How do I determine which mod is the issue when they're all interdependent on one another? **SOLVED**

[amenshawn]

I got the basics to load and run via SKSE64 using MO2, so I know the game got loaded correctly, and the basic mods worked.  Then I stared loading up SexLab and things stopped launching.  My problem is that all the sexlab mods have master files that are all dependent on each other, so I can't figure out which one is causing me issues by just loading one at a time.  I ran LOOT and cleaned the plugins, I have no missing master files, and I cleared my overwrite folder.  I feel like I'm missing something simple.  I get the 'locked' screen for MO2, then it just unlocks without launching.  Can you folks take a look at my load order and see what I fucked up?  I've been trying to figure this out for two days straight...

 

***FIXED***

Edited May 18, 2023 by amenshawn

[Dodzh]

not an easy task tbh, just need to load them in groups until you narrow down what the problem is. I sure hope you not doing this with a save you care about, deleting mods mid game not such a good idea

[amenshawn]

7 minutes ago, Dodzh said:

not an easy task tbh, just need to load them in groups until you narrow down what the problem is. I sure hope you not doing this with a save you care about, deleting mods mid game not such a good idea

 

Nope.  Fresh install on a new PC, building from the ground up.

[libertyordeath]

1. For posting long stuff like LOs, you can put them in spoiler-tags to create a collapsible list. 

 

2. Your SL mods may be interdependent, but the SL foundation itself is not. That foundation is pretty much just SL, SLA, CF and MNC. Those four - plus maybe ZAZ - are what truely almost everything else depends on (which makes it such a PITA to debug or replace anything within that foundation). So for starters, you could just disable all SL mods, except for SL, SLA, CF, MNC and ZAZ, and then check if the game runs with just those 5. This way you know at least the foundation is working properly. It would also recommend starting any new game with just those 5. Make sure they run properly, before activating the rest.

 

3. I'm sure lots of people will disagree with me on this, but LOOT is a tool for lamers. And i mean that in a factual way, not a condescending one. Why do i think that way? Because every LO generated by LOOT is unreadable to humans. This means there's no way to use LOOT as an "assisting" tool: Instead either LOOT manages the LO or the user does so manually. There's nothing in between. Is using LOOT better than no LO control? Yes. Is LOOT better than a user who is clueless about how skyrim modding works? Also yes. That's what i meant by "LOOT is for lamers". But the problem is: Not only do you lose control over the LO, but others like me also can no longer (be bothered to) make sense of your LO. 

 

EDIT: Notice that you don't need a savegame to merely test if the game runs at all. Instead you can just launch skyrim. Open the console in the mainmenu and type "coc riverwood". In addition to saving time and not putting saves at risk, it also has the nice sideeffect of excluding savegame corruption: If the COC test works, but your savegame does not, then the problem is within the save.

Edited May 17, 2023 by libertyordeath

[bnub345]

There are a lot of things that could be causing issues, and just your load order is not much to go with.

• In general, it is not a good modding practice to throw a bunch of mods into your load order at once and hope for the best. If you have a problem, you now have to go through and disable each new mod one by one until you find the problem. There is no circular dependency, where multiple mods are each others' master. I would make sure just Sexlab works and go from there.
• If FNIS isn't working properly the game won't launch. Make sure there are no warnings in your FNIS log. Most often people download anims for LE, which will not work on SE. Also, there is an anim limit in Skyrim, and if you have too many the game will crash. There are mods to increase this limit.
• All mods with an SKSE plugin ( .dll file) must be for the proper version of your game. Anything for v1.5.97 is labeled SE, anything v1.6+ is AE.
• Even if you are not missing masters, you may be missing a non-plugin mod dependency. Also sometimes these utility mods might have older or incompatible versions bundled with larger mods. Check things like JContainers and PapyrusUtil and make sure they are not overwritten.
• There are certain bug fix and stability patch mods that everyone should use. Make sure you have SSE Engine fixes at least.

Also, this isn't a technical issue, but you are using flowergirls and sexlab at the same time. FG was made as a stripped down lite alternative to SL, so why you would use both is beyond me. 

[amenshawn]

1 hour ago, libertyordeath said:

1. For posting long stuff like LOs, you can put them in spoiler-tags to create a collapsible list. 

 

2. Your SL mods may be interdependent, but the SL foundation itself is not. That foundation is pretty much just SL, SLA, CF and MNC. Those four - plus maybe ZAZ - are what truely almost everything else depends on (which makes it such a PITA to debug or replace anything within that foundation). So for starters, you could just disable all SL mods, except for SL, SLA, CF, MNC and ZAZ, and then check if the game runs with just those 5. This way you know at least the foundation is working properly. It would also recommend starting any new game with just those 5. Make sure they run properly, before activating the rest.

 

3. I'm sure lots of people will disagree with me on this, but LOOT is a tool for lamers. And i mean that in a factual way, not a condescending one. Why do i think that way? Because every LO generated by LOOT is unreadable to humans. This means there's no way to use LOOT as an "assisting" tool: Instead either LOOT manages the LO or the user does so manually. There's nothing in between. Is using LOOT better than no LO control? Yes. Is LOOT better than a user who is clueless about how skyrim modding works? Also yes. That's what i meant by "LOOT is for lamers". But the problem is: Not only do you lose control over the LO, but others like me also can no longer (be bothered to) make sense of your LO. 

 

EDIT: Notice that you don't need a savegame to merely test if the game runs at all. Instead you can just launch skyrim. Open the console in the mainmenu and type "coc riverwood". In addition to saving time and not putting saves at risk, it also has the nice sideeffect of excluding savegame corruption: If the COC test works, but your savegame does not, then the problem is within the save.

 

Thank you.  I'm not good at this.  If I had to give an example of my skill level with modding, the scene in the first Avengers movie where Cap says "It seems to run on some form of electricity." pretty much sums me up.  Honestly, I'm just doing what the AICave 'how-to' videos tell me and trying not to break anything.  I use the tools they point me toward because at least they know what they're doing.  If one of the tools tells me to add a mod because another mod I want to run needs it, I add the mod.  I do read the mod requirement lists and the other instructions of the mods, but inevitably one mod ends up contradicting another in the load order instructions, so I just hit it with LOOT and hope for the best.  I'll try your solution and see if it will launch with just those and go from there.  

[amenshawn]

1 hour ago, bnub345 said:

There are a lot of things that could be causing issues, and just your load order is not much to go with.

• In general, it is not a good modding practice to throw a bunch of mods into your load order at once and hope for the best. If you have a problem, you now have to go through and disable each new mod one by one until you find the problem. There is no circular dependency, where multiple mods are each others' master. I would make sure just Sexlab works and go from there.
• If FNIS isn't working properly the game won't launch. Make sure there are no warnings in your FNIS log. Most often people download anims for LE, which will not work on SE. Also, there is an anim limit in Skyrim, and if you have too many the game will crash. There are mods to increase this limit.
• All mods with an SKSE plugin ( .dll file) must be for the proper version of your game. Anything for v1.5.97 is labeled SE, anything v1.6+ is AE.
• Even if you are not missing masters, you may be missing a non-plugin mod dependency. Also sometimes these utility mods might have older or incompatible versions bundled with larger mods. Check things like JContainers and PapyrusUtil and make sure they are not overwritten.
• There are certain bug fix and stability patch mods that everyone should use. Make sure you have SSE Engine fixes at least.

Also, this isn't a technical issue, but you are using flowergirls and sexlab at the same time. FG was made as a stripped down lite alternative to SL, so why you would use both is beyond me. 

I'm using FG and SL because MO2 told me some of the mods had missing masters.  Simple as that.  I'm just a potato doing what the tools tell me.

[traison]

With missing masters you usually see at least something, be it a black screen or the main menu background. This smells more like an skse version issue or a very early crash. If your skse version is correct* then grab this and see if it spits out a log for you.

 

* And don't trust steam or any other platform to tell you what version you have, purchase receipts mean nothing in the age where companies can replace (remove) games on your virtual shelf without you noticing. Yes I'm looking at you Blizzard, scumbags. But I digress, the version information associated with SkyrimSE.exe is the only thing that matters.