SexLab Hormones (January 2022)

[Balgin]

Was it only those two changes that made it in or were some of the other things you've been adding on Git Hub included as well?

[DeepBlueFrog]

3 minutes ago, Balgin said:

Was it only those two changes that made it in or were some of the other things you've been adding on Git Hub included as well?

 

Which 'other things'?

 

Did I miss changes in my list?

 

This is a release of whatever is in Github at this moment.

 

The new Bodymorphs support may or may not be working at this time. More testing need to be done.

[Balgin]

2 minutes ago, DeepBlueFrog said:

 

Which 'other things'?

 

Did I miss changes in my list?

 

This is a release of whatever is in Github at this moment.

 

The new Bodymorphs support may or may not be working at this time. More testing need to be done.

 

While I haven't taken down any of the files from Git Hub I did occasionally peek to see what might be coming. I think there were a few minor changes to the potions or alchemy recipes and placing a new item somewhere (and something to do with sleeping). I should look into how these advanced bodymorphs work. I might finally be able to see body changes working in locations other than the penis.

[DeepBlueFrog]

28 minutes ago, Balgin said:

 

While I haven't taken down any of the files from Git Hub I did occasionally peek to see what might be coming. I think there were a few minor changes to the potions or alchemy recipes and placing a new item somewhere (and something to do with sleeping). I should look into how these advanced bodymorphs work. I might finally be able to see body changes working in locations other than the penis.

 

Looking at my list of commits to Hormones, I missed these two items in my list:

 

- Changed the Hunger hormone to Fertility (internal change, nothing visible to players yet)

- Changed the Book of Giggles into a scroll and added scrolls for each curse (one in Windhelm, one in Cracked Tusk keep and one in Bolli's basement in Riften).

 

Edit: I added them to the issues list in Github and marked them as Done for the next release notes.

[Yoshiquest]

Hey DeepBlueFrog, I checked and it seems you're missing Hentai Pregnancy in your pregnancy checks. According to the page you can check by seeing if the actor is in "HentaiPregnantFaction" at rank 3 (1 is for cuminflation, 2 is cuminflated about to be pregnant).

Also, unless there's a reason I'm not seeing for it, I'd also recommend moving your pregnancy checks to a single "isPregnant" function, instead of calling the half dozen different checks in each place it's called (which to be fair aren't many places, but putting it all in a single function would make it easier to add additional pregnancy mods in the future).

 

BTW, is MME support planned (for the lactation hormone)? Or should I just take a shot at making a patch for it myself? I'm thinking you could probably make the lactation hormone add lactaid to the player when the mod updates based on its value.

[DeepBlueFrog]

1 minute ago, Yoshiquest said:

Hey DeepBlueFrog, I checked and it seems you're missing Hentai Pregnancy in your pregnancy checks. According to the page you can check by seeing if the actor is in "HentaiPregnantFaction" at rank 3 (1 is for cuminflation, 2 is cuminflated about to be pregnant).

Also, unless there's a reason I'm not seeing for it, I'd also recommend moving your pregnancy checks to a single "isPregnant" function, instead of calling the half dozen different checks in each place it's called (which to be fair aren't many places, but putting it all in a single function would make it easier to add additional pregnancy mods in the future).

 

I am planning on simplifying pregnancy detection and possibly integrating with Hentai pregnancy. I am not using that mod and I have to check which formID I should look for for that faction. That's something I will be working on this month hopefully.

 

1 minute ago, Yoshiquest said:

BTW, is MME support planned (for the lactation hormone)? Or should I just take a shot at making a patch for it myself? I'm thinking you could probably make the lactation hormone add lactaid to the player when the mod updates based on its value.

 

Same as above.. I am planning to add MME support for both Hormones and SexLab Stories where and how it makes sense.

In Hormones, that would be as you said, adding lactaid when the hormone is kicking in.

In Stories, that would be to make the cows at the farm Milk Maids themselves.

 

That too is something I have lined up to look into this month.

[Yoshiquest]

9 minutes ago, DeepBlueFrog said:

 

I am planning on simplifying pregnancy detection and possibly integrating with Hentai pregnancy. I am not using that mod and I have to check which formID I should look for for that faction. That's something I will be working on this month hopefully.

 

 

Same as above.. I am planning to add MME support for both Hormones and SexLab Stories where and how it makes sense.

In Hormones, that would be as you said, adding lactaid when the hormone is kicking in.

In Stories, that would be to make the cows at the farm Milk Maids themselves.

 

That too is something I have lined up to look into this month.

Cool! Thanks for the fast response.

I think I'll try my hand at converting some of the new versions. I'll post in the SE topic when I'm done.

[Wut1969]

My experience is that having multiple mods that control morphing usually don't work great together. If, say, hormones demands a certain breast or sos-size, and another mod wants to change that, it kinda makes sense that one of them is going to end up unhappy. 

I do hope you'll be find a way to make it work, but it seems quite the challenge.

 

Maybe it would be a good idea to put up a list somewhere of transformation mods that you consider to be (in)compatible with your mods?

 

On a sidenote; I should stop adding mods during a playthrough.

[DeepBlueFrog]

2 hours ago, Wut1969 said:

My experience is that having multiple mods that control morphing usually don't work great together. If, say, hormones demands a certain breast or sos-size, and another mod wants to change that, it kinda makes sense that one of them is going to end up unhappy. 

I do hope you'll be find a way to make it work, but it seems quite the challenge.

 

Maybe it would be a good idea to put up a list somewhere of transformation mods that you consider to be (in)compatible with your mods?

 

On a sidenote; I should stop adding mods during a playthrough.

 

There is one little advertised thing that helps a lot with conflicts between node changing mods - edit your Netimmerse ini file to Additive.

It is set to Multiplicative by default, which is an odd choice in my opinion. Additive is much more forgiving and easier to control.

 

I hope someone can share the name and path of the exact file to edit.. I am afraid I did that many years ago and I lost track of that information.

[w234aew]

2 hours ago, DeepBlueFrog said:

 

There is one little advertised thing that helps a lot with conflicts between node changing mods - edit your Netimmerse ini file to Additive.

It is set to Multiplicative by default, which is an odd choice in my opinion. Additive is much more forgiving and easier to control.

 

I hope someone can share the name and path of the exact file to edit.. I am afraid I did that many years ago and I lost track of that information.

 

It's called different things in LE and SE.

 

In LE, it's located in Data/SKSE/Plugins, and it's called NiOverride.ini. In SE, it's located in the same place (Data/SKSE/Plugins), but it's called Skee64.ini.

 

I should note that with bodymorphs, the skee64.ini has bodymorphs set to additive by default. It's part of the reason they're more forgiving than node scaling is.

 

However, they can get out of proportion much faster.

For node scaling in LE, the belly node could be set to 8-10 with the right bodyslide preset pretty reliably for pregnancy mods (ex. BeeingFemale).

 

With bodymorphs though, SE is a different story. Setting fertility mode's bodymorph slider to 8 would result in filling a room.

 

With the 3BA body, I set the slider to 1.8, and even that is pretty much the upper limit for "reasonable" size.

[Wut1969]

4 hours ago, DeepBlueFrog said:

 

There is one little advertised thing that helps a lot with conflicts between node changing mods - edit your Netimmerse ini file to Additive.

It is set to Multiplicative by default, which is an odd choice in my opinion. Additive is much more forgiving and easier to control.

 

I hope someone can share the name and path of the exact file to edit.. I am afraid I did that many years ago and I lost track of that information.

 

2 hours ago, w234aew said:

 

It's called different things in LE and SE.

 

In LE, it's located in Data/SKSE/Plugins, and it's called NiOverride.ini. In SE, it's located in the same place (Data/SKSE/Plugins), but it's called Skee64.ini.

 

I should note that with bodymorphs, the skee64.ini has bodymorphs set to additive by default. It's part of the reason they're more forgiving than node scaling is.

 

However, they can get out of proportion much faster.

For node scaling in LE, the belly node could be set to 8-10 with the right bodyslide preset pretty reliably for pregnancy mods (ex. BeeingFemale).

 

With bodymorphs though, SE is a different story. Setting fertility mode's bodymorph slider to 8 would result in filling a room.

 

With the 3BA body, I set the slider to 1.8, and even that is pretty much the upper limit for "reasonable" size.

Cheers, found and changed it.

I can see the logic behind additive, average or largest. There are pros and cons on everyone of them, but multiplicative is a weird choice. You'll end up with whales very very quickly.

 

I noticed the same issue with the 'is 2 a large number?' when trying to combine SLIF and Nio earlier. I probably would have achieved better results if I had realised that one was multiplicative ( 1 doesn't do anything and 2 is am awful lot more (probably around twice as much ? ) ) and the other was additive (1 does something and 2 look quite normal as well).

 

Oh well, I learned a thing today, so thanks.  ?

[asdasd123123]

Possible bug: If you get your head shaved once, it'll never happen again. Probably due to not having YPS fashion? Idk if this was an intentional feature or not

[w234aew]

4 hours ago, Wut1969 said:

 

Cheers, found and changed it.

I can see the logic behind additive, average or largest. There are pros and cons on everyone of them, but multiplicative is a weird choice. You'll end up with whales very very quickly.

 

I noticed the same issue with the 'is 2 a large number?' when trying to combine SLIF and Nio earlier. I probably would have achieved better results if I had realised that one was multiplicative ( 1 doesn't do anything and 2 is am awful lot more (probably around twice as much ? ) ) and the other was additive (1 does something and 2 look quite normal as well).

 

Oh well, I learned a thing today, so thanks.  ?

 

Yeah, I only got away with Nodes+Bodymorphs with the old Hormones addon version (prior to bodymorph patch, Hormones SE scaling was a Node-based modified method) and MME, and even that was a tenuous balance. I set the max scale for nodes in hormones to 1.4, any larger and MME+Weightmorphs would result in adiposian proportions.

[Wut1969]

11 hours ago, w234aew said:

 

Yeah, I only got away with Nodes+Bodymorphs with the old Hormones addon version (prior to bodymorph patch, Hormones SE scaling was a Node-based modified method) and MME, and even that was a tenuous balance. I set the max scale for nodes in hormones to 1.4, any larger and MME+Weightmorphs would result in adiposian proportions.

So you're saying that me trying to get 5 or 6 mods working on the same body when I first started looking around on LL may have been a bit ambitious?  ?

 

But anyway.. so we have UNP and CBBE and several spinoffs of those as bodies, I guess most people are using the same(ish) skeleton, a plethora of scaling programs, multiplicative versus additive versus .. and of course, nobody will be using the same set of mods and load order.

Your Mileage May Vary indeed.

 

I'm still learning every day on how to tune Skyrim, but geeez.. the amount of variables is huge.

 

[LinksSword]

either i did something wrong or this is what the mcm is suppose to look like now..

 

 

 

[DeepBlueFrog]

27 minutes ago, LinksSword said:

either i did something wrong or this is what the mcm is suppose to look like now..

 

 

 

 

Did you install the files from Github or from LL?

 

I added translation files someone provided. You have to make sure the Interface/Translations/SL_Hormones folder is installed.

[LinksSword]

18 minutes ago, DeepBlueFrog said:

 

Did you install the files from Github or from LL?

 

I added translation files someone provided. You have to make sure the Interface/Translations/SL_Hormones folder is installed.

yeah i fixed it, about bodymorphs can i use both them and slif at the same time? 

[DeepBlueFrog]

27 minutes ago, LinksSword said:

yeah i fixed it, about bodymorphs can i use both them and slif at the same time? 

 

That's still experimental and we are tweaking the files. I don't remember if I have updated Github with a patch yet or if I was just about to do it before the shot show that was my work week happened this week,

 

[z45949355]

I find that whatever the bodymorphs, Nio or the Net can't control the breast node. I use the bhunp 3bbb body,and the slif.

[Wut1969]

On 3/5/2021 at 12:36 AM, w234aew said:

 

Yeah, I only got away with Nodes+Bodymorphs with the old Hormones addon version (prior to bodymorph patch, Hormones SE scaling was a Node-based modified method) and MME, and even that was a tenuous balance. I set the max scale for nodes in hormones to 1.4, any larger and MME+Weightmorphs would result in adiposian proportions.

 

It seems that changing the values in niooveride.ini can have interesting side effects;

 

[w234aew]

5 minutes ago, Wut1969 said:

 

It seems that changing the values in niooveride.ini can have interesting side effects;

 

 

Yeah, weird stuff tends to happen when trying to hyper-customize.

 

Do you know what setting it was in the ini that caused this?

 

If you're just enabling bodymorphs, changing the update settings (bImmediateFace, etc.), or the number of override layers allowed (ex. for SlaveTats), it shouldn't cause this.

 

 

On the topic of Nodes vs. Bodymorphs vs. Both vs. SLIF, I tend to avoid SLIF when I can.

 

In LE it's useful due to the sensitivity of whos-on-first for node updates to avoid ballooning (as discussed before) and to make nodes+morphs more doable.

 

In SE, shape changes have pretty much completely transitioned away from node scaling to morphs, because not every body shares the same number/name of nodes anymore (3BBB bodies don't use NPC L/R Breast bones, CBBE SE doesn't have a belly node, etc.).

 

 

If a user is only using morph scaling, all SLIF is doing at that point is acting as a unified shape update scheduler. That's useful for node scaling, but with morph scaling it's just a "nice to have".

 

If SLIF were marked as a light plugin (i.e. no load order cost), it would have more appeal for me. That one nice-to-have isn't worth taking up a valuable esp slot for me though, and I mod relatively "lightly" (i.e. 155-ish esps without merging them).

 

 

In SE, a bit of time fine-tuning morph settings pays off, because it can still end up balanced and non-ballooning if done correctly, and because a lot of the morph mods use a json for the morph settings, adjustments can be done with a text editor (which IMO is a lot faster than MCM).

[w234aew]

7 hours ago, z45949355 said:

I find that whatever the bodymorphs, Nio or the Net can't control the breast node. I use the bhunp 3bbb body,and the slif.

 

Some debugging Tips:

 

1. Did you select only one option?

 

    The scaling methods are elseif statements in the code, so the first selected one is what will be used (none checked should direct it to use basic NetImmerse, with BHUNP 3BBB you'll want only bodymorphs selected)

 

2. Did you select it before the changes were enabled?

 

    After the changes start, I've found changing selections to be glitchy and not always work.

 

3. What is the load order for your BHUNP esps?

 

    With 3BA, I have to have the order as CBBE.esp, 3BBB.esp, then RacemenuMorphsCBBE.esp (that last one is overwritten to 3BBB morphs).

 

If all of these things don't work, it could be a difference in node names between CBBE 3BA and BHUNP 3BBB. I can add any missing BHUNP 3BBB morphs if required.

 

19 hours ago, LinksSword said:

yeah i fixed it, about bodymorphs can i use both them and slif at the same time? 

 

No. The SLIF scaling method that was re-implemented is (practically speaking), the same thing.

 

The only difference between the two options is that the Bodymorphs option in the Hormones menu directly uses NiO to add 3BBB morphs. The SLIF implementation just passes all of the same morph changes directly to SLIF.

 

If you've already got SLIF installed for other mods, I'd just stick with that.

[iamwookie]

For anyone that doesn't have it, there is a json file for 3BBB in this post which tells SLIF all the right nodes for the 3BBB body and lets SLIF morphs work with it.

 

[iamwookie]

So I was going over that code I had posted and was comparing it to some of the MME SLIF code and realized

 

the SLIF event for the Morph path should be 

int SLIF_event = ModEvent.Create("SLIF_morph")

and not

int SLIF_event = ModEvent.Create("SLIF_inflate")

 

That is what makes it register as a morph.

[DeepBlueFrog]

18 minutes ago, iamwookie said:

So I was going over that code I had posted and was comparing it to some of the MME SLIF code and realized

 

the SLIF event for the Morph path should be 

int SLIF_inflate_t = ModEvent.Create("SLIF_morph")

and not

int SLIF_event = ModEvent.Create("SLIF_inflate")

 

That is what makes it register as a morph.

 

Should I assume SLIF_inflate_t and SLIF_event are the same thing copied from two different examples?

 

I iwll take your word for it and change it in Hormones.