you are prejudiced?

[markdf]

2 hours ago, FauxFurry said:

Slavery is still happening in Libya (among other places).

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/apr/10/libya-public-slave-auctions-un-migration

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_contemporary_Africa

https://www.religiousfreedomcoalition.org/2013/01/10/muslim-slave-market-footage-from-the-1960′s-and-modern-times/

Yeah... things are going undeniably badly there.

[markdf]

1 hour ago, Allannaa said:

The American Civil War was, first and foremost, about states' rights.

It was about one right in particular though... the right to own people.

 

https://www.battlefields.org/learn/primary-sources/declaration-causes-seceding-states

These are the declarations of secession of Georgie, Mississippi, South Caroline, Texas, and Virginia. The word "SLAVE" (and its derivations) appears EIGHTY THREE times in them, collectively.

 

http://teachingamericanhistory.org/library/document/cornerstone-speech/

This is the "Cornerstone" speech. Why don't you count how many times the word "SLAVE" appears for yourself in this one.

 

These are the actual words of the seceding governments -- and they say that YOU are WRONG. They say that secession was first and foremost about PRESERVING SLAVERY. You can argue you all you like, but you can't argue with the actual words of the actual people who fought the actual war. It's sad that most Americans understand their own history so poorly.

 

 

[markdf]

4 hours ago, Greeniewolf said:

seriously if you have to make up shit to prove your point, you have none. 

you just lost any and all credibility as far as I am concerned. 

This is all 100% true. I don't have to make up anything, these all happened. Why are you so worshipful towards the police that you can't believe they ever do anything wrong?

[wokking56]

12 hours ago, markdf said:

https://www.battlefields.org/learn/primary-sources/declaration-causes-seceding-states

These are the declarations of secession of Georgie, Mississippi, South Caroline, Texas, and Virginia. The word "SLAVE" (and its derivations) appears EIGHTY THREE times in them, collectively.

 

Yes slavery is frequently mentioned in these declarations, true. Yet if you take time to actually read them you will see that they (the south) were fed up with the Federal Government changing the rules whenever it felt like it. The north had been supported and assisted for 40+ years while the south was not. The Federal Government was at that time acting in a manner exactly opposite of it's intended purpose. When the country acquired new lands the Federal Government reneged on long standing policies. Once again I clearly state "that I personally don't believe slavery is in anyway acceptable" but that was never the only reason for the war.

 

Georgia

They have endeavored to weaken our security, to disturb our domestic peace and tranquility, and persistently refused to comply with their express constitutional obligations to us in reference to that property, and by the use of their power in the Federal Government have striven to deprive us of an equal enjoyment of the common Territories of the Republic. This hostile policy of our confederates has been pursued with every circumstance of aggravation which could arouse the passions and excite the hatred of our people, and has placed the two sections of the Union for many years past in the condition of virtual civil war.

The material prosperity of the North was greatly dependent on the Federal Government; that of the South not at all. In the first years of the Republic the navigating, commercial, and manufacturing interests of the North began to seek profit and aggrandizement at the expense of the agricultural interests. Even the owners of fishing smacks sought and obtained bounties for pursuing their own business (which yet continue), and $500,000 is now paid them annually out of the Treasury. ...
Not content with these great and unjust advantages, they have sought to throw the legitimate burden of their business as much as possible upon the public; they have succeeded in throwing the cost of light-houses, buoys, and the maintenance of their seamen upon the Treasury, and the Government now pays above $2,000,000 annually for the support of these objects. Theses interests, in connection with the commercial and manufacturing classes, have also succeeded, by means of subventions to mail steamers and the reduction in postage, in relieving their business from the payment of about $7,000,000 annually, throwing it upon the public Treasury under the name of postal deficiency.

 

South Carolina

In the year 1765, that portion of the British Empire embracing Great Britain, undertook to make laws for the government of that portion composed of the thirteen American Colonies. A struggle for the right of self-government ensued, which resulted, on the 4th of July, 1776, in a Declaration, by the Colonies, "that they are, and of right ought to be, FREE AND INDEPENDENT STATES; and that, as free and independent States, they have full power to levy war, conclude peace, contract alliances, establish commerce, and to do all other acts and things which independent States may of right do."
They further solemnly declared that whenever any "form of government becomes destructive of the ends for which it was established, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it, and to institute a new government."
For purposes of defense, they united their arms and their counsels; and, in 1778, they entered into a League known as the Articles of Confederation, whereby they agreed to entrust the administration of their external relations to a common agent, known as the Congress of the United States, expressly declaring, in the first Article "that each State retains its sovereignty, freedom and independence, and every power, jurisdiction and right which is not, by this Confederation, expressly delegated to the United States in Congress assembled."

 

Texas

The controlling majority of the Federal Government, under various pretences and disguises, has so administered the same as to exclude the citizens of the Southern States, unless under odious and unconstitutional restrictions, from all the immense territory owned in common by all the States on the Pacific Ocean, for the avowed purpose of acquiring sufficient power in the common government to use it as a means of destroying the institutions of Texas and her sister slaveholding States.

 

Virginia

The people of Virginia, in their ratification of the Constitution of the United States of America, adopted by them in Convention on the twenty-fifth day of June, in the year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and eighty-eight, having declared that the powers granted under the said Constitution were derived from the people of the United States, and might be resumed whensoever the same should be perverted to their injury and oppression; and the Federal Government, having perverted said powers, not only to the injury of the people of Virginia, but to the oppression of the Southern Slaveholding States.

Now, therefore, we, the people of Virginia, do declare and ordain that the ordinance adopted by the people of this State in Convention, on the twenty-fifth day of June, eighty-eight, whereby the Constitution of the United States of America was ratified, and all acts of the General Assembly of this State, ratifying or adopting amendments to said Constitution, are hereby repealed and abrogated; that the Union between the State of Virginia and the other States under the Constitution aforesaid, is hereby dissolved, and that the State of Virginia is in the full possession and exercise of all the rights of sovereignty which belong and appertain to a free and independent State. And they do further declare that the said Constitution of the United States of America is no longer binding on any of the citizens of this State.

[GrimReaper]

13 hours ago, markdf said:

This is all 100% true. I don't have to make up anything, these all happened. Why are you so worshipful towards the police that you can't believe they ever do anything wrong?

You have to admit though that this is very far away from your previous statement that 'the police shoots people in the back'.

[markdf]

59 minutes ago, GrimReaper said:

You have to admit though that this is very far away from your previous statement that 'the police shoots people in the back'.

I was giving examples of how evil these people are. And there are literally videos on YouTube of police officers shooting unarmed people in the back as they run away. Slamming pregnant women against the ground? Yup, got videos of that too. Executing an unarmed man in his car because he was nervous about the uniformed maniac waving a gun in his face? Yup, the police officer's own dashcam video. And for every case caught on camera, there are many more that didn't get recorded.

 

Walter Scott, for example. Fleeing down a street, unarmed, in broad daylight, not running around a corner or any bullshit like that. And he was shot eight times in the back. You can watch it yourself. 

 

How about shooting an old man for no reason? Got you covered.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jul/21/florida-police-shoot-black-man-lying-down-with-arms-in-air

 

[markdf]

2 hours ago, wokking56 said:

Yes slavery is frequently mentioned in these declarations, true. Yet if you take time to actually read them you will see that they (the south) were fed up with the Federal Government changing the rules whenever it felt like it.

So why didn't they secede BEFORE slavery became an issue? Or wait to secede until AFTER abolition? Why are Americans so desperate to avoid the basic truth of the Confederacy? They said it themselves, slavery would be the "cornerstone" of the Confederacy.

 

You are literally arguing against the actual people from that time period. There is not one single confederate leader who disputed that slavery was the primary reason for secession. NOT. EVEN. ONE.

[GrimReaper]

2 hours ago, markdf said:

I was giving examples of how evil these people are. And there are literally videos on YouTube of police officers shooting unarmed people in the back as they run away. Slamming pregnant women against the ground? Yup, got videos of that too. Executing an unarmed man in his car because he was nervous about the uniformed maniac waving a gun in his face? Yup, the police officer's own dashcam video. And for every case caught on camera, there are many more that didn't get recorded.

 

Walter Scott, for example. Fleeing down a street, unarmed, in broad daylight, not running around a corner or any bullshit like that. And he was shot eight times in the back. You can watch it yourself. 

 

How about shooting an old man for no reason? Got you covered.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jul/21/florida-police-shoot-black-man-lying-down-with-arms-in-air

 

Now you're back to your sensationalist nonsense. You were giving example how evil these people are? I didn't know guilt by association is still a thing but apparently it is. There are bad people in the police (and the police as an institution has several problems itself) but that doesn't mean that the police is bad people. I mean, if you want to push the narrative that the US police are all a bunch of racist murderers despite statistics painting another picture that's on you, but don't expect people agreeing with you. You do have a legitimate point (violent/tyrannical tendencies among police officers) but you're also pushing anyone who might listen away by being hysterical.

[markdf]

3 hours ago, GrimReaper said:

Now you're back to your sensationalist nonsense. You were giving example how evil these people are? I didn't know guilt by association is still a thing but apparently it is. There are bad people in the police (and the police as an institution has several problems itself) but that doesn't mean that the police is bad people. I mean, if you want to push the narrative that the US police are all a bunch of racist murderers despite statistics painting another picture that's on you, but don't expect people agreeing with you. You do have a legitimate point (violent/tyrannical tendencies among police officers) but you're also pushing anyone who might listen away by being hysterical.

Guilt by association does apply -- because the police are the only ones who are in a position to actually DO something about the really bad people within the police force. But they don't. They PROTECT the bad cops, they ALWAYS take another cop's word over that of someone that's been victimized. And that makes them just as bad.

 

When my friend got beaten up by her cop boyfriend (incidentally cops have one of the highest rates of partner abuse of any profession), who was she supposed to call to protect her? Who is going to come and arrest the guy? His buddies? Not likely. Cops have created a system that insulates them from responsibility for their actions. The cop that threatened to murder my dad was a highly respected officer, considered a hero by the community. There was absolutely no recourse for him except to go into hiding for a few weeks. If he'd tried to tell other police officers, do you really think they would have done ANYTHING? THAT'S why they are ALL EVIL. Complicity in evil is itself evil.

[Kaldor Draigo]

1 hour ago, Alkpaz said:

 

 

um rick and his team pretty much have the right to kill his people they were trying to kill him so

[Kaldor Draigo]

4 hours ago, markdf said:

Guilt by association does apply -- because the police are the only ones who are in a position to actually DO something about the really bad people within the police force. But they don't. They PROTECT the bad cops, they ALWAYS take another cop's word over that of someone that's been victimized. And that makes them just as bad.

 

When my friend got beaten up by her cop boyfriend (incidentally cops have one of the highest rates of partner abuse of any profession), who was she supposed to call to protect her? Who is going to come and arrest the guy? His buddies? Not likely. Cops have created a system that insulates them from responsibility for their actions. The cop that threatened to murder my dad was a highly respected officer, considered a hero by the community. There was absolutely no recourse for him except to go into hiding for a few weeks. If he'd tried to tell other police officers, do you really think they would have done ANYTHING? THAT'S why they are ALL EVIL. Complicity in evil is itself evil.

you can video tap them its legal and if they try and take it make sure to make back ups and post that over the town that cop wont last long when people see how much of an asshole his is if it were up to me i will kill each and every corrupt cop they dont deserve to breath but sadly im i dont have the power to do so

[markdf]

4 hours ago, melovepengy said:

you can video tap them its legal and if they try and take it make sure to make back ups and post that over the town that cop wont last long when people see how much of an asshole his is if it were up to me i will kill each and every corrupt cop they dont deserve to breath but sadly im i dont have the power to do so

Cops have gotten away with murders even after their own body cam footage got leaked. Because their friends on the force do the investigation, and their friends in the prosecutor's office give them a free ride.

 

They CAN take your recording. It's illegal, but who are you going to call -- the cops?

[Kamen Rider Kuuga]

I would frankly love to see all the cops just quit and see how fast all the people who shit on law enforcement will last when anarchy reigns supreme.

 

Maybe we can get a good ol' fashioned purge going.

[saito_zool]

On 8/11/2018 at 9:21 AM, AWP3RATOR said:

Stirring the pot?  I'll take the ladle.

 

My father says he's not prejudiced - he dislikes all other people equally.  The older I get, the more truth this seems to have.

 

 

 

 

 

On 9/4/2018 at 7:10 AM, markdf said:

If you can't think of ANY way to stop a person from escaping that doesn't involve murdering them, you probably shouldn't be a police officer or be allowed to own anything more lethal than stale celery.

 

Things cops have done to people I know: 

* A cop raped a woman I know who was a witness in protective custody at the time.

* A cop threatened to murder a guy I know over a personal dispute.

* A cop went through my belongings without permission, without a warrant, without probably cause, for the sole reason that his adult daughter was my roommate. 

* A cop beat the shit out of my best friend, who is a harmless 100 lb skinny Korean girl... And was his girlfriend at the time. She had to be hospitalized.

 

Many cops abuse their power, and the ones that do it are protected by the ones that don't. The entire institution is garbage.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On 9/4/2018 at 5:50 AM, markdf said:

swastika-wearing

 

..

[markdf]

53 minutes ago, Kamen Rider Kuuga said:

I would frankly love to see all the cops just quit and see how fast all the people who shit on law enforcement will last when anarchy reigns supreme.

 

Maybe we can get a good ol' fashioned purge going.

What if we just, you know, hold cops accountable for their actions -- the way we do with every other profession on earth?

 

If all the cops all just quit, they would presumably take their toxic "blue line" culture with them, and we could hire all new cops who are made to understand that they are public servants.

 

So yes, I would so love to see all the cops just quit. ? 

[Kamen Rider Kuuga]

1 hour ago, markdf said:

What if we just, you know, hold cops accountable for their actions -- the way we do with every other profession on earth?

The fact is that even if we strictly regulated the police to such a point where they couldn't actually do anything, you would still bitch and moan about how evil they are. You do not care about the law, you just want somebody to blame.

 

I've been reading your posts, and my god do you love the victim narrative.

[wokking56]

1 hour ago, markdf said:

If all the cops all just quit, they would presumably take their toxic "blue line" culture with them, and we could hire all new cops who are made to understand that they are public servants.

 

So yes, I would so love to see all the cops just quit. ? 

You might think so but their toxic "blue line" culture is not solely a cop thing it is basic human nature. Give a person a small modicum of power and they usually abuse it, give that same power to a group and the shit really hits the fan. When insulated within a group there will always be that special few that sink to their lowest point of assholery. So you want to get rid of all the cops and start over, what happens in the interim while we have no police? Well I have to agree with Kamen Rider Kuuga "I would frankly love to see all the cops just quit and see how fast all the people who shit on law enforcement will last when anarchy reigns supreme." There are plenty of "bad people" out there that are barely kept in check by our "corrupt" police officers, what do we do about them?

 

Look I get it "some" cops suck, yet again that is the way people are in general some suck some don't. Sure I have had my share of run ins with them but that doesn't make every cop an asshole. As a teenager I would get hauled in regularly because I fit the description (young white male long brown hair average height and build wearing t-shirt and jeans). A few years later I was pulled over for suspicious behavior (I drove through a subdivision). When I refused to let him search my car without a warrant I ended up sitting on the side of the road for an hour and a half until another cop showed up with said warrant. After they pretty much gutted my interior and emptied my trunk onto the side of the road they left and told me to have a nice day. Then much later still I worked in a really nice upscale section of town and got off work at 2:AM every morning. Now the building I worked in was right next to the police department and therefore my (crappy eyesore) of a car sat in that lot all night long, yet nearly every night I would get pulled over and harassed. I even saw the shock on a face or two when my pasty white hand gave them my "papers".

 

As for your hyperbole about the cops gunning down innocent civilians that were running away, As Greeniewolf stated "That is not excessive force.  If you're running from the cops and get shot, that is the perfect level of force.  If the cops let them run, it wasn't enough force.  This isn't TV.  This is real life.  The only people that run are those that did something wrong and are afraid of being caught. There are two saying in the city I grew up: "You run, you die" and "the innocent don't run."  These weren't sayings made up by the cops.  These were sayings made up by the community that was sick of the gang bangers, the drug cartels, the purse snatchers, carjackers, murders, and other lowlifes."

 

Since this is a thread about being prejudiced let's look at some statistics shall we. Currently blacks make up about 12% of the U.S. population yet they commit 53% of all murders in the U.S. Furthermore 93% of blacks killed in this country are killed by other blacks. Is that also the cops fault?

[FauxFurry]

19 hours ago, markdf said:

I was giving examples of how evil these people are. And there are literally videos on YouTube of police officers shooting unarmed people in the back as they run away. Slamming pregnant women against the ground? Yup, got videos of that too. Executing an unarmed man in his car because he was nervous about the uniformed maniac waving a gun in his face? Yup, the police officer's own dashcam video. And for every case caught on camera, there are many more that didn't get recorded.

 

Walter Scott, for example. Fleeing down a street, unarmed, in broad daylight, not running around a corner or any bullshit like that. And he was shot eight times in the back. You can watch it yourself. 

 

How about shooting an old man for no reason? Got you covered.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jul/21/florida-police-shoot-black-man-lying-down-with-arms-in-air

 

You could directly ask police officers and ex-police officers questions about these topics as well as watch their videos answering past queries on their Youtube channels (such as these ones):

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwkm_Wcyh0pc7UUmZZfL-6w

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCH8HxtIoKOmG4WekL8u0sAA

 

It could also serve as an excuse to take all of this vitriol off of this site before this thread ends up purged.

[GrimReaper]

13 hours ago, markdf said:

Guilt by association does apply -- because the police are the only ones who are in a position to actually DO something about the really bad people within the police force. But they don't. They PROTECT the bad cops, they ALWAYS take another cop's word over that of someone that's been victimized. And that makes them just as bad.

 

When my friend got beaten up by her cop boyfriend (incidentally cops have one of the highest rates of partner abuse of any profession), who was she supposed to call to protect her? Who is going to come and arrest the guy? His buddies? Not likely. Cops have created a system that insulates them from responsibility for their actions. The cop that threatened to murder my dad was a highly respected officer, considered a hero by the community. There was absolutely no recourse for him except to go into hiding for a few weeks. If he'd tried to tell other police officers, do you really think they would have done ANYTHING? THAT'S why they are ALL EVIL. Complicity in evil is itself evil.

The police is not a monolithic hivemind, so no, guilt by association does not apply. It's a highly dangerous concept anyway, making everyone in a group guilty because the actions of a select few individuals within that group. I think you know where this leads to eventually. The people working in the police that behave like power tripping assholes and those that cover up for them are the bad guys, the people not involved in that have nothing to do with them.

 

Besides, your anecdotal evidence is problematic because no one asked for help. You can't really complain about not getting help if you didn't ask for any. If what you saying was true, there wouldn't be any cops facing legal consequences whatsoever, zero. Yet there are. Which again brings me back to you being sensationalist about the topic.

 

Lastly, you won't find any pacifist cops for the same reason you won't find animal rights activists working in a slaughterhouse, this kinda comes with the job description. Keep in mind police officers are often working in the outskirts of society. I would argue that this puts a huge strain on everyone's psyche, similar to what some veterans have experienced. If you've seen just how bad, and I mean REALLY bad things can get people often have difficulties adjusting to their normal lives again. Everything that bursts the bubble of normalcy is hard to deal with.

[markdf]

9 hours ago, Kamen Rider Kuuga said:

The fact is that even if we strictly regulated the police to such a point where they couldn't actually do anything, you would still bitch and moan about how evil they are. You do not care about the law, you just want somebody to blame.

 

I've been reading your posts, and my god do you love the victim narrative.

There are places where the police departments are still effective, but they actually TRAIN the officers in de-escalation, in how to not be so terrified of black people that they open fire when they see a cell phone in their hand, in dealing with the public without pointing guns at them. Police CAN be better. But as long as we give them absolute trust, they'll never improve. 

 

I don't love the victim narrative, there are people I love who have been victimized, in some cases repeatedly. I would like to push for a world when they DON'T get victimized, which is why I speak out against transphobia and against letting police officers get away with crimes, and against blaming rape victims for being raped.

[GrimReaper]

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2018/05/the-57375-years-of-life-lost-to-police-violence/559835/

 

The article conveniently doesn't mention the US crime statistics, though.

 

https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/homicides-fall-to-lowest-rate-in-four-decades-133967273.html

 

Nobody is arguing that corrupt and violent police officers shouldn't be punished for their wrongdoings. Which wasn't your point anyways, because everyone that works within the police force is obviously a spawn of the devil himself, so there's no need to differentiate because they're all evil. Doesn't matter if the person in question did actually something wrong, no. Group identity is all that matters here.

[wokking56]

32 minutes ago, GrimReaper said:

The article conveniently doesn't mention the US crime statistics, though.

Currently blacks make up about 12% of the U.S. population yet they commit 50% of all violent crimes and a whopping 53% of the murders in the U.S. Furthermore 93% of blacks killed in this country are killed by other blacks. This is according to the FBI crime statistics from 2 years ago. Now whites do seem to excel at white collar crimes like fraud and embezzlement committing upwards of 70% of these crimes.

[wokking56]

47 minutes ago, Alkpaz said:

Now you sound like this guy: 

I fail to see the comparison Grimreaper mentioned that an article had no American crime stats so I provided some. Sure I made a few suppositions (of the content expected) based on the current flow of the discussion. I have not went off on any rant besmirching blacks or any other group, I am not trying to advance a personal agenda here. So far I have only posted easily searched and known facts or related personal experiences. I have refrained from making blanket generalizations on any group I form my opinions on people on an individual basis. I have known really awesome people and totally worthless a**holes from all walks of life, races, sexes, religions, economic backgrounds and so on. As of yet I have found no one group to be better or worse than any other.

[Guest]

15 hours ago, wokking56 said:

As for your hyperbole about the cops gunning down innocent civilians that were running away, As Greeniewolf stated "That is not excessive force.  If you're running from the cops and get shot, that is the perfect level of force.  If the cops let them run, it wasn't enough force.  This isn't TV.  This is real life.  The only people that run are those that did something wrong and are afraid of being caught. There are two saying in the city I grew up: "You run, you die" and "the innocent don't run."  These weren't sayings made up by the cops.  These were sayings made up by the community that was sick of the gang bangers, the drug cartels, the purse snatchers, carjackers, murders, and other lowlifes."

Those people who run from the cops are entitled to due process. Doesn't matter if they really did steal a purse or a car or not. Those crimes are not punishable by death, especially by the unilateral action of a single police officer in a high-stress moment. Being a society of laws means following the procedure to actually convict & punish (or, preferably, rehabilitate) a criminal. 

[Guest]

I tend to overgeneralize,prejudiced yes mostly towards fuckheads