[solved]PC sunk on ground

[Justinof]

I have a glitch that is driving me nuts: my player character is always sunk 10 cm. into the ground. >>See screeshot, the PC is on the right.

The NPCs arent' affected by this problem, only the PC.

It doesn't matter if she is naked, wear High Heels or vanilla shoes, the problem is always there. High Heels works correctly but since the starting point is too low all Sexlab animations are misalligned and if i correct the animations they become off for the NPCs obviously... 

Any help would be very appreciated.

[Dorabella]

 1) With Nifskope , open shoes and check where the HH OFSET is located , change its value

 

Spoiler

 

2) With Nifskope , open shoes and check where the HH OFSET is located , If it's on your feet, move it to your shoes

 

Extend 0NiNode, See where the NiFloatExtraData string is located , Right-click on the string, select LCTRL+SHIFT (for copy), move to shoes and LCTRL+V (Drop into shoes),

Right-click on the string in the “feet” section and select “Remove Branch”

 

Spoiler

Before

 

 

 

Spoiler

After

 

 

 

Spoiler

Delete

 

 

 

If you've remade a shoe in Bodyslide, make sure you don't have a version of the shoe without HH OFSET/SDTA. Rebuild it without using Batch Build. If you have multiple shoes of the same model, it's likely that the one without HH has overwritten the one with HH.

[Justinof]

Thanks for the replay, but as i have mentioned already  the problem could not be related to a .nif file since it happens whit every shoes she is wearing and even whit naked feet.

In the first screenshot she is wearing the same high heels shoes as her follower, in the second they are both whit naked feet (and the NPC is slight floating in the air now that i have noticed, damn...)

I use Softbody, maybe it is related? But the same body is used by everyone in the game, why only the PC is sunk?

[Dorabella]

16 minutes ago, Justinof said:

I use Softbody, maybe it is related?

I don't think so; I've used it myself and didn't have the problem you're having. 

 

Do you have any mods that only affect the main character?

 

22 minutes ago, Justinof said:

wearing the same high heels shoes as her follower

Does the follower use a custom body?

[Justinof]

I am not aware of a mod that i use that could affect the PC only in relation to her position, i have to check attentively.

The follower use the same body as the PC.

I am going to update Softbody anyway, maybe it fix this problem and maybe not.

[traison]

2 hours ago, Justinof said:

I am not aware of a mod that i use that could affect the PC only in relation to her position, i have to check attentively.

The follower use the same body as the PC.

I am going to update Softbody anyway, maybe it fix this problem and maybe not.

 

Here's a quick sanity test you can do to test if it's coming from Papyrus (somewhat likely): Delete or rename nioverride.pex in RaceMenu and make sure no other mod is providing an alternative. If the problem goes away, you have a mod that's moving the root node of your player character.

[Dorabella]

3 hours ago, Justinof said:

I am not aware of a mod that i use that could affect the PC only in relation to her position, i have to check attentively.

High Heel System It could be the cause, affecting the script

 

HDT HighHeels System 

 

If it's installed, uninstall it. Extract the ZIP file to any location and manually install only the master (ESM), or create a ZIP file containing only the master and install it using ModManager. By removing the scripts, only the HHOFSET for the shoes will be used.

[Justinof]

3 hours ago, traison said:

 

Here's a quick sanity test you can do to test if it's coming from Papyrus (somewhat likely): Delete or rename nioverride.pex in RaceMenu and make sure no other mod is providing an alternative. If the problem goes away, you have a mod that's moving the root node of your player character.

I am on SE 1.5.97 so i don't use Nioverride but Skee64 . The only similar file i have in the mods is NiOverrideCleanScript.pex inside SlaveTats NG, but even renaming it doesn't solve anything sadly.

[Justinof]

2 hours ago, Dorabella said:

High Heel System It could be the cause, affecting the script

 

HDT HighHeels System 

 

If it's installed, uninstall it. Extract the ZIP file to any location and manually install only the master (ESM), or create a ZIP file containing only the master and install it using ModManager. By removing the scripts, only the HHOFSET for the shoes will be used.

That mod is for LE, i don't have it.

I have installed RaceMenu SE RaceMenu High Heels and  RaceMenu High Heel Sexlab Patch  as last in load order.

The only option that remain seems to disable, 1 by 1, the scripts inside these mod and test if the problem is solved (but i doubt).

 

BTW updating Softbody was not the solution i hoped for.

[traison]

1 hour ago, Justinof said:

I am on SE 1.5.97 so i don't use Nioverride but Skee64

 

NiOverride has been built into RaceMenu for a long time, probably since around late pre-LE. SKEE64 is RaceMenu. Everyone has this file.

[Dorabella]

1 hour ago, Justinof said:

That mod is for LE, i don't have it.

It was just an example

 

1 hour ago, Justinof said:

RaceMenu High Heel Sexlab Patch

I don't use it, and I don't have your problem. Could that be the cause?

[Justinof]

20 hours ago, traison said:

 

NiOverride has been built into RaceMenu for a long time, probably since around late pre-LE. SKEE64 is RaceMenu. Everyone has this file.

I knew that NiOverride was built into Racemenu, what i didn't know is that .pex file is inside the bsa archive, so i had to extract the bsa e rename (disable) NiOverride.

Once started the game RaceMenu, XPMSE and other mods confirmed that NiOverride was missing so i was sure there was not another copy of it running in my game.

The result is that nothing is solved, my char still drags her feet in the ground...

Edited August 13 by Justinof

[Justinof]

19 hours ago, Dorabella said:

It was just an example

 

 

Ok 

Quote

I don't use it, and I don't have your problem. Could that be the cause?

I use it from a long time, for what i can remember i have started using it because in my game the High Hells  wear during sex animations were'nt compensate correctly even whit the option enabled in Sexlab MCM.

Now even disabling it my actual problem doesn't get fixed, but i will test further whit it disabled.

The weird thing is that whit it disabled it seems (still not sure) that my PC doesn't get sunk into the ground only when she has naked feet and not during a sex animation, since i like my girls to fuck wearing High Hells this doesn't change my situation.

 

I would like to know if other gamers use HH and the compensation option enabled in Sexlab and their experience: it works or not?

[Dorabella]

13 minutes ago, Justinof said:

I would like to know if other gamers use HH and the compensation option enabled in Sexlab and their experience: it works or not?

Generally, I turn off HH in Sexlab (men don't wear high heels) 

 

The alignment issue with HH may vary depending on the height of the heels (they aren't all the same). That's why I'm disabling the mod

 

In my opinion, the problem is caused by the HH SexLab fix you installed. Try removing it, extracting the HighHeels mod, and pasting only the ESM file (which is required) into the Skyrim data folder (or wherever your ModManager installs mods), then activate it and try again. 

 

From your second screenshot, your PG is off the ground, which means that HighHeel hasn't been removed from your feet but is still active.

 

1) Make sure you haven't configured anything that might affect your character 

2) Try starting a new game (it's annoying) to see if the problem persists . 

 

 

[traison]

2 hours ago, Justinof said:

The result is that nothing is solved, my char still drags her feet in the ground...

 

Then it's one of the following: A dll, the skeleton or the meshes you're using. The latter 2 you can check in NifSkope. See where the foot nodes are, and where the Root node is. If it's all level, i.e. not below 0 on the Z axis then it's a dll doing it.

 

2 hours ago, Justinof said:

I would like to know if other gamers use HH...

 

I do not because of 2 reasons:

1. Whenver I equip or unequip something the HH offset resets and my feet sink into the ground. I have to keep re-equpping the shoes every-single-time and it gets old real quick. HH worked better in older RM versions.
2. I don't find it immersive to be running in mud and on cobblestone with what might as well be space-age shoes.

 

Edit: And yes I'm aware of that ugly hack that requips shoes every time I equip or unequip something else. I'd rather have a proper fix from RaceMenu but the odds of that happening seem smaller than me getting hit by a meteorite right now.

Edited August 13 by traison

[Justinof]

23 hours ago, Dorabella said:

In my opinion, the problem is caused by the HH SexLab fix you installed. Try removing it, extracting the HighHeels mod, and pasting only the ESM file (which is required) into the Skyrim data folder (or wherever your ModManager installs mods), then activate it and try again. 

 

From your second screenshot, your PG is off the ground, which means that HighHeel hasn't been removed from your feet but is still active.

 

I have tested it disabling the Sexlab fix (it is only a .pex file), removing all the scripts from the HH mod keeping only the .esp (it doesn't have an .esm) and still the problem persists.

In the screenshot, whit PG do you mean my character? My PC is on the right side and is sunk into the ground, on the left there is my follower and she is undoubtely hovering few centimeters above the ground, but it is not important now (maybe later).

[Dorabella]

HDT High Heels Fix-32052-1-01-1639250962.7z  only ESM ( Required for any shoes that requires HH ) . 

MCM, it should read the height of the heels you're wearing.

Don't change anything in the mod; it's not necessary.

 

Do you happen to have the HighheelFix racemenu as well? If so, disable or remove it.

[Justinof]

22 hours ago, traison said:

 

Then it's one of the following: A dll, the skeleton or the meshes you're using. The latter 2 you can check in NifSkope. See where the foot nodes are, and where the Root node is. If it's all level, i.e. not below 0 on the Z axis then it's a dll doing it.I

 

Checked the skeleton (PC and followers uses the same btw): all seems ok.

Meshes...i have no idea how to check hundreds of meshes...not even trying.

 

Out of desperation i have loaded a very old save (5 months old) whit the same mods and configurations i am using now... and... the problem is gone! In the old save my PC is perfectly aligned at ground level and even is sex animations the HH works like a charm.

This means, correct me if i am wrong, that i have a cursed glitch baked in my more recent saves and there is no way to fix it!

In conclusion, i am doomed until i decide to start a new game or waste hundreds of game hours starting from a very old save...

[Justinof]

51 minutes ago, Dorabella said:

HDT High Heels Fix-32052-1-01-1639250962.7z  only ESM ( Required for any shoes that requires HH ) . 

MCM, it should read the height of the heels you're wearing.

Don't change anything in the mod; it's not necessary.

 

Do you happen to have the HighheelFix racemenu as well? If so, disable or remove it.

I am sorry but my game ctd on save load whit your .esm in my  load order, whit or whitout Racemenu HH installed, so i can't test it.

[traison]

1 hour ago, Justinof said:

Meshes...i have no idea how to check hundreds of meshes...not even trying.

 

Only have to test one: the one that's currently occupying slot 32.

 

1 hour ago, Justinof said:

This means, correct me if i am wrong, that i have a cursed glitch baked in my more recent saves and there is no way to fix it!

 

Probably through NiOverride. RaceMenu might be retaining the node offsets. This puts the blame back on a Papyrus script/mod. In other words, playing without NiOverride would prevent the problem from coming back. Obviously that is not a recommended workaround.

 

Search through all pex files in all mods, including in BSA archives for "AddNodeTransformPosition", "AddNodeTransformScale" and "AddNodeTransformRotation" and you'll have your list of suspects. Inspect the equivalent psc files for calls that are moving nodes that may be relevant: foot, root or perhaps leg and pelvis nodes. Notepad++ can do recursive searches like this, but it wont search within packed BSAs. I've made a tool that can do it which is available on request.

[Justinof]

I have a hell lot of work to do, i will give you some news once done. Thanks.

[traison]

1 hour ago, Justinof said:

I have a hell lot of work to do...

 

If you're talking about searching pex files then that should be a ~5 minute job per keyword. Depending on your mod count and such of course.

[Justinof]

I would like to know how to script in Papyrus....i did some basic scripting in Oblivion years ago, good times 😉

After narrowing the possible suspects, the most probably culprit i have found is Captive Player.

It has a function to restrain the player to a pillory that move the character 60 units down to the Z axis (how much in centimeters are 60 units in Papyrus i don't know).

Most probably my character was thrown off the pillory by some unexpected event and her position at ground level wasn't reset correctly. 

 

Is there a way to edit a save file to fix this?

 

 

 

[traison]

1 hour ago, Justinof said:

It has a function to restrain the player to a pillory that move the character 60 units down to the Z axis (how much in centimeters are 60 units in Papyrus i don't know).

 

I would say 60 is about half or a third of a characters height. You're looking for something along the lines of -4 (Z). You can demo this in NifSkope by opening a shoe mesh and setting the Scene Root translation to -4 on the Z axis.

 

1 hour ago, Justinof said:

Most probably my character was thrown off the pillory by some unexpected event and her position at ground level wasn't reset correctly.

 

I do not know how RaceMenu manages this internally if one mod sets -4 (Edit: i.e. high heel offset) and the other +60. What happens when one of those mods unregister their offset? Do they have to internally store the previous value and gracefully handle the reset themselves? There's lots of potential for race conditions here if there's no centralized institution to handle it.

 

1 hour ago, Justinof said:

Is there a way to edit a save file to fix this?

 

Theoretically yes. The offset is stored in the SKSE cosave. The SKSE source code is available and it will contain the container structure. Some version of RaceMenu is also available and should contain the data format in which it saves its own chunk within this container. Once you've got it mapped out, a simple hex editor is all you need to poke the bytes.

 

I think instead of editing the save file it would be easier to go through the NiOverride API. See if you can find a function to get all position transform mod keys either from NiOverride or the mod scripts themselves. Using NiOverride you can remove these transforms on behalf of the other mods. The problem would stay away until some mod puts its transform back. NiOverride.GetNodeTransformKeys looks quite promising for instance.

 

There's also NiOverride.RemoveAllReferenceTransforms which if it does what it says on the tin could be used to nuke all transforms.

 

Since all this talking about transforms and translations might not make sense, here's my understanding of it:

• Transform translation = linear motion or a x/y/z position or offset.
• Transform rotation = rotation around one of the x/y/z axis.

So the GetNodeTransformKeys function is most likely going to return keys for rotation transform as well as translations: the latter is what you're looking for. If you ask me I wouldn't care and just run all keys through the RemoveNodeTransformPosition function.

 

Edit: Note that the mod keys might be unique enough that you can guess which mod they came from, or again search all pex files for the source.

Edited August 16 by traison

[Justinof]

All these solutions implies that i have the programming environment and the knownledge to do the work, things that i have not.

In conclusion too much work for a little gain, so i give up.

 

Thanks again to Traison and Dorabella for their efforts to help me, it is really appreciated.