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12 hours ago, Code Serpent said:

Just uploaded an update that includes an Uninstall button. This will likely be the last update on this page.

I'm guessing the only reason to bother installing this latest update is if you're still playing with 2.04 when the new DiD-replacement mods come out?

 

 

I'm using 2.04 right now, and I saw a scenario you might want to bear in mind for future defeat mod:

 

 

I was fighting an Essential NPC.

I knocked them down so they were in bleedout. All their non-essential friends were dead.

My followers arrived and started pounding on the NPC, keeping him in bleedout.

 

A damage-over-time effect kicked me into surrender.

I sort of failed to surrender to the downed NPC. Screen went black. Nothing happened. Back to normal again after a few seconds.

 

 

 

I'd really wish addictions included milk. I'm using Milk Addict with MME. Milking addiction is working fine in DiD. Really like the compulsive milking.

The lack of any recognition or trauma reduction from the milk addiction feels odd though.

 

One thing about the pump compulsion - the walk to the pump is really slow. In some cases it can time out before you get there.

It would make more sense if you ran to the pump, especially if you're really keen to get milked.

 

 

Sex addiction can be used to avoid milking, because sex causes milk loss. I wouldn't call this a bug as such, in some ways it's sort of fair - just making you aware of the interaction.

 

I have chastity enabled but the dialogs aren't showing up now. Maybe DiD is in some state where it thinks I'm still belted?

 

 

I tried pretty hard to get a serious alcohol addiction going. It's a bit unclear how it works - when it registers you're doing something to raise it. If I have just one drink, it goes up. If I have lots, it doesn't seem to. If I drink repeatedly, it doesn't seem to. Maybe it's also going down a the same rate due to my config?

 

 

It occurred to me that all addictions would benefit from a threshold that the player can set in the MCM.

With addiction below the threshold there is no withdrawal effect.

With addiction over the threshold, withdrawal works normally.

With addiction below the threshold, addiction increases and decays more slowly.

With addiction above the threshold, addiction increases and decays normally.

 

This allows the PC to make modest use of skooma, sex, milking, etc, before it becomes a problem, but can still help a little with trauma.

However, once you get over the threshold, things should to accelerate, and the trauma removal benefits should increase.

 

The biggest problem is sex and tentacle addiction that can lead to more trauma rather easily.

 

 

Also, there's a bug in the current MCM. The trauma from tentacles cannot be set properly. The slider only allows you to set 0 and 1.

On the occasion I selected 1, I got a CTD. Might have been coincidence. I just leave this on default, as it's not practical to change it.

 

Maybe this value should be related to tentacle addition? Addiction should reduce any possible trauma gain before it's applied?

 

The same with regular sex? The more addicted you are, the less trauma it causes?

 

 

This could be offset by adding trauma from beatings.

 

 

If you handle spanking addiction, spanks could also cause trauma - reduced by spanking addiction (masochism).

However, beatings are (supposed to be) severe, and while they might feed your masochism addiction, they should still cause -some- trauma, even if you're highly addicted.

 

The exception I can see to this is "pain slut training" from Slaverun. If you go through that, you shouldn't get trauma from beatings either if you have enough masochism - could support that generally simply by adding an MCM tickbox (or sliders) to control how beatings are handled/scaled/reduced or whatever, allowing the player to set it up manually for their current situation.

 

OTOH, a character with high masochism should have the same sort of compulsion dialogs as sex addicts, and constantly be begging for pain. Characters who beg for spanks might sometimes get something more extreme than they bargained for.

 

Another handy feature would be a way to "click to add trauma". For those times where ... we just feel it makes sense to get it.

Being able to tweak it up and down in the Debug menu would make sense, as then the player could fix manually those situations where it got added when maybe it shouldn't.

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10 hours ago, donkeywho said:

- use Pamatronic's recent Gallows mod (or lethal Zaz furniture scripts) to have them strung up, or imperiled, outside the nearest city - or in some remote place - with a VERY VERY slow health degradation setting - multiple game days worth - to give the player an incentive to escape and rescue them before they 'really' die.  And make their inventory irrecoverable if they die so that the player doesn't succeed - even give them a load of the player's inventory too, so the risk of loss is greater.  And if more than one dealt with like this, one at a few cities to make the player have to choose which to save LOL.  The basic assets and scripts are there, and shouldn't need huge amounts of change

Using a crucifixion, Slaverun and Ibn-style would work for this. Stick follower up on cross, and they die very slowly over a period of days.

It makes more sense than a gallows, as crucifixion kills slowly by design.

Add crosses to roadside locations, put markers on map so PC knows where to go.

 

But what about Devious Followers?

 

We don't want those just killed, it would let you off the debt.

 

Devious Followers should be auto-ransomed once they get to half-dead, and they add the ransom to your debt, obviously.

There's a mod event to add debt. If it doesn't suit, I can fix it.

 

That would give you half the normal time to rescue a DF. Rescue them in time, and you just get a punishment debt. Fail, and you get the whole ransom debt (configure in DiD MCM).

Punishment debt typically 400-500 or so. Ransom could either be a fixed sum in the DiD MCM, or "half enslavement debt".

 

I guess if you have two followers or more, that latter means you will be in some serious trouble. You better have a lot of cash!

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13 hours ago, Code Serpent said:

I don't know how long it will take me to develop the first versions of these, as I'm aiming for polish first before most other features. Also, given my track record of talking about features, and never getting around to making them, I'm going to avoid talking about how far they are along until they are close to release.

Everyone does this. It's more fun than the boring coding to make it happen.

 

Don't deny yourself a crucial fun part of the experience.

Laboring alone, for months, without talking about it ... I made SLD that way ... it's OK for a while, but after a time you want to convince yourself you're making something people will actually have a use for.

 

Also, Devious Lore matters too... Don't forget that :) 

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12 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

Using a crucifixion, Slaverun and Ibn-style would work for this. Stick follower up on cross, and they die very slowly over a period of days.

It makes more sense than a gallows, as crucifixion kills slowly by design.

Add crosses to roadside locations, put markers on map so PC knows where to go.

 

But what about Devious Followers?

 

We don't want those just killed, it would let you off the debt.

 

Devious Followers should be auto-ransomed once they get to half-dead, and they add the ransom to your debt, obviously.

There's a mod event to add debt. If it doesn't suit, I can fix it.

 

That would give you half the normal time to rescue a DF. Rescue them in time, and you just get a punishment debt. Fail, and you get the whole ransom debt (configure in DiD MCM).

Punishment debt typically 400-500 or so. Ransom could either be a fixed sum in the DiD MCM, or "half enslavement debt".

 

I guess if you have two followers or more, that latter means you will be in some serious trouble. You better have a lot of cash!

LOL

 

I hadn't thought about a Devious Follower.  It would be better, tho, if they were reserved to share the Dragonborne's fate, as it would serve them jolly well right for being such an evil capricious bitch

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7 hours ago, donkeywho said:

it would serve them jolly well right for being such an evil capricious bitch

Exactly why they should blame the PC for anything bad that happens to them and charge accordingly. Even if it's their own fault for randomly surrendering.

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Speaking of followers randomly surrendering...

 

I had another scenario occur that could be considered in future versions...

 

Fighting some enemy Falmer with my followers:

 

  1. A Falmer knocks my health down to zero. The Falmer is definitely not dead. He has most of his health.
  2. My followers throw themselves on the floor, quivering. I guess this is working as intended.
  3. I get a message. "Failed - avoid being captured".
  4. So far, so good.
  5. Screen goes dark. Screen fades back up.
  6. PC is wearing a yoke. We are all still in the same place.
  7. Followers are back up and smash the lone Falmer to paste.
  8. PC stands there in yoke looking puzzled. We won, but I'm in a yoke now? Where did that come from?

 

I guess that DiD did a search for some buddies of the Falmer that defeated me, or a place to put the capture scenario, and came back with nothing?

 

This is to be expected, as I was in caves added by TitD, and which are almost entirely occupied by factions friendly to the PC.

The enemy Falmer were invaders in this case, and had no locations to run a capture scenario from.

 

 

The general problem is likely "nowhere to run capture scenario from".

It seems like this could happen quite often.

 

In this case, the "logical" thing is to fall back to something basic, like Defeat...

PC is raped. Anyone who comes to interfere is calmed. PC gets trauma from the rape.

Afterwards everyone is calmed for a bit, allowing the PC to choose to run, or attack.

PC can either make a run for it or fight and possibly win.

If they run and don't quickly get out of range or through a load door, then probably another defeat and rape will occur and so on.

This would be the same as basic Defeat and DCL type behavior.

 

If followers exist, the end is quick for the enemy, as with my situation above - but the PC would get rapes and trauma, not a random device and no trauma.

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Though stated that is not compatible with SE, I tried converting it. MCM is working, scripts as well. A bit of testing and I can say that defeat module is almost unusable. SL scenes are prematurely interrupted by fading and teleportation, scenes are consensual (makes no sense?), only 1 actor uses player and only 1 time. Escape quest is interrupted (counts as escape attempt, prompts player decision) by every action you do except sleeping, even if you try to open door stealthy. Picking up combat solution makes NPC open cage door and you can just leave the dungeon unharmed.

Would take a better look on trauma module and tell the results soon, can only say that calculations are ok.

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I looked a little through the esp itself and referenced back to a guide given by a great pillar in Skyrim's modding community (mator) about what mods actually need to get converted to the new Form 44 created for Skyrim, and I'll have to say: Dragonborn in Distress is completely compatible with Special Edition, it only has one singe record that has to get ported, and that is even an optional feature in the game. I would say that it can unofficially be used in Special Edition, but I'm not sure. Here's a link to the reddit response he made regarding these plugins:

Again, this data is technically obsolete but is the only data I can find related to why there needs to be a conversion between Form 43 to 44. TAKE THIS WITH THE HUGEST GRAIN OF SALT YOU CAN FIND!

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While doing some smithing work at the Avennici forge in Whiterun, my Follower Jenassa decided it was time to defeat me....

Spoiler

ScreenShot2.jpg.53feb954037bbcf1439d8d64eafe121d.jpg

I don't know what the problem is. I just just plain EFF and even if I let her relax or wait at a distance it still triggers for her...

 

Using "Defeat Safeword" before the smithing helpts though :P

 

So I guess the Defeat quest completion was not triggered somehow.

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I searched through this thread for information on whether the mod is compatible with Prison Overhaul Patched, and found a reply from Code Serpent saying that it was possible to disable imprisonment in this mod to make them compatible, but I haven't found any setting in the MCM to do that.  I'm on the latest version of DiD, on LE.  Has anyone got these two mods working together, and if so, could you explain how you did it?  Thanks.

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I'm using DiD in a new playthrough, that has PoP in it.

 

This is what I saw.

 

 

I started with a LAL variation, where I began as an escaped slave in heavy bondage. The game started me at the far east of the map, on the road from Riften towards Morrowind.

 

Right at the start of my game I was ambushed by an aggressive argonian mage.

 

Being completely helpless, and level 1, I was quickly defeated by the mage.

DiD activated once, sent the screen black, then did nothing apart from freeze me in place. I'm guessing this was due to "second wind" option, so working as expected, albeit the fade to black and controls freeze were probably unwanted.

 

After a while it cleared, then the fight restarted, and I was defeated again.

This time I was "captured" and robbed.

Not that I had anything to steal apart from the DDs being worn.

 

There was a rape.

This was to be expected I suppose, but the animation used was not appropriate to the chastity belt and bra worn.

Should have been oral. Was not oral.

Both DiD and the DD filter failed here.

 

Then the mage just stood about for a bit.

As I was freezing to death. I set off walking.

The argonian followed, but made no objection.

 

Every so often the screen would go black, then fade back up, but nothing happened. This seems to be a bug.

It happened continually, every minute or so.

The same fade happened as a precursor to rapes or device addition, but in most cases was a precursor to nothing.

 

If I ran, the Argonian would rape me again, or add more devices. Mostly I couldn't run due to the trauma and over encumberance, but sometimes I could because the argonian gave me skooma.

 

Eventually, by keeping my speed down to walk, I got to Riften, now blindfolded.

When I reached the guards and spoke to them, I got "Quest complete escape your captor."

The Argonian was still hanging around, the guards didn't attack him, but I guess he stopped following.

This was fine.

 

I spoke to the guards, and there was a "Can I discuss my bounty?" option or something like that.

It might be from the LAL scenario?

I used it, and was sent to prison. Not PoP, but regular prison.

 

I used the bed and was released.

 

Guards wouldn't help me remove devices, and Devious Lore dialogs were not activating. Not sure why.

Struggled, but did not escape anything.

 

I found a potential follower in Bee & Barb and recruited them.

Devious Lore dialogs activated on the follower, and they removed some devices for me, failed with others.

 

I then used DF dialogs to remove the remaining serious problem devices, like the blindfold, gaining debt.

 

 

Some conclusions:

  • The repeated fading to black is a bit confusing.
  • Rape animations are not considering chastity devices when picking animations.
  • PoP is not firing with DiD in play.
  • Devious Lore follower dialogs somewhat undermine DF. Not sure how this could be resolved or how much of an issue it really is.

 

While I understand that DiD is not being actively developed due to plans to make something new, it exists and mostly works.

It is likely used by quite a few players.

If some issues could easily be fixed it would be a boon to current users.

 

In terms of the device dialogs, maybe I can turn them off in DL for followers? I didn't check yet. It would make a nice option if it doesn't already exist.

I can sort of rationalize around it, that the free removal is the follower cutting or levering the device open, while the paid option uses a precious key.

Maybe as the follower gets more dominant in DL, it will have some synergy with DF and be fun? I'll wait and see.

 

 

I understand that proper determination of animations based on chastity is way harder than just looking for a belt, because other things block sex, lockable plugs, hobble dresses, straightjacket hobble skirt, pet-suits ... the pet-suit in particular ... and while they may arguably allow "access", the dresses and pet-suits look TERRIBLE if you play regular sex animations with them, and the plugs definitely block a hole. You can't have anal sex with someone wearing a pony-tail up the bum, it just doesn't work! Plugged holes are closed for business.

 

There is some code in SLD you can copy that does the checks and sets tags accordingly. I think it should work ok. PM me if you want me to cut+paste it to you.

As for failure of DD filter ... I'd like to know why that happens myself.

Can be caused by playing animations through Zaz, but that seems an unlikely cause in this case.

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10 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

 

I think some of those issues were replicated in my playthrough as well when I tried to port this mod SE, which lead me to conclusion it was not a porting failure but this release might be unstable for users. Trauma module seems to working ok but I didn't test all of withdrawal effects yet ("sex crazed" script fires ok).

I hope this mod will keep being developed as it is awesome replacement for buggy Defeat, though I miss NPC turn in feature. I disabled DiD defeat module and use both of mods at the same time. For current build, I think, it's a quite stable solution.

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13 hours ago, Lupine00 said:

I'm using DiD in a new playthrough, that has PoP in it.

 

This is what I saw.

I've tried surrendering to guards for both major and minor crimes (as defined by the PoP MCM) but the PoP arrest never triggers, I just get the vanilla jail experience.  I like DiD's defeat mechanism, which is why I installed it, but I miss PoP.  Would loading PoP after DiD make any difference, I wonder?

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10 minutes ago, PubliusNV said:

I've tried surrendering to guards for both major and minor crimes (as defined by the PoP MCM) but the PoP arrest never triggers, I just get the vanilla jail experience.  I like DiD's defeat mechanism, which is why I installed it, but I miss PoP.  Would loading PoP after DiD make any difference, I wonder?

I think it worked putting POP towards the end (I have it almost at the end anyway).
But I am not 100% sure, its been a while. 

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Have a little bug.  The Hysterical trauma message keeps repeating as soon as it starts to fade, every 4 seconds, even tho my trauma is long gone, as in weeks ago.  Kind of annoying to keep having it run.  The message also no longer changes when my toon has been multiple-raped again either.  This is the only message that is now playing for me.

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3 hours ago, Nymra said:

I think it worked putting POP towards the end (I have it almost at the end anyway).
But I am not 100% sure, its been a while. 

LOOT had put PoP way above DiD in my load order.  I moved the ESP below DiD and also moved the mod in the left hand MO pane below DiD, then started a completely new game.

 

If my PC gets the "Wait, I know you" dialog for minor crimes, she can surrender to the guard and then gets the PoP arrest scene, and, I assume, the PoP experience in prison.

 

I also tried attacking a guard.  She was unable to surrender to the guards (perhaps because she's a vampire though), was defeated, and the DiD defeat kicked in, and after a blackout she woke up in prison with no PoP arrest and not dressed as I had specified in the PoP MCM.  So I think that was the vanilla prison.

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1 hour ago, PubliusNV said:

LOOT had put PoP way above DiD in my load order.  I moved the ESP below DiD and also moved the mod in the left hand MO pane below DiD, then started a completely new game.

 

If I learned something from using LOOT then it is that it causes almost as many problems as it solves. Some stuff needs to be sorted manually. 
POP is one of them.  More Nasty Critters for example gets basically destroyed by LOOT. 
 

1 hour ago, PubliusNV said:

If my PC gets the "Wait, I know you" dialog for minor crimes, she can surrender to the guard and then gets the PoP arrest scene, and, I assume, the PoP experience in prison.

 

I also tried attacking a guard.  She was unable to surrender to the guards (perhaps because she's a vampire though), was defeated, and the DiD defeat kicked in, and after a blackout she woke up in prison with no PoP arrest and not dressed as I had specified in the PoP MCM.  So I think that was the vanilla prison.


Hmm I remember vaguely that this might be my experience too. 

Try using the surrender button at all times (so if a guard talks to you try to fight them and then surrender. 
This might make both DiD and POP possible to use at the same time. I just remember that i found a reliable method (before dumping DiD for other reasons) 

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Okay, I have tested every single addiction outside of sex and devices and got addicted within 10 seconds of downing drugs/alcohol. I have racked up almost half an hour of sex and maintained a timerate of 80-100 at all times - still no addiction to sex. At this point I am certain the fault is mine, but I can't think of anything for the life of me. My load order seems fine, I have all the files. Perhaps my game is just full of shitty scripts? I do have issues with other mods as well. SCGS shows no issues with my save.

 

Edit: Nevermind, I don't know what I did but all of a sudden the addiction jumped to 83. I re-enabled the addiction and that did the trick.

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@Code Serpent
Hi! I love your mod but im stuck in trouble.
Any chance to add debug/rescue button in mcm to reset "capture quest"? I think that i killed all bandits and in same time quest "avoid" was started - now is active (long time after this fight). :( that's broke this feature.

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On 4/17/2020 at 1:34 PM, Code Serpent said:

Just uploaded an update that includes an Uninstall button. This will likely be the last update on this page.

 

I'm going to be remaking the mod from scratch (again) and splitting it into two mods: Dragonborn in More Distress (containing all the defeat, capture, and imprisonment features), and Corruption of the Dragonborn (containing all the trauma and addiction features).

 

I don't know how long it will take me to develop the first versions of these, as I'm aiming for polish first before most other features. Also, given my track record of talking about features, and never getting around to making them, I'm going to avoid talking about how far they are along until they are close to release.

Just a question..will the Corruption of the Dragonborn hook into Defeat, all sorts of rape/sex mods for trauma/addiction purposes?

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