At Wit's End (XPMSE and SOS causing CTD)

[Vrailis]

Greetings. Thank you for being willing to help me resolve this. I've been modding Skyrim for about four years now, during which time I've spent more hours trying to mod correctly than I have playing the damn game. I've done my homework. I've watched tutorials by Gopher and Gamer Poets. I've read Sacremas's detailed (though admittedly unorganized) modding guide. I've spent countless hours downloading, deleting, testing, and re-arranging hundreds of mods in an attempt to create my ideal Skyrim. To this end, I have also completely deleted my game and all associated files on four separate occasions in an effort to start the modding process over from scratch. This will be my fifth go-around, and hopefully my last.

 

Basic Information

 

I use Mod Organizer. I use an ENB - RealVision, which (to my knowledge) is installed and functions correctly. I have cleaned my master files and mods with TES5 and have sorted them with LOOT. I have downloaded SKSE and create the requisite INI file (in my common>steamapps>skyrim folder) to these specifications:

 

[General]

ClearInvalidRegistrations=1

[Display]

iTintTextureResolution=2048

[Memory]

defaultHeapInitialAllocMB=1024

scrapHeapSizeMB=384

 

I use Windows 10. I have an i5-6600 CPU with 8GB of RAM. My graphics card is an NVIDIA GeForce GTX 950. As far as I know, I have an upper-end computer which should be able to run Skyrim and advanced mods without issue.

 

To my knowledge, every single mod and modding utility that I am using are the latest editions.

 

The Problem

 

I am experiencing a CTD 15-30 minutes into gameplay. This happens seemingly at random - no single thing triggers the CTD consistently. The game absolutely works without fail for the first 15 minutes - I can do whatever I want, take on a hundred guards at Ultra quality, run naked through the streets of Whiterun, whatever, I'm fine. After that time period, all bets are off. By reviewing my game's Papyrus logs, I have determined that the culprit is likely either XMPSE or SOS.

 

Exhibit A: Here is one of my Papyrus logs. As you can see, the game crashes after attempting to assign schlongs to numerous NPCs.

 

 

Exhibit B: Another Papyrus log. This time, the game is only assigning a schlong to one NPC. Nonetheless, a crash.

 

 

Convinced that SOS was the problem, I unchecked the mod from my checklist and started the game. Alas, I crashed all the same.

 

Exhibit C: With SOS uninstalled, this log suggests that XMPSE is now the cause of my CTDs.

 

 

At this point, I'm wondering what I'm doing wrong. Both SOS and XMPSE seem to be conflicting with some other part of my game. If anyone has any ideas as to what I should do, please let me know.

 

Other Information

 

Here's other stuff you might need to know.

 

My Load Order:

 

-

 

Here is my Plugin Load Order.

 

 

---

 

Things I HAVE Tried (Will edit this as I go along)

 

-Re-arranging my mod load order. I've tried close to every possible combination. I know XMPSE and other animation mods are supposed to be kept near the bottom, so that's where I keep them. I've experimented placing SOS in numerous slots throughout my order, to no avail.

 

-Updating/Running FNIS. I run FNIS regularly and make patches for the overwritten files.

 

-Cleaning my masterfiles, sort through LOOT, etc. As stated above, I've been very careful to correctly use these tools.

 

-Deleting high-res texture DLC. Didn't help.

 

---

 

If anyone has any advice, I'd be very appreciative. I'm a bit disheartened, to be truthful - this isn't even a third of the mods I intend to download, and I'm already running into problems. I only hope that this is the worst of them, and that I won't be back here again when I start downloading my favorite SexLab and combat mods.

[Kriegera]

I see you have realistic ragdolls in your load order. You didn't happen to allow that to overwrite xpmse did you? Also try getting rid of climates of Tamriel and the high res stuff. You may be running into the infamous windows ten memory bug.

[Vrailis]

Hey Kriegera, thanks for the response. I redownloaded Ragdolls to make sure it wasn't overwriting XPMSE. I didn't get even get an option asking me if I wanted to. Because of this, I'll continue to assume that placing XPMSE lower in the load order than Ragdolls will prioritize XPMSE.

 

I removed the high res texture DLC. Unfortunately, it didn't help. I'm hesitant to delete CoT, since the ENB I run depends on the mod. Is there a definitive way to check if memory is the issue?

[valcon767]

a few notes that might help

 

you have two lighting mods ("Realistic Lighting Overhaul" and "Enhanced Lights and FX") check to make sure they do not have a fatal conflict.

 

SOS is loading after XPMSE (I have it before in my game) and if I remember right SOS has a skeleton in it (depending on version).

what version of SOS are you running??? ( I use 3.00.004 myself and have not had problems with it in a long time now)

 

to make sure nothing has overwritten XPMSE you can always re-install it (this way you can be sure it was not accidently overwritten at any point).

 

from the parts of logs you posted it (exhibit A) looks like RLO is causing a memory freeze ( I could be wrong here, I am not the best at reading papyrus logs).

 

if I remember correctly the papyrus log records what the papyrus does in game (errors and other things) so the last line you see is not automatically the culprit.

the last line is the last thing papyrus actually did (not what it was in the process of trying to do which is what actually caused the ctd)

 

thing to look for in the logs would include mods that generate a lot of errors or cause stack dumps (this will cause more problems later in the game).

 

from what I was able to read of the examples it looks like it there is actually an animations issue causing problems

(Exhibit B has a "Error cannot find variable named FNISaa_bowidle_crc" )

it cannot find that and that is causing issues (which may or may not be the cause of the CTD).

 

when you run FNIS you will need to verify that you are including the patches you need (and not including any extra patches).

double check which patches it is including (each patch lists what mod they are for {from nexus etc}) so if you include a patch for something you do not have (or skip one you do have)

it can and will lead to issues in game (at some point or other).

 

I did something very similar in the past - I tried a mod out (it has a FNIS patch) and did not like it so I removed it and reran FNIS but forgot to untick the patch

so of course I kept running into issues.  and the worst part was I did not get an error while running FNIS (this was a while back and at least 2 versions ago now for me, currently using FNIS 6.3XXL)

I am not sure if a patch that should be included (but is not ticked) will give an error while running FNIS, but I do know forgetting to tick a patch (that you

should have ticked) will not give an error.

 

[fore]

 

thing to look for in the logs would include mods that generate a lot of errors or cause stack dumps (this will cause more problems later in the game).

 

from what I was able to read of the examples it looks like it there is actually an animations issue causing problems

(Exhibit B has a "Error cannot find variable named FNISaa_bowidle_crc" )

it cannot find that and that is causing issues (which may or may not be the cause of the CTD).

 

I doubt that this is cause of CTD. But it's a clear indication that FNIS isn't properly executed. Or the output badly used in MO.

 

The animation variable "FNISaa_bowidle_crc" is defined in the FNIS generated file 0_master.hkx. And it is GENERALLY created, independent of the animation mods you use. 

 

So if that (or any other similarly named) variable isn't found, the user has messed up something.

[Vrailis]

a few notes that might help

 

you have two lighting mods ("Realistic Lighting Overhaul" and "Enhanced Lights and FX") check to make sure they do not have a fatal conflict.

 

SOS is loading after XPMSE (I have it before in my game) and if I remember right SOS has a skeleton in it (depending on version).

what version of SOS are you running??? ( I use 3.00.004 myself and have not had problems with it in a long time now)

 

to make sure nothing has overwritten XPMSE you can always re-install it (this way you can be sure it was not accidently overwritten at any point).

 

from the parts of logs you posted it (exhibit A) looks like RLO is causing a memory freeze ( I could be wrong here, I am not the best at reading papyrus logs).

 

if I remember correctly the papyrus log records what the papyrus does in game (errors and other things) so the last line you see is not automatically the culprit.

the last line is the last thing papyrus actually did (not what it was in the process of trying to do which is what actually caused the ctd)

 

thing to look for in the logs would include mods that generate a lot of errors or cause stack dumps (this will cause more problems later in the game).

 

from what I was able to read of the examples it looks like it there is actually an animations issue causing problems

(Exhibit B has a "Error cannot find variable named FNISaa_bowidle_crc" )

it cannot find that and that is causing issues (which may or may not be the cause of the CTD).

 

when you run FNIS you will need to verify that you are including the patches you need (and not including any extra patches).

double check which patches it is including (each patch lists what mod they are for {from nexus etc}) so if you include a patch for something you do not have (or skip one you do have)

it can and will lead to issues in game (at some point or other).

 

I did something very similar in the past - I tried a mod out (it has a FNIS patch) and did not like it so I removed it and reran FNIS but forgot to untick the patch

so of course I kept running into issues.  and the worst part was I did not get an error while running FNIS (this was a while back and at least 2 versions ago now for me, currently using FNIS 6.3XXL)

I am not sure if a patch that should be included (but is not ticked) will give an error while running FNIS, but I do know forgetting to tick a patch (that you

should have ticked) will not give an error.

 

Hey Valcon, thanks for the response. I'll disable RLO and see if it works better. I appreciate the tutoring on how Papyrus works - I don't know a damn thing about reading scripts. If I post future screenshots of my crashed logs, I'll be sure to focus on the error messages.

 

As for the FNIS patches, the only one I have ticked is the 'arm fix', which I believe is needed for XPMSE. Other than that, I should be good.

 

As an update, I redownloaded SOS and ticked the skeleton support (but this time I /didn't/ enable the other two schlong options). I also redownloaded XPMSE and also ticked the SOS support. I initially only ticked one of these because I thought that SOS's skeleton and XPMSE's skeleton would conflict, but I'm running it now and things /appear/ to be okay. Haven't crashed yet. I'd play for longer but I'm dead tired and need to sleep. I'll try it tomorrow with SexLab and see what happens.

 

 

 

 

thing to look for in the logs would include mods that generate a lot of errors or cause stack dumps (this will cause more problems later in the game).

 

from what I was able to read of the examples it looks like it there is actually an animations issue causing problems

(Exhibit B has a "Error cannot find variable named FNISaa_bowidle_crc" )

it cannot find that and that is causing issues (which may or may not be the cause of the CTD).

 

I doubt that this is cause of CTD. But it's a clear indication that FNIS isn't properly executed. Or the output badly used in MO.

 

The animation variable "FNISaa_bowidle_crc" is defined in the FNIS generated file 0_master.hkx. And it is GENERALLY created, independent of the animation mods you use. 

 

So if that (or any other similarly named) variable isn't found, the user has messed up something.

 

 

Woah, wasn't expecting a response from Fore himself. Thanks for helping me out - I've downloaded your mod into common>steamapps>skyrim>ModOrganizer>mods. I downloaded it from Nexus straight to MO, and I run it directly from MO through an executable. I watched one of Gamer Poets tutorials to help me.

 

I don't think I messed up the instillation. Is there a way I can diagnose the problem and find out exactly how I'm misusing your mod?

[fore]

 

 

thing to look for in the logs would include mods that generate a lot of errors or cause stack dumps (this will cause more problems later in the game).

 

from what I was able to read of the examples it looks like it there is actually an animations issue causing problems

(Exhibit B has a "Error cannot find variable named FNISaa_bowidle_crc" )

it cannot find that and that is causing issues (which may or may not be the cause of the CTD).

 

I doubt that this is cause of CTD. But it's a clear indication that FNIS isn't properly executed. Or the output badly used in MO.

 

The animation variable "FNISaa_bowidle_crc" is defined in the FNIS generated file 0_master.hkx. And it is GENERALLY created, independent of the animation mods you use. 

 

So if that (or any other similarly named) variable isn't found, the user has messed up something.

 

 

Woah, wasn't expecting a response from Fore himself. Thanks for helping me out - I've downloaded your mod into common>steamapps>skyrim>ModOrganizer>mods. I downloaded it from Nexus straight to MO, and I run it directly from MO through an executable. I watched one of Gamer Poets tutorials to help me.

 

I don't think I messed up the instillation. Is there a way I can diagnose the problem and find out exactly how I'm misusing your mod?

 

That can have a whole bunch of reasons. From executing FNIS with error, over not making a proper overwrite, or having 0_master.hkx being overloaded by a mod that has it's own 0_master.hkx, to the (known) MO bug where behavior files from other mods are overwritten with FNIS files.

 

You need advive from an MO expert. And it should be known by now that I'm definitely not one of them.

[Lodakai]

Make sure to disable sexlab debug option.  Also do this for any other mod.  Debug logs can cause crashing like clockwork after 30 minutes when the logs start to become quite large.

Only enable them when you want to actively debug.

 

Use crash fixes to address memory issues with skyrim. http://www.loverslab.com/files/file/2551-crash-fixes/. Make sure to use the skse preloader as instructed on the front page.  Although this particularly might not effect you since your load order seems pretty light,  crash fixes also detects incorrect setups in INI files that could assist you in isolating obscure problems.