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[WIP] Skyrim Slavers Guild


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Eh' date=' but don't you KINDA ALREADY Get one (or several, actually) of those in the vanilla game? You know, Housecarls? Seems to me that kind of reward is just a tad bit... redundant then. Different premiss then, but yeah.

 

And what if you're married? lol.

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Well, I woudn't want to force anyone into the role of slavekeeper. I'm sure you'd be able to find loving homes for these poor girls and earn the gratitude of the community for doing so.

 

On the other hand, I wouldn't penalise a fellow if he wanted to keep a souvenir or two of the quest.

 

Well' date=' unless you (and your spouce assumably) are starting your own little harem ;)

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Seems like a legitimate aspiration to me ;)

 

After you get the "Agent of Dibella" perk after rescuing that little girl from the foresworn' date=' perhaps there could be a small, radiant fueled quest where you're tasked with actually putting it to good use: That is, going out and "instructing" men/women on the proper and beautiful use of sexual intercourse and making love. After all, if there's one thing skyrim lacks and needs a lot more of these days its people making love and less making war. ;)

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It would make for a good counter-balance for the rape and degradation that tends to go on in these mods, I suppose. I'm not sure I'm the one to write it, but we could probably sort something out.

 

Also' date=' the House of Dibella would be another faction that could be a possible enemy of the slavers guild (and ally of you if you go the anti-slavers guild route, enemy if otherwise.) in addition to/instead of the vigilants. [/quote']

 

I can certainly see them being grateful. Maybe even offer a temp companion to help with some of the quest stages. Both of which could be interesting, I suppose...

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For a female PC who decides to oppose the Slaver's Guild (rescue the damsel rather than rape her, etc), you might have the PC herself become the target of NPCs who are actually doing Slaver quests.

 

e.g.: if the PC is an elf, then it turns out that she has the genetic signature needed for the next stage in the breeding process for the Snow Elf Rebreeding project. You could have a band of slavers show up to capture the PC. Alternately, you could have the slavers actually take note of the PC's reputation as the Dhovakiin of legend, and do the smart thing and lie in wait for the next time she goes to sleep.

 

related: would her being Dragonborn have an effect on the breeding project?

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I think you could have some the girls you rescue stay with the PC due not having family to go back to as they where killed in the raid that captured them. Or they are now seen as tainted and despoiled that their families and communities would not accepted them back. So they join you household as they have few options.

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related: would her being Dragonborn have an effect on the breeding project?

 

So you're saying I should lock the PC' date=' and up force her to become a brood mare for a bunch of incestuous snow elves with all the loving benevolence of a Falmer Shadowmaster with a bad hangover, and who can also shout in Dragontongue?

 

That's nasty. Even by my standards, that's nasty. I'll [i']definitely[/i] consider it :D

 

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DocClox, this is one heck of a mod to be undertaking and kudos for you in getting ideas up. I'm not sure how much my ideas will help but here goes:

 

QUESTS

1) Instead of starting a 'damsel-in-distress' mission, you can probably start this quest by having a random NPC (a civilian most likely) come up to you and talk about a slave raid on them during their travels. Once you track them down, the slave leader can offer you either to turn away, join them or pay to rape/have some fun with the slaves so far.

 

If you turn away, you can branch that story with the Radiant Story to destroy the Slave trade.

 

However, if you choose to join, you'll have to prove their worth by enslaving a particular person (this person has to be unique and not required for quests, perhaps an original NPC?) and bringing them to them. Once done, you can then start the quests to help them gain favour and notoriety.

 

1a) So once you gain their trust, you next move would be to acquire a place for them. So buying out a store and kicking the owner out/paying them to keep quiet would be the next step. If you listen carefully to Belethor's comments, he did say that he can sell your sister if you were so inclined so perhaps have him as the logical shop front. However, you'll need to pass a speech check or bribe him to do this.

 

1b) Another alternative would be to go to Winterhold and open a store there. Have an empty house and get the Jarl's favour to have that house opened. After that, you need to find possible shopkeepers.

 

2) Once you find a place, you can start slaving but you need the required pieces such as slave collars and the like. Collars and potions, you can learn off the slave leader. Magic, you might do this from a rogue wizard. You need to find some muscle in training so perhaps certain individuals are paid to help training. Uthgerd the Unbroken is a possible as she enjoys pain and 'beating people to a pulp'.

 

3) ????

 

4) PROFIT! But have certain slaves trained in a certain way such as a Jarl needing a loyal slave that's good in one handed...etc.

 

CONSUMABLES/ITEMS

1) Slave collars can be crafted at a forge/workshop with some leather strips and iron ingots.

 

2) Have a potion where the drinker is automatically in heat?

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DocClox' date=' this is one heck of a mod to be undertaking and kudos for you in getting ideas up.

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Thank you. I just hope I can do justice to it all. I'm very aware of how ambitious some of this is, especially for a starting modder. Realistically, I'll be more than happy to get as far as taking over Helgen.

 

And if I do hit a wall developing this, maybe the ideas will be of use to someone else. I just wish I had a CK to play with. (Me and a thousand other modders, I know :))

 

1) Instead of starting a 'damsel-in-distress' mission' date=' you can probably start this quest by having a random NPC (a civilian most likely) come up to you and talk about a slave raid on them during their travels. Once you track them down, the slave leader can offer you either to turn away, join them or pay to rape/have some fun with the slaves so far.

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I think I prefer giving the player the moral choice before meeting the guild. Maybe make it a little more explicit: She's tied down, naked and blindfolded. You need to find the key to release her, and when you activate her to remove the chains you get a choice:

 

"What do you want to do?

*Release her

*Fuck her. She'll never know it was you"

 

Players (or characters) with a strong moral centre do the right thing, and they get the destroy the guild quest. The ones who have some fun are probably the ones who want to be in the guild. Although it should probably be possible to decline the invite at this stage and still get on the destruction path. Probably with some ugly rumours circulating about you if you choose that path.

 

 

However' date=' if you choose to join, you'll have to prove their worth by enslaving a particular person (this person has to be unique and not required for quests, perhaps an original NPC?) and bringing them to them. Once done, you can then start the quests to help them gain favour and notoriety.

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I was thinking rape first, then abduction, then enslavement. It's a graduated series of tests for the guild. The way I see it, the guild when you join is one, maybe two guys. They had a base in a ruin, with some bandit guards who were working for free pussy plus a cut of the loot - but you just wrecked that. So until you get to Helgen, there isn't really anywhere to deliver a slave to.

 

If you listen carefully to Belethor's comments' date=' he did say that he can sell your sister if you were so inclined so perhaps have him as the logical shop front. However, you'll need to pass a speech check or bribe him to do this.

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Now why didn't I think of that? Yeah, you'd need to be a good talker to make that happen, but I like that a lot.

 

1b) Another alternative would be to go to Winterhold and open a store there. Have an empty house and get the Jarl's favour to have that house opened. After that' date=' you need to find possible shopkeepers.

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Another nice idea. I've always thought there should be something you can do with those ruined houses.

 

2) Once you find a place' date=' you can start slaving but you need the required pieces such as slave collars and the like. Collars and potions, you can learn off the slave leader. Magic, you might do this from a rogue wizard.

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Simple stuff like non-magical collars and cuffs you can probably smith from the start. Maybe have a guild smith turn up once Helgen is online, and you can learn from him. The magic and potions I want to be a bit miserly with and hand them out as quest rewards. I suppose the guild could use access to a bent enchanter, just in case the player doesn't want to learn. Maybe I'll add a quest to recruit (or enslave) one.

 

You need to find some muscle in training so perhaps certain individuals are paid to help training. Uthgerd the Unbroken is a possible as she enjoys pain and 'beating people to a pulp'.

 

Nice' date=' but remember why the companions refused to take her. You'd probably wind up with a certain "spoilage" rate if you had her as a trainer. On the other hand, I could be tempted to give her bonuses if you took her along on slaving missions.

 

I'm also thinking that not all companions should be equally keen on this slaving business. Some of them should probably refuse to help.. but that might get complicated, and it's fluff rather than substance.

 

4) PROFIT! But have certain slaves trained in a certain way such as a Jarl needing a loyal slave that's good in one handed...etc.

 

Yeah, that'd be nice. I'm shying away from training too many skills at the moment, at least until I have a better idea of what's entailed, but adding skills profiles to the mission requirement would be cool. I could see bard skills being in demand as well. Might wait for someone to do a barding overhaul for that one.

 

 

1) Slave collars can be crafted at a forge/workshop with some leather strips and iron ingots.

 

Absolutely. And cuffs' date=' hobbles. Maybe dildo panties later on, and some jewlery for piercings. The lack of clothing slots is going to be a serious pain here.

 

Maybe one simple enchantment, early on as well. Add a soul gem that acted as a quest marker when you cast a certain spell. Then if the little darlings did stray, you'd know where to go looking.

 

2) Have a potion where the drinker is automatically in heat?

 

Oh yeah. And maybe a stronger, addictive version.

 

The problem I'm having with potions is how to administer them. Force someone to drink one using persuasion or intimidation? (I have a feeling slavers are going get lots of chances to level up speechcraft). Treat 'em as poisons and use the pickpocket perk to drop 'em in someone's inventory? That could be entertaining in it's own right.

 

Maybe some others that work as sleeping draughts, lingering drains on combat stats (reduce combat skills, damage, magicka probably have a range of effects rather than one potion to knobble all at once) or reduce willpower (make target yield earlier and more likely to submit to intimidation). These could work well with the knife at the throat perk. "Drink this, or die"/"No! What is it?"/"It's not going to hurt you, but you need to drink it, NOW!"

 

I'm also tempted to do some of this stuff with food. Add some recipes so you can either try the poison apple approach with a target, or just keep your slaves dosed on the stuff to keep down the chance of rebellion and escape.

 

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The other side of the coin, of course, is how to administer potions or doped food to an enslaved player, of course. If we arrange for her to operate under some sort of hardcode recovery system, she'll voluntarily eat and drink what's on offer for the limited recovery they offer, which would be my preferred option. But if potions are your only option for limiting recovery, how do you administer the first dose? Dartguns are tempting, as are spells, but they feel like a bit of a cop-out. Plus they'd make things too easy for the slaver players...

 

Things to think about :)

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Alright, the mod is awesome by it self, and really, I think that the start is ready and should be the way it is developed now, adding new stuff is going to decrease the fun. But the thing i wanned to say is that u should really consider about the voice acting, im sure its not easy to find ppl who would do that, but u should write a topic or just a post that ur looking for voice actors. First just write all the words ofcourse and be sure about them, so u dont need to update it, release ur first version without the voice acting and see how it looks, later on, u could add some voice actings, it would really increase the number of ppl who would play this mod, as mods without voice acting r really boring.

 

But anyways this is what i wanned to say, good luck with the mod, its really the one that i gonna wait the most. Btw for most performance u should really wait for CK, its better to have a fully made mod then partially lame one, no offence, but in my expirience i know that CK increases works performance.

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Alright' date=' the mod is awesome by it self, and really, I think that the start is ready and should be the way it is developed now, adding new stuff is going to decrease the fun.

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Thank you. I think you're probably right, although I'll probably still add the odd node to the outline, if only so I don't forget it.

 

But the thing i wanned to say is that u should really consider about the voice acting.

 

Yeah' date=' I'm not averse to voice acting - I just don't want to worry about it until I have something working and playable. I think we're more or less on the same page, here.

 

Mind, it'll never be fully voiced, if only because I'm going to have to give some lines to existing NPCs. Still, cross that bridge when we come to it and all that...

 

Btw for most performance u should really wait for CK, its better to have a fully made mod then partially lame one, no offence, but in my expirience i know that CK increases works performance.

 

Yeah, I know. I'm not familar enough with Gamebryo/Creation to make a mod without the CK. Much as I'm itching to get started with this, it's going to have to wait until I have the tools :)

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Yeah' date=' I'm not averse to voice acting - I just don't want to worry about it until I have something working and playable. I think we're more or less on the same page, here.

 

Mind, it'll never be fully voiced, if only because I'm going to have to give some lines to existing NPCs. Still, cross that bridge when we come to it and all that...

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I am a rather good vocal mimic (male) with a pretty good range. I'm no Rich Little, but I'm pretty good. I could train myself to emulate the voices of vanilla characters when the time comes. I may even be able to emulate the voices of the huskier voiced females (Argonian, Khajiit). I can't promise great quality recordings right now as I don't have any good audio equipment, but I don't think you need the voices right off anyway right?

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I am a rather good vocal mimic (male) with a pretty good range. I'm no Rich Little' date=' but I'm pretty good. I could train myself to emulate the voices of vanilla characters when the time comes. I may even be able to emulate the voices of the huskier voiced females (Argonian, Khajiit).

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Hey, cool :)

 

I can't promise great quality recordings right now as I don't have any good audio equipment' date=' but I don't think you need the voices right off anyway right?

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That's right. At the very least I want to have something released and playable. And thinking about it, I need to be confident that the lines aren't going to change, so we're probably talking a couple of releases in before we think seriously about this.

 

But that's a great offer, thanks. Let's talk about this again, once I have something more than a bunch of notes and quest outlines :)

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As far as all this goes, I think you basically know what you want to do, but I would set up seperate experiences for male and female characters, personally. As well, I think female characters should get some time as slaves. Perhaps getting ambushed and raped themselves when they find the naked, chained girl at the very beginning, and having to fuck and arena-fight their way to freedom by pleasing the various pit-bosses, lieutenants, and leaders. Just a thought.

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As far as all this goes' date=' I think you basically know what you want to do, but I would set up seperate experiences for male and female characters, personally. As well, I think female characters should get some time as slaves.

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That's the plan, more or less. There's a lot of common content between the male and female path, but there's also going to be a lot of opportunities for the female PC to find herself enslaved. In fact, she'll be lucky to make it through the questline without feeling a collar around her neck at least once.

 

Perhaps getting ambushed and raped themselves when they find the naked' date=' chained girl at the very beginning, and having to fuck and arena-fight their way to freedom by pleasing the various pit-bosses, lieutenants, and leaders. Just a thought.

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Probably not right at the start, but starting pretty soon thereafter. For instance, if you mess up on the first couple of missions, you might start the Helen Ruins mission to find that the guild have already sent someone to do the recruiting, and you get jumped by all of the bandits at the same time. Once that happens, you're going to need to do a lot of fucking and sucking just to stay alive, and a lot of fighting before they'll take another chance on you.

 

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It sounds really good thus far. I hope you can do justice to your very ambitious (and awesome) plans. Just thought I might chip in with a couple of ideas/considerations.

 

First, I think it would be good if the slavers guild did a bit of abductions for purposes other than slavery. While slavery should be the biggest part, it would be nice if you could put your abduction skills to work in capturing people and then handing them on to other parties unscathed. Going on with the Thalmor idea, maybe they contract you to abduct a stormcloak officer. You snatch him and just hand him on to the Thalmor for gold. They would pay more for an untouched (read: unraped) victim; I get the feeling they like to do their own torture/interrogation. Same theme: perhaps the Imperials/stormcloaks want you to capture a stormcloak/imperial courier/officer for the war effort. The general idea is that perhaps the slavers guild could occasionally do side jobs - after all, they've already got the means to abduct people.

 

Secondly, I think that you shouldn't be afraid of making some the targets relatively important NPCs that are already in Vanilla. Yes, that could potentially screw up quests, but I get the feeling that a character who works for a guild of slaver rapists isn't in Skyrim to help every man woman and child with their petty problems. Also, by making the target a named NPC, there is a larger connection and larger moral choice in enacting the abduction and following slave-making. In the Dark Brotherhood, all the radiant quests are to talk to the Scheming Servant/Corrupt Officer/Desperate Gambler and then kill the Itinerant Worker/Travelling Dignitary etc. They are repetitive and boring - the target is an automaton, story-less and two dimensional. By having real NPCs (eg Ysolda or Falk Firebeard or Chief Battleborn) as the target, each mission will have more gravity. You really get the sense that your actions change the world.

 

So, you might consider:

1) implementing side-jobs to perform non-slavery/rapey abductions. This could be added in a later version, once the bulk of the slavers guild stuff is done.

2) don't be afraid to make the target a questgiver/otherwise important NPC. After all, why would someone pay lots of money to have the Itinerant Worker abducted and raped?

 

Keep up the good ideas and hopefully make this dream a reality! Virtual reality, that is.

 

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First' date=' I think it would be good if the slavers guild did a bit of abductions for purposes other than slavery. While slavery should be the biggest part, it would be nice if you could put your abduction skills to work in capturing people and then handing them on to other parties unscathed.

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Funny you should say that - I've been wracking my brains for other possible radiant missions. Ideally, I want to expand the pool of radiant missions available with each new location.

 

Certainly some "deliver unharmed" missions. As a special case of that, I can imagine some "rescue" missions where you have to go and liberate someone who has been abducted by another group. "Set a thief to catch a thief" and all that.

 

I was thinking of having some pure interrogation missions. Abduct and abuse by whatever means you choose until certain information is divulged, and then release the subject into the wild, possibly after the client has had a chance to verify the data. A variation on the theme would be to make sure the victim disappeared for good, with the implementation of the disappearance left to the player's discretion. (Murdered, kept for personal use, exiled to Cyrodiil and told never to come back, traded to the Falmer, that sort of thing...)

 

Some "persuasion" missions might be possible as well. Variations on abduct-and-rape where the objective is to get them to agree with whatever it as Maeve Black-Briar wants them to do (for instance). And on the understanding that if they don't co-operate, you can always come back again. In some cases you'll be targetting wives and/or daughters to put pressure on someone; in other cases it'll be the woman who has the authority and she can be persuaded directly.

 

mmm... I'm not doing very well on the non-rapey, non-slavey side of things. How about, once you have some suitable well trained slaves in-house, a few honeytrap missions, where you set a well trained sex-slave to seduce a senior figure, either to discredit them, or for purposes of blackmail. The same approach coudl work for persuasion and interrogation missions too, unless the client explicitly asks for violence. (and of course, female PCs could do their own honeytrapping if they wanted ... but it might not be best to get the rest ofthe guild thinking along those lines...)

 

Finally, there's the "stepford" operation, where you take a wife who's making her husband unhappy for some reason, and return to him one who is happy, obedient, and really enthusiastic in bed. No questions asked about "how", but there might well be a deadline with a bonus attached.

 

perhaps the Imperials/stormcloaks want you to capture a stormcloak/imperial courier/officer for the war effort. The general idea is that perhaps the slavers guild could occasionally do side jobs - after all' date=' they've already got the means to abduct people.

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Yeah, exactly :) I was thinking that once the guild builds its profile a bit, both sides would have the occasional radiant mission to capture a female soldier from the other side and deliver her to one of their camps as a "morale booster". I thought of two variations: one where you deliver her naked and bound but otherwise unharmed and let her spit defiance while the legionaires/stormcloaks have their way with her, and the other one where you deliver her in her full gear (or some portion thereof) after breaking her spirit and training her as a sex slave. Of course, once the Dragonborn chooses a side in the war, he'll only get jobs from his chosen side.

 

 

Secondly' date=' I think that you shouldn't be afraid of making some the targets relatively important NPCs that are already in Vanilla. Yes, that could potentially screw up quests, but I get the feeling that a character who works for a guild of slaver rapists isn't in Skyrim to help every man woman and child with their petty problems.

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Agreed again. I think I'd like to allow any female in Skyrim to be targetted by the guild, with a big disclaimer that if you mess with major NPCs you may break something. Possibly with an option to only allow non-quest NPCs for the nervous.

 

Also' date=' by making the target a named NPC, there is a larger connection and larger moral choice in enacting the abduction and following slave-making. In the Dark Brotherhood, all the radiant quests are to talk to the Scheming Servant/Corrupt Officer/Desperate Gambler and then kill the Itinerant Worker/Travelling Dignitary etc. They are repetitive and boring - the target is an automaton, story-less and two dimensional. By having real NPCs (eg Ysolda or Falk Firebeard or Chief Battleborn) as the target, each mission will have more gravity. You really get the sense that your actions change the world.

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mmm... a few of the big names I want to save for the final stage, where you need to persuade a few of the Jarls to allow the guild to operate openly. So that well known Reserved Word, Elsif the Fair, could be a target for a persuasion mission. Or one of the Black-Briar clan. Maybe persuade Balgruf through Proventus, and pressure Proventus through Adrianne. That sort of thing.

 

That said, there are dozens of minor NPCs who can probably be named, and yeah, I agree with your thinking entirely. It would add a lot to be targetting people with whom you'd already had some interaction. I might limit these to the missions that returned them to the wild, though, at least in terms of radiant missions, purely so the guild doesn't de-populate the game over time.

 

So yeah, I'm definitely interested in more kinds of radiant missions, if only to try and keep them from getting too samey, and I'm probably going to include if not all, then a lot of named, vanilla NPCs in many of the radiant missions.

 

Keep up the good ideas and hopefully make this dream a reality! Virtual reality' date=' that is.

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Thanks :) I'll do my best!

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The guild is strong now' date=' but must still operate in secrecy. Having resolved the dragon crisis and brought an end to the civil war, the Dragonborn is well placed to persuade the Jarls to recognise the ancient guild once again. Of course, some may require more persuasion than others...

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Ehhhhhhhhhh, this is probably the one thing I'm going to have to have to disagree with. Logically, there's NO WAY all the Jarls, let alone the two factions running them, would ever agree to this. It just doesn't even BEGIN to make any sort sense, logically OR loreically (especially loreically), dragonborn or no (In fact, proposing such a thing would probably just sully your reputation rather than achieving the desired result.)

 

Ulfric wouldn't allow it for sure, ESPECIALLY if it means enslaving fellow nords. Oh sure, he might look the other way when it comes to enslaving other races AT BEST, but otherwise if you even enslaved a single nord, then you'd quickly find his Stormcloak army beating down your front door.

 

The Legion would also not be interested in backing it. Oh sure, they employ some "back door" slavery (see below), but official, "grab some babes from no where, fuck em, and sell 'em on the open market" kind of slavery? Definitely not.

 

Now I know you're probably going to bring up two points: Morrowind and Markthal's prison. However, neither of these are valid in this case and I'll explain why.

 

Morrowind: Morrowind allowed slavery too, but you have to remember: Up until King Helseth did away with it anyway, Morrowind had always allowed slavery since the day it was formed. So it had inertia. They weren't trying to "bring it back" as it is in this case.

 

On top of that, you've got to remember that they got 90% of their slaves from outside of Morrowind, not within it. The other 10% were pretty much all criminals or people who didn't pay their debts on time. Slavers in morrowind (legal ones anyway, there were some bandits that did this but they were outlaws anyway, like your group.) didn't just go around randomly grabbing potential slaves off the streets and roads like this guild does.

 

Finally, slavery in Morrowind was tolerated, but just barely. The only true advocates for it were: The Telvanni (Xenophobic, bigoted wizards too lazy to do any real work and too stingy to hire people), House Dres (Because their entire economy ran on slave labor), The Cammona Tong (Bunch of Murderous Xenophobic criminals. Basically what your guild is, minus perhaps the xenophobia part), and the 6th house (who nobody liked to begin with), and to a lesser degree the east empire company (who are corrupt to the bone by greed and represent some of the worst aspects of capitalism/protocapitalism.) Pretty much every other faction in Morrowind distanced themselves from it (Redoran looked down upon it, the non-C.Tong part of Hlaalu opposed it, The Imperial Cult denouced it, the Legion basically dragged their feet when it came to enforcing slavery laws, the temple supported it only as a "tradition," The thieves guild were against it from the start, and let's not forget the twin lamps either.

 

If there was that much resistance against institutionalized/tolerated slavery in Morrowind, then imagine trying to bring it back to a country that hasn't had it in thousands of years, let alone slavery under such questionable pretenses (so horny men can have a free fuck is not a very good reason for any leader to accept a sexual slave trade) and being dragonborn isn't going to help any.

 

In fact, the only faction of any importance in Skyrim that I can think of that would accept such a thing is... well, the Thalmor, and even they'd only accept it as a means to an end. Beyond them though, no one would accept it.

 

MARKOTH: "but wait, there already is slavery in skyrim! In Markoth!" ... well, no. Those aren't random people they've grabbed from off the streets or from across the borders, those were prisoners of war or political prisoners or common criminals. It's not the same thing.

 

So yeah, I'm sorry, but I just don't see the whole "Getting the sex slaver guild accepted publicly into skyrim" as anywhere near feasible or believable. Even Skyrim legalizing the Dark Brotherhood is much more feasible than even tolerating let alone legalizing this Slavers Guild.

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The guild is strong now' date=' but must still operate in secrecy. Having resolved the dragon crisis and brought an end to the civil war, the Dragonborn is well placed to persuade the Jarls to recognise the ancient guild once again. Of course, some may require more persuasion than others...

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Ehhhhhhhhhh, this is probably the one thing I'm going to have to have to disagree with. Logically, there's NO WAY all the Jarls, let alone the two factions running them, would ever agree to this. It just doesn't even BEGIN to make any sort sense, logically OR loreically (especially loreically), dragonborn or no (In fact, proposing such a thing would probably just sully your reputation rather than achieving the desired result.)

 

Ulfric wouldn't allow it for sure, ESPECIALLY if it means enslaving fellow nords. Oh sure, he might look the other way when it comes to enslaving other races AT BEST, but otherwise if you even enslaved a single nord, then you'd quickly find his Stormcloak army beating down your front door.

 

The Legion would also not be interested in backing it. Oh sure, they employ some "back door" slavery (see below), but official, "grab some babes from no where, fuck em, and sell 'em on the open market" kind of slavery? Definitely not.

 

Now I know you're probably going to bring up two points: Morrowind and Markthal's prison. However, neither of these are valid in this case and I'll explain why.

 

Morrowind: Morrowind allowed slavery too, but you have to remember: Up until King Helseth did away with it anyway, Morrowind had always allowed slavery since the day it was formed. So it had inertia. They weren't trying to "bring it back" as it is in this case.

 

On top of that, you've got to remember that they got 90% of their slaves from outside of Morrowind, not within it. The other 10% were pretty much all criminals or people who didn't pay their debts on time. Slavers in morrowind (legal ones anyway, there were some bandits that did this but they were outlaws anyway, like your group.) didn't just go around randomly grabbing potential slaves off the streets and roads like this guild does.

 

Finally, slavery in Morrowind was tolerated, but just barely. The only true advocates for it were: The Telvanni (Xenophobic, bigoted wizards too lazy to do any real work and too stingy to hire people), House Dres (Because their entire economy ran on slave labor), The Cammona Tong (Bunch of Murderous Xenophobic criminals. Basically what your guild is, minus perhaps the xenophobia part), and the 6th house (who nobody liked to begin with), and to a lesser degree the east empire company (who are corrupt to the bone by greed and represent some of the worst aspects of capitalism/protocapitalism.) Pretty much every other faction in Morrowind distanced themselves from it (Redoran looked down upon it, the non-C.Tong part of Hlaalu opposed it, The Imperial Cult denouced it, the Legion basically dragged their feet when it came to enforcing slavery laws, the temple supported it only as a "tradition," The thieves guild were against it from the start, and let's not forget the twin lamps either.

 

If there was that much resistance against institutionalized/tolerated slavery in Morrowind, then imagine trying to bring it back to a country that hasn't had it in thousands of years, let alone slavery under such questionable pretenses (so horny men can have a free fuck is not a very good reason for any leader to accept a sexual slave trade) and being dragonborn isn't going to help any.

 

In fact, the only faction of any importance in Skyrim that I can think of that would accept such a thing is... well, the Thalmor, and even they'd only accept it as a means to an end. Beyond them though, no one would accept it.

 

MARKOTH: "but wait, there already is slavery in skyrim! In Markoth!" ... well, no. Those aren't random people they've grabbed from off the streets or from across the borders, those were prisoners of war or political prisoners or common criminals. It's not the same thing.

 

So yeah, I'm sorry, but I just don't see the whole "Getting the sex slaver guild accepted publicly into skyrim" as anywhere near feasible or believable. Even Skyrim legalizing the Dark Brotherhood is much more feasible than even tolerating let alone legalizing this Slavers Guild.

 

Who said a faction would do that? Dont u think that random bandits would do anythin just to get someone to fuck or some money? Btw, u dont have to bring up the whole slavery story, theres always ppl in high posts which r going to take bribes. So in this case, ur opinion is a waste of ur time, writing such a post wasnt easy eh? So just sayin, if u dont like it, who cares, everyone else does.

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Who said a faction would do that?

 

You mean allow a slavers guild in Skyrim? They wouldn't. That's exactly the point I'm trying to make.

 

Dont u think that random bandits would do anythin just to get someone to fuck or some money?

 

Er' date=' what? What does that have to do with building guildhalls in every city and/or getting the Jarls to officially recognize the guild? That's not the point of what I'm trying to say here at all. Are you even reading what I wrote before?

 

Btw, u dont have to bring up the whole slavery story, theres always ppl in high posts which r going to take bribes.

 

There's a huge difference between "Giving officials bribes to look the other way so you have less frequent raids on your slaver base" and "Getting officially recognized and allowed legally and setting up guildhalls in every city." Which is what the OP is proposing. I for one would accept the former, as that would be realistic, but not the latter.

 

Please read both the post I'm making, AND the post I'm replying to before saying stuff like this.

 

So in this case' date=' ur opinion is a waste of ur time, writing such a post wasnt easy eh? So just sayin, if u dont like it, who cares, everyone else does.[/quote']

 

Oh, so suddenly because I find ONE SMALL TINY PART of this idea completely unfeasible/unrealistic, I suddenly hate the whole idea now and I should just shut up, is that what you're trying to say? Because, god forbid we should... you know, discuss the idea? God forbid that anyone should, say, give feedback and opinions on presented ideas?

 

This is the kind of mentality that wrecked Nexus, this "Love it 100% or don't say anything at all" attitude.

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Ulfric wouldn't allow it for sure' date=' ESPECIALLY if it means enslaving fellow nords. Oh sure, he might look the other way when it comes to enslaving other races AT BEST, but otherwise if you even enslaved a single nord, then you'd quickly find his Stormcloak army beating down your front door.

[/quote']

 

Actually, the general point has occurred to me as well. There's a good argument for saying that if you take this option then the guild will have to stop abducting random innocents. Maybe that would be imposed as a condition of trading openly. Still you can probably go and harvest bandits, foresworn, necromancers and other undesirable types without anyone getting too upset about it.

 

Maybe throw in a few missions to enforce debtor's slavery, maybe collar a few criminals and the like and I think Ulfric could plausibly be sold on the idea. For the rest of it, it's a case of don't get caught, or pay penalties similar to murder, and maybe fines to the guild as well. I think it could be made to work without spitting in the eye of All That Has Gone Before.

 

The other way to look at this is: what do I want out of this? In terms of narrative and of game effects.

 

  • I want an sense of closure for the main quest, but without too slavishly following the TG & DB formula of "oh gosh, why don't you be in charge? Oh, BTW, we're doing really well now".
  • I want a good excuse to open slave markets across Skyrim. I want to ride into Winterhold and pass the local slaver with three naked lovlies chained and shivering in the snow, and I want to have some justification for them being there. It may not withstand close scrutiny, but I want to try and at least respect the setting and the lore. This is probably as close as I'm going to get.
  • I want to give the player a chance to mess with the great and the powerful in Skyrim. Possibly a little unreasonably, but no more so on balance than the DB being allowed to continue after the second, successful, assassination attempt on the Emperor.

 

I'm open to suggestions for a better way to achieve these things. Failing that, I'll work inside the Lore as far as I can to get where I'm going.

 

Morrowind: Morrowind allowed slavery too' date=' but you have to remember:

On top of that, you've got to remember that they got 90% of their slaves from outside of Morrowind, not within it. The other 10% were pretty much all criminals or people who didn't pay their debts on time. Slavers in morrowind (legal ones anyway, there were some bandits that did this but they were outlaws anyway, like your group.) didn't just go around randomly grabbing potential slaves off the streets and roads like this guild does.

[/quote']

 

Good points, well argued and in general, a valid interpretation. That said, the history of Tamriel is one of slavery everywhere you look. To see it arise again in Skyrim might surprise a few people, but it's not exactly unprecedented. Respecting the lore of the setting is a matter of degree, I always think. It's not as if I'm introducing men-from-mars as a playable race, or Spongebob Squarepants as a major villain.

 

The way I see it, Skyrim is at a time of change, when old institutions may crumble, and new one rise. Or be restored. We have an empire on the verge of collapse, a province largely in ruins and torn by internal strife. This is a setting where the future could turn in any number of directions. And the directions it does turn in are largely going to be determined by one hero. The Dragonborn.

 

MARKOTH: "but wait' date=' there already is slavery in skyrim! In Markoth!" ... well, no. Those aren't random people they've grabbed from off the streets or from across the borders, those were prisoners of war or political prisoners or common criminals. It's not the same thing.

[/quote']

 

Yeah, it's more indentured servitude than outright slavery. It comes to much the same thing, but I take your point entirely. Like I say, the guild will have to change it's methods if it wants to go legit.

 

So yeah' date=' I'm sorry, but I just don't see the whole "Getting the sex slaver guild accepted publicly into skyrim" as anywhere near feasible or believable. Even Skyrim legalizing the Dark Brotherhood is much more feasible than even tolerating let alone legalizing this Slavers Guild.

[/quote']

 

Well, there's a long way to go before that even gets to be an issue. Nothing that far ahead is set in stone, and I'm certainly open to suggestions. If a lot of people object, if all else fails I can probably set a config option so the final questline never occurs.

 

At the end of the day though, it's a BDSM fetish fantasy first and foremost, and while I want my work to respect the setting, that's not the only consideration, and not always the most important one.

 

That's how I see it, anyway.

 

[edit]

 

Actually, it occurs to me that the best punishment for breaking the law once the guild goes legit would be to be thrown out of the guild. You'd still be able to operate as a slaver, but with reduced considerably resources, and the legitimate guild would all be looking for you. Kind of poetic justice, really...

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Wow this is amazing and ambitious, a lot like something I had imagined except much more intricate. I really hope you make it.

 

But please please please! Don't forget female players! Even if female PCs can't really join in on the raping as a slaver (though there might still be some ways for them to use female slaves), they can still be subjected to everything female NPCs are subjected to. And you can do a lot with a female PC that you couldn't with a male.

 

For instance having her health reduced to 0 after an encounter with slavers could get her enslaved instead of killed, either that of give her the option to "yield" before dying. And once slavery is reestablished, it doesn't even have to be only the Slavers Guild. Certain factions could capture the player and hold her captive instead of killing her. Her fate could be anything from serving at the Thalmor embassy to being prostituted to hard labour in a mine to being chained naked in a Forsworn camp and used as a toy. Or being sold to another faction and marched naked through Skyrim. There could be several possible but difficult mini-quests allowing her to escape. Or she could be rescued after a (not too short) while. Or not.

 

Similarly, being captured/raped/enslaved could happen to your companion or spouse, which would prompt you to go rescue her.

 

There could also be rapist NPCs roaming Skyrim, who will rape the PC if they manage to defeat her (but will not capture).

 

A female PC could also freely use her body in certain cases with a sufficient speech skill, for instance to get a guard to drop her bounty, or instead of fighting certain hostile NPCs like thieves (or possibly even certain creatures...)

 

The automated Dwemer facility is an excellent idea. I really like those kinds of events that render the female PC very defenceless, be it by applying strongly restrictive effects on her or spitting her out into the wilderness stripped of all items, combined with the fact that Skyrim becomes a very dangerous place for helpless females.

 

Perhaps some of those events could even leave some permanent marks on the PC. In any case, this could make playing as a female a lot more challenging :)

 

 

Sorry if some things I mentioned have already been adressed, I haven't completely read through the comments yet but couldn't wait to post.

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This sounds awesome can't wait till it gets started. An interesting twist for this would be to have the Dwemer facility as a potential headquarters site for the slavers guild with the threat that if the sex slaves don't do as they are told they will be sent in to the facility to be trained by the machines. Also another idea with the slavers guild would be to have domesticated monsters as slave tools, like trolls for punishing slaves and other type monsters.

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I really love the idea of the Dwemer Ruins; was thinking about it a bit, and thought it would be cool if the PC was lead there on a quest by somebody who feels wronged by them. As in, somebody who was inadvertently affected by the PC actions, or maybe something like a Dark Brotherhood associate who escaped it's destruction at the hands of the PC and now poses as a person in need of assistance in order to exact the ultimate revenge. Anything like this wouldn't preclude the player from just stumbling into the trap by themself, either.

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Actually' date=' the general point has occurred to me as well. There's a good argument for saying that if you take this option then the guild will have to stop abducting random innocents. Maybe that would be imposed as a condition of trading openly. Still you can probably go and harvest bandits, foresworn, necromancers and other undesirable types without anyone getting too upset about it.

 

Maybe throw in a few missions to enforce debtor's slavery, maybe collar a few criminals and the like and I think Ulfric could plausibly be sold on the idea. For the rest of it, it's a case of don't get caught, or pay penalties similar to murder, and maybe fines to the guild as well. I think it could be made to work without spitting in the eye of All That Has Gone Before.

 

The other way to look at this is: what do I want out of this? In terms of narrative and of game effects.

 

[list']

[*]I want an sense of closure for the main quest, but without too slavishly following the TG & DB formula of "oh gosh, why don't you be in charge? Oh, BTW, we're doing really well now".

[*]I want a good excuse to open slave markets across Skyrim. I want to ride into Winterhold and pass the local slaver with three naked lovlies chained and shivering in the snow, and I want to have some justification for them being there. It may not withstand close scrutiny, but I want to try and at least respect the setting and the lore. This is probably as close as I'm going to get.

[*]I want to give the player a chance to mess with the great and the powerful in Skyrim. Possibly a little unreasonably, but no more so on balance than the being allowed to continue after the second, successful, assassination attempt on the Emperor.

 

I'm open to suggestions for a better way to achieve these things. Failing that, I'll work inside the Lore as far as I can to get where I'm going.

 

I dunno, having to change their ways and lower their potential targets might sound a bit more like a punishment to some players than a real reward (IE like in oblivion: the game "Rewards" you for completing the main quest by closing all the Oblivion gates :dodgy:)

 

Personally I'd recommend that just before you get to that point, the player is represented with a choice: To keep the guild illegal and undercover, or to legitimize, both with possible pros and cons.

 

Example, if you Legitimize:

 

+ More money for the player (The guild makes more money than it did when illegal) which also means...

+ Better equipped guards.

+ Markets in most (if not all, I still think there should be a few cities that apsolutely refuse to accept your legitimacy, depending on certain circumstances)

+ GuildHalls in the forementioned cities.

-+ Severely reduced Attacks on your stronghold (Neutral because players could see this as either plus or negative

-+ Thalmor Favor (Get slaves from them and get missions from them, again people could see this as going either way.)

- Less exciting missions.

- Severely reduced amounts of possible targets. (You can't just grab random people anymore, so you have to be more choosy and specific.)

- Some of the more... questionable practices will need to be done away with or at least hidden from the public.

- A lot of the more raider-ish sex driven members and the Molag Bal and/or sanguine worshipers will see this as a betrayal and leave, so you'll have to rehire some of the guards again. These might become the new raiders that try to raid your stronghold.

- Lower public opinion overall (the Jarls may be in your pocket, but that doesn't mean everyone's going to approve of what you do.

 

On the other hand, if you choose to stay in the shadows as an illegal guild:

 

+ More exciting missions and more variety and freedom in potential targets.

+ Get to keep the more questionable practices. No restrictions on what you can do to the slaves.

+ More favor from Bal/Sanguine.

+ You get to save public face (since just about nobody knows that you are in charge of the kidnappings.)

+ A lot more of your slaver crew stays happy.

+ Friendly to outlaw factions.

+ No breakaway faction

+- More intensive raids since no one is actively trying to save your skin other than yourself.

+- No official Thalmor Endorsement.

- Both the Imperial Legion and/or the Stormcloaks will be after you constantly.

-Less money for the player.

-Guards have crappier equipment.

-No public slave markets/guildhalls.

 

It's not as if I'm introducing men-from-mars as a playable race' date=' or Spongebob Squarepants as a major villain.[/quote']

 

Randy Savage Dragon, and Saxton Hale Draugr as end boss plz. :D

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