SYSTEM crashes, not just CTDs. How to document or diagnose?

[traison]

6 hours ago, asdt123123 said:

What I do is just buy a new PSU/etc, test if it works, return it if I don't need it.

 

In some countries the laws do not require stores to do this. Where I live, an open package can't be returned, it's considered finalizing the transaction.

[VenomousOuroboros]

Something occurred to me this morning.

Bearing in mind that I know jack shit about electricity, I still want to pose this idea:

My PSU - the Thermaltake Toughpower GF3 - takes an input current of 20-16A.

I live in the US, so all wall outlets are either 15 or 20A.

However... my UPS (which powers my PC, monitor, etc.) has an output current of only 12A.

Could this, then, cause the computer to shut down when running high-demand processes (Cyberpunk w/ path tracing and DLSS; Skyrim with a full Community Shaders suite)?

 

EDIT: Might as well go for full disclosure.  Here's a link to the specs: APC Back-UPS 1375

810W vs. 1650W might be a big problem too, huh?

Edited December 30, 2025 by VenomousOuroboros
Added details of UPS

[traison]

3 hours ago, VenomousOuroboros said:

...takes an input current of 20-16A...

 

1600W / ~16A = ~100V. I'm guessing the US stil uses 120V lines.

 

3 hours ago, VenomousOuroboros said:

I live in the US, so all wall outlets are either 15 or 20A.

 

x120V = 1800W or 2400W

 

3 hours ago, VenomousOuroboros said:

...my UPS (which powers my PC, monitor, etc.) has an output current of only 12A.

Could this, then, cause the computer to shut down...

 

12x120 = 1440W, so eventually yes by exploding the fuse on either end. You'll know when this happens, as you'll either have to pull a breaker to reset it, or replace the fuse if it's old-fashioned.

 

I however bet your maximum power usage is in the 800W range going full-tilt. You're far away from making the neighbourhood lights dim. I wouldn't worry about that. Don't add another GPU though. Also consider what else you have connected to that UPS - monitors? lights? printer?

 

Edit: It wouldn't hurt to bypass the UPS as a test. Power stability issues could be coming from the UPS. Could also attach a desk lamp to the UPS if bypassing is too much work. If light goes dark with the machine -> UPS. Lamp might only blink though, so not sure how reliable that is in all cases.

 

Edit again: UPS specs state 810W. That's too close.

Edited December 30, 2025 by traison

[VenomousOuroboros]

3 hours ago, traison said:

UPS specs state 810W. That's too close.

 

So we've found a likely culprit?  Because yeah, my monitor and a VR headset (which is usually not running, as one would expect) are also connected to that UPS.

 

Looks like I'm gonna go shopping for a robust surge protector.

Edited December 30, 2025 by VenomousOuroboros

[traison]

16 minutes ago, VenomousOuroboros said:

So we've found a likely culprit?  ... Looks like I'm gonna go shopping for a robust surge protector.

 

Why not plug the computer straight into the wall first and do a test? Seems silly to blow $1000 on a UPS before doing a 10 minute test to make sure.

[VenomousOuroboros]

Oh, of course.  I'm far from interested in spending the money on a new UPS.  I just want to have basic surge protection because the power grid in my area is known for its instability; I just don't want some random voltage spike causing any damage.

[traison]

45 minutes ago, VenomousOuroboros said:

Oh, of course.  I'm far from interested in spending the money on a new UPS.  I just want to have basic surge protection because the power grid in my area is known for its instability; I just don't want some random voltage spike causing any damage.

 

Not an expert here (obviously) but my understanding is that surge protection won't do anything about black- or brown-outs. Surge protection is more about having some percentage chance of stopping something like a lightning bolt. It's a fuse in a fancy box basically. As far as I know, UPS is the only thing that will ensure smooth power delivery - and by smooth I mean spot-on voltage and current delivery.

Edited December 30, 2025 by traison

[PippinTom]

1 hour ago, traison said:

As far as I know, UPS is the only thing that will ensure smooth power delivery - and by smooth I mean spot-on voltage and current delivery.

 

Good UPS if far more that just temporal juice provider during blackout, and I'm not an expert either.

[belegost]

On 12/26/2025 at 9:46 PM, traison said:

 

In some countries the laws do not require stores to do this. Where I live, an open package can't be returned, it's considered finalizing the transaction.

Where I live you have 14 days return policy with no questions asked if the item was bought online. Full money return, including shipping and any costs of returning the package have to be covered by the vendor as well. 

Plus a regular 2 year warranty (minimum).

[traison]

18 minutes ago, belegost said:

Where I live you have 14 days return policy...

 

Same here. But getting stores to honor it is another thing entirely.

 

Steam does something similar: 14 day refund period which is revoked immediately when the product is activated, i.e. if you click next-next-next in the post-purchase wizard. Steam apparently allows one refund per customer, no questions asked. Getting a 2nd refund might not be possible.

 

I get why they do it, but it's still a broken system. The problem is elsewhere.

 

Edit: I guess Steam allows a game to be played for one hour or so until refund right is revoked. Still, 1 hour < 14 days. Should be illegal.

Edited December 31, 2025 by traison

[belegost]

9 minutes ago, traison said:

But getting stores to honor it is another thing entirely.

Woe to any vendor that tries to not honor it. In fact you don't even have to fuck around with anything. You just send the item back and notify them. They are obliged to return the money within 7 days of receiving the package. No ifs ands or buts.

Edited December 31, 2025 by belegost

[belegost]

6 hours ago, traison said:

Steam does something similar: 14 day refund period which is revoked immediately when the product is activated, i.e. if you click next-next-next in the post-purchase wizard. Steam apparently allows one refund per customer, no questions asked. Getting a 2nd refund might not be possible.

 

I get why they do it, but it's still a broken system. The problem is elsewhere.

 

Edit: I guess Steam allows a game to be played for one hour or so until refund right is revoked. Still, 1 hour < 14 days. Should be illegal.

Edited 6 hours ago by traison

 

The playtime is 2 hours. 14 days if you played less than that. Which is still better than GOG. GOG will not honor refunds if you downloaded the product, no matter the playtime. I guess this is because of their non-DRM stuff. 

 

I have never had issues with refunds on Steam, provided I was under the alloted playtime. With GOG... that's a different matter. 

Edited December 31, 2025 by belegost

[VenomousOuroboros]

Well... shit.  Unfortunate update:
I got an 1800W-output surge protector, ran Skyrim this morning, had a heart full of optimism, and crashed the system during one of the instances of saving the game (regular save, not quicksave).

The Windows Event Log was exactly the same as before: Critical Event, Kernel-Power, etc. etc.

 

I'll be very honest: I'm trying to exhaust any other possibility before playing with the hardware.

Is there any chance that an excessive modlist* could be responsible for this?

What I mean by "excessive" is:

• Full combat system overhaul (Attack MCO-DXP, Dodge MCO-DXP, Smooth Moveset OAR, For Honor in Skyrim, Precision, Dynamic Collision Adjustment, Valhalla, Core Impact Framework...)
• Community Shaders suite (Skylighting, Inverse Square Lighting, Screen Space Shadows, Wetness Effects...)
• A complex Sexlab and Adult Modding setup (BaneMaster's Defeat, SLSO Reloaded, AND, BimbosOfSkyrim, YPS Fashion Lite,  Love Sickness, CumSwallowNeedsAddon, FHU...)
• Several other mods that run scripts at frequent intervals (Winterweight, Fertility Mode, Enhanced Soultrap, Modesty Detection...)

I mean, if I'm just asking way too damn much of the game engine and extensions off of it, could it crash a whole PC rather than just CTD?

[traison]

29 minutes ago, VenomousOuroboros said:

Is there any chance that an excessive modlist* could be responsible for this?

 

Nothing in ring 3 can cause a crash in ring 0. If you have something in ring 3 that's sending commands to ring 0 then... sure... I guess; but turning the system off abruptly sounds more like an old-school malicious virus than badly made DRM or anti-virus. Very very unlikely.

Edited January 7 by traison

[VenomousOuroboros]

As a test measure, I'm updating to the latest SSE Engine Fixes (from v5.9.1 to v7.0.19) and running BethINI Pie to optimize.  I'm under the impression that the Engine Fixes won't really resolve this situation, but are a damn good idea anyway, and BethINI might help, though that's also still a stretch.  Is that pretty close to the truth?

 

I'll report back as I see what happens.

 

EDIT:

If I had WinDbg analyze the crash dump from this event, would that report be valuable to you?

Edited January 7 by VenomousOuroboros

[traison]

1 hour ago, VenomousOuroboros said:

As a test measure, I'm updating to the latest SSE Engine Fixes (from v5.9.1 to v7.0.19) and running BethINI Pie to optimize.  I'm under the impression that the Engine Fixes won't really resolve this situation, but are a damn good idea anyway, and BethINI might help, though that's also still a stretch.

 

Unfortunately my opinion is that nothing you do in ring 3 will fix your issue. You can hide it yes. I could say you should only play WinDigger for now on and your $4500 system will work perfectly fine. But that's not really a solution is it?

 

1 hour ago, VenomousOuroboros said:

If I had WinDbg analyze the crash dump from this event, would that report be valuable to you?

 

Sure:

!analyze -v

 

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/drivers/debuggercmds/-analyze

 

Edit: If you have a minidump from a shutdown, then you're dealing with a BSOD. Power failures won't dump memory - there is no powered memory to dump, to name just one of the major issues in this scenario.

Edited January 7 by traison

[VenomousOuroboros]

Well, it definitely had something to say with these 200+ lines.

I'm just hoping for a better narrowing-down of suspects.  Ten times out of ten, the problem is some ignorant mistake that I made rather than a faulty manufactured component.  This could be that exceptional "eleventh" case, but the odds suggest otherwise.

 

Spoiler

0:042> !analyze -v
................................................................
................................................................
................
Loading unloaded module list
.
*******************************************************************************
*                                                                             *
*                        Exception Analysis                                   *
*                                                                             *
*******************************************************************************


KEY_VALUES_STRING: 1

    Key  : Analysis.CPU.mSec
    Value: 3812

    Key  : Analysis.Elapsed.mSec
    Value: 7432

    Key  : Analysis.IO.Other.Mb
    Value: 12

    Key  : Analysis.IO.Read.Mb
    Value: 3

    Key  : Analysis.IO.Write.Mb
    Value: 568

    Key  : Analysis.Init.CPU.mSec
    Value: 4656

    Key  : Analysis.Init.Elapsed.mSec
    Value: 62132

    Key  : Analysis.Memory.CommitPeak.Mb
    Value: 601

    Key  : Analysis.Version.DbgEng
    Value: 10.0.29482.1003

    Key  : Analysis.Version.Description
    Value: 10.2509.29.03 amd64fre

    Key  : Analysis.Version.Ext
    Value: 1.2509.29.3

    Key  : Failure.Bucket
    Value: E_FAIL_80004005_edgehtml.dll!Abandonment::InduceAbandonment

    Key  : Failure.Exception.Code
    Value: 0x80004005

    Key  : Failure.Exception.IP.Address
    Value: 0x7ffbb94ea36b

    Key  : Failure.Exception.IP.Module
    Value: edgehtml

    Key  : Failure.Exception.IP.Offset
    Value: 0x5a36b

    Key  : Failure.Hash
    Value: {0dd7f4fe-70da-728a-8068-b6ba263ad0ec}

    Key  : Failure.ProblemClass.Primary
    Value: E_FAIL

    Key  : Faulting.IP.Type
    Value: Paged

    Key  : Timeline.OS.Boot.DeltaSec
    Value: 42

    Key  : Timeline.Process.Start.DeltaSec
    Value: 3

    Key  : WER.OS.Branch
    Value: ge_release

    Key  : WER.OS.Version
    Value: 10.0.26100.1

    Key  : WER.Process.Version
    Value: 2125.30001.10.0


FILE_IN_CAB:  TextInputHost.exe.17096.dmp

NTGLOBALFLAG:  0

APPLICATION_VERIFIER_FLAGS:  0

CONTEXT:  (.ecxr)
rax=0000004b2014bf50 rbx=0000004b2014c490 rcx=0000004b2014bf50
rdx=0000004b2014c400 rsi=0000000000070386 rdi=0000004b2014bf50
rip=00007ffc244df298 rsp=0000004b2014be70 rbp=0000004b2014bf70
 r8=0000000000000000  r9=0000004b2014c3c0 r10=0000000000000000
r11=0000000000000800 r12=0000000000000001 r13=00000171d7b8d190
r14=0000000000000001 r15=0000000000000000
iopl=0         nv up ei pl nz na po nc
cs=0033  ss=002b  ds=002b  es=002b  fs=0053  gs=002b             efl=00000204
KERNELBASE!RaiseFailFastException+0x188:
00007ffc`244df298 0f1f440000      nop     dword ptr [rax+rax]
Resetting default scope

EXCEPTION_RECORD:  (.exr -1)
ExceptionAddress: 00007ffbb94ea36b (edgehtml!Abandonment::CheckHRESULT+0x0000000000000013)
   ExceptionCode: 80004005
  ExceptionFlags: 00000001
NumberParameters: 0

PROCESS_NAME:  TextInputHost.exe

ERROR_CODE: (NTSTATUS) 0x80004005 - Unspecified error

EXCEPTION_CODE_STR:  80004005

STACK_TEXT:  
0000004b`2014be70 00007ffb`b9b9b31e     : 00007ffb`b94ea36b 00000000`00070386 00007ffb`b94ea36b 00000000`00000008 : KERNELBASE!RaiseFailFastException+0x188
0000004b`2014c450 00007ffb`b9b9b672     : 0000d2b1`284458f8 d3c9168c`d3cb9f8c 00000000`00000000 00007ffb`b96677fc : edgehtml!Abandonment::InduceAbandonment+0xea
0000004b`2014c550 00007ffb`b94ea36b     : 00000171`d715ef40 00000171`d715ede0 0000004b`2014c790 00000171`d7b8d140 : edgehtml!Abandonment::InduceHRESULTAbandonment+0x26
0000004b`2014c580 00007ffb`b9bb5e42     : 00000171`d78fc2f0 0000004b`2014c6b9 00000000`00070386 00000000`00000001 : edgehtml!Abandonment::CheckHRESULT+0x13
0000004b`2014c5b0 00007ffb`b9937009     : 00007ffb`b9b084c0 00000171`d7b8d1b0 00007ffb`b9b084c0 00000171`d7b8d1b0 : edgehtml!CCoreWebViewTaskHandler::_OleActivateWebPlatform+0xc2
0000004b`2014c600 00007ffb`b9a855cb     : 00000171`d7914b60 00007ffb`df6823b8 00000171`d791e2c0 0000004b`2014c960 : edgehtml!CCoreWebViewTaskHandler::Initialize+0x3e9
0000004b`2014c700 00007ffb`df5e2909     : 00000000`00000870 00000000`00000f00 00000000`00000000 0000004b`2014cf70 : edgehtml!CCoreWebView::Initialize+0x14b
0000004b`2014c880 00007ffb`df5e197e     : 0000004b`2014cf70 0000004b`2014cf70 00000171`d78f1cf8 00007ffc`2441f4a2 : EdgeManager!WebViewManager::CreateCoreWebViewPrivate+0xbf9
0000004b`2014cda0 00007ffb`f2620b01     : 00000171`00000001 00000171`d7b03530 00000171`d78c7600 00000000`00000000 : EdgeManager!CCoreWebViewControl::Initialize+0x1fe
0000004b`2014ce30 00007ffb`f295f620     : 00000171`d7b03530 00000171`d7721b60 00000000`00070082 00000171`d7b03530 : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::CoreWebViewHost::CreateComponent+0x8c5
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::WebView::CreateComponent+0x1c
0000004b`2014d0a0 00007ffb`f295f48c     : 00000171`d7b03530 00000171`d7945a20 0000004b`2014d1f8 00000171`d7b03530 : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::WebView::CreateComponent+0xb0
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!CFxCallbacks::WebView_CreateComponent+0x10
0000004b`2014d100 00007ffb`f29944b5     : 00000000`00000000 00000000`00000000 00000171`d7945a20 0000004b`2014d2c0 : Windows_UI_Xaml!CWebView::CreateComponent+0x5c
0000004b`2014d130 00007ffb`f2972a31     : 00000171`d7b03530 0000004b`2014d2c0 0000004b`2014d298 00000000`00000001 : Windows_UI_Xaml!CComponentHost::EnsureComponentCreated+0x2d
0000004b`2014d160 00007ffb`f2464c46     : 00000171`d7b03530 00000000`00000000 00000171`d7721b60 00007ffb`f24679e6 : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::WebView::OnPropertyChanged2+0x71
0000004b`2014d190 00007ffb`f2467449     : 00000171`d7b03530 00000000`00000000 00000000`00000000 00000000`00000000 : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::DependencyObject::NotifyPropertyChanged+0x5a
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::DependencyObject::NotifyPropertyChanged+0x86
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!CFxCallbacks::DependencyObject_NotifyPropertyChanged+0x86
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!CDependencyObject::NotifyPropertyChanged+0x86
0000004b`2014d240 00007ffb`f24a15f2     : 00000000`00000000 00000000`00000096 00000000`00000000 00000000`00000000 : Windows_UI_Xaml!CDependencyObject::SetEffectiveValue+0x1f89
0000004b`2014d3b0 00007ffb`f24a0982     : 00000000`00280000 00000171`d7b03000 00000000`00000000 00007ffb`f25418c5 : Windows_UI_Xaml!CDependencyObject::UpdateEffectiveValue+0x232
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!CDependencyObject::SetValue+0x194
0000004b`2014d590 00007ffb`f249eeac     : 00000171`00000000 00000171`d79d8100 01600020`00000000 00000171`d7726000 : Windows_UI_Xaml!CUIElement::SetValue+0x272
0000004b`2014d6c0 00007ffb`f297d6df     : 00000000`00000000 00007ffb`f231415c 00000000`00000323 00000000`00000000 : Windows_UI_Xaml!CFrameworkElement::SetValue+0xac
0000004b`2014d810 00007ffb`f233e9cd     : 00000000`00000323 00000000`00000000 00000000`0000069e 00000171`00000001 : Windows_UI_Xaml!CWebView::SetValue+0x1f
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!DependencyObject_SetValue+0x2b
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::DependencyObject::SetValueCore+0x1a3
0000004b`2014d850 00007ffb`f2d8e6cf     : 00000000`00000000 00000000`00000000 0000004b`2014da01 00000171`d7741a01 : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::DependencyObject::SetValueCore+0x1bd
0000004b`2014d8e0 00007ffb`f2b39e51     : 00000000`00000000 00000000`00000000 00000171`d78ddcf0 00007ffb`e0c2f44f : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::DependencyObject::SetValueByKnownIndex<enum Windows::UI::Xaml::Controls::WebViewExecutionMode>+0x67
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::WebViewGenerated::put_ExecutionMode+0xd
0000004b`2014d940 00007ffb`f2d8fdec     : 00000171`d7b03530 00000000`00000000 00000000`00000001 00000171`d7741a01 : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::WebViewFactory::CreateInstanceWithSettingsImpl+0x71
0000004b`2014d970 00007ffb`e0c2f36a     : 0000004b`2014da68 00000000`00000000 00000171`d7741a48 00000000`00000001 : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::WebViewFactory::CreateInstanceWithSettings+0x8c
0000004b`2014d9b0 00007ffb`e0c2f29b     : 00000000`00000000 0000004b`2014da68 00000171`d767c050 00000171`d767c230 : windowsudk_shellcommon!winrt::impl::consume_Windows_UI_Xaml_Controls_IWebViewFactoryInternal<winrt::Windows::UI::Xaml::Controls::IWebViewFactoryInternal>::CreateInstanceWithSettings+0x4e
0000004b`2014da10 00007ffb`d09f3a24     : 00000171`d78ddcf0 00000171`00000000 00007ffb`d0a76c9e 00000023`00000011 : windowsudk_shellcommon!winrt::impl::produce<winrt::WindowsUdk::UI::Xaml::Controls::factory_implementation::WebView,winrt::WindowsUdk::UI::Xaml::Controls::IWebViewStatics>::Create+0x4b
0000004b`2014da50 00007ffb`d0a3c584     : 00007ffb`d0bc44ac 00000002`00000058 0000004b`2014dac8 00007ffb`d0a76c9e : WindowsInternal_ComposableShell_Experiences_SuggestionUIUndocked!Windows::Web::Http::IHttpRequestMessageFactory::Create+0x34
0000004b`2014dab0 00007ffb`d0a76fa5     : 00007ffb`d0a76c9e 00007ffb`d0c2dc20 00007ffb`d0a76c9e 00000171`d7741a48 : WindowsInternal_ComposableShell_Experiences_SuggestionUIUndocked!WindowsUdk::UI::Xaml::Controls::WebView::Create+0x70
0000004b`2014db10 00007ffb`d0a76c9e     : 00000171`00003ce4 00000171`d767c050 00000171`d7741a48 00000171`d767c050 : WindowsInternal_ComposableShell_Experiences_SuggestionUIUndocked!WindowsInternal::ComposableShell::Experiences::SuggestionUIUndocked::SuggestionUIContainer::[WindowsInternal::ComposableShell::Experiences::SuggestionUIUndocked::__ISuggestionUIContainerPublicNonVirtuals]::EnsureWebUIInitialized+0xb5
0000004b`2014dba0 00007ffb`d0b1b5a2     : 00000171`d7b0f0e0 00000000`00000000 00000171`d7741a48 00000171`d767c050 : WindowsInternal_ComposableShell_Experiences_SuggestionUIUndocked!WindowsInternal::ComposableShell::Experiences::SuggestionUIUndocked::SuggestionUIContainer::[WindowsInternal::ComposableShell::Experiences::SuggestionUIUndocked::__ISuggestionUIContainerPublicNonVirtuals]::EnsureInitialized+0x8e
0000004b`2014dd90 00007ffb`e2b68031     : 00000171`d7b61598 00000171`d7b61570 00000171`d79bc590 0000004b`2014de70 : WindowsInternal_ComposableShell_Experiences_SuggestionUIUndocked!WindowsInternal::ComposableShell::Experiences::SuggestionUIUndocked::SuggestionUIContainer::[WindowsInternal::ComposableShell::Experiences::SuggestionUIUndocked::__ISuggestionUIContainerPublicNonVirtuals]::__abi_WindowsInternal_ComposableShell_Experiences_SuggestionUIUndocked___ISuggestionUIContainerPublicNonVirtuals____abi_EnsureInitialized+0x22
0000004b`2014ddc0 00007ffb`e2bb2f9b     : 00000171`d7b61570 00000171`d7b61570 00000171`d7741a48 00000171`d7741a48 : InputApp!WindowsInternal::ComposableShell::Experiences::SuggestionUIUndocked::__ISuggestionUIContainerPublicNonVirtuals::EnsureInitialized+0x11
0000004b`2014ddf0 00007ffb`e2bab4c1     : 00000171`d76ab430 00000171`d77417f0 00000171`d787b318 00000171`d77417f0 : InputApp!WindowsInternal::ComposableShell::Experiences::TextInputUndocked::InputApp::ExpressiveSuggestionUIPage::OnExpressiveSuggestionUIPageLoaded+0x4eb
0000004b`2014e010 00007ffb`e2ba04c8     : 00000171`d77417f0 00000000`00000000 0000004b`2014e0e8 00000171`d77417f0 : InputApp!`Windows::Foundation::TypedEventHandler<WindowsInternal::ComposableShell::Experiences::SuggestionUIUndocked::ISuggestionUIContainerViewModel ^ __ptr64,Platform::Object ^ __ptr64>::TypedEventHandler<WindowsInternal::ComposableShell::Experiences::SuggestionUIUndocked::ISuggestionUIContainerViewModel ^ __ptr64,Platform::Object ^ __ptr64><WindowsInternal::ComposableShell::Experiences::TextInputUndocked::InputApp::ExpressiveSuggestionUIPage,void (__cdecl WindowsInternal::ComposableShell::Experiences::TextInputUndocked::InputApp::ExpressiveSuggestionUIPage::*)(WindowsInternal::ComposableShell::Experiences::SuggestionUIUndocked::ISuggestionUIContainerViewModel ^ __ptr64,Platform::Object ^ __ptr64) __ptr64>'::`2'::__abi_PointerToMemberWeakRefCapture::Invoke+0xc1
0000004b`2014e060 00007ffb`f2650e4a     : 00000000`00000000 00000171`d79ddf60 0000004b`2014e0e8 00000000`00000000 : InputApp!Windows::UI::Xaml::RoutedEventHandler::[Windows::UI::Xaml::RoutedEventHandler::__abi_IDelegate]::__abi_Windows_UI_Xaml_RoutedEventHandler___abi_IDelegate____abi_Invoke+0x28
0000004b`2014e090 00007ffb`f2650b12     : 00000171`00000000 00000171`d77417f0 00000171`d79bc590 00000171`d79bc590 : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::CRoutedEventSourceBase<DirectUI::IUntypedEventSource,Windows::UI::Xaml::IRoutedEventHandler,IInspectable,Windows::UI::Xaml::IRoutedEventArgs>::Raise+0x2ca
0000004b`2014e130 00007ffb`f257e6f7     : 00000171`cb11ba80 00000171`d77417f0 00000000`00000036 00000171`d79bc590 : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::CRoutedEventSourceBase<DirectUI::IUntypedEventSource,Windows::UI::Xaml::IRoutedEventHandler,IInspectable,Windows::UI::Xaml::IRoutedEventArgs>::UntypedRaise+0x82
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::DependencyObject::FireEvent+0x8a
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!DirectUI::DXamlCore::FireEvent+0x33a
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!AgCoreCallbacks::FireEvent+0x361
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!CFxCallbacks::JoltHelper_FireEvent+0x361
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!CCoreServices::CLR_FireEvent+0x4a0
0000004b`2014e160 00007ffb`f26fa8b9     : 00000171`00000004 00000171`d77b8250 00000000`00000036 00007ffb`f31b6200 : Windows_UI_Xaml!CommonBrowserHost::CLR_FireEvent+0x4c7
0000004b`2014e210 00007ffb`f2448f56     : 00000171`00000001 00000000`00000036 0000004b`2014e329 00000171`d7180020 : Windows_UI_Xaml!CControlBase::ScriptCallback+0x149
0000004b`2014e290 00007ffb`f2352668     : 00000171`d75e40b0 00007ffb`00000128 00000082`001f0155 00000171`d79ddd60 : Windows_UI_Xaml!CXcpDispatcher::OnScriptCallback+0x206
0000004b`2014e390 00007ffb`f235094e     : 00000171`d75e4100 00000000`00000002 00000000`00000416 00000000`00000000 : Windows_UI_Xaml!CXcpDispatcher::OnWindowMessage+0x720
(Inline Function) --------`--------     : --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- --------`-------- : Windows_UI_Xaml!CXcpDispatcher::ProcessMessage+0x34

IP_IN_PAGED_CODE: 
edgehtml!Abandonment::CheckHRESULT+13
00007ffb`b94ea36b cc              int     3

SYMBOL_NAME:  edgehtml!Abandonment::InduceAbandonment+ea

MODULE_NAME: edgehtml

IMAGE_NAME:  edgehtml.dll

STACK_COMMAND: ~42s; .ecxr ; kb

FAILURE_BUCKET_ID:  E_FAIL_80004005_edgehtml.dll!Abandonment::InduceAbandonment

OS_VERSION:  10.0.26100.1

BUILDLAB_STR:  ge_release

OSPLATFORM_TYPE:  x64

OSNAME:  Windows 10

IMAGE_VERSION:  11.0.26100.7309

FAILURE_ID_HASH:  {0dd7f4fe-70da-728a-8068-b6ba263ad0ec}

Followup:     MachineOwner
---------

 

 

Extra update:

I had a reliable point-of-failure in Cyberpunk 2077 that I mentioned before.  I just tried to recreate the system crash, and I passed the point of failure without any problems.  At least switching to the surge protector yielded some benefit.

Edited January 7 by VenomousOuroboros
Spoiler-tagged the report; SECOND EDIT: Tried to replicate

[traison]

That's a minidump from Edge crashing:

IMAGE_NAME:  edgehtml.dll

 

[VenomousOuroboros]

I'm going to try running Skyrim and having nvidia log all stats (temp, VRAM usage, etc.).  Supposing that I run into another system crash, what sorts of behaviors might you look for (aside from temperatures running out of control)?

[traison]

11 minutes ago, VenomousOuroboros said:

... what sorts of behaviors might you look for?

 

I mentioned this earlier in this thread: unstable voltages.

[VenomousOuroboros]

Okay.  I ran a 3m log earlier, just to see how it all worked.  The GPU voltage stayed between 0.965 and 1.050 the whole time, and the temperature peaked at 63C.

I'm still going to do another longer run, and hopefully if/when it crashes, the log will have saved something close to the point of crashing.

[traison]

I would log the 12v, 5v, 3.3v and Vcore rails with HWiNFO instead like I mentioned earlier. That GPU voltage can be anything, changing with power states.

Edited January 7 by traison

[VenomousOuroboros]

I ran it for almost an hour this morning, and actually didn't manage to replicate the system crash.  It did CTD, though, on one save attempt* (after many successful saves, too).  Like you said, Ring 3 issues and fixes tend to not have anything to do with Ring 0 issues, which suggests that even though I had updated the SSE Engine Fixes and ran BethINI, those two things shouldn't have made the difference.

...Anyway, that's all supposition.  I've attached the HWiNFO log, regardless.  Do you notice any odd fluctuations?

 

 

*I have always noticed that, once a single SLDefeat scenario has played-out, it's just a matter of time before the game CTDs; such was the case here.  That's another problem for another day, but it has always annoyed and confused me.

SkyrimSE_CrashTest_CSV.zip

[traison]

Made a quick Python script to get averages and min/max range. Here's the (to me) relevant bits, and the entire thing as an attachment. Search by colum names. I'm sure Excel/OpenOffice/LibreOffice can do this as well, but I'm faster doing it in code.

 

+12V [V] avg:12.02, range:11.98-12.05
+5V [V] avg:5.03, range:5.00-5.07
Vcore [V] avg:1.32, range:0.79-1.42
+3.3V [V] avg:3.33, range:3.30-3.36

 

These seem fine to me. Vcore I'm not sure of; that's probably device specific.

 

Edit: For comparison (probably meaningless) my Ryzen vcore fluctuates between 0.960 and 1.216. Quite significantly less than yours.

 

avg_min_max.txt

Edited January 8 by traison

[VenomousOuroboros]

I really appreciate it.  I guess this issue will be put on the shelf unless it recurs.  Like you said earlier, the Engine Fixes and INI adjustments probably just hid the issue.  Now I just have to dig around and find the cause of the CTD.

 

Progress is progress though, right?

Thanks again, seriously.