Weight changing bug

[cold steel]

Hello everyone, I hope someone know how to fix my problem. I imported femalebody_0 and femalebody_1 in blender and exported it to skyrim. This bodies works fine in the game but there is a bug when I am changing weight. When I am using weight=1 then I have mine femalebody_0 and it looks fine. When I am changing weight from 2 to 99 then there is a bug with right leg where some vertices moved not correctly(and little bug with hands and waist), but when I set weight on 100 then I have mine femalebody_1 without bugs : Here is mine screenshot with 50% weight

 Someone please help me to fix this problem if you know how.

[Ark of Truth]

One or more of the skeleton nodes is out of place.

 

If you go through this guys videos, he explains how to deal with those bugs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSpL13jVF34&list=PL38C28CE97107F8F3

[cold steel]

One or more of the skeleton nodes is out of place.

 

If you go through this guys videos, he explains how to deal with those bugs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSpL13jVF34&list=PL38C28CE97107F8F3

Thanks for your link, but I still can't find video where he explain how to fix this problem. I found video where he explain that _0 and _1 nif files must have the same size or weight change will not work. My files have the same size and weight change is working, but with some bugs

[cold steel]

Guys, I created two new BBP bodies in bodyslide. This time it is not TBBP bodies, but after I edited femalebody_1 in blender there is again this fucking bug with few vertices on left leg. Why this is happened only with character weight 2-99? That mean Skyrim can't create weight changing correctly for some reason. Please someone can told me how to fix it? I tried to use the same skeletons with created bodies like it was created in bodyslide. I tried to export femalebody_1 with one skeleton and femalebody_0 with the same skeleton and every time I have this bug in the game. I want to know only one thing - WHY SKYRIM can not create weight change slider correctly after editing bodies in blender or in 3ds max?

[jacques00]

Guys, I created two new BBP bodies in bodyslide. This time it is not TBBP bodies, but after I edited femalebody_1 in blender there is again this fucking bug with few vertices on left leg. Why this is happened only with character weight 2-99? That mean Skyrim can't create weight changing correctly for some reason. Please someone can told me how to fix it? I tried to use the same skeletons with created bodies like it was created in bodyslide. I tried to export femalebody_1 with one skeleton and femalebody_0 with the same skeleton and every time I have this bug in the game. I want to know only one thing - WHY SKYRIM can not create weight change slider correctly after editing bodies in blender or in 3ds max?

 

I do not have a solution, but I can also confirm this issue. I do not have this problem on the nude female body (on TBBP+Belly custom mesh), however, but it does appear on other clothed/armored bodies edited by the BodySlider, one in particular is the CB++-compatible Aradia Lace Dress.

 

I don't think it's a skeleton issue since the skeleton is consistent throughout, so it must have something to do with either a vertex count or vertex orientation that is off on the model's BodySlider shape data. I haven't pinpointed it, but if the problem is spawning from the mesh, it most likely is coming from that source (it could be because the source .nif doesn't necessarily match the .bsd morph files for those particular vertices). So while the extremes (_0 and _1) look fine, the transitional morph blends don't look all that nice because some vertices decide to jut out in miscalculation.

 

Then again, I could be wrong, but I'm just estimating based on my experience.

 

[cold steel]

 

Guys, I created two new BBP bodies in bodyslide. This time it is not TBBP bodies, but after I edited femalebody_1 in blender there is again this fucking bug with few vertices on left leg. Why this is happened only with character weight 2-99? That mean Skyrim can't create weight changing correctly for some reason. Please someone can told me how to fix it? I tried to use the same skeletons with created bodies like it was created in bodyslide. I tried to export femalebody_1 with one skeleton and femalebody_0 with the same skeleton and every time I have this bug in the game. I want to know only one thing - WHY SKYRIM can not create weight change slider correctly after editing bodies in blender or in 3ds max?

 

I do not have a solution, but I can also confirm this issue. I do not have this problem on the nude female body (on TBBP+Belly custom mesh), however, but it does appear on other clothed/armored bodies edited by the BodySlider, one in particular is the CB++-compatible Aradia Lace Dress.

 

I don't think it's a skeleton issue since the skeleton is consistent throughout, so it must have something to do with either a vertex count or vertex orientation that is off on the model's BodySlider shape data. I haven't pinpointed it, but if the problem is spawning from the mesh, it most likely is coming from that source (it could be because the source .nif doesn't necessarily match the .bsd morph files for those particular vertices). So while the extremes (_0 and _1) look fine, the transitional morph blends don't look all that nice because some vertices decide to jut out in miscalculation.

 

Then again, I could be wrong, but I'm just estimating based on my experience.

 

 

I am not very good in english, but if I understand correctly you mean that I must have different count of vertices on femalebody_0 and femalebody_1? By the way, this bodies work without any bugs if I just created it in bodyslide and install in the game. I have this bug only when I imported bodies to blender and the exported it. And at my new bodies there is only deformation on left leg, and only with 4-6 vertices. I can't understand why this is happened. I can upload my bodies here or make new screenshots if it can help someone to find a solution. 

[cold steel]

Argh, now I tried to import and export different body types from blender, which I created in bodyslide  and every time when I check bodies in the game I have this bugs with different vertices. BBP body, TBBP body, all of them have this bugs. Guys, is there someone who can import and export bodies from blender without any bugs in the game in weight changing slider? IS IT REAL or not? I even tried to take femalebody_1 which I used like femalebody_0, edit it in blender and then use it like femalebody_1 - again this fucking bug with left leg. HOW the hell people can edit meshes in blender without weight changing bugs?

[Guest kimbale]

Argh, now I tried to import and export different body types from blender, which I created in bodyslide  and every time when I check bodies in the game I have this bugs with different vertices. BBP body, TBBP body, all of them have this bugs. Guys, is there someone who can import and export bodies from blender without any bugs in the game in weight changing slider? IS IT REAL or not? I even tried to take femalebody_1 which I used like femalebody_0, edit it in blender and then use it like femalebody_1 - again this fucking bug with left leg. HOW the hell people can edit meshes in blender without weight changing bugs?

 

Endless patience. When i first made an armor i had similar problems, only thing to do is tweak one of the models until it works. Try not to use any automated tools from blender (or any other 3d editor), as they often do unwanted/unseen stuff to your meshes. In the end i made it by carefully moving single mesh points with the base mesh edit, checking every small change in skyrim and rollback if the was any mesh problem. That is the only way to be sure, i think...

[cold steel]

 

Argh, now I tried to import and export different body types from blender, which I created in bodyslide  and every time when I check bodies in the game I have this bugs with different vertices. BBP body, TBBP body, all of them have this bugs. Guys, is there someone who can import and export bodies from blender without any bugs in the game in weight changing slider? IS IT REAL or not? I even tried to take femalebody_1 which I used like femalebody_0, edit it in blender and then use it like femalebody_1 - again this fucking bug with left leg. HOW the hell people can edit meshes in blender without weight changing bugs?

 

Endless patience. When i first made an armor i had similar problems, only thing to do is tweak one of the models until it works. Try not to use any automated tools from blender (or any other 3d editor), as they often do unwanted/unseen stuff to your meshes. In the end i made it by carefully moving single mesh points with the base mesh edit, checking every small change in skyrim and rollback if the was any mesh problem. That is the only way to be sure, i think...

 

But I don't know what I must check? I am not using automated tools. I just imported meshes in blender and export it to Skyrim. That is all, I even don't changed anything in this meshes. Oh, there is only one thing which I used - Set Smooth option, because if I just import mesh without it then in the game it is not roundness. By the way, this option I need to use only with bodyslide bodies. Hm, will try to take some body not from bodyslide.

[cold steel]

Facepalm, tried to import manga body in blender and it imported two meshes with different count of vertices(((( I don't know, maybe it is unreal to edit bodies with this blender scripts?

[Guest kimbale]

Something like the smooth tool is exactly what i meant with "blender tools", it most likely changes vert count. Smoothing is mostly done by putting more verts into a face and making the angles between each pair of verts smaller. Skyrim wouldn't know where those verts come from and go apeshit vertexploding on everything between 2 and 99 weight.

 

Yes, i stopped even trying to make work easier by using tools/scripts - maybe one could use them if you know what they are EXACTLY doing to your mesh, but thats why people study 3d design...

 

I've come up with these base rules when getting stuff weight-sliderable: You need to maintain complete mesh integrity between models, no missing points, no overlap, points not moving through verts and a lot of patience to check even slight changes in the engine (ie. skyirm). I use the "hidden wireframe" viewmode of 3dsmax to find overlap, i think blender has something similar (haven't used blender for ages). Try to make the "outer" wireframe conrast as much with the "inner" as possible (dunno how i did it in max, fiddled with the viewport settings a lot), so you see if anything would "stick through".

 

I really don't know if all of this helps, just my mediocre experience from porting an armor and tweaking a sword.

 

 

*snip*

If you go through this guys videos, he explains how to deal with those bugs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSpL13jVF34&list=PL38C28CE97107F8F3

 

Watch those videos, there are 1-2 only concerned wih making the weight slider work (30-something or so in the series). What he explains with armors is exactly the same with "base bodies", as skyrim handles them as armors. And the basic stuff applies to blender too.

[cold steel]

I watched those videos and there is only two of them where he explain how to create armor to work with weight slider. He don't get any bugs in the game after editing and even I will not see this bugs in the game if I create such small difference between body_0 and body_1. Of course I know that in 3ds max I can just set smooth option to 2 on body_0 and body_1 and it will fix such problems (because I already created about 4 different body meshes in 3ds max), but I can't increase use "subdivide" function in 3ds max, I can't freeze a few vertices, I can't smooth some parts of mesh, because "relax" function in 3ds work not so good like smooth in blender . 

About warframe : all difference which I can see in this mode is a difference in edges. Many edges in body_1 are not in the same plase like in body_0, but as I know Skyrim engine create weight changing slider only between vertices. I think it woild be easy to take femalebody_0 from mangabody and create femalebody_1 by editing it. It will take all day, but I hope there willn't be bugs if I don't need to use "set smooth" function.

[Guest kimbale]

Unfortunately, that is the conclusion i came to too.

Since then i have great respect for anyone porting/editing anything model related in skyrim, as it takes a lot of perseverance to do all that by hand.

[cold steel]

Just tried to import and export TBBP body from bodyslide without "set smooth" option. For some reason femalebody_1 looks nice in the game, but femalebody_0 have a lot of bugs. Well, maybe it will work if I create two meshes from one... But I can't understand why blender exported it in nif with 18823 vertex if this mesh have only 3288 vertices O_O. Eh, I think that I don't need to think so much. Will take manga body and create new mesh from it   . But if it will have bugs even after that, then... I'll get all Skyrim modders out of the ground to ask what the hell is going on here.

[ousnius]

Just tried to import and export TBBP body from bodyslide without "set smooth" option. For some reason femalebody_1 looks nice in the game, but femalebody_0 have a lot of bugs. Well, maybe it will work if I create two meshes from one... But I can't understand why blender exported it in nif with 18823 vertex if this mesh have only 3288 vertices O_O. Eh, I think that I don't need to think so much. Will take manga body and create new mesh from it   . But if it will have bugs even after that, then... I'll get all Skyrim modders out of the ground to ask what the hell is going on here.

 

I don't know how to fix your issues, but what I do know is that you'll be able to edit your body meshes using the new BodySlide/Outfit Studio when it's released by using the brushes (and optionally creating your own slider in it). That's not promotion but a fact...

[Vioxsis]

 

But I can't understand why blender exported it in nif with 18823 vertex if this mesh have only 3288 vertices O_O. Eh, I think that I don't need to think so much.

 

Its to do with how vertex normals are stored in the nif.

 

2 geospheres one smoothed

 

 

 

The other not smoothed

 

 

 

As you can see the vertex count is different, the reason is the vertex normals.

I can show you them in max.

 

smoothed

 

 

 

And not smoothed

 

 

 

the blue lines show how light will be bounced of the mesh,

now max uses smooth groups to store the normals so vertex count stays the same regardless.

 

But the nif splices vertexes on different smooth groups in to there own vertex.

there are 320 polys on the geosphere with 3 points (vertexes) each, 320x3= 960 the same number in the un-smoothed nif.

 

 

Sadly i don't know how to use blender, but hopefully that bit of info will help you understand what is happening with your nif.

And help you find the answer to the problems you've been having.         

 

 

 

[cold steel]

Thanks for the information. If I understand correctly then smooth option edit only normals and that mean I have bugs, because of normals position. As I know I can edit normals in nif file by my hand, but I still can't understand on which number I must change my normals. Maybe I must copy normals from femalebody_0 to femalebody_1? Anyway, I will try to experiment with it.

[cold steel]

Damn, all this normals have different positions on different meshes but I have bug only in a few vertices on left leg. Still can't understand why this bug happened.

P.S. today tried to import and export tbbp body which I created in bodyslide in 3ds max and even with 3ds max smooth "2" option I have bug, but now on right leg and only with 2-3 vertices (not very big).I should try to ask some people who created their own bodies to understand how they smoothed it.

[cold steel]

Problem solved. It was problem with Skin partition.