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Devious Device Helpers

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Followers help you out of and in to devious devices.

 

Upgrading from versions prior to 1.04: A clean save is required.

 

Motivation and Concept:

While playing with Deviously Cursed Loot and other Devious Devices mods, I found that my character being tied up and helpless was amusing for about five minutes.  I also found that NPC's could be tragically stupid when it came to restraints.  For example, when my character was doing the key fumble thing to remove "Paw Bondage Mittens" the follower would stand there, with his free hands at his side saying "Let's not waste time.", "Let's get going." and, dumbest of all, "We've stopped, what is it?".  So I decided to start on a mod.


First; followers would get smarter about removing debilitating restraints.  While the normal thing would be for the player to ask to have her hands freed and then free herself from any blindfold and gag, what happens when the wrist restraint is not removable because it either requires a special key, is time locked or a quest item?  I wanted the follower to be able to assist with blindfolds and gags too.


Second; a follower would, in a reasonably safe location, offer to help the player character have some fun by tying her up for a while.  When they are done having fun (after no more that five minutes real time), the follower would untie her, put the toys away and go off to hack and slay.  Related to this would be reluctance to remove restraints in "safe" areas.


I have decided to release this mod because the removal of "Can you help me?" from DDi 4.0 has left a vacuum for dungeon divers.


What this mod does:

Device unlocking:

Any items tagged "Heavy Bondage", bondage mittens, blindfolds, gags, restrictive corsets, and chastity bras can be removed by either a blacksmith or a follower subject to certain conditions.


Neither the blacksmith or the follower will attempt to remove items tagged as quest items or block generic so as not to break other mods.


A blacksmith will always charge a fee.  A blacksmith will use a key if the player has one, but will fall back to hammer, cold chisel and anvil otherwise.  Any device which is cut off is destroyed and your character can't play with it any more.


A follower will not charge a fee, but if the device requires a key then the player or follower should have that key.  If the correct type and number of keys is not available, and the device can possibly be cut, the follower will attempt to cut the device.  This uses the same base chances of success as DDi, but uses it's own success chance modifier in it's own MCM (after all it's the follower, not the player doing the cutting).  Again, any device which is cut off is destroyed and your character can't play with it any more.  Whether the follower will cut a device is controlled by a MCM setting.

 

If the follower decides it's "play time" (see below) the follower will be reluctant to remove a device when asked.  This reluctance can be overcome by being insistent.  The places where this can happen are selectable in the MCM menu.  Available locations are inhabited areas, dwellings, stores, player homes and cleared dungeons.  (The follower will always cooperate in a dungeon or the wilds.)  How often the follower is reluctant and for how long are controlled by MCM settings.  The defaults are that the follower will become reluctant to remove devices once every one to two game days and will persist in his or her reluctance for 1/2 to 2 game hours.  These times can be adjusted in the MCM.

 

Play time:

The play time system runs in a cycle:

  1. Adventuring and work time:  The follower does not want to tie up the player and will willingly remove devices.  Lasts one to two in-game days by default, but is adjustable in the MCM.
  2. Ready for Play time:  The follower wants to tie up the player but has not done so yet.  Usually this is because the player is in a location where being tied is not allowed.  When the player enters an eligible location the follower will force greet the player and ask to tie her up.  Ends with the beginning of play time.
  3. Play time:  Starts when the follower ties up the player or the player, after asking to remove a device, is persuaded to continue wearing it by the follower.  The follower will borrow the player's devious keys.  By default play time lasts 1/2 to 2 in-game hours, but can be adjusted in the MCM.  If the player asks for a device to be removed the follower will attempt to persuade the player to continue wearing a device during play time.
  4. Willing to untie:  Begins with the ending of play time.  The follower will force-greet the player, announce that play time is over and offer to remove all the devices added by the follower at the beginning of play time.  If the player consents then all keys are returned and all devices locked on by the follower are removed.  Once the player is free it's adventuring and work time again.  The player may, through dialogue extend the play time.

 

In order not to delay the game any more than the player wants, all bondage is fully consensual by the player.  When the follower asks to tie up the player, the player may allow it, hesitate, refuse, or ask the follower to wait two minutes.  If the player hesitates the follower will make a feeble attempt to persuade the player.  The player may end play time early by asking to be untied.

 

The follower will only approach the player for "play time" when in eligible locations such as Player homes.  When in the wilds or a dungeon the follower will not ask to tie up the player and will always cooperate in the removal of devices.

 

The eligible locations currently include Player homes, Stores, Inns, Dwellings, and Inhabited areas.  Dungeons, Forts and other locations tagged "LocTypeClearable" may be eligible after they have been cleared.  The categories Player homes, Stores, Inns, Dwellings, Inhabited outdoor areas and Cleared Locations can each be enabled or disabled in the MCM options.

 

As a blatant exception to the consensual bondage philosophy there is an MCM option (all the way at the bottom) called "Bondage lover" which defaults off.

  • When off (default), any and all bondage is fully consensual as described above.
  • When on, indicates that the player loves bondage and will not refuse to be tied up or ask to be untied early.  The dialogue options like "Can you help me out?" and "I'm not in the mood." are not present when the follower wants to tie up the player or during "play time".  Also, if the player walks away from the tie-up dialogue the follower will tie her up anyway.
  • The disruption to game progression that this causes has two adjustable mitigations:  The follower will only ask in eligible locations and the "play time" can be kept short.  This is adjusted in the MCM.

 

The player may start play time early by saying "I think it's time to relax for a while." or "I feel like being tied up." which will lead to the follower tying up the player.

 

Requirements:

Devious Devices (Assets) 3.0e

Devious Devices - Integration V4.0+

Devious Devices - Expansion V4.0+

And their requirements

 

Known issues:

Some custom devices from other mods may not work and generate errors.

There are some items from other mods which the follower should be able to remove, but won't.  This is due to the item being tagged with block generic.

The lock jam state, time lock state and cool-downs are not respected.  This is actually symmetric since none of these apply to the player removing devices from a NPC.

Slaves acquired with Paradise Halls Enhanced will not function properly as "followers" with this mod.

 

Acknowledgement:

The code which ties up the player is taken, with minor changes, from Deviously Cursed Loot by Kimy.

The users for their ideas and bug reports.

 

Permissions:

This is a Lovers' Lab exclusive.  Do not upload it anywhere else.

You may not use any part of this in a for-profit project.  Tips are fine provided they are voluntary.

This is an open source project.  You may use my code in your own project but if you do then your project must be open source too and you must allow others to use it in a similar manner.

If you publish a "fork" of this project with similar functionality, please make sure that no one is confused about which is which.


  • Submitter
  • Submitted
    02/07/2018
  • Category
  • Requires
    Devious Devices (Assets) 3.0e, Devious Devices - Integration V4.0+, Devious Devices - Expansion V4.0+
  • Special Edition Compatible
    No

 

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What I'm Planning next:

I intend to refine the conditions for a follower's refusal to remove devices.  Some factors I'm thinking about are:

  • The speech skill.
  • Time since the devices was equipped or time since the follower first refused or maybe time since entering an inhabited area.
  • Relationship rank.
  • Phase of the Moons.

I will investigate honoring the lock shield, key break chance, etc.

 

Possibly adding help with chastity bras since the lock is hard to reach and they debuff physical combat.

 

What I could use some help with:

Bug reports, of course.

I could always use more witty excuses to not untie the player character and clever, persuasive reasons to tie her up for a while.

I would like to find a way to determine the correct, "magic", primary keyword from a worn device which is required to remove it.  I want to support, if possible, custom devices from mods like DCL without having to add dependencies on the mods in question.

What is the "correct" way to get the lock jam/covered status of a specific device?

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I like the concept of this mod, DDi 4.0 makes it annoyingly difficult to find someone to help you out of debilitating restraints.

 

Can a follower use a key to unlock you if the key is in their inventory or only in yours? Another idea, maybe add a bolt cutter item that the follower can carry to cut restraints off (destroying them, naturally), similar to how a blacksmith does if you don't have a key. (That might just be too easy, though, unless you have bolt cutters wear out after so many uses or something. Maybe have them crafted from a rarer material, like ebony, with the justification that they need the extra hardness to be able to cut through anything?)

 

An MCM with the probabilities, those conditions, and options for where the follower asks/demands to tie you up (by which I mean configurable "safe areas" with categories, like player house, city, inn, stores, etc.) would be a good addition.

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Will the mod be player restraint focused or will it support restrained followers?

 

Is the mod aware of restraints the follower might be wearing, preventing or restricting how much help they can provide?

Will the player be able to pay to remove restraints from followers?

Will a follower on occasion want to be restrained?

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I think this is a great concept that fills a very big need.  It seems like every time I'm in the mood for my naughty mage to get in trouble, there's none to be found, but as soon as I'm trying to do a serious quest, all sorts of madness ensues.  This will be a great mechanic for helping me progress without having to use console commands and safe words.  Installing it now, I'll give detailed thoughts when I've played around with it enough.

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2 hours ago, TurboNerd said:

What I'm Planning next:

I intend to refine the conditions for a follower's refusal to remove devices.  Some factors I'm thinking about are:

  • The speech skill.
  • Time since the devices was equipped or time since the follower first refused or maybe time since entering an inhabited area.
  • Relationship rank.
  • Phase of the Moons.

I will investigate honoring the lock shield, key break chance, etc.

 

Possibly adding help with chastity bras since the lock is hard to reach and they debuff physical combat.

 

What I could use some help with:

Bug reports, of course.

I could always use more witty excuses to not untie the player character and clever, persuasive reasons to tie her up for a while.

I would like to find a way to determine the correct, "magic", primary keyword from a worn device which is required to remove it.  I want to support, if possible, custom devices from mods like DCL without having to add dependencies on the mods in question.

What is the "correct" way to get the lock jam/covered status of a specific device?

as you said they will always help in dungeons the following are aimed at inhabited areas (but could be used "out in the wilds" also, but not in actual dungeons)

relationship rank is almost always set to 3 or 4 along the way for most followers so i would not think this would be too useful

speech skill - YES (lower skill means more likely follower will not remove)

time since entering inhabited area - YES (the longer the time since entering inhabited areas the more likely they will release pc)

time since first refusal - yes (have them refuse to remove only a finite number of times, but with a cooldown where the pc cannot ask again for x amount of time)

phase of the moon - this could be good (set it on a weekly timer where week 1 is neutral (full moon), and week 2 and 4 (moon is changing between full and new) is

                              a +10% to refusal chance, and week 3 (new moon) is a +25% chance to refusal chance.  reason for chances i stated are less light means they

                              cannot see  what to do.

  

2 hours ago, m2pt5 said:

I like the concept of this mod, DDi 4.0 makes it annoyingly difficult to find someone to help you out of debilitating restraints.

 

Can a follower use a key to unlock you if the key is in their inventory or only in yours? Another idea, maybe add a bolt cutter item that the follower can carry to cut restraints off (destroying them, naturally), similar to how a blacksmith does if you don't have a key. (That might just be too easy, though, unless you have bolt cutters wear out after so many uses or something. Maybe have them crafted from a rarer material, like ebony, with the justification that they need the extra hardness to be able to cut through anything?)

 

An MCM with the probabilities, those conditions, and options for where the follower asks/demands to tie you up (by which I mean configurable "safe areas" with categories, like player house, city, inn, stores, etc.) would be a good addition.

i think the MCM idea is a good one, as it would let players customize thing to individual taste, and the bolt cutter idea is also a good one provided it takes some rare and

expensive stuff to craft (you have to craft it beforehand and give to follower so they can use it) provided it wears out (5 uses max??)

considering what it does i am going to post a suggested recipe (yes i know this is very expensive.....that is the point)

bolt cutters (made at anvil/forge under misc items) - requires 5 Ebony ingots, 5 Refined Malachite, 5 Refined Moonstone, 5 Quicksiler ingots, and 5 Steel ingots

craftable at any time (do NOT tie it to a smithing perk needed to create).  as it is not a weapon or armor it cannot be enchanted or tempered.

everything i have put in the recipe can be bought or mined and smelted at level 1, this too was deliberate. (if i knew of some real expensive alchemy ingredients

that you could buy at level 1 i would have added them too:smile:, but the ones i know are expensive are not a sure thing to show up at level one).

1 hour ago, r5e4w3q2 said:

Will the mod be player restraint focused or will it support restrained followers?

 

Is the mod aware of restraints the follower might be wearing, preventing or restricting how much help they can provide?

Will the player be able to pay to remove restraints from followers?

Will a follower on occasion want to be restrained?

if it is not now aware of follower restraints i think it would be a good idea to have it so that a follower cannot release player if the follower is wearing:

a blindfold (they cannot see to release you)

Heavy Bondage or Paw Mittens (their hands are to restricted to release player)

 

i do think the follower should NEVER fool with any item that has the block tag or any quest item

 

this is just my opinion without having played with the mod (yet .. just downloaded it to test it out)

 

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great idea, and maybe look at how devious followers is implemented as well. I wont use devious followers due to its dependency on heretic resources (waste of dependency due to HR assets being implemented in DD4) and on ZEP, as ZEP breaks ZAP 7.0/8.0 due to design flaws.

 

I like the concept of Devious Followers though and this mod goes partway toward it. love the idea of follower refusing to untie in cities lol, bit like city bondage mod.

 

Would love to see how far you can go with this mod, and am happy to report any issues. looking forward to your next update in anticipation.

 

I am unhappy they removed "can you help me" dialogue, but that said the DD4 development team didn't even remove it in tes5edit, as everything is still there, just disabled the dialogue from showing in game due to DD4 development team stating it makes the game too easy.

 

All they had to do was tweak it a bit to implement as part of DD4, ie make gag dialogue never reach 100% as thats just too easy. Your idea of followers saying no in safe areas is awesome.

 

Please keep going and while i can't make mods, happy to test it as a player

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@TurboNerd

 

Great idea and lots of positive and useful contributions so far

 

Four thoughts

 

1 - Pls make key ownership dependent on/related to the player character having the keys.  If you don't. you may run into problems with other follower control mods, with their multiple outfit and inventory backpack controls, like AFT, where the key might not be in the 'same place' on the follower each time. 

 

2 - I presently use my AFT followers to carry the keys and then get them back, to try to stop them being stolen, eg if you set a high 'transfer drop' probability for the exchange to and from the follower, that adds considerable risk in itself.  But even NOTIONALLY linking getting keys from a follower to its being dependent on the states of both parties, ie the PC having some gag talk restriction, or the NPC follower's own 'bound' state, would also be a really positive step.

 

3 - I like the expensive, difficult to craft, bolt cutter idea.  Not so hot on it being limited use as that tends to get us back to where we started this from.  But if you could make it a very heavy, non transferable, object, but storable by the PC in chests etc, the player would have to weigh up (unintended pun) the risks of carrying it vs the restrictions that placed on their PCs carry limit and the risk of loss if temporarily placed in respawnable containers

 

4 - MCM settings options which are comprehensible as to what they actually do are always a plus!  And allow for tempering (or should that be tampering?) for individual's playstyle

 

Otherwise, anything you can do on this issue can only be a progressive step to simultaneously both increasing and decreasing the general level of weirdness experienced by us troglodytes who find our relaxation in grubbing around in the depths of Skyrim :classic_angel:

 

Thanks for starting, what you've achieved so far, and please keep going!

 

:smile:

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1 hour ago, donkeywho said:

1 - Pls make key ownership dependent on/related to the player character having the keys.  If you don't. you may run into problems with other follower control mods, with their multiple outfit and inventory backpack controls, like AFT, where the key might not be in the 'same place' on the follower each time. 

i agree totally here - currently if the player OR the follower has a key it works, i agree that it should REQUIRE the key to be on the player

2 - I presently use my AFT followers to carry the keys and then get them back, to try to stop them being stolen, eg if you set a high 'transfer drop' probability for the exchange to and from the follower, that adds considerable risk in itself.  But even NOTIONALLY linking getting keys from a follower to its being dependent on the states of both parties, ie the PC having some gag talk restriction, or the NPC follower's own 'bound' state, would also be a really positive step.

see usage report below

3 - I like the expensive, difficult to craft, bolt cutter idea.  Not so hot on it being limited use as that tends to get us back to where we started this from.  But if you could make it a very heavy, non transferable, object, but storable by the PC in chests etc, the player would have to weigh up (unintended pun) the risks of carrying it vs the restrictions that placed on their PCs carry limit and the risk of loss if temporarily placed in respawnable containers

the reason i suggested it having limited uses was twofold - 1 make it so the player only has the follower use it to remove something when the player REALLY REALLY needs

to be free, and to prevent players from just dragging a follower along to lug JUST the bold cutter (some may do this anyway but it would cut that down)

4 - MCM settings options which are comprehensible as to what they actually do are always a plus!  And allow for tempering (or should that be tampering?) for individual's playstyle

again i totally agree here (and will make some more comments below)

Otherwise, anything you can do on this issue can only be a progressive step to simultaneously both increasing and decreasing the general level of weirdness experienced by us troglodytes who find our relaxation in grubbing around in the depths of Skyrim :classic_angel:

 

usage report (and some suggestions), just an FYI for people i use AFT (only 1 minor issue - see keys below)

 

i used it for a (short) while now (to test it) and while this is not full usage under all circumstances report it should still be helpful (i hope).

 

it works with all followers i tested, vanilla, generic mod added, custom added (but vanilla based follower system), and custom and vanilla races both work,

i did not try followers with their own separate follower system so cannot comment on whether it would work for those.

 

the "follower will help the player have fun by tying her up" feature does not seem to be implemented yet (i do not know if it is supposed to be).

 

follower restricted by restraints - follower should not be able to release player if certain restraints are worn by follower (blindfolds, and any

item that restricts hand usage , ie all heavy bondage for ease of telling)

 

follower refusal cooldown period - a period of time where the follower will always refuse to remove devices if they have previously refused,

so that a player cannot just spam asking until the follower agrees.

 

please consider anything in the MCM suggestions that is not part of the mod to be a request to add it (if you want and think it would fit).

 

keys - it works provided that the key is either in players inventory OR followers inventory. as Donkeywho stated (and i agree totally here) it should be the dependent

          on the key being in the player's inventory only (prevents/limits key hoarding and other issues this way)

          i did run into the "key in the wrong inventory of a follower" where follower could not release me due to the key was in a different inventory than what was 

          checked.  if it is dependent on being in players inventory this is a non issue.

          while i can understand both sides of the "key is destroyed in use"  thing i think a option to have the key be "used up" during usage would be a nice option

 

possible bolt cutter idea - see previous post and post by Donkeywho ... i think either idea would work well (but not both at the same time)

 

MCM - as Donkeywho said a MCM that is easy to comprehend with options would be a very nice thing.  some suggestions below

 

          pause mod (turn mod off) button - this would (hopefully) work like the one in DFB (Devious Followers Beta) it pauses the mod entirely which can solve

                                                             unintended problems and provides a fast work around for issues (at the player level) 

          settings buttons - turn on/off follower part of the mod

                                    turn on/off blacksmith part of the mod

                                    turn on/off merchant part of mod (so those that have another mod that does it already do not have to have this on as well)

                                    key destroyed by usage button (turns on or off key goes bye bye when used)

                                    follower can tie player up button (if this is off the follower will not tie player up at all)

                                    game can be played in dungeons (cleared only) 

                                    arousal button (whether arousal affects "tie up player game" and "device removal refusal"

                                    follower restraints button - turn on or off follower cannot free player if wearing restraints themselves

          a reset mod button - this would reset the entire mod to default settings (as if it was just installed) for emergency problems that cannot be solved 

                                        any other way

          sliders - follower refusal slider - this would adjust base chance that a follower refuses to remove items (when not in a dungeon)

                      follower cooldown slider - adjust how long of a timeout that happens after a follower refuses to remove restraints

                      follower game should be played - how likely it is that a follower will decide you should be "tied up for a while"

                      game cooldown timer - how long of a cooldown period happens after follower plays the "tie up the player game"

                      game repeat timer - a slider for how often (after a cooldown period from previous game) the follower should try for a new game

                      arousal slider - what arousal level increase chance of "tie up player game" and "device removal refusal"         

 

while this mod and DFB do some of the same things (remove heavy bondage in dungeons) they both do different things as well,

and i think with a good MCM they could both work together to make for some real fun (and possibilities) for players.

 

hope to see this mod get better and more fleshed out.

please keep up the good work :smile::cool: and have a :beer: for all the good work already done.

 

p.s. sorry to any who were reading this when i posted about the number of times i ended up editing (due to spelling or having realized i forgot something)

 

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Perhaps just being able to craft a very delicate tool from expensive materials at level 1 with next to none smithing skill is a bit too much, maybe allow the player to purchase it from a blacksmith? Since they have at least one already, they can make more, and the recipe could be tied to some mid-tier smithing perk (or just raw skill level, like 50 smithing, for compatibility with perk overhauls), or perhaps some devious quest that would reward the PC with a crafting book, like ye olde Forbidden bookshelf.

As for price, it could be some decent amount of gold, coupled with being tied up for some time, while the blacksmith creates the thing for you (couple minutes, like your proposed follower wants to play scenario).

MCM settings come pretty much as standard with mods these days, especially something so varied like restraints. Many people like it in different doses, so a properly done configuration will go a long way.

All in all, great work! I hope it blossoms into another mod that would become a stable part of many players' load orders.

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3 minutes ago, jigwigigx said:

I have always wanted to make some slight changes of my own to DD etc but never knew where to start.

How do you go about it?

For simple changes, all you need to do is change stuff around in the CK. For editing scripts, you need to gather sources of all dependencies, and their dependencies, and so on, since they are all required to recompile.

For greater changes, make a new mod with DDi (or all 3) being the master dependency, and change stuff around in there. This is actually the preferred way to do things if you ever plan on releasing it in the future, because Kimy does not allow others to ship modified files from the framework itself with their mods.

As for the exact procedures and methods, that is beyond the scope of a forum post, and you need to find some guides or such yourself.

Best of luck!

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2 minutes ago, phate45 said:

For simple changes, all you need to do is change stuff around in the CK. For editing scripts, you need to gather sources of all dependencies, and their dependencies, and so on, since they are all required to recompile.

For greater changes, make a new mod with DDi (or all 3) being the master dependency, and change stuff around in there. This is actually the preferred way to do things if you ever plan on releasing it in the future, because Kimy does not allow others to ship modified files from the framework itself with their mods.

As for the exact procedures and methods, that is beyond the scope of a forum post, and you need to find some guides or such yourself.

Best of luck!

Thanks. It's simply a bit of text editing that I want to do for now. I would love to be able to create my own devious mod but I don't know what tools I need or how to use them.

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39 minutes ago, phate45 said:

Perhaps just being able to craft a very delicate tool from expensive materials at level 1 with next to none smithing skill is a bit too much, maybe allow the player to purchase it from a blacksmith? Since they have at least one already, they can make more, and the recipe could be tied to some mid-tier smithing perk (or just raw skill level, like 50 smithing, for compatibility with perk overhauls), or perhaps some devious quest that would reward the PC with a crafting book, like ye olde Forbidden bookshelf.

As for price, it could be some decent amount of gold, coupled with being tied up for some time, while the blacksmith creates the thing for you (couple minutes, like your proposed follower wants to play scenario).

i do have to say I LIKE THIS IDEA.

tie the ability to make a "bolt-cutter" directly to the smithing skill (50) and having to have a crafting book as well.

while the Smith is making the player a bolt-cutter (very expensive - 5000 gold or more) they would "tie the player up" including Heavy Bondage

(use 1-3 items that this mod normally removes, and 1-3 other generic items) for a while (1-4 game hours) and when they release the player the

Smith would only remove the items that this mod would normally remove (gags, blindfolds, bondage mittens, heavy bondage), telling the player

"there you go 1 bolt-cutter, and oh keep that other stuff as a gift."

 

for gaining the crafting book a devious style quest could be done (tie the start of it to the first purchase of a "bolt-cutter).

 

   Smith sells player a bolt-cutter, and says "that was easy to make."

     player "how can i make a bolt-cutter"  (this only appears in smiths dialogue if player bought a bolt-cutter previously)

     Smith "you have to have the manual"

     player 1 "how can i get one?"

               2 "can i borrow/buy yours?"

     smith  1 "you have to find a unowned copy"

               2 for borrow buy " i cant sell the manual, but if you get me what i want i can make you a copy"

     player 1 "how do i find an unowned copy?"

               2 "what do you need me to do?"

     smith  1 "search old places and hope for the best" (manual can be in Boss Chest {specific type??} at 1% rate)

               2 "i will send you out to get the stuff i need if you agree"

     player 2 "ok what do i have to do?"

     smith  2 "ok let's get you outfitted and on your way"

                   smith places quest restraints on player (collar, arm cuffs, leg cuffs, boots {or leg chains/ ball and chain})

     player 2 "hey what did you do that for?"

     smith  2 "i have to be sure you get what i need and that you bring it back to me"

     player 2 " ok so wht do i have to go get?"

     smith  2 " ok go get me the material i need for paper" (5 linen wrap)

     player 2 " where do i get that at?"

     smith  2 "well i would check some undead tombs"

     Player 2 "i have the linen wraps you wanted"

     smith 2 "thanks, now for the next part" (takes 5 linen wraps from player)

              3 "you do not have them, what are you stupid coming back without them?"

                 (smith punishes player by putting her in Heavy Bondage for 2-4 game hours then removing the Heavy Bondage) and telling the player

                 "now go get me what i need"  (every time player returns without the required items the time in Heavy Bondage increase by 1-2 game hours)

   player 2 "ok what else do you need?"

   smith  2 "i need some special quills to write the instructions with, made from hawk feathers, so go get me 3 of those"

   player 2 "where do i find those at?" (optional question)

   smith  2 "boy you are really irritating with all the dumb questions" (gags player for 3 hours quest gag, notice to wait 3 hours and talk to smith again, wait disabled)

   player 2 "mmmmph"

   smith  2 (removes gag after 3 hours) "well i would suggest you either catch a hawk or just check a hawk nest for leftover feathers"

   player 2 "i have the feathers"

   smith  2 "ok those will do"

             3 "what you really are stupid, didn't you learn last time?" (repeat punishment as above)

   player 2 "what's next?"

   smith  2 "i need some stuff to make the ink with"

   player 2 "what do you need?"

   smith  2 "i need 5 chaurus eggs, and 3 glowing mushrooms, and 2 giant lichens"

   player 2 " where do i find those at?" (optional question)

   smith  2 "dang that's a dumb question" (gags player for 3 hours quest gag, notice to wait 3 hours and talk to smith again, wait disabled)

   player 2 "mmmmph"

   smith  2 (removes gag) 'well for the eggs and mushrooms i would suggest you look in some deep dark caves, and for the lichen i would look in swampy areas"

   player 2 "i have what you need"

   smith  2 "thanks" (remove 5 chaurus eggs, 3 glowing mushrooms, and 2 giant lichens from player inventory)

             3 "dang it i told you what i needed, what's so hard about that???" (repeat punishment as per above)

   player 2 "what else do you need me to go fetch now?"

             3 "is there anything else?"

   smith  2 "nothing other than time, no shoo" (3 days needed but quest does NOT update to tell player how long to wait)

             3 "time to actually copy the book, no don't bother me for a few days" (3 days needed quest updates to say wait 3 days)

   player 2 "is it ready?"

   smith     (if less than 3 days have passed response 2 below)

                (if 3 days or more have passed response 3 below)             

             2 "not yet, guess i will have to make you quit bugging me while i copy it down for you" (smith place player in Heavy Bondage) and tells player

                "come back no sooner than over 3 days from now" (restart 3 day timer to start over at this time) 

             3 "yes it is here you go, now let me get my stuff back" (removes quest items and give player a copy of bolt-cutter crafting manual)

             

quest ends

 

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I'm not a big fan of speechcraft in general, don't like the idea to avoid doing quests or stuff by just talking so i never skill it... i would at least appretiate it if the feature is still usable without. ;)

Craftable tools to remove devices: not a big fan of running around and collecting stuff either, i could do it my usual way and just use AddItemMenu but i've thought about alternatives:

With some few cheap iron and wood you could craft your own tool (workbench is what i have in mind, maybe something else would be better). It will never break, remove all non-quest devices but it's stationary. You can get out anytime you want, but not anywhere. ;)

What i could imagine for a transportable item is some alchemy stuff, little one-use potions that can cause an explosion small enough not to hurt the player, but enough to kill the lock. Firesalts would be an obvious ingredience, maybe with (frostbite) poison or something like that. Maybe with a chance that you get hurt anyways, a little debuff for according bodyparts or even a chance to trigger ampuator framework (i know that probably won't happen, but mentioning it anyways :P)

 

For not getting out immediatly, i was always a big fan of the more devious quests mod because of it's little tasks, randomly both lewd and innocent. Like, before your follower will let you out of your bra (or more items) you need 

a) do a task for them or

b) ask a random person for a task.

Those tasks could be anything, clean a place with a broom (and there is an awesome animation in ZAZ since 6.x where you clean, then somebody takes the broom and puts it into your butt), clean a sword (with and without pun), dance (in public or just for the follower),... 

 

Another idea i had, meant for safe places: your follower hides the key and you have to search for it first, there were some great animations actually made for maid work and workout, but i can't find them right now, will try again.

 

*edit: found them again. Check the video on the right, left on is almost only different sleeping poses. https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/81568

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it would also be wise to make the mod scan for the cursed loot items (hoods and the like) since it seems right now that they can't be removed by the follower, even with a key

I will continue to use the mod and warn of (percieved) flaws I find 

good luck and keep up the neat work, as it will no doubt become a crucial part of the DD supply

 

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First, thanks for all the feedback.  I don't have time to answer and quote everybody individually but I'll hit the main items.

 

First, if it is not listed in "What works" then it is not supposed to work yet.  In particular the follower offering to tie up the player only exists only as a miMind drawing of the dialog at this point.  I don't plan this to be a "long term use" case, but a short term "play time".  The player character will not be enslaved, she will be "role playing".

 

This is my first major mod and I have quite a learning curve to climb.  It is my first effort at doing things "correctly" with DDi.  I will be my first use of MCM Menus and maybe my first use of force greet.  This is all stuff I have to learn how to do, so it's going to take time.  I also said that I was releasing this early in order to fill a void.  It appears that I have at least succeded in that.

 

I am not making the MCM menu yet because the current refusal mechanic is incomplete and I don't want to do the corresponding MCM items twice.

 

If the follower's hands are tied they should say so and refuse to help, though I have not tested this as well as I should yet.  I do not intend to add a blindfold to the blocking mechanics because of my personal experience working on cars.  I don't have to see the bolt to put a nut on it.  I can do it by feel and the same goes for keys.

 

As far as removal of devices if the follower has a key, I did that because it made sense at the time.  I am aware of additional inventories created by AFT, Bag of holding, spawnable chest, etc.  I have no intention of supporting all that other stuff because of the dependencies it would add.

 

I have no plan to create portable bolt cutters.  I can see why some would want it but I think it is too much of a cheat.  Let's pretend that bolt cutters have not been invented yet and the blacksmith is using a hammer, cold chisel, and anvil.   I may implement cutting of leather devices if the follower has a knife.

 

My immediate short term goal is to get the device removal completed and debugged.

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2 minutes ago, donkeywho said:

@TurboNerd

 

Quick thought inspired by this

 

When adding to the mod, if at all possible, can you pls try to make updates installable on current games? 

 

I do realise that's not always feasible, but at the same time neither is abandoning a few hundred hours of gameplay :smile:

For this mod I don't think an upgrade will ever require any more than a clean save and use of a save cleaner.

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5 minutes ago, TurboNerd said:

First, thanks for all the feedback.  I don't have time to answer and quote everybody individually but I'll hit the main items.

 

First, if it is not listed in "What works" then it is not supposed to work yet.  In particular the follower offering to tie up the player only exists only as a miMind drawing of the dialog at this point.  I don't plan this to be a "long term use" case, but a short term "play time".  The player character will not be enslaved, she will be "role playing".

 

This is my first major mod and I have quite a learning curve to climb.  It is my first effort at doing things "correctly" with DDi.  I will be my first use of MCM Menus and maybe my first use of force greet.  This is all stuff I have to learn how to do, so it's going to take time.  I also said that I was releasing this early in order to fill a void.  It appears that I have at least succeded in that.

 

I am not making the MCM menu yet because the current refusal mechanic is incomplete and I don't want to do the corresponding MCM items twice.

 

If the follower's hands are tied they should say so and refuse to help, though I have not tested this as well as I should yet.  I do not intend to add a blindfold to the blocking mechanics because of my personal experience working on cars.  I don't have to see the bolt to put a nut on it.  I can do it by feel and the same goes for keys.

 

As far as removal of devices if the follower has a key, I did that because it made sense at the time.  I am aware of additional inventories created by AFT, Bag of holding, spawnable chest, etc.  I have no intention of supporting all that other stuff because of the dependencies it would add.

 

I have no plan to create portable bolt cutters.  I can see why some would want it but I think it is too much of a cheat.  Let's pretend that bolt cutters have not been invented yet and the blacksmith is using a hammer, cold chisel, and anvil.   I may implement cutting of leather devices if the follower has a knife.

 

My immediate short term goal is to get the device removal completed and debugged.

Thanks for the info.  It all sounds very sensible from here :smile:

 

Just take your time, do it as you can, and don't cut corners to placate the baying mob.  They can use their own straitjackets to keep themselves happy..... :tongue: 

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Sounds like a nice addition. But these parts

Quote

Second; a follower would, in a reasonably safe location, offer to help the player character have some fun by tying her up for a while.  Sometimes he might not take "no" for an answer.  When they are done having fun (after no more that five minutes real time), the follower would untie her, put the toys away and go off to hack and slay.  Related to this would be reluctance to remove restraints in "safe" areas and sometimes outright refusal.

should be toggleable from the very beginning, for the reason you stated in the very first sentence of mod description. Otherwise it will rapidly turn into just another chore.

 

On the other hand, it'd be better if "follower refusal" will be tied not to PC persuasion ability (Followers shouldn't be hostile shitheads, no is a no, those who don't understand should expect battleaxe explanation.), but better tied to rewards afterwards - usual loot, unusual  loot, some mutual fun. That would be much, MUCH better, if we replace "refusual" with "suggestion".

 

All too many DD mods turn their many features into an annoying, unskippable chore, don't do that to yours, please.

 

Or at least make a switch for those who don't want regular and mandatory DD commercial breaks in their game.

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2 hours ago, TurboNerd said:

I have no plan to create portable bolt cutters.  I can see why some would want it but I think it is too much of a cheat.  Let's pretend that bolt cutters have not been invented yet and the blacksmith is using a hammer, cold chisel, and anvil.   I may implement cutting of leather devices if the follower has a knife.

 

100% agree.  Besides, for immersive reasons, why are we picking locks left and right if we have bolt cutters?  This mod is primarily designed to fill a void, which it does.  As such, the simplest scripts will be the most reliable.

 

I can confirm that a player with bound arms will say they can't help you with most DD items (I didn't try every single one, only armbinders and yokes).  I have not yet tested it with any quest items, or with Captured Dreams items, which as I understand are "supposed" to be fully compatible, but can sometimes be tempermental.  I have...like...842 different bondage mods, so I'll keep an eye out for any conflicts.  

 

Although I haven't tested it, I believe that this could create conflicts with Devious Followers and Deviously Enslaved.  I'm going to try to stress test those later, but you may want to take a look at them.  I understand you're putting off having MCM functionality until you've got the basics hammered out, which is completely logical, but perhaps you'd consider a temporary menu option which simply toggles the "can you help me" dialogue option off and on, to avoid any potential conflicts?

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8 minutes ago, nigwriter said:

Although I haven't tested it, I believe that this could create conflicts with Devious Followers and Deviously Enslaved.  I'm going to try to stress test those later, but you may want to take a look at them.  I understand you're putting off having MCM functionality until you've got the basics hammered out, which is completely logical, but perhaps you'd consider a temporary menu option which simply toggles the "can you help me" dialogue option off and on, to avoid any potential conflicts?

If Devious Followers does not use the BlockGeneric or QuestItem keywords then the "Can you help me out?" dialog will allow the removal of any device DDH handles.  If there were a global "Player is Enslaved" flag somewhere that I could read without separate detection and query code for all of the player slavery mods out there, then I could turn off the "Can you help me out?" dialog when the player is a slave.  An obvious way to do that is to create a "Slave" faction and make the player a member when appropriate.  Good luck getting all the mod authors to respect that.  I think herding cats would be easier.

 

I don't see a conflict with Deviously Enslaved as far as approach and "free sex" are concerned, but enslavement could still be an issue if your follower remains in your service.

 

I don't use player slavery mods because, for me, it turns into a boring grind in a hurry.

 

I could add an enable item to a future MCM menu, but for now I can only suggest not using it if you suspect it might break something.

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Excellent work! I've been looking for something like this for a while, for similar reasons to what you mention.

 

Whilst trying to fight through a dungeon all tied up and full of sex toys is fun (for a given LoversLab value of 'fun' admittedly ;) ) once I have got back to town it's over, and I want to move on to the next adventure rather than spending hours fighting repetitive futile escape mechanisms for the devices.

 

I've been wanting a framework that lets me crawl up to a blacksmith and go 'Ugh...I seem to be covered in twisted cursed items...can you cut them off please...' - to the point of considering learning how to mod so I can write it.

 

Thanks, will add it to my build now and see how it works.

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