General non sexual physics for creatures?

[Skooma_bodyshots]

I'm a tad new at this so and just trying to figure out how it all works. I"m more of a normie than you'd normally see here but i like immersion and accuracy and i just started playing skyrim vr for the first time and i'm having a blast. I've basically modded everything to be anatomically accurate and all the humanoid race npcs have plausible looking parts with physics and i have that all working (TNG, CBBE, 3ba, faster smp, cbpc, pandora all the basic stuff.) just because i like the more biologically plausible aspect of it and it's also just sometimes amusing. I've put in quite a few creature replacer mods with anatomical accuracy and even the physics enabled creature mods i find on nexus don't have working physics. I also have ANNA the anatomically correct wildlife replacer which i know is just the models from MNC without all their aroused meshes and it appears there's .hkx files bundled with each creature and i've randomly stumbled across some of the adult gifs made with MNC and it sure looks like there IS working physics on some of the extra parts  that aren't the aroused meshes (I Could be wrong, maybe it's all hand animated.). 

I guess my questions is IS there general non collision physics on some of these models like the stuff in anna/mnc? Are there specific things that have to be done to get creature physics working in general on models that are set up for it? From what i understand you have to have a working config file to get a lot of creature physics to work and some of the ones i've downloaded off nexus have cbpc configs bundled with them yet I still get zero physics. I run FNIS (I mainly use pandora but most of these mods say fnis is required so i tried that too.) and it shows animations are being generated but i see no physics.

As much as i like the ANNA mod it's a bit odd to have these nicely animated creatures with parts that are completely stationary, some swaying gargoyle cock and balls would be nice if it's set up for it. I guess i'm just trying to make sense out of all of this and for obvious reasons this isn't the sort of question i can ask in a general skyrim mod list discord or whatever. 

Again i'm not interested in collisions or sexlab animations etc, i'm just wondering if there's physics on these models and if i need some other framework or config or something to get creature physics working in general with just the normal vanilla animations of the game. Does abc/mnc/sl/asos/cf any of that provide this functionality?"

Bonus points if you can recommend some great anatomically correct creature replacers i might not be aware of. If there's just a guide to how all this works feel free to just link it. Thanks in advance!

[traison]

1 hour ago, Skooma_bodyshots said:

I mainly use pandora but most of these mods say fnis is required so i tried that too.

 

They both write the same behaviour files so running both makes no sense. You'll need the FNIS scripts and plugin though, as the plugin in Pandora is nothing but a skeleton and it's missing all the scripts that mods like SL and XPMSE will be looking for. Install both, make sure FNIS wins conflicts, and use only one of them.

 

1 hour ago, Skooma_bodyshots said:

I run FNIS and it shows animations are being generated but i see no physics.

 

FNIS has nothing to do with physics.

 

1 hour ago, Skooma_bodyshots said:

Again i'm not interested in collisions or sexlab animations etc, i'm just wondering if there's physics on these models and if i need some other framework or config or something to get creature physics working in general with just the normal vanilla animations of the game.

 

I don't see why it wouldn't be possible to have physics on dongs. A framework on top of CBPC/SMP sounds like bloat.

 

1 hour ago, Skooma_bodyshots said:

Does abc/mnc/sl/asos/cf any of that provide this functionality?

 

ABC, SL and CF+MNC: No.

ASOS: Yes, using CPBC last I checked. According to my notes ASOS is not compatible with ABC. That may have changed.

Edited July 17 by traison

[Skooma_bodyshots]

Okay, thanks for responding! I will check out asos again, i was aware of it but it lists all this other stuff as dependencies. https://www.loverslab.com/files/file/8666-animal-sos-se/. I guess it's only dependent on that stuff i you want the full functionality for creature scripted animations/sex lab stuff.

But yes when i said i have fnis and pandora i just meant i've tried both and have both installed but i disabled one and it's outputs and then tried the other just to test this. I don't run both simultaneously. ANd which fnis plugins are you referring to? In all the tutorials all i saw was fnis creature pack and to enable the skeleton arm fix option when processing the animations with fnis. Is there something else i might need besides asos and the creature pack for fnis? 

 

Edited July 18 by Skooma_bodyshots

[Skooma_bodyshots]

Gonna post one more time even though it seems like nobody actually understands how any of this works but i'm really trying to. So again i am modding everything in my game to be anatomically correct. 

I've successfully replaced the gargoyle model one with one from the asos package which has all the bones needed for physics and hte configs to drive them. I added it to the creature replacer mod pack i have and its actually working, but the gargoyle has a physics enabled permanent hard one i'd like to make a flaccid floppy wang. Don'tt get me wrong the physics on his cock looks great but i'm trying to change it so he's not hard all the time. I don't have sos, or animal sos or mnc or sl or any of that running as i'm sure this is dictated by a config...somewhere.

I assumed this is driven by the asos config but i really can't make sense of how these configs work and what specifically is driving what. I've tried editing the parameters from other regular sos configs with appropriate floppiness into the asos one and it seems to do utterly nothing. There's a high and low config which i assume is for arousal state and they don't seem to make any difference if i overwrite them. I know a config is dictating the movement but can anybody help me understand where it is? 

Here's a copy of the configs and a screenshot of the bones in nifskope (It's the gargoyle from asos and probably mnc). Is there ANYBODY who knows how this all works? Surely somebody has to know. I really want to just learn how this all works. Any help would be appreciated. Even if there's just a link to how specifically male genital physics config editing works for cbpc. I've looked and best i can tell no such thing exists. I could probably write a phd dissertation on tit and ass physics but creature dick physics seem to be like some eldritch knowledge nobody has access to. 

CBPConfig_ASOS.txt CBPCMasterConfig.txt

Edited July 21 by Skooma_bodyshots

[traison]

29 minutes ago, Skooma_bodyshots said:

I assumed this is driven by the asos config but i really can't make sense of how these configs work and what specifically is driving what. I've tried editing the parameters from other regular sos configs with appropriate floppiness into the asos one and it seems to do utterly nothing. There's a high and low config which i assume is for arousal state and they don't seem to make any difference if i overwrite them. I know a config is dictating the movement but can anybody help me understand where it is?

 

There's a paper on this in my signature.

 

29 minutes ago, Skooma_bodyshots said:

Any help would be appreciated. ... I've looked and best i can tell no such thing exists. I could probably write a phd dissertation on tit and ass physics but creature dick physics seem to be like some eldritch knowledge nobody has access to.

 

I spent well over a year writing SMP and CBPC documentation for myself because the publicly available resources (at least a the time) were lacking or non-existant.

 

Q: Why not release them?

A: Because most of it is guesses based on observations. The later things are guesses based on the source code.

 

Q: So you're just being annoying?

A: I share as much as I can answering specific questions.

 

29 minutes ago, Skooma_bodyshots said:

Here's a copy of the configs and a screenshot of the bones in nifskope...

 

Note that your configs are bound to the Lag bones, whereas the ones you screenshotted are the regular ones:

 

GenitalsLag01=GenitalsLag01

vs

NPC Genitals01 [Gen01]

 

CBPC is not bound to those nodes. The physics you're seeing are coming from somewhere else, like SMP or they could be build into an animation. Explaining why your config changes achieve nothing.

 

Edit: If I remember correctly, it's not possible to slap physics directly onto the non-Lag bones. I recall trying and all values resulted in intense jittering or other glitching. It's possible animated bones can't have physics, or something along these lines.

Edited July 21 by traison

[Skooma_bodyshots]

52 minutes ago, traison said:

 

There's a paper on this in my signature.

 

 

I spent well over a year writing SMP and CBPC documentation for myself because the publicly available resources (at least a the time) were lacking or non-existant.

 

Q: Why not release them?

A: Because most of it is guesses based on observations. The later things are guesses based on the source code.

 

Q: So you're just being annoying?

A: I share as much as I can answering specific questions.

 

 

Note that your configs are bound to the Lag bones, whereas the ones you screenshotted are the regular ones:

 

GenitalsLag01=GenitalsLag01

vs

NPC Genitals01 [Gen01]

 

CBPC is not bound to those nodes. The physics you're seeing are coming from somewhere else, like SMP or they could be build into an animation. Explaining why your config changes achieve nothing.

 

Edit: If I remember correctly, it's not possible to slap physics directly onto the non-Lag bones. I recall trying and all values resulted in intense jittering or other glitching. It's possible animated bones can't have physics, or something along these lines.

Okay interesting. after digging around through thte package again there ARE .xml files. I made the correct filepath to the gargoyle one and it has no change. It's so weird. A lot of the floppy dong creature replacers i have are just hdt driven but this SHOULD be mapping to the correct .xml file yet again there's zero difference in game. 

Something is giving it physics that is directing it to keep it's shape i feel like but i just can't make sense of it. i'ts definitely not an animation. 

Edited July 21 by Skooma_bodyshots

[traison]

Were I in your shoes, I'd disable CBPC and SMP. Get to a point where you have control over the situation - in this case, no physics is easiest to achieve. Enable them one at a time until you have physics again, then figure out why that is.

 

Edit: When I said "figure out why that is" I mean if changing the config file you suspect is adding physics appears to do nothing, then remove it until you have no physics again: "in this case, no physics is easiest to achieve."

Edited July 21 by traison

[Skooma_bodyshots]

30 minutes ago, traison said:

Were I in your shoes, I'd disable CBPC and SMP. Get to a point where you have control over the situation - in this case, no physics is easiest to achieve. Enable them one at a time until you have physics again, then figure out why that is.

 

Edit: When I said "figure out why that is" I mean if changing the config file you suspect is adding physics appears to do nothing, then remove it until you have no physics again: "in this case, no physics is easiest to achieve."

Yeah, i guess that could demystify it. That's not a bad idea. I have a feeling i'm SOL and will have to just revert back to my static flaccid versions from the creature replacer mod which just aren't near as fun or realistic. 

[Skooma_bodyshots]

I'm pretty damn sure i know what's going on and i tried the most logical fix. 

The only bones mapped in the config are the genital lag bones and not the npc genital bones themselves. So we have the lag physics being applied to the genital lag bones but the npc genital bones are retaining the straight shape which is the default rest pose of the mod (And every mod i have with a physics cock, not sure how to make it flop like my tng cocks.). The easiest way to deal with this since the physics look great it seemed like would be to just change the default shape of the cock in the .nif file so you would have a flaccid looking cock that sways about. I looked up how to do this and transfer the weights in blender and did it. (Image)  
I went back to the only place i knew of left (I finished dawnguard so gargoyle spawns are super random and console spawning is just not working at all.) with some guaranteed gargoyle spawns (statue spawns in bloodlet throne) and just to test it i replaced EVERY single gargoyle variant mesh in my creature replacer with the corrected version and it's still getting a totally straight cock mesh and bones from somewhere and i have no clue where. That or somehow in game despite this being the new rest pose in the .nif something is straightening out the cock and i have no clue what. I don't have asos or any animations installed. Just the cbpc configs, the creature .nifs and the xml file. 

Utterly baffling. 

Another dead end. I"ve found a bunch of people trying to accomplish what i am and nobody seems to have figured this out. 

I think the next question is. If i dont' want any of the arousal stuff, no aroused meshes on any ambient animals, just everything with physics in a flaccid state AND i have the new gentelman and can't use SOS. is there any cobination of sexlab/mnc or anything else that could accomplish what i'm trying to do here.

 

Edited July 23 by Skooma_bodyshots

[traison]

10 hours ago, Skooma_bodyshots said:

...it's still getting a totally straight cock mesh and bones from somewhere and i have no clue where.

 

More Informative Console can show you where it's coming from. Look for equipped armors.

[Skooma_bodyshots]

Okay so for posterity if anybody finds this. The reason as traison correctly stated that i didn't really understand why the gargoyles had boners is because yes, the lag bones are the only thing receiving physics, not the actual skeleton bones and I took the .nif from the mod animal SOS which uses bone scaling for arousal states so the default posing/bind position would be with a fully extended straight dick because that's how the creator would model and rig the thing and the way cbpc physics work is that it's not REAL physics, it is, but it's not like cloth physics, it's more like, you have a default position of a bone and physics can layer on top of that but everything will deviate around the reference point of the default position of the bones. 

I tried for quite some time to figure out a way to make a new resting pose for those bones but nothing worked. I could not figure out how the damn animation rigs and skin binding worked in blender on these rigs so that was a dead end. 

ASOS supplies the animations that make the cocks flaccid and sexlab aroused controls them. So unless you want all the creatures to have floppy boners just trying to swap .nif creature files ain't gonna work.

The actual solution to what i wanted to do which was jus thave everything in the game anatomically correct, with physics for realism ended up not being that hard. so if you want to do it this is what you have to do. I am playing in vr and can confirm this works in vr. 

Install these mods and not in this order, consult each mod page for their load orders and instructions and dependencies: 

Animal SOS

SOS* (Keep reading if you have TNG like i do cuz SOS will not work with it. and if you have vr sos is problematic and outdated anyways.) 

Sexlab 

Sexlab aroused redux. 

Sexlab VR patch

Creature framework

FNIS

FNIS creature pack 

More nasty critters (Not sure why. i'm not even using it but for some reason ASOS lists it as a dependency even though ASOS has all it's own meshes.)

Once all that's installed run FNIS and check skeleton arm patch (Not sure if pandora even works for all this. If anybody can confirm ti does you should use that instead.) 

After you install these get the mastersremover script from  nexus and install it in the edit script folder for xedit. IF YOU'RE USING THE LATEST VERSIONS OF THIS STUFF YOU CAN SKIP THIS AND THE NEXT STEP as SOS isn't even listed as a master dependency for anything. I just deleted it.

After you install all of that stuff open the ANIMAL SOS ESP with xedit and select run script > choose master remover > remove SOS. Then you can install SOS and continue using TNG if you have it. 

It takes awhile for all these new mcms to load but go in and take out the weirdest stuff in the creature frameowrk menu (None of my skeletons or robots have cocks 😂 but i bet that's amusing.) and disable arousal and arousal animations everywhere you find them in both the sexlab aroused, sexlab animations and wherever you find it in any of these new mcm menus so none of the creatures get horny. 

After that enable creature animations in sexlab. 

Once all the mcm's load just restart your game and voila. All the creatures practically in the game have realistic, not too silly looking and quite naturally moving physics based parts. No more ken doll trolls and other creatures you would expect to be naked and have anatomy have them. If you want to fuck them, that's cool, but you'll have to look elsewhere  (Anwhere else here lol) for advice on that. 

While this might seem like a lot of trouble for something very trivial it really wasn't hard and it all went off without a hitch. 

Edited July 25 by Skooma_bodyshots