character. Or just make a hard save of the game before editing, so you can go back.

Open the tab to change makeup, scars and everything else, and disable EVERYTHING. If your character face returns to normal color, then you may want to check the addons one by one. Maybe it is an eyebrow, maybe a freckle, maybe a scar or a face paint.
If your character still have rusty face, pray.
I mean, well, try a different preset or a new game and see if it fixes the problem. If not, give a shout here and i can pray with you. Or try to help.

So, to make it clear:

 

Random brown face happens, you can use console command disable/enable or enter slm and edit anything to re-load face, save and load or restart the game. Any will fix the issue.
The mod Rusty Face Fix fixes this almost all the time.

 

When the brown face is consistent, then you must take a look on all your face textures, including brows, makeup, grime/dirt, tattoo, face paint. Eyes and hair are excluded from this, also teeth.

 

Vanilla: if i'm not mistaken, diffuse and normal are 1024 and specular, 512.
HD DLC: diffuse, normal and specular are all 1024.
Real HD (example): normal and diffuse 2048 and specular 1024.

 

What does this mean?

 

All make up, face paint, etc files must have the same resolution as face.
If you are using vanilla, you can't install a mod for makeup with 2K.
IF using HD DLC, you can install a mod for makeup, for example, as they are in 1024 (for vanilla), but a body texture that comes with face textures for vanilla will cause problem (because they have 512 specular).
If using 2K face, mods for makeup must be 2048, and if you install another face texture, it must be for 2K, with 1024 specular.

 

Does Load Order matters? Yes AND no.

 

If your textures are all loose files, then NO.
If you have textures packed in ba2, then YES. But this will only happen if you pack it yourself, or if you install a lot of things that you doesn't even know what they are. Chances are minimal. So... usually, load order doesn't matter at all. In any case, load the ba2 with face textures as low as possible to avoid problems, if that's the case.

 

Just remember thar some mods that replaces NPCs can cause problems on their own, and if you use them, it will be more difficult to solve. For vanilla NPCs and player character, not touched by replacer mods, it is easy to fix.

 

You just need to actually remove all texture mods that touch face and re-install them, keeping in mind what exactly is your goal.

IF vanilla, just remove everything, and reinstall them looking if they are for vanilla or HD dlc or 2k face. CBBE, any body texture, mods like DeLuxe makeup and etc, all fine.

For HD DLC, you'll have to be more carefull. Install CBBE, the body texture you want and etc, and then you'll have to run a program that will convert the speculars to 1024, there is a few on nexus but i never used them myself. Makeup, tints and brows for vanilla will work fine.

For 2K face, then things must be strict. You'll have to install CBBE, then any body texture you want, and then the face files for 2K. If using face files in a ba2 (like the one i provided), you'll have to delete the face files from character assets manually.
After that, carefully install makeup and tint mods that have 2k patch. No patch, no install.
What i recommend is installing Looks Meny Customization Compendium with it's patch for 2K.

Now, about load order... it shouldn't matter, but my LooksMenu and LMCC plugins are at the top of my load order, just below the esl plugins. Some time ago i was having some problems and they ended going up there, i don't remember why.
(brown face bug, Unique NPCs... I made a patch for Unique, but only after i removed it from my game i discovered that my ba2 was corrupt, and probably the cause of my issues was it lol)

 

Sorry for extensive reply, hope it helps.

Edit: Holy Cow! Is it just me or editing in LL is messed up? I tried using [spoiler tag and everything went to hell. Now i fixed with the proper spoiler button but my text is going out of the text box lol
Edit2: Had to make another comment and delete the other. What just happened.. ?

ok I totally love you!  I have been fighting brown face on several attempted play throughs.   I found a face preset that I could not get to work for the life of me, which is what prompted the bunch of attempts to restart.  Now just to place in context I have played since before launch aka beta and have like almost 4k hours in game. It was only after I decided to start putting in moles, freckles some of the tighter tattoos and TH brows that I started having some issues... Then I deleted the HD textures from beth and went with your BA2 file and the remaining original lose files, the LMCC and pretty much that was it.... and everything magically started working and I mean everything.. lots of presets that went dark brown or black even and the black or indian presets that went rusty bad, all fine.. both in saved games and in new game.   

 

Now I can get back to the main reason for my frustrations which is to find or make the perfect face for my play through of Insane Ivy!

thank you so much

C

[Arcturus7777]

On 11/7/2019 at 5:47 AM, casma164 said:

If using looksmenu, looksmenu CC and ANY OTHER texture replacer/standalone (basefemalehead.dds, eyes, brows, etc.), where should they be in the load order in relation to each other?

 

I install this mod and it fixed the face in game.  If the looksmenu preset has the brown face I do not use it.

https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/21907

 

everytime is see the brown face I install, OR uninstall and reinstall the above mod.  works for me.