Fanboy Bitching

[buzzbombr]

I frickin' love this game. It is all Beth and all in space and it's everything I was expecting and hoping for.

 

Darn those frickin' afflictions, though! WTF! I don't know how to hop off a rock without getting a sprain? I can't walk past a gaseous vent in a space suit, without getting poisoned? My space suit has so little protection that cold and radiation do really bad things to me?

 

For conversation sake, I am in the Mark 1 space suit. Arguably one of the best suits you can get early game (though it does take an exploit). Every little tiny thing seems to get through that supposedly kick-ass space suit.

 

Afflictions have got to go. All of them. I honestly think they are ridiculous and serve no purpose to further either game immersion or gameplay itself. It's just a pain in the ass that makes you reload a previous save and lose your progress. All pain, no gain.

 

I love Bethesda games, but What The Hell were they thinking with annoying-ass inflictions impacting my enjoyment of the game? Here I am, irritated as hell, when I should be just enjoying and playing the game.

 

Yep. It became a rant. Sorry. I was having such a good time sneaking around and sniping those pirate bastards until I got a sprain and then it was like "Wait. What?" I can't even sneak anymore. Reload. Do it all over again without hopping off a damn rock. 

[Mexicola88]

It's also so inconsistent. On Toliman II where you have -18 Celsius you freeze after just 2-3 minutes, but on another planet with -213 Celsius you don't. It doesn't make any sense.

Edited September 30, 2023 by Mexicola88

[Miauzi]

In this thread there was an extensive exchange about the spacesuit of the game and everything that does NOT work ... extensively

 

 

Ultimately, the conclusion provides two approaches to what happens to the spacesuits in the game:

a) the mechanics of the game are completely broken

or

b) the game mechanics are no longer present - because they are deactivated.

the result is in any case the same -> frustration of the players because they have such "immersion" breaking experiences.

whether this can be fixed? Unfortunately, this is still completely open!

[Travestea]

I find it hilarious that the fact some afflictions (ex: lung damage, poison) imply the spacesuits aren't airtight and with their own oxygen supply.

 

There is a Todd interview saying planet survival was originally way more brutal before they "nerfed the hell out of it". Wonder if that explains why we ended up with a half baked spacesuit/survival aspect.

Edited October 1, 2023 by Travestea

[Miauzi]

Vor 4 Stunden sagte Travestea:

Ich finde es urkomisch, dass die Tatsache, dass einige Beschwerden (z. B. Lungenschäden, Gift) darauf hindeuten, dass die Raumanzüge nicht luftdicht sind und über eine eigene Sauerstoffversorgung verfügen.

 

In einem Todd-Interview heißt es, dass das Überleben auf dem Planeten ursprünglich viel brutaler gewesen sei, bevor sie es „verdammt abgeschwächt“ hätten. Ich frage mich, ob das erklärt, warum wir am Ende einen halbfertigen Raumanzug/Überlebensaspekt hatten.

 

"Todd the Liar" ... he says a lot when the day is long.

They just didn't manage to create an acceptable system for a spacesuit - how else would it be possible to get "poison gas damage" from a "smoker" in a vacuum (i.e. an environment containing NOTHING)?

They have not weakened anything - they have "merely" "switched off" a large part of the mechanics of the spacesuit ... but NOT EVERYTHING - and that is how these "curiosities" come about.

And of course a spacesuit has by definition its own CLOSED air circuit - which must be absolutely TIGHT against the environment!

Nothing is allowed to go out - NOTHING is allowed to come in ... in terms of microbes, toxic liquids or gases.

[DocClox]

13 hours ago, Travestea said:

I find it hilarious that the fact some afflictions (ex: lung damage, poison) imply the spacesuits aren't airtight and with their own oxygen supply.

 

There is a Todd interview saying planet survival was originally way more brutal before they "nerfed the hell out of it". Wonder if that explains why we ended up with a half baked spacesuit/survival aspect.

 

Gotta say, I would really like to play the un-nerfed version. Hazardous planets, fuel consumption for jumping, all that stuff. I want to have to plan how I'm going to get to Masada. I want to look at an Inferno or a Deep Freeze planet and say "that looks nasty - I'm not going down there without good reason". I want to have a row of specialist spacesuit manikins , each one optimized for different planetary conditions.

Edited October 2, 2023 by DocClox

[Miauzi]

Vor 8 Minuten sagte DocClox:

 

Ich muss sagen, ich würde wirklich gerne die nicht-nerfed-Version spielen. Gefährliche Planeten, Treibstoffverbrauch beim Umpumpen, all das Zeug. müssen, Ich möchte planen wie ich nach Masada komme. Ich möchte mir ein Inferno oder einen Deep Freeze-Planeten ansehen und sagen: „Das sieht eklig aus – ich gehe nicht ohne guten Grund dorthin . “ Ich möchte eine Reihe spezieller Raumanzugpuppen haben, die jeweils für unterschiedliche Planetenbedingungen optimiert sind.

 

Then the development of the skill "environmental conditioning" would also make sense in the game ... as would the fact that you can modify your spacesuit at a workbench and first have to do research for it.

All of this is currently completely undermined and one of the most interesting aspects of the game is ultimately NOT there.

It is currently a rather boring baller game with a "space look" - nothing more.

[DocClox]

5 minutes ago, Miauzi said:

It is currently a rather boring baller game with a "space look" - nothing more.

 

I wouldn't go that far, personally. I'm still having a blast.

 

Nevertheless, looking forward to playing the full game at some point

[Reigor]

1 hour ago, DocClox said:

Gotta say, I would really like to play the un-nerfed version. Hazardous planets, fuel consumption for jumping, all that stuff. I want to have to plan how I'm going to get to Masada. I want to look at an Inferno or a Deep Freeze planet and say "that looks nasty - I'm not going down there without good reason". I want to have a row of specialist spacesuit manikins , each one optimized for different planetary conditions.

 

I went all in on spacesuit design to try to avoid the environmental conditions only to realize that they don't really matter. Yes, having frostbite sucks, but it doesn't impact things that much. Just roll one's eyes of getting it because the spacesuit won't block freezing rain and game on.

 

That said, that the system is there not only means that it can eventually be fixed so that different and skill investment actually matter, but also the system can be used for other things.

 

Like an arousal system, mood, sex attributes, etc or a more vanilla needs system for food, sleep, and so on...It's there, no need to make a framework, just make up new conditions like aroused, horny, hungry, starving, whatever, and set when they occur (which would require a sex framework for some).  

[Bluegunk]

I'm having plenty of fun in the game, but left scratching my head at beer bottles and sandwiches left out on a table outdoors on an airless moon.  Er......

[nIn nIn nIn]

3 minutes ago, Bluegunk said:

I'm having plenty of fun in the game, but left scratching my head at beer bottles and sandwiches left out on a table outdoors on an airless moon.  Er......

Almost as immersive as external doors (not airlocks) on that same airless moon. 

 

They need to tweak their procedural code a tiny little bit.

[DocClox]

7 minutes ago, Bluegunk said:

I'm having plenty of fun in the game, but left scratching my head at beer bottles and sandwiches left out on a table outdoors on an airless moon.  Er......

 

Obviously, there's a perfectly simple explanation. Clearly the sandwiches were ... that is to say the table was ....

 

Um, what was the question, again?

[BAB PEEG]

STALKER in space might be cool.

[Travestea]

11 hours ago, DocClox said:

 

Gotta say, I would really like to play the un-nerfed version. Hazardous planets, fuel consumption for jumping, all that stuff. I want to have to plan how I'm going to get to Masada. I want to look at an Inferno or a Deep Freeze planet and say "that looks nasty - I'm not going down there without good reason". I want to have a row of specialist spacesuit manikins , each one optimized for different planetary conditions.

 

Me too, and I await the mods that add that. My Skyrim difficulty is so heavily modded that I usually need at least one follower to clear Embershard mine and have to be real careful with that pack of wolves between it and Riverwood.

[davisev5225]

8 hours ago, Bluegunk said:

I'm having plenty of fun in the game, but left scratching my head at beer bottles and sandwiches left out on a table outdoors on an airless moon.  Er......

 

It was the final meal of the latest victim of the spacers. 

[pashax]

14 hours ago, DocClox said:

Gotta say, I would really like to play the un-nerfed version.

I've got a hunch, based on what remains in the game today, that "brutal" in this case might not mean interesting and challenging but rather a boring micromanagement menu slog where you are constantly having to use this consumable or that one every few seconds.  Why do I think that? I got a frostbite ailment in a -18C environment after 15 seconds on a planet, and if that's what made it to the game...  I'm sure there will be plenty of mods for this eventually after the authoring tools are available and people can deconstruct what's here and reconstruct it into something more interesting.

 

10 hours ago, nIn nIn nIn said:

Almost as immersive as external doors (not airlocks) on that same airless moon. 

Even better when those external doors on the airless moon leads to beds.  Are they sleeping in spacesuits?  My favorite is that the airlock door placement is a little buggy and since they're responsible for removing the "inside" flag you get when entering a building, so if they're not in the right place, you can walk through the nonexistent airlock doors back to "outside" in 0% oxygen, -270C and take off all your clothes and not suffocate or freeze (and also not suffer any ailments except fall damage ones). It just works.

 

I may pick on the game quite a bit, but I am still enjoying it after an awful lot of hours of play time.  I just wish it was better.

[DocClox]

5 hours ago, pashax said:

Why do I think that? I got a frostbite ailment in a -18C environment after 15 seconds on a planet, and if that's what made it to the game... 

 

Sounds like my last visit to Londinion. I kept curing frostbite only to get it again moments later. I gave up and just endured it in the end, until I was back in the warm and could see a medic.

 

I know what you mean though. This is my problem with Fallout 4's survival mode - you get a new disease every five steps and the game becomes bore about managing the antibiotic supply than anything else..

 

Then again, some of my most satisfying missions have been the ones where I've limped back into the ship, fractued bones, frostbite and internal bleeding, croaking "medic!" as loudly as I could manage.

 

It'd be tricky to get right, but I expect there'll be a ton of rebalance mods.

[Miauzi]

Vor 18 Minuten sagte DocClox:

 

Klingt nach meinem letzten Besuch in London. Ich habe die Erfrierungen immer wieder geheilt, nur um sie wenige Augenblicke später erneut zu bekommen. Ich gab auf und ertrug es am Ende einfach, bis ich wieder im Warmen war und einen Arzt aufsuchen konnte.

 

Ich weiß aber, was du meinst. Das ist mein Problem mit dem Überlebensmodus von Fallout 4 – man bekommt alle fünf Schritte eine neue Krankheit und das Spiel wird langweiliger, weil es vor allem um die Verwaltung der Antibiotikaversorgung geht.

 

Andererseits waren einige meiner befriedigendsten Missionen diejenigen, bei denen ich mit gebrochenen Knochen, Erfrierungen und inneren Blutungen zurück ins Schiff humpelte und „Sanitäter!“ krächzte. so laut ich konnte.

 

Es wäre schwierig, es richtig zu machen, aber ich gehe davon aus, dass es eine Menge Rebalancing-Mods geben wird.

 

First of all, we have to find out what the plan of "Buggy-desta" of a FUNCTIONING spacesuit looked like.

What we experience as players are the remains of deactivated and/or deleted game mechanics.

Obviously there is no documentation whatsoever of what was programmed there in the first place.

When they noticed shortly before the "end of the gate" (the start of sales) that many things did not work ... somewhere they "put the axe" to "because we don't know what we are doing".

We are now experiencing the consequences with things like

- poison gas damage in vacuum

- severe frostbite at temperatures - at which an Iniut from Canada or Greenland would exclaim "... yay - it's a mild spring day...".

and any number of other BULLSHIT

In terms of temperature regulation, the suit system works quite well on moons with a vacuum - i.e. no atmosphere.

On planets with an atmosphere that also contains sufficient oxygen ... the environmental control of the spacesuit is effectively "switched off".

So have fun finding the connections - which not even the game studio itself seems to understand

 

---

I can produce all the medicines I need in huge quantities - I get raw materials from the killed fauna of various planets.