Immersive Hair Growth and Styling (YPS Devious & Immersive Fashion 2024-05-09)

[kapibar]

@emily1673 I'm checking out recent additions to the Dibella Quest and I noticed a minor inconvenience in YPS setting, specifically related to sexual orientation. When you start as a heterosexual male, you'll turn into heterosexual woman, meaning your sexual orientation will change with your sex. For consistency the user would have to remember that sexual preference requires post-change adjustment, which is a little bit inconvenient for someone who doesn't know the mod. Maybe you would consider changing the sexual orientation to male/ female/ bi preference?

[emily1673]

3 hours ago, ArgyleSmith said:

I'm glad you veered from working on the main question enough to add the "Thoughts" feature. It's good enough to be its own mod, IMO.

It makes me wonder if a similar structure might be used to repair/replace/augment the fun-but-largely-broken Apropos mod. That's not something I'm suggesting you undertake, of course. I don't even know if it's possible.

Point is, thanks for the "Thoughts" feature. It's a good add.

You quoted the most important two sentences from my last post. Maybe I should add them to my signature...  🙂

Indeed, when the idea of the "thought" system came up and I found a way to implement the whole thing, I felt I must do it. It increases immersion for all the YPS features, and also underlines a very important aspect of the Dibella quest (if you haven't got it yet: Aside from the tg stuff, the most important theme of the whole quest is mind control; that's the reason behind the lengthy dialogues, and behind the thoughts).

And surely, it certainly would be possible to adapt the YPS thought system to do something like Apropos. Just need to write a script that listens to SL events, sets some json variables according to the SL conditions, and then calls the Playthought() function from the YPS thought script. (Can also readily use & and | operators in the thought database.)

Easy thing. But I have other things to focus on for a while.

[emily1673]

9 minutes ago, kapibar said:

@emily1673 I'm checking out recent additions to the Dibella Quest and I noticed a minor inconvenience in YPS setting, specifically related to sexual orientation. When you start as a heterosexual male, you'll turn into heterosexual woman, meaning your sexual orientation will change with your sex. For consistency the user would have to remember that sexual preference requires post-change adjustment, which is a little bit inconvenient for someone who doesn't know the mod. Maybe you would consider changing the sexual orientation to male/ female/ bi preference?

Yes, I am aware of this as well. The "canonical" main line of the quest is that the player is turned from hetero male into hetero female. But of course it is possible to change preferences during the quest (before you find your lover). Once the main quest line is finished, I'll prepare a little FAQ on how to configure the quest properly.

[kapibar]

1 hour ago, emily1673 said:

Yes, I am aware of this as well. The "canonical" main line of the quest is that the player is turned from hetero male into hetero female. But of course it is possible to change preferences during the quest (before you find your lover). Once the main quest line is finished, I'll prepare a little FAQ on how to configure the quest properly.

Out of curiosity - will there be any in-yps-lore explanation for this phenomenon? Because on the first glance it does seem a little... stretched. The sex change is explained and there's a logic behind the process, but I don't recall the subject of sexual orientation being touched at all. IRL sexual orientation seems less fluid than gender. I know, RL logic does not apply, but still, you can suspend your disbelief only so far.

[emily1673]

18 hours ago, kapibar said:

Out of curiosity - will there be any in-yps-lore explanation for this phenomenon?

There is no in-lore explanation for it. I just like to push it to the extremes. 😇

But anyway, I know that people have different preferences, therefore I added the MCM option, so everybody can have it as they prefer.

[Slimreb]

I have gone through a bunch of different armors and can not seem to find any that does not give me the message that the heels are not big enough for my deformed feet. Is there anything out there that talks about making the NIOverride work with these heels in AE? I really love this mod but that message does get old after a little while.

[sbvb1290]

5 hours ago, Slimreb said:

I have gone through a bunch of different armors and can not seem to find any that does not give me the message that the heels are not big enough for my deformed feet. Is there anything out there that talks about making the NIOverride work with these heels in AE? I really love this mod but that message does get old after a little while.

 

Tera armors are working for me regarding the heels. I did have to select it (heels) during setup. Daedric Chainmail heels are working too. Alternatively you could just uncheck the boxes regarding the deformed feet in the MCM.

[KentuckyExpat]

On 3/21/2024 at 4:58 AM, monsta88 said:

Hi there,

 

I played a little with v6.6.4, unfortunately I ran into an issue (maybe not related to v6.6.4)

 

I did a slow armpit shaving session, which went through fine, all the anims and foam effects worked. However, after I finished, I got my fashion buff updated, but I did not get back the control of my character.

 

 

 

 

Slow shaving either armpits or pubes seems to cause that softlock. Had that happen every time I did the slow shave rather than the quick shave. Not sure what the problem is.

[KentuckyExpat]

On 3/25/2024 at 5:30 AM, kapibar said:

Out of curiosity - will there be any in-yps-lore explanation for this phenomenon? Because on the first glance it does seem a little... stretched. The sex change is explained and there's a logic behind the process, but I don't recall the subject of sexual orientation being touched at all. IRL sexual orientation seems less fluid than gender. I know, RL logic does not apply, but still, you can suspend your disbelief only so far.

Being hetero I can't speak from personal experience IRL but in the Dibella Quest my rationale in-game is - I'm a guy that likes girls, but I find myself becoming more and more attracted to the idea of becoming a woman.... but I still like girls, so, outwardly, my orientation changes from hetero to lesbian, but it's really not my orientation that changes, it's my gender.

[KentuckyExpat]

On 3/22/2024 at 4:15 PM, blackkatt said:

Yeah, I read that it's included in Race Menu which I have the latest Race menu but stating it can not find the file. I tried loading an older version but my game states mods won't work with older version.

Did you check your SKSE folder to see if skee64.dll is in there?

[emily1673]

3 hours ago, KentuckyExpat said:

Slow shaving either armpits or pubes seems to cause that softlock. Had that happen every time I did the slow shave rather than the quick shave. Not sure what the problem is.

Indeed, there is a bug in the script. Will be fixed in the next update.

 

3 hours ago, KentuckyExpat said:

Being hetero I can't speak from personal experience IRL but in the Dibella Quest my rationale in-game is - I'm a guy that likes girls, but I find myself becoming more and more attracted to the idea of becoming a woman.... but I still like girls, so, outwardly, my orientation changes from hetero to lesbian, but it's really not my orientation that changes, it's my gender.

I will add an MCM option to let the player swap sexual orientation upon gender change (i. e. heterosexual male become homosexual female)

Edited March 27 by emily1673

[monsta88]

On 3/24/2024 at 6:29 AM, emily1673 said:

I have a very long list of things to be added or corrected, many are suggestions from this board, many are my own. The list is already so long that I make not much difference to add even more to it; and certainly I would have to stop modding if I would see it as a burden.

 

Just some practical advices, take it or leave it (I also don't assume that you are doing it differently, this may be a completely unnecessary wall of text):

 

Have your list prioritized. Base the priority on anything you want, but I'd say the most important factor for a hobby project is to not change into "work". Prioritize high those things which interest You, things which you have fun creating. Do not listen to us too much.   Once you have a priority list (sort of like a roadmap), you will see things much clearer. Revise the priority list every 3-4 months (or any time period you feel comfortable with, but no too often).

 

That being said, bugfixing is very important, because bugs can ruin the experience for the players. Also, if they are left unattended, it is much harder to fix them later, when you don't remember how the given feature worked exactly. They can also hurt your reputation as a modder (although I assume you are not doing this for reputation). I won't name names, but I stopped using mods from certain people, because their mods are full with gamebreaking bugs.

 

Have a critical eye for feature requests from us, users. The users often don't know what they want, they just have a "cool idea", which they'd like to see. But since most people are not developers or tech savvy enough to know how things work in CK, they don't know how much effort would be to create this or that feature. A lot of the times different feature requests can be molded into something new, more robust feature, which would serve multiple purposes. But you always need to weight all requests if they are worth doing or not. Say No if you don't like it, or you don't feel motivated to do it. If you are bad at saying No, just add these features to the bottom of your priority list.  This is Your mod, so you decide. We are of course happy if you include some of our suggestions, but ultimately it is up to You.

 

Try to concentrate on only 1 major feature at a time. It really helps to make it happen. If a developer tries to do 5-6 things at the same time, it slows down work significantly. There is a lot of context switch, you lose time when you try to remember where you were on feature x, you have trouble concentrating because your mind keeps jumping back to feature y, etc.

 

Release often. We are your testers, so we can help to pinpoint issues, give feedback, etc. It is much better to realize that a new feature works badly with some other mod early than to realize it when it is completely done. Also, people can jump on the wagon early and may help with things, like json files or ideas how to make things easier or better. Take this advice with a grain of salt though, because it also requires more of your time to go through the feedback.

 

Try to have patience towards users. The mod is very big and the support thread is huge. Even the main page of the mod is something which most people won't read, because there are so much information there. Nobody can know everything about how the mod work or should work (I wouldn't be surprised if even you would have a hard time to remember all the intricacies of this mod). So we will repeat stupid questions, we expect things to work this way even if the mod description clearly says that it works that way. The good news is that some advanced, old time users will help the new ones sometimes, so it is not all on you alone.

 

Sorry, this became longer than I expected and I could write even more, so I better stop it here. The main point is to have fun!

Edited March 27 by monsta88

[KentuckyExpat]

There appears to be a conflict between the Dibella Quest and the mod, Go to Bed. The conflict seems to occur in the latter stages of the Dibella Quest, specifically when you are advised to go sleep in the inn following Proventus giving you a new name. Here's what can happen - Your character goes to the Bannered Mare, you rent the room, go upstairs, get in bed and go to sleep. When you awaken a new stage should be triggered but it doesn't , nothing happens. What is supposed to happen are two things - you should get a message that your bondage boots have spontaneously dropped off your feet and that you should go see the doctor because your misshapen feet make it hard to walk. Disabling Go to Bed prior going to sleep seems to correct the problem.

 

[emily1673]

10 hours ago, monsta88 said:

 

Just some practical advices, take it or leave it (I also don't assume that you are doing it differently, this may be a completely unnecessary wall of text):

<snip>

Excellent summary! Seems you can exactly read my thoughts

 

Here is my current roadmap:

 

next update:

1. finish main line of the Dibella quest

2. new super cool top secret feature 😁

 

upcoming:

Dibella quest: redo dialogues; make it easier to progress at some stages; add the BoS ending

 

further down the road:

revamp the system how NPCs react on the players outfit and fashion

"being cheated/forced" line of the Dibella quest

 

 

3 hours ago, KentuckyExpat said:

There appears to be a conflict between the Dibella Quest and the mod, Go to Bed. The conflict seems to occur in the latter stages of the Dibella Quest, specifically when you are advised to go sleep in the inn following Proventus giving you a new name. Here's what can happen - Your character goes to the Bannered Mare, you rent the room, go upstairs, get in bed and go to sleep. When you awaken a new stage should be triggered but it doesn't , nothing happens. What is supposed to happen are two things - you should get a message that your bondage boots have spontaneously dropped off your feet and that you should go see the doctor because your misshapen feet make it hard to walk. Disabling Go to Bed prior going to sleep seems to correct the problem.

 

Yes, this a known incompatibility (not the fault of YPS though). I am considering to change the way the quest advances at this stage. But please use a workaround for the time being (-(=disable the mod).

[Balgin]

2 hours ago, emily1673 said:

"being cheated/forced" line of the Dibella quest

I mean that's kind of there already if you pay attention.

[anonymous515]

3 hours ago, Balgin said:

I mean that's kind of there already if you pay attention.

 

There are several areas, specifically around the Whiterun name change, especially around the visagiste makeover options, and the wearing of female clothes, that were intended by Emily to showcase the player's gradual acceptance of their new female identity. Those areas were a change from the baseline start where the player initially resisted the changes. She's talking about a fork of the quest where the player continues to be resistant but continues to be cheated/forced.

[KentuckyExpat]

22 hours ago, emily1673 said:

Indeed, there is a bug in the script. Will be fixed in the next update.

 

I will add an MCM option to let the player swap sexual orientation upon gender change (i. e. heterosexual male become homosexual female)

That would be convenient but really, it's just two changes now. Change orientation from "Heterosexual"  to "Lesbian" in the SexLab mod and in the NPC Interaction option in YPS. That's what I do when playing a guy with YPS in the modlist.

[Balgin]

4 hours ago, anonymous515 said:

 

There are several areas, specifically around the Whiterun name change, especially around the visagiste makeover options, and the wearing of female clothes, that were intended by Emily to showcase the player's gradual acceptance of their new female identity. Those areas were a change from the baseline start where the player initially resisted the changes. She's talking about a fork of the quest where the player continues to be resistant but continues to be cheated/forced.

Yes. I saw a hint at that on the roadmap.

[kapibar]

On 3/27/2024 at 5:02 AM, KentuckyExpat said:

Being hetero I can't speak from personal experience IRL but in the Dibella Quest my rationale in-game is - I'm a guy that likes girls, but I find myself becoming more and more attracted to the idea of becoming a woman.... but I still like girls, so, outwardly, my orientation changes from hetero to lesbian, but it's really not my orientation that changes, it's my gender.

Yup, and that's exactly my point - the preference doesn't change. And logically it shouldn't, nothing in the plot suggests otherwise. Gender change is more of a self image thing, while sexual preference is - well - preference.

[xXDawnCasterXx]

Hey, I feel dumb asking this but who do you go to to remove welded piercings

 

[Balgin]

25 minutes ago, xXDawnCasterXx said:

Hey, I feel dumb asking this but who do you go to to remove welded piercings

 

The same person who welded them.

[emily1673]

16 hours ago, Balgin said:

I mean that's kind of there already if you pay attention.

Right now it's more like being cheated into the illusion that you want it yourself. (Which is of course difficult, but that's what I've been trying to achieve.)

The other quest branch will be: being very obviously cheated into something you don't want at all.

And then there will be a third line, "I really want the changes", which will (optionally) lead to the BoS ending.

Edited March 28 by emily1673

[xXDawnCasterXx]

8 hours ago, Balgin said:

The same person who welded them.

 

So, as part of the infibulation quest, Tiz doesn't offer to remove them, also the quest just gets stuck as saying go to the basement.

Edited March 28 by xXDawnCasterXx

[Balgin]

2 hours ago, xXDawnCasterXx said:

 

So, as part of the infibulation quest, Tiz doesn't offer to remove them, also the quest just gets stuck as saying go to the basement.

Ah, no, that's a separate issue entirely. In that case you want to go and show them to a blacksmith or one of the nurses in Whiterun (it might also need to be a male blacksmith or even, only the Riverwood blacksmith, in an older version of the mod). They'll direct you to the priest in Whiterun (the one who spends all his time in the temple healing the sick and wounded). He should be able to tell you what to do.

[xXDawnCasterXx]

3 hours ago, Balgin said:

Ah, no, that's a separate issue entirely. In that case you want to go and show them to a blacksmith or one of the nurses in Whiterun (it might also need to be a male blacksmith or even, only the Riverwood blacksmith, in an older version of the mod). They'll direct you to the priest in Whiterun (the one who spends all his time in the temple healing the sick and wounded). He should be able to tell you what to do.

So I have spoken with several blacksmiths including the Riverwood one and some other smiths, Also checked with the nurse in Whiterun, no one says anything.