Apply HDT SMP physics to an existing body mesh?

[kubikiri]

First: CBBE 3BA works fine in my game.   

   

Okay now, one specific CBBE body mesh(.nif) has the body shape I want, but with no physics. How do I apply physics to it, or adapt CBBE 3BA body mesh to its shape?   

    

Thanks in advance.

[traison]

Does the body even have weightpainted jiggly bits?

[anjenthedog]

The way I did it (for both CBBE and UNP follower bodies) was to replace the meshes with CBBE-3BBB and BHUNP meshes respectively (the two body types I have installed aside from CBBE). The way you'd need to do it is to replace the CBBE meshes with the CBBE-3BA meshes you're using to generate a set of custom meshes to replace those it uses.

 

The problem, of course, is that in doing so, unless the source body (the one you want to convert) has an associated Bodyslide preset whose settings you can copy (pencil and paper) and transfer to said target body type's own 100% self-compatible Bodyslide preset, you'll need to take a more artistic approach and recreate them using snapshots of the original as models to match. Yeah, the latter can be a bit of a pita, but you gain skills doing so (if that's any silver lining)

 

However, in either case, it's "easily" doable with a bit of patience and learning what each slider does for that body type, and which they share with the older, non 3BA model (ex: breast size is generally shared by CBBE and CBBE-3BB

 

Just remember that if you make any custom Bodyslide presets along the way to perform the conversion(s), save them for use later in fitting clothes/armor/etc

 

Anyway, not to belabor this, but the last step is when building them (body, feet hands),

1. Direct Bodyslide's output to a staging/work folder via Settings > Advanced,
2. make sure that Build Morphs checkbox for Racemenu support
3. build them (body feet hands) using the Amazing body (I think that's still the standard for CBBE-3BA yes?)
4. then archive the old meshes and tri files (and older skeletons if they have them)  off their source folder (eg create "/backup meshes/" folder to deposit the two body two feet two hands and three tri files into...along with any older skeleton files for the sex you're working on)
5. then and only then drop copies of  your edited meshes and tri files (9 in all)  from the location set by step 1, into meshes/character/character assets/ or the named NPC's meshes folder and overwrite the ones still there
6. then
7. Finally, if there *was* a skeleton in the folder, and if it isn't the latest skeleton installed, make sure to drop copies of the associated skeleton files into the folder as well, in case it expects them there instead of the generalized location in /meshes/character/character  assets/  and or /character assets female/
8. DO NOT USE CBBE PRESETS TO BUILD THE CBBE-3BA MESHES. THEY ARE INCOMPATIBLE. YOU MUST MAKE SURE TO USE CBBE-3BA PRESETS ONLY.  (it's not always obvious from the preset names)

 

EDIT: I forgot to say if you're working on a follower/NPC, once you have the nifs generated and in place, you'll also need to edit the generated nifs (using nifskope or equivalent) to ensure that the paths to their original custom textures are used. 

Edited November 1, 2023 by anjenthedog
more blather!

[kubikiri]

20 hours ago, traison said:

Does the body even have weightpainted jiggly bits?

 

19 hours ago, anjenthedog said:

The way I did it (for both CBBE and UNP follower bodies) was to replace the meshes with CBBE-3BBB and BHUNP meshes respectively (the two body types I have installed aside from CBBE). The way you'd need to do it is to replace the CBBE meshes with the CBBE-3BA meshes you're using to generate a set of custom meshes to replace those it uses.

 

The problem, of course, is that in doing so, unless the source body (the one you want to convert) has an associated Bodyslide preset whose settings you can copy (pencil and paper) and transfer to said target body type's own 100% self-compatible Bodyslide preset, you'll need to take a more artistic approach and recreate them using snapshots of the original as models to match. Yeah, the latter can be a bit of a pita, but you gain skills doing so (if that's any silver lining)

 

However, in either case, it's "easily" doable with a bit of patience and learning what each slider does for that body type, and which they share with the older, non 3BA model (ex: breast size is generally shared by CBBE and CBBE-3BB

 

Just remember that if you make any custom Bodyslide presets along the way to perform the conversion(s), save them for use later in fitting clothes/armor/etc

 

Anyway, not to belabor this, but the last step is when building them (body, feet hands),

1. Direct Bodyslide's output to a staging/work folder via Settings > Advanced,
2. make sure that Build Morphs checkbox for Racemenu support
3. build them (body feet hands) using the Amazing body (I think that's still the standard for CBBE-3BA yes?)
4. then archive the old meshes and tri files (and older skeletons if they have them)  off their source folder (eg create "/backup meshes/" folder to deposit the two body two feet two hands and three tri files into...along with any older skeleton files for the sex you're working on)
5. then and only then drop copies of  your edited meshes and tri files (9 in all)  from the location set by step 1, into meshes/character/character assets/ or the named NPC's meshes folder and overwrite the ones still there
6. then
7. Finally, if there *was* a skeleton in the folder, and if it isn't the latest skeleton installed, make sure to drop copies of the associated skeleton files into the folder as well, in case it expects them there instead of the generalized location in /meshes/character/character  assets/  and or /character assets female/
8. DO NOT USE CBBE PRESETS TO BUILD THE CBBE-3BA MESHES. THEY ARE INCOMPATIBLE. YOU MUST MAKE SURE TO USE CBBE-3BA PRESETS ONLY.  (it's not always obvious from the preset names)

 

EDIT: I forgot to say if you're working on a follower/NPC, once you have the nifs generated and in place, you'll also need to edit the generated nifs (using nifskope or equivalent) to ensure that the paths to their original custom textures are used. 

 

I can't believe my own stupidity. The body itself has BBP/TBBP options included which I completely overlooked. They may not be as advanced as 3BA, but will do just fine at least for now.    

 

Thanks to anjenthedog for your detailed instructions, seems if I want both the body shape and advanced physics, using 3BA as base to build a custom body is the only way?

[traison]

32 minutes ago, kubikiri said:

Thanks to anjenthedog for your detailed instructions, seems if I want both the body shape and advanced physics, using 3BA as base to build a custom body is the only way?

 

I wouldn't say there's any "only way", its more a question of how much work you want to do. You could bend that CBBE based body into having BHUNP weightpainting but its probably going to be more work than doing it with a CBBE-based body such as 3BA.

[anjenthedog]

3 hours ago, kubikiri said:

Thanks to anjenthedog for your detailed instructions, seems if I want both the body shape and advanced physics, using 3BA as base to build a custom body is the only way?

The "only" way? IDK. To get 3BA? Outside someone producing a 3BA body overwriter for the character, not as far as I know. (and there *are* overwriters (NPC overhauls) for body types in *some cases*... most time these days though, if they do include such a mod, they usually just point the NPC body to the player body, which ends up with everyone looking the same (ime)

 

But... as much as my long winded explanation of the process might be off-putting or seem complicated, it's really very easy once you do it a couple times.

 

Simple version:

1) Just do what you normally do to tweak and build a body in Bodyslide,

2) but send it to a dummy folder (if for someone other than the player, or if you want a staging folder for any further nif tweaks)

3) and edit the nifs to make sure they point to the intended texture resource for the target (normally no need if for the player),

4) and then copy them and hard-overwrite the existing meshes for the player or NPC depending on "who" you're working on. Done. 

 

anyway, glad you found an interim solution. For "educational purposes", I'd recommend generating the suggested meshes just once and send them to some dummy folder, just to see how easy it is. Afterwards, reset the output path in Bodyslide so that the next time you use it, Bodyslidet sends output files (nifs and tri files) to their normal destination, with "no harm no foul" in place... You don't have to overwrite anything. Just try the "complicated" part of the process "fer the Gipper!" You might be surprised at how "only" becomes a an irrelevant word. It's really a trivial edit in the grand scheme of things. FWIW, YMMV, etc

 

good luck in any case.

Edited November 2, 2023 by anjenthedog

[kubikiri]

On 11/3/2023 at 1:59 AM, anjenthedog said:

The "only" way? IDK. To get 3BA? Outside someone producing a 3BA body overwriter for the character, not as far as I know. (and there *are* overwriters (NPC overhauls) for body types in *some cases*... most time these days though, if they do include such a mod, they usually just point the NPC body to the player body, which ends up with everyone looking the same (ime)

 

But... as much as my long winded explanation of the process might be off-putting or seem complicated, it's really very easy once you do it a couple times.

 

Simple version:

1) Just do what you normally do to tweak and build a body in Bodyslide,

2) but send it to a dummy folder (if for someone other than the player, or if you want a staging folder for any further nif tweaks)

3) and edit the nifs to make sure they point to the intended texture resource for the target (normally no need if for the player),

4) and then copy them and hard-overwrite the existing meshes for the player or NPC depending on "who" you're working on. Done. 

 

anyway, glad you found an interim solution. For "educational purposes", I'd recommend generating the suggested meshes just once and send them to some dummy folder, just to see how easy it is. Afterwards, reset the output path in Bodyslide so that the next time you use it, Bodyslidet sends output files (nifs and tri files) to their normal destination, with "no harm no foul" in place... You don't have to overwrite anything. Just try the "complicated" part of the process "fer the Gipper!" You might be surprised at how "only" becomes a an irrelevant word. It's really a trivial edit in the grand scheme of things. FWIW, YMMV, etc

 

good luck in any case.

In order to prevent overwriting the default body mesh, do I have to change the output folder in Bodyslide settings?

[traison]

57 minutes ago, kubikiri said:

In order to prevent overwriting the default body mesh, do I have to change the output folder in Bodyslide settings?

 

That's not going to change where the file is placed by MO2, if a file with the same name already exists.

 

Hold shift while pressing the Build button in BS and it'll dump the meshes in its working directory.

 

Edit: Or...

On 11/1/2023 at 8:12 PM, anjenthedog said:

Direct Bodyslide's output to a staging/work folder via Settings > Advanced,

 

Disclaimer: I've never used the settings mentioned there.

 

Edited November 4, 2023 by traison

[kubikiri]

40 minutes ago, traison said:

 

That's not going to change where the file is placed by MO2, if a file with the same name already exists.

 

Hold shift while pressing the Build button in BS and it'll dump the meshes in its working directory.

 

Edit: Or...

 

Disclaimer: I've never used the settings mentioned there.

 

I'm not using MO2.    

I mostly install and sort mods manually, and for error checking I use Wrye Bash and xEdit.    

Anyway, I find that by hovering mouse cursor on the browse button, the program tells me what the setting is for, and looks like it is what I presume.   

    

One more question though, if I'm going to modify the in-game proportion for the body/character (torso and leg length, head size, etc.), do I have to edit the skeleton file?

[traison]

58 minutes ago, kubikiri said:

if I'm going to modify the in-game proportion for the body/character (torso and leg length, head size, etc.)

 

RaceMenu or NiOverride.

[anjenthedog]

1 hour ago, kubikiri said:

I'm not using MO2.    

I mostly install and sort mods manually, and for error checking I use Wrye Bash and xEdit.    

Anyway, I find that by hovering mouse cursor on the browse button, the program tells me what the setting is for, and looks like it is what I presume.   

    

One more question though, if I'm going to modify the in-game proportion for the body/character (torso and leg length, head size, etc.), do I have to edit the skeleton file?

Normally, you leave the Settings >> Advanced >> Output path blank, and it directs output to 

 

a) the player folder

or

b) to an installed mod's pre-configured secondary output (ie suppose you got an NPC replacer that came with a fully custom Bodyslide - custom Bodyslide preset and custom source/target mesh and output directives ... and any other tailored goodies maybe make up etc, idk - its Bodyslide output would almost assuredly auto-direct to that named NPC replacement folder, not player)

 

When there isn't such a path configured/defined, yes, you manually choose an output path, then situate the output files manually.

 

I usually opt for the third method, often even for my player instance, because I can review the nifs using Nifskope, before "committing them", and to make sure to archive anything from the target NPC (or player) that I feel might be worthy of archiving, prior to overwriting. You *could redirect it directly over top of the existing targeted "was CBBE soon to be CBBE-3BA" NPC/Follower folder, but I find it prudent to stage the output.

 

As far as I know, the skeleton is basically a fixed commodity (afaik a least within a given race). One size fits all for the most part. Afaik, the only time you might fiddle with it, or perceive yourself as at least quasi-directly, or at least "apparently" fiddling with it, is by using skeleton adjustments in racemenu, especially when adjusting the more nuanced items like hand size, or the various spinal adjustments, or individual arm or leg proportion.

 

eg

Spoiler

 

One word of "warning" although it's more of a clarification of things rather than a worry. If you use Vortex (which I presume since you said you don't use MO2), next time you deploy (you install some mod, or you uninstall some mod or you enable or disable some mod), you may get a warning about files associated with the manual file changes that you made during this editing process, something along the lines of "Files were changed outside Vortex", and then it will ask "use newer files". Go ahead check its review files for that specific warning first, for good measure, but after confirming that they are indeed the mesh (and tri) files you dropped into place manually, answer yes, since you want to keep these new files you just put in place. If you answer no, it will overwrite the files you just inserted with the original files from the source mod. Not the end of the world, you'd just need to recopy the custom 3BA files back into place, but then next time you deploy you're probably going to get that same warning about that particular change, so be advised.

 

Edited November 4, 2023 by anjenthedog
shinies!