The Lore of Sanguine Debauchery (and other stories)

[DeepBlueFrog]

Over time, I tried to weave threads between my mods to extend the Lore and give them more coherence and back story.

 

Here are a few ideas and principles I have been following. 

 

Feel free to reuse them, discuss or critique them in case I missed something.

And many thanks to Content Consumer and several others who contributed ideas to this list!

 

These are just the key 'facts' of the Lore as I see it related to Sanguine and the rest of my mods. Each could use their own thread with details and speculations.

(in a spoiler tag because of spoilers for the mods and because of the wall of text).

 

Spoiler

• A long time ago, Sanguine became smitten with a whore from Stross M'Kai named Alicia (yes.. the one from the bandits song) while he was partaking in mortal pleasures
• He tried to bring her back with him, permanently, but she could not handle long term exposure to his realm in Oblivion and perished in horrible circumstances
• Sex with Daedra/Dremora is risky for mortals. They carry with them traces of the creative power behind Mundus. Side effect to exposure include gender change, gender mix, body part changes, mental changes (bimbo curse) and after a while, permanent split of a shard from of the mortal's 
• The soul shard remains linked to Oblivion and leave a void inside the mortal. One way to fill that void is through sexual energy, which is how succubi are born
• The succubus shape is the soul shard ripped from a mortal soul. When a mortal turns into a succubus shape, they are in fact trading places. The mortal goes to Oblivion and the succubus goes to Mundus
• In rare cases, both the succubus and the mortal shapes coexist in the same space. That usually doesn't end well... and in the case of Alicia, they ended up ripping each other to pieces.
• Since then, Sanguine has been trying to recreate his perfect lover
• He is selecting women that catch his eye during his travels and give them a proper training in one of his pocket realms. They all take the name of Alicia.
• The slave queen, St Alessia, was in fact one of his chosen ones. She went further than most in her worship of Sanguine under the rule of the Alyeids, but she became terrified at the thought of losing part of her soul and made a deal with Akatosh to reclaim her soul and start open revolt against her masters. Sanguine did not take that well, in particular when other Aedra helped her champion, Pelinal Whitestrake with unique artifacts, especially Dibella.
• Sanguine can take many forms, including forms of the opposite sex
• He started the corruption of the Temple of Dibella in Markarth as one of many attempts at getting back at Dibella for her role in helping Alessia. He has a certain affinity to Dibella since they both trade in sexual pleasures - Dibella for the sacred beauty of it and Sanguine just for the sheer indulgence of it.
• As the patron of brothels, he has created a network of recruiting grounds for new Alicias
• The Dragonborn is of particular interest to him because of his ability to absorb dragon souls. He believes that makes him/her uniquely qualified to resist the soul shard effect (or at least, control it better)
• One of his pupils, Alicia (the pain slut from the mod), was trained by a group of bandits and a mage under his guidance. They showed her how to embrace pain instead of sex as a way to control her succubus form. 
• Dremora outcasts are dremoras who stayed behind aftert he Oblivion crisis and tried to blend in as mages or healers. They use their residual powers in exchange of very simple lives with mortals. Outside of Sanguine or possibly Clavicus Vile, they are the only ones who can reverse some of the effects of exposure to daedric sex.
• One of Sanguine's pocket worlds includes his favorite pet - none other than Crassius Curio of the Lusty Argonian fame. He rewarded his life of debauchery with a job of scribe for as long as it pleases him.

 

That about sums it up :)

 

 

 

[mercplatypus]

Couple of comments to make on the lore behind SD.

 

1. As a Daedric Prince it is actually canon that Sanguine is whatever gender he chooses to be at that point in time.  The Daedra are literally neither male nor female but simply choose to manifest as one, the other, both or something completely alien.

 

2. Your idea behind Alessia is less bizarre than the actual canonized lore.  Officially she prayed to Kynareth for salvation who sent her Demigod son, Morrihaus, to Alessia's aid.  Morrihous was a winged bull.  Alessia's heir was her son the Minotaur.  I think everyone else can do the math on that one.  Alessia did not make her pact with Akatosh until she was on her deathbed.  Up until she began praying to Kyne it is only known that she would have worshipped whichever divines her Ayleid master favored.

 

3. The TES version of Succubi are the Dark and Daedra Seducers.  It's not like vampirism where you are turned into one its an actual type of lesser daedra akin to dremora.  The way Ojanon has PSQ set up is actually almost spot on to the lore behind them with the minor exception that most will not willingly deal with mortals.  Note that Seducers are not associated with any Daedra in particular but rather serve whoever suits their fancy at that moment in time.

 

This next couple are more a minor gripe than anything you should ever consider changing in the mod or background.  I figure it might give you some ideas though. 

 

4. Sanguine is not really focused on sex but rather is the prince of sin.  He has rarely been portrayed in anything sexual outside the modding community.  The vast majority of his debauchery is actually related to gluttony and alcoholism.  While occasional forays into lustful pursuits after a long night of partying are entirely within scope sex isn't really his scope.  If his worshippers ain't enjoying themselves, typically through pranks or partying like rockstars, it isn't really his thing.  Sanguine was the creator of a spell that stripped every one around the caster naked, so there is that.

 

5. The 2 Aedra/Daedra whose spheres explicitly relate to sex are Dibella and Mephala.  Dibella's Temples practice not only the arts but erotic services as well.  Mephala's sphere's are lies, deception, sex and secret plots of murder.  She is also themed very heavily around spiders.  The basic idea was the black widow both as the serial killer and the literal spider.

 

6. Sex with Daedra is absolutely bad news but not in the way you portray.  The way vampires came about was when Molag Bal raped a woman.  She survived the encounter.  In most sources it states that a bit of Molag's blood fell into her mouth and, through the rape and infusion of Daedric blood, created the first vampire.  It's why all the pureblood vampires are Daughter of Coldharbor and not Sons of Coldharbor.  The only other distinct happening aside from Molag Bal raping women to the brink of death and then infusing them with his power that I can think of was Vivec (this was one of the weirdest, LSD-Alice-chasing-the-White-Rabbit bits of lore involving Vivec permitting Molag Bal to have his way with Vivec's body after Vivec detached his own head.  After Molag Bal had at for a while and left Vivec re attached his head to his body.  I wish I was making this up).

 

On the whole the lore behind how you have SD relating to your other mods is fairly functional and works.  In a great many ways it is way less bizarre and kinky than the actual lore but most of the racy stuff is from a long time ago so I doubt many will remember it.  Quite a bit of what you already have such as the flowering spriggan in SD are not too far from the base lore in any regard.

[Content Consumer]

One of the great thing about ES lore is that it is ultimately manipulable on every level. You can draw almost anything down to a dragon-break, for instance.

[DeepBlueFrog]

Thanks for the comments.

 

The story of Molag Bal and that of Vivec are also part of my thinking about the transformational effect of sex with the daedra. In both cases, the mortal having sex with them came out changed in some fundamental way.

 

About Alessia, I will have to find the right reference. I am pretty sure I saw somewhere that the Ayleids made her pray to Daedra, not to Divines... thus the connections to Sanguine.

 

Practically, I chose Sanguine as a central character because I inherited the mod from Jbezorg, but here is how I break down relationships to sex with the divines/daedra:

 

- Mephala - sex and seduction as a manipulation weapon

- Sanguine - sex in a drunken stupor for the fun of it. There is documented close relationship between Sanguine and Mephala (he did make the Threads of Webspinner for her).

- Molag Bal - rape, violent sex and forced slavery.

- Dibella - eroticism, sex as beauty

- Mara - married sex for procreation

 

Technically, the slavery in SD+ would be better represented by Molag Bal, but he is throwing the player through coerced slavery as a tool to reveal his/her true nature of debauchery to them. He is not interested in them serving as slaves and will, in fact, routinely free them from enslavement to throw them into another situation.

[mercplatypus]

@Content Consumer Very true.

 

@skyrimll Vivec was not actually transformed by his encounter with Molag Bal.  Camelworks on youtube did a pretty good summary on Vivec's particular weirdness.  If I find it again I'll definately post the link.

 

The closest I've found to giving us an idea about Alessia's early life is here http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/Alessia.

 

There really isn't much to go on other than a remark that the Ayleids worshipped one set of divines while the Nords revered others more sympathetic to them.  Unfortunately most of Alessia's early life has been left fairly barren to go off of.  On the other hand it does give free license to fill things in with whatever we choose to create a story.

 

I'd say the breakdown on how each Aedra/Daedra relates to sex is close to spot on.  Mephala's sphere includes sex in general but I don't think I've ever seen it expanded on.  Usually everything revolves around murder, mostly in relation to the Morag Tong and some theories relating to the Dark Brotherhood, making her a much less obvious choice for anything.

 

Either way I think you've done a good job keeping the internal lore behind SD thought out and consistent.  Its something I'm not sure Bethesda has managed to do yet.

[DeepBlueFrog]

I researched my sources a little bit (36 lessons, wikia and UESP pages) and it appears the episode between Vivec and Molag Bal happened years before the Tribunal claimed god status for themselves and Vivec took a permanent dual shape.

 

Therefore, Vivec would have been exposed to deeply transformative sex with a Daedra, during which he went without head for more than 80 days, gave birth to a multitude of children of Molag Bal and even bit off his ‘spear’, which is likely to have been Molag Bal’s own sex, in order to create Muatra.

 

I didn’t find a video from camel work on that point but I would very much like to watch it :)

 

In my own view of the Lore, it is possible Vivec would have been changed by his experience with Molag Bal, maybe living in a state of flux between forms, and, years later, embraced that change permanently with a dual appearance.

 

Edit: and if it turns out the Molag Bal experience happened after reaching god status, bear in mind they became gods by messing with the Heart of Lorkhan, which would have exposed them to a greater source of the same transformative energy as I am using for Daedra Sex. So it would still kind-off fit (although I would much prefer the first option).

 

Edit 2: I do know that Vivec was born hermaphrodite in both the real and revised versions of his timeline. I see the transformations from exposure to daedric material deeper extensions to his initial nature.

[mercplatypus]

I tried finding the video I mentioned and was simply not able to find it.  I think I may have had it confused with a fudgemuppet video from a while ago but I'm stumped which one.

 

I think you may be dead on with transformative stuff happening during Vivec's short affair with Molag Bal.  The following is from http://elderscrolls.wikia.com/wiki/CHIM

 

The only being who is known to have actually achieved CHIM is Vivec. Talos might have achieved CHIM. Vivec supposedly learned of CHIM after marrying and mating with the Daedric Prince Molag Bal.^[1] Vivec wrote extensively on its nature,^{[OOG 1]} and used CHIM to banish Azura from the world during his trial.^{[OOG 10]} Talos might have achieved CHIM before ascending to godhood, how he did so is not entirely known. According to some sources, in an act of love, Talos used CHIM to effectively erase the jungles of Cyrodiil retroactively from all history,^[9][10] being quoted as saying:^{[OOG 3]}

"You have suffered for me to win this throne, and I see how you hate jungle. Let me show you the power of Talos Stormcrown, born of the North, where my breath is long winter. I breathe now, in royalty, and reshape this land which is mine. I do this for you, Red Legions, for I love you."

 

The summary actually state that Vivec was able to achieve some incredibly significant power from the marriage, enough to banish another Daedric prince with relative ease.  While it is not clear whether this would be before or after attaining effective godhood from the heart of lorkhan it is clear that this is an entirely different form of power from a completely different source.  The article implies that this power may in fact surpass the Daedra entirely.

I believe that it would have been after as during Vivec's account he supposedly separated his own head from his body before the 80 days of nonstop rape began, which he would not have survived as a mere chimer.  It would also explain why Serana is only a vampire and not an actual godlike being.

 

[DeepBlueFrog]

Funny you bring it up. CHIM and other Walking Ways will play a role in the main quest I am preparing for SD+

[mercplatypus]

Sounds interesting at the very least.  I'd definately be curious to see how that will develop.