[3ds Max] Skeleton Controller Rigs - Draugr v0.13.2 (2015-09-22)

[pornphile]

Yes. Link pussy to pelvis. Move pelvis around and everything should follow. Were you able to skin and export a working animation from the other skeleton?

[trepleen]

Yes. Link pussy to pelvis. Move pelvis around and everything should follow. Were you able to skin and export a working animation from the other skeleton?

 

With 1.6 skeleton and 1.93a legacy skeleton in my data folder, I was able to successfully skin the vagina to the calf & skirt bones and animate the vagina with no problems.

 

However if I skin any verts to the NPC R pussy 02 or NPC L Pussy 02 bones, then the verts mess up in game.

 

This thread has all the details of the problem I"m experiencing with the NPC Pussy bones.

 

http://www.loverslab.com/topic/37402-please-help-me-solve-this-issue-with-vagina-model-skeleton-bones/

 

I thought maybe if I add new bones from another skeleton, and skin to them instead, the problem would go away.

[pornphile]

What skeleton are you using in game? Does it have matching bones?

[trepleen]

What skeleton are you using in game? Does it have matching bones?

 

I'm using 1.93a legacy skeleton by groovtama.

 

It has the NPC r pussy 01, NPC r pussy 02, NPC l pussy 01, NPC l pussy 02 connected to a pussy bone, which is then connected to the pelvis bone.

 

The 1.6 skeleton in your controller rig has NPC r pussy 01, NPC r pussy 02, NPC l pussy 01, NPC l pussy 02 bones connected directly to the pelvis without a pussy bone.

 

Could that be causing the problem? If so how could we remedy that?

[pornphile]

Could be the problem. See if a 1.6 skeleton in game animates correctly.

 

If that works, you can delete the 1.6 pussy bones, link 1.9 pussy bone to pelvis and test from there. That way you'll have matching skeleton for your game.

[trepleen]

Could be the problem. See if a 1.6 skeleton in game animates correctly.

 

If that works, you can delete the 1.6 pussy bones, link 1.9 pussy bone to pelvis and test from there. That way you'll have matching skeleton for your game.

 

Hmm, you wouldn't happen to know where to find a 1.6 skeleton? If not, I'm looking for it.

[pornphile]

First link in OP.

[trepleen]

OMFG, installing 1.6 fixed the issue. The pussy fully animates properly, thank you very much! But the problem is 1.6 is so old. 

 

Something broke the npc pussy bones after version 1.6, or is incompatible most likely.

 

I have to somehow compared 1.6 to 1.93a legacy skeleton and figure out what went wrong.

 

I understand the skeleton.hkx & skeleton_female.hkx to a certain degree.  You can use this information in the future if need be, but I want to contribute something back for all your help.

 

 

 

1. You can convert skeleton_female.hkx to skeleton_female.xml using hkxcmd.exe

 

C:\1\hkxcmd.exe convert skeleton.hkx skeleton.xml

 

edit skeletno.xml in notepad++ , save changes

 

C:\1\hkxcmd.exe convert skeleton_female.xml skeleton_female.hkx -v win32

 

that compiles it back to hkx format

 

This link explains "parentindices" in the skeleton_female.xml file.  It also explains how bone orders work.  I'm just putting this information out there for you and anyone else who may google it.

 

http://www.gamesas.com/havok-animation-converter-t207307-50.html

 

 

 

 

If you ever want to know how to skin, I can show you. IT"S EXTREMELY EASY. 

 

Here look at these screenshots. Thanks again for your help. This is screenshot of a 200 frame animation of open and closing.

 

 

Do you think we can somehow get animations exported out of 1.6 controller rig to be compatible with the 1.93a legacy skeleton?

 

[pornphile]

Animations exported with 1.6 expects the pussy bones to be linked to the pelvis. The problem is 1.9 has an intermediary bone. So as the skeleton is animated, the pussy bones are left behind.

 

You should be able to solve this by importing 1.9 into 1.6, delete unneeded bones and re-establish 1.9 hierarchy.

[trepleen]

Animations exported with 1.6 expects the pussy bones to be linked to the pelvis. The problem is 1.9 has an intermediary bone. So as the skeleton is animated, the pussy bones are left behind.

 

You should be able to solve this by importing 1.9 into 1.6, delete unneeded bones and re-establish 1.9 hierarchy.

 

If by some miracle i get this to work, I'll upload the max file here as a resource.

 

Here is my plan.

 

1. Import 1.9 skeleton into 3d studio max.

2. delete uneeded bones like you said.

3. save max file

4. merge max file with new bones into 1.6 skeleton rig max file

5. delete 1.6 vagina bones

6. link npc r pussy 01 and npc l pussy 01 to pelvis

7. export test animation

 

that is basically what you told me to do right? when you said establish a hierarchy?

 

That Pussy Bone is not specified in the skeleton_female.hkx or in the havok skeleton rig text file .....

uugggh

[pornphile]

You want the same hierarchy as the 1.9 skeleton. If I'm using the right version skeleton, You want something like this:

 

 

So you need only link Pussy --> NPC Pelvis [Pelv]

 

Be aware this is a very non standard setup. The 1.93 skeleton itself has scaling issues.

 

Maybe an easier solution would be to put the 1.6 pussy bones onto the 1.9 skeleton. This would mean you'd have to package your modified skeleton with your mod.

[trepleen]

You want the same hierarchy as the 1.9 skeleton. If I'm using the right version skeleton, You want something like this:

 

link.JPG

 

So you need only link Pussy --> NPC Pelvis [Pelv]

 

 

TO ANYONE WHO READS THIS POST, WARNING DO NOT DO THIS, I AM STILL LEARNING. OUT OF RESPECT FOR ALL OF GROOVTAMA'S HARDWORK, DO NOT TRY ANYTHING BELOW. I AM JUST EXPERIMENTING AND LEARNING, SINCE THIS IS A HOBBY OF MINE NOW!

 

1. I linked the pussy bone to the NPC Pelvis Bone

 

2. I skinned the vagina model to the Pussy Bone, NPC R Pussy 02, NPC L Pussy 02 bones

 

3. I exported the femalebody_1.nif with the vagina model inside it

 

4. I am now going to export a vagina animation from your 1.6 skeleton controller rig scene with the new pussy bones linked.

 

I modified XPMS RIG 1.6c Full Bone.txt and added the following bone to the list:

 

... NPC R Item03

Pussy

NPC L Pussy01

NPC L Pussy 02

NPC R Pussy 01

NPC R Pussy 02

LeftWing1 ....

 

5. I exported a vagtest.hkx animation

 

6. Now I have to modify 1.93a skeleton_female.hkx by first converting it to XML.

 

hkxcmd convert skeleton_female.hkx skeleton_female.xml

 

7. I modify the skeleton_female.xml with the following changes, making sure I keep the order the same:

 

(IN PROGRESS)

;;; Since we're adding the pussy bone the bone count goes up

;;; BONE COUNT GOES FROM 232 to 233

 

<hkparam name="parentIndices" numelements="233">

    -1 0 0 0 0 4 5 6 7 5 9 10 5 12 13 5

    15 16 5 18 19 5 21 22 4 24 25 26 27 28 26 30

    31 0 0 26 35 36 29 32 38 39 38 39 27 30 24 38

    39 36 8 11 29 29 28 54 32 32 31 58 26 5 26 26

    5 5 5 38 67 68 38 70 71 38 73 74 38 76 77 38

    79 80 39 82 83 39 85 86 39 88 89 39 91 92 39 94

    95 -1 0 36 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110

    111 112 113 114 99 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126

    127 128 129 130 99 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142

    143 144 145 146 99 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 99 157 158

    159 160 161 162 163 164 26 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174

    175 176 26 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 -1 190

    191 -1 193 194 5 196 197 196 199 26 201 202 203 204 26 206 207

    208 209 26 211 212 213 214 215 216 214 218 214 220 26 222 223

    224 225 226 227 225 229 225 231

</hkparam>

 

;;; SINCE WE ADDED A BONE AT position 196 ... Any bone after 196, that parents to a bone above 196 should have their number incremented by one.  The above numbers in orange represent going up by a value of 1 to accommodate the bone we added.

 

;;; Where 5 means Pussy bone should link to bone NPC Pelvis Bone (Since NPC Pelvis bone is represented in the list in position 5)

;;; Where 196 means NPC L Pussy 01 bone should link to Pussy Bone

;;; Where 197 means NPC L Pussy 02 bone should link to NPC L Pussy 01

;;; Where 196 means NPC R Pussy 01 should link to Pussy Bone

;;; Where 199 means NPC R Pussy 02 should link to NPC R Pussy 01

 

==================

Reference Only - not to be added to XML file

This simply shows that each bone goes in order from 0 to 232 (total 233)

 

NPC Root [Root] (0)

x_NPC LookNode [Look] (1)

x_NPC Translate [Pos ] (2)

x_NPC Rotate [Rot ] (3)

NPC COM [COM ] (4)

NPC Pelvis [Pelv] (5)

.....

 

....

NPC R Item03 (195)

Pussy (196)

NPC L Pussy 01 (197)

NPC L Pussy 02 (198)

NPC R Pussy 01 (199)

NPC R Pussy 02 (200)

Leftwing1 (201)

.....

===================

 

;;;; change count here as well from 232 to 233

<hkparam name="bones" numelements="233">

..............

<hkobject>

    <hkparam name="name">NPC R Item03</hkparam>

    <hkparam name="lockTranslation">false</hkparam>

</hkobject>

<hkobject>

    <hkparam name="name">Pussy</hkparam>

    <hkparam name="lockTranslation">false</hkparam>

</hkobject>

<hkobject>

    <hkparam name="name">NPC L Pussy01</hkparam>

    <hkparam name="lockTranslation">false</hkparam>

</hkobject>

<hkobject>

    <hkparam name="name">NPC L Pussy02</hkparam>

    <hkparam name="lockTranslation">false</hkparam>

</hkobject>

<hkobject>

    <hkparam name="name">NPC R Pussy01</hkparam>

    <hkparam name="lockTranslation">false</hkparam>

</hkobject>

<hkobject>

    <hkparam name="name">NPC R Pussy02</hkparam>

    <hkparam name="lockTranslation">false</hkparam>

</hkobject>

<hkobject>

    <hkparam name="name">LeftWing1</hkparam>

    <hkparam name="lockTranslation">false</hkparam>

</hkobject>

 

....................

 

<hkparam name="referencePose" numelements="233">

 

.................................

 

;;lines with ;; in front of it are comments only, just to help anyone who reads this. do not add lines to the xml

;;file that have ;; in front of them.

 

.....................

 

;; NPC R Item03

(0.015642 0.258839 4.250500)(-0.000000 0.000000 0.000000 1.000000)(1.000000 1.000000 1.000000)

;; Pussy (196) .. In 3d studio max if you pick the pussy bone and switch to parent, it should match these values

(0.000000 0.000000 0.000000)(0.000000 0.000000 0.000000 1.000000)(1.000000 1.000000 1.000000)

;; NPC L Pussy 01 (197)

(-2.000000 0.000000 -1.000031)(0.000000 0.000000 0.000000 1.000000)(1.000000 1.000000 1.000000)

;; NPC L Pussy 02 (198)

(-1.000000 -0.000001 -3.000000)(0.000000 0.000000 0.000000 1.000000)(1.000000 1.000000 1.000000)

;; NPC R Pussy 01 (199)

(2.000000 0.000000 -1.000031)(0.000000 0.000000 0.000000 1.000000)(1.000000 1.000000 1.000000)

;; NPC R Pussy 02 (200)

(1.000000 -0.000002 -3.000000)(0.000000 0.000000 0.000000 1.000000)(1.000000 1.000000 1.000000)

;; LeftWing1

(-5.797053 -8.605551 19.734535)(0.591567 -0.203952 -0.249089 0.739193)(1.000000 1.000000 1.000000)

.........................

 

;;;changed unmapped bones from 85 to 86 and added the pussy bone (196)

;;; since adding a pussy bone it bumps every bone after by one

;;;; so 197, 198, 199, 200 become the other four vagina bones

 

<hkparam name="unmappedBones" numelements="86">

    0 1 2 3 5 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22

    23 27 30 33 34 37 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49

    50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65

    66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81

    82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97

    98 196 197 198 199 200

</hkparam>

 

 

8. Now convert the skeleton_female.xml back to an hkx

 

hkxcmd convert skeleton_female.xml skeleton_female.hkx -v win32

 

9. Copy skeleton_female.hkx to the skyrim data folder:

 

Data\meshes\actors\character\character assets female

 

Conclusion

 

* NPC R Pussy 01 & NPC L Pussy 01 connect to the pussy bone.

* The pussy bone connects to the pelvis bone.

* When exporting a havok animation we include the pussy bone

* 1.6 skeleton rig has the pussy bone linked to the pelvis bone

 

Technically the 1.6 & 1.93a skeleton should now be the same bone wise in regard to the vagina bones.

[trepleen]

Before I continue with the above post, pornphile I'm curious.  Groovtama says the problem is probably rotation/scale/position issue. You mentioned this as well.

 

1.93a
NPC_COM
- World XYZ - 0,0, 68.911
- Scale 94

NPC Pelvis

- World XYZ - 0,0, 68.911

- Scale 99.0

 

1.6
NPC_COM
- World XYZ 0,-0.35, 68.911
- Scale 100

NPC Pelvis

- World XYZ 0,-0.35, 68.911

- Scale 100

 

 

If I make the 1.6 skeleton match the 1.93a in regards to rotation/scale/position do you think that is more likely to fix the problem?

 

Or

 

Do you think including that pussy bone is more likely to fix the problem?

[pornphile]

We're only using the 1.6 skeleton for animations so it shouldn't affect the game skeleton. The bone rotations of both skeletons should be matching. It's when you want to rig something does the scaling become a factor. I don't think you'll need to change the 1.6 scales. Not sure what difference the in/exclusion of the pussy bone will have, but you probably need it if your game skeleton has it.

[trepleen]

Out of curiousity I tried:

 

XPMS 1-93a NMM-BAIN INSTALLER

http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/download/1000094461

 

The vagina model animates properly using 1.93a, but for some reason does not work with groovtama's 1.93 ......

 

All I need to do is just find out what the difference is between:

 

XPMS 1-93a NMM-BAIN INSTALLER

 

and

 

XP32 Maximum Skeleton Extended 1.93 Legacy Edition.7z

 

[pornphile]

So you were successful getting a working animation exporting with the modified skeleton?

[trepleen]

So you were successful getting a working animation exporting with the modified skeleton?

 

We didn't even need to do that.

 

I solved the problem by installing groovtama's 1.93a legacy edition, but then using xp32's 1.93a skeleton_female.hkx file.

 

The only difference between the two hkx files is 10 breast & butt nodes that have been removed. I'm hoping groov still has the nif files with these nodes still intact. I could use them in my animations.

 

Your skeleton controller rig is fine just the way it is.  That pussy bone is not causing a problem just like groovtama said.

[pornphile]

Your original setup with 1.6 + 1.9 was fine and it was just the skeleton_female.hkx that was the issue?

 

Was the source of the mesh stretching the difference of +/- 10 nodes between the 2 hkx?

[trepleen]

Your original setup with 1.6 + 1.9 was fine and it was just the skeleton_female.hkx that was the issue?

 

Was the source of the mesh stretching the difference of +/- 10 nodes between the 2 hkx?

 

No, not even that.  It's an issue with skeleton_female.hkx

 

Bone order seems to be the most important factor.

 

Xp32 1.93 skeleton_female.hkx = 242 bones

XPMS RIG 1.6c Full Bone.txt = 242 bones

Groovtama's 1.93 skeleton_female.hkx = 232 bones

 

Groovtama removed the following nodes:

 

NPC L PreBreast

NPC L Breast

NPC R PreBreast

NPC R Breast

NPC L PreButt

NPC R PreButt

NPC L Butt

NPC R Butt

NPC L Breast01

NPC R Breast01

 

By removing the above bones, every bone that comes after now have their bone order permanently changed.

 

Your 1.6 skeleton controller rig uses xp32s: XPMS RIG 1.6c Full Bone.txt

 

XPMS RIG 1.6c Full Bone.txt = 242 bones

 

Animations exported using XPMS RIG 1.6c Full Bone.txt create incompatibilities with groovtama's skeleton_female.hkx in regards to any bone that came after the removal of the above 10 bones.

 

In order to export an animation that is compatible with groovtama's 1.93a skeleton_female.hkx in regards to bones after the removal of the above 10 nodes, I had to do the following:

 

I removed the following nodes from XPMS RIG 1.6c Full Bone.txt:

 

NPC L PreBreast

NPC L Breast

NPC R PreBreast

NPC R Breast

NPC L PreButt

NPC R PreButt

NPC L Butt

NPC R Butt

NPC L Breast01

NPC R Breast01

 

Then I saved it as XPMS Rig 1.6c Full Bone (232 bones).txt - This matches the bone data in groovetama's 1.93a skeleton_female.hkx - Now the vagina animation works properly with groovtama's 1.93a

 

HOWEVER, the problem now is FNIS sexy move animations cause the vagina model to break.  This is easily explained however. FNIS sexy moves exported their animations with the 242 bone list.

 

Groovtama's 1.93a skeleton_female.hkx bone order changes after the removal of these bones:

 

NPC L PreBreast

NPC L Breast

NPC R PreBreast

NPC R Breast

NPC L PreButt

NPC R PreButt

NPC L Butt

NPC R Butt

NPC L Breast01

NPC R Breast01

 

NPC L Pussy 01, NPC R Pussy 01 come after the bone change, hence their order is different which causes the glitch.

 

Long story short?  XP32's skeleton_female.hkx has the most compatible bone count of 242 which is the exact same as the XPMS RIG 1.6c Full Bone.txt as part of your rig package. 

 

But still, groovtama's 1.93a skeleton_female.hkx adds the vagina nodes to unmappedbones which ensures they don't mess up on ragdoll. 

 

Instead of modifying groovtama's skeleton_female.hkx to suit my needs. I'm going to focus on making his 2.06 skeleton compatible with what I need.

[pornphile]

I understand. Good reference material. Thank you.

[trepleen]

I understand. Good reference material. Thank you.

 

The least I can do since you provide such an excellent skeleton controller rig

[trepleen]

Heya, I just thought I'd bring this up. Blabba brings up a good point here. I'm wondering if it's an issue with the skeleton you are using.

 

by Blabba

- DO NOT USE XPMS SKELETONS BEFORE 2.0 TO ANIMATE YOUR SCALES WILL GET FUCKED UP!

  (Using Vanilla is also a good option as it doesn't contain any polluted hierarchy and you can find a bunch of resources for it)

 

by Trepleen

The skeleton controller rig uses a 1.6 skeleton ... I'm going to ask pornphiles about the scales, thanks for bringing this up.

 

 

[pornphile]

I've made a post about it:

http://www.loverslab.com/topic/34798-fixing-skeleton-deformations-crushedtorpedo-breasts-etc/page-4?do=findComment&comment=943484

[trepleen]

I'm going to update the 1.6 skeleton bone/rotation/scale to that of 2.0+ while also checking the vanilla skeleton_female as well.  I have two questions.

 

1. I don't want to break the controller rig in anyway, are there any dos or donts I should watch when changing rotation/scale etc?

 

2. The NPC com object is off by -.35 ... for some reason I cannot edit the NPC com bone, is there a way to do that safely without breaking the controller rig?

 

3. If you don't mind I'd like to post the data here and I'll hide it in spoiler tags. I'm going to start with the first default 98 bones to make sure 1.6 matches vanilla.

 

4. For some reason no matter where I right click, I can't seem to access CopyPasteTransforms.

[pornphile]

You'd have to delete the position constraints, then go into bone tools and untick Bone On. This lets you move the COM bone around. Then constrain it back to the controller. I can't guarantee results. You're free to do what you want with the rig.

 

 

CopyPasteTransform:

http://www.scriptspot.com/3ds-max/scripts/copy-paste-transforms