CTD when trying to load save games

N3v3r3nding_N3wb · September 28, 2017

So, I've tried everything I can think of -- disabling all new mods, running TESVEdit, LOOT, the built-in LOOT Lite in MO, changing mod list presets and changing them back, re-running FNIS, and using MO's mod reorganizer (caution sign, top right).

Ever since I loaded the attached set of mods, I haven't been able load save games reliably. About 90% of the time (I've tried multiple save games, and I've tried to load about 50 times(with 10-12 save games)).

New games mostly work (75%+), although it has crashed a few times when I tried to load it.

Load Order (with new mods removed)

0 0 Skyrim.esm

1 1 Update.esm

2 2 Dawnguard.esm

3 3 HearthFires.esm

4 4 Dragonborn.esm

5 5 Unofficial Skyrim Legendary Edition Patch.esp

6 6 Falskaar.esm

7 7 ApachiiHair.esm

8 8 RaceCompatibility.esm

9 9 hdtHighHeel.esm

10 a Schlongs of Skyrim - Core.esm

11 b OSA.esm

12 c Evil Lair of Hydra.esm

13 d SexLab.esm

14 e SexLabAroused.esm

15 f Devious Devices - Assets.esm

16 10 BSAssets.esm

17 11 BSHeartland.esm

18 12 arnima.esm

19 13 ZaZAnimationPack.esm

20 14 MiasLair.esp

21 15 Devious Devices - Integration.esm

22 16 Devious Devices - Expansion.esm

23 17 paradise_halls.esm

24 18 AOM.esm

25 19 daymoyl.esm

26 1a Havok Breast Physic.esm

27 1b ApachiiHairFemales.esm

28 1c FNIS.esp

29 1d iHUD.esp

30 1e RaceMenu.esp

31 1f RaceMenuPlugin.esp

Babette.esp (deactivated -- it crashes my game on startup)

32 20 SkyUI.esp

33 21 Convenient Horses.esp

34 22 EnhancedLightsandFX.esp

35 23 ELFX - Exteriors.esp

36 24 Purewaters.esp

37 25 CharacterMakingExtender.esp

38 26 LegacyoftheDragonborn.esp

39 27 Havok Breast Physic.esp

40 28 Guard Dialogue Overhaul.esp

41 29 Merta Assassin Armor.esp

42 2a RaceMenuMorphsCBBE.esp

43 2b EnhancedCharacterEdit.esp

44 2c SOS - Smurf Average Addon.esp

45 2d SOSRaceMenu.esp

46 2e XPMSE.esp

47 2f KS Hairdos - HDT.esp

48 30 Bijin Wives.esp

49 31 SkyrimBound.esp

50 32 Devious Loading Screens.esp

51 33 comvex-hmpriestess.esp

52 34 PAH_AndYouGetASlave.esp

53 35 AK_RM_PubicStyles_All_In_One.esp

54 36 SexyVest.esp

55 37 TERAArmors_CBBE.esp

56 38 UIExtensions.esp

57 39 SexLabDefeat.esp

58 3a mslDeviousCaptures.esp

59 3b Skin Universalizer.esp

60 3c FreckleMania.esp

61 3d Brows.esp

62 3e Female Skin Universalizer.esp

63 3f Havok Breast Physic Dawnguard.esp

64 40 Havok Breast Physic Dragonborn.esp

65 41 dcpack1.esp

66 42 Unique Grasses.esp

67 43 Devious Devices - Equip.esp

68 44 3DNPC.esp

69 45 HouseW.esp

70 46 paradise_halls_SLExtension.esp

71 47 AmazingFollowerTweaks.esp

72 48 AOM.esp

73 49 OBIS.esp

74 4a ELFX - Weathers.esp

75 4b Captured Dreams.esp

76 4c Cidhna Mine Expanded.esp

77 4d SexyBanditCaptives.esp

78 4e DragonfallCastle.esp

79 4f Deviously Cursed Loot.esp

80 50 Immersive Weapons.esp

81 51 SimpleSlavery.esp

82 52 qayl.esp

83 53 PAH_HomeSweetHome.esp

84 54 SofiaFollower.esp

85 55 Immersive Patrols II.esp

86 56 Schlongs of Skyrim.esp

87 57 Devious Cidhna.esp

88 58 Deviously Enslaved.esp

89 59 SOS - Shop.esp

90 5a daymoyl_DawnguardAddon.esp

91 5b Devious Deviants.esp

92 5c DeviouslyHelpless.esp

93 5d SBF All In One + DLC.esp

94 5e Merta Black Rose Armor.esp

95 5f paradise_halls_farengars_study.esp

96 60 PuppetMaster.esp

97 61 Dragon Lilly.esp

98 62 HjerimV1.0.esp

99 63 DudestiaMultiMarriages.esp

100 64 Apocalypse - The Spell Package.esp

101 65 Neo's Slave Leia Renewal.esp

102 66 TheEyesOfBeauty.esp

103 67 OBISDB.esp

104 68 Alternate Start - Live Another Life.esp

105 69 Alternate Start - Live A Deviant Life.esp

106 6a Deviously Cursed Loot LAL AddOn.esp

107 6b da_alternate_start_extension.esp

108 6c DBM_RelicHunter.esp

**Output by LOOT**

That load order was solid. Playing most days for between 20 minutes and 1.5 hours for a month plus (and for about three months with only a few mods missing from this list), I experienced only 3 CTDs (5, including the similar mod list that's been there longer).

Mod Load Order (with new mods)

0 0 Skyrim.esm

1 1 Update.esm

2 2 Dawnguard.esm

3 3 HearthFires.esm

4 4 Dragonborn.esm

5 5 Unofficial Skyrim Legendary Edition Patch.esp

6 6 Falskaar.esm

7 7 ApachiiHair.esm

8 8 RaceCompatibility.esm

9 9 hdtHighHeel.esm

10 a Schlongs of Skyrim - Core.esm

11 b OSA.esm

12 c Evil Lair of Hydra.esm

13 d SexLab.esm

14 e SexLabAroused.esm

15 f Devious Devices - Assets.esm

16 10 BSAssets.esm

17 11 BSHeartland.esm

18 12 arnima.esm

19 13 ZaZAnimationPack.esm

20 14 MiasLair.esp

21 15 Devious Devices - Integration.esm

22 16 Devious Devices - Expansion.esm

23 17 paradise_halls.esm

24 18 AOM.esm

25 19 daymoyl.esm

26 1a Havok Breast Physic.esm

27 1b ApachiiHairFemales.esm

28 1c FNIS.esp

29 1d iHUD.esp

30 1e RaceMenu.esp

31 1f RaceMenuPlugin.esp

Babette.esp

32 20 SkyUI.esp

33 21 Convenient Horses.esp

34 22 EnhancedLightsandFX.esp

35 23 ELFX - Exteriors.esp

36 24 Purewaters.esp

37 25 CharacterMakingExtender.esp

38 26 LegacyoftheDragonborn.esp

39 27 Havok Breast Physic.esp

40 28 Guard Dialogue Overhaul.esp

41 29 Merta Assassin Armor.esp

42 2a RaceMenuMorphsCBBE.esp

43 2b SOS - Smurf Average Addon.esp

44 2c SOSRaceMenu.esp

45 2d XPMSE.esp

46 2e KS Hairdos - HDT.esp

47 2f Bijin Wives.esp

48 30 SkyrimBound.esp

49 31 Devious Loading Screens.esp

50 32 comvex-hmpriestess.esp

51 33 PAH_AndYouGetASlave.esp

52 34 AK_RM_PubicStyles_All_In_One.esp

53 35 SexyVest.esp

54 36 TERAArmors_CBBE.esp

55 37 UIExtensions.esp

56 38 SexLabDefeat.esp

57 39 mslDeviousCaptures.esp

58 3a Skin Universalizer.esp

59 3b FreckleMania.esp

60 3c Brows.esp

61 3d Female Skin Universalizer.esp

62 3e Havok Breast Physic Dawnguard.esp

63 3f Havok Breast Physic Dragonborn.esp

64 40 dcpack1.esp

65 41 Unique Grasses.esp

66 42 Devious Devices - Equip.esp

67 43 3DNPC.esp

68 44 HouseW.esp

69 45 paradise_halls_SLExtension.esp

70 46 AmazingFollowerTweaks.esp

71 47 Remodeled Armor - Vanilla Replacer.esp

72 48 AOM.esp

73 49 OBIS.esp

74 4a ELFX - Weathers.esp

75 4b Captured Dreams.esp

76 4c Cidhna Mine Expanded.esp

77 4d SexyBanditCaptives.esp

78 4e sanguinesDebauchery.esp

79 4f EnhancedCharacterEdit.esp

80 50 DragonfallCastle.esp

81 51 Deviously Cursed Loot.esp

82 52 Immersive Weapons.esp

83 53 SimpleSlavery.esp

84 54 qayl.esp

85 55 PAH_HomeSweetHome.esp

86 56 SofiaFollower.esp

87 57 Immersive Patrols II.esp

88 58 Schlongs of Skyrim.esp

89 59 SexLab_Dialogues.esp

90 5a Devious Cidhna.esp

91 5b Devious Deviants.esp

92 5c DeviouslyHelpless.esp

93 5d SBF All In One + DLC.esp

94 5e Merta Black Rose Armor.esp

95 5f paradise_halls_farengars_study.esp

96 60 Dragon Lilly.esp

97 61 OBISDB.esp

98 62 SlaveTats.esp

99 63 SlaveTatsEventsBridge.esp

100 64 Remodeled Armor - Vanilla Replacer - Dawnguard.esp

101 65 Remodeled Armor - Vanilla Replacer - Dragonborn.esp

102 66 AngrimApprentice.esp

103 67 Deviously Enslaved.esp

104 68 SOS - Shop.esp

105 69 daymoyl_DawnguardAddon.esp

106 6a PuppetMaster.esp

107 6b HjerimV1.0.esp

108 6c DudestiaMultiMarriages.esp

109 6d Apocalypse - The Spell Package.esp

110 6e Neo's Slave Leia Renewal.esp

111 6f TheEyesOfBeauty.esp

112 70 SD Addons.esp

113 71 DeviousTraining.esp

114 72 Alternate Start - Live Another Life.esp

115 73 Alternate Start - Live A Deviant Life.esp

116 74 Deviously Cursed Loot LAL AddOn.esp

117 75 da_alternate_start_extension.esp

118 76 ImmerSlave.esp

119 77 DBM_RelicHunter.esp

**Output by LOOT**

With the new mods enabled, going through the same LOOT re-runs, TESVEdit checks, etc., I've been able to load only 1 save (from about a week ago), and have only been able to load it once. Starting a new game works about 25% of the time.

I have attached my most recent MO logs, though for some reason my Papyrus logs refuse to record anything.

If I change my MO preset to my playthrough preset, the game works flawlessly.

Thank you so much for any and all help, and if I can be of service in any way, tell me! Thank you again!

ModOrganizer.log

ModOrganizer_17_09_28_00_59.log

ModOrganizer_17_09_28_00_58.log

That_Dude79 · September 28, 2017

One quick thing I'd suggest trying(worked for me) is this mod which makes the game load an empty save before loading the actual save, giving mods some time to start up.

https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/85443/?

Just install it, and run the game like normal. when you select Continue, or Load, you should see your characters level in the top corner appear as 1, until the initial load is done, then it will load your actual save with your character stats as normal. It only takes a few seconds longer, but it removed all my loading crashes.

RUD3DUD3 · September 28, 2017

One quick thing I'd suggest trying(worked for me) is this mod which makes the game load an empty save before loading the actual save, giving mods some time to start up.

https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/85443/?

wrong description man. the mod you are describing is continue game no crash which was made by the same man. load game ctd fix doesn't work like that instead it deals with memory part and limit Skyrim to single core when it loads the save.

That_Dude79 · September 28, 2017

wrong description man. the mod you are describing is continue game no crash which was made by the same man. load game ctd fix doesn't work like that instead it deals with memory part and limit Skyrim to single core when it loads the save.

You're right, thanks for pointing this out. The link I posted doesn't work that way, but it should handle this same issue in a different way. I'm still using the original fix, but I'll have to try out this new version and see if it woks for me. Thanks.

N3v3r3nding N3wb, Try the link I posted above, but here's the older version I was referring to, that uses the loading trick if it doesn't work.

https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/78557/?

RUD3DUD3 · September 28, 2017

load game ctd fix works flawlessly i have yet to see a single load game ctd since i began using it 2 months ago. everyone should be using that instead of his older mod which he no longer recommends, that mod was never the solution to the load game CTD problem but a cheeky workaround but now we do have a better workaround for it.

valcon767 · September 28, 2017

ok a couple of things that may help

do you have Crash Fixes installed?? ( http://www.loverslab.com/files/file/2551-crash-fixes/ )

move XPMSE way down in load order (it should be near or at the very bottom) so that you can be sure no other mod that also adds a custom skeleton will overwirite it.

you have some SOS stuff before XPMSE and some after, if I remember right some versions of SOS have a skeleton.

check on your PAH mods (support threads for those mods) it looks out of order (PAH_AndYouGetASlave.esp before the PAH_SLExtension.esp???)

edit

do you have a bashed patch??

N3v3r3nding_N3wb · September 29, 2017

wrong description man. the mod you are describing is continue game no crash which was made by the same man. load game ctd fix doesn't work like that instead it deals with memory part and limit Skyrim to single core when it loads the save.

You're right, thanks for pointing this out. The link I posted doesn't work that way, but it should handle this same issue in a different way. I'm still using the original fix, but I'll have to try out this new version and see if it woks for me. Thanks.

N3v3r3nding N3wb, Try the link I posted above, but here's the older version I was referring to, that uses the loading trick if it doesn't work.

https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/78557/?

Neither of them worked, and something that I forgot to mention is that I've tried going from a fresh, new game to a few different saves (I've tried that method ~10 times (included in my above total)), without success on any of those ~10 tries. It seems like that 1st mod works very similarly to what I tried (I actually got the idea to try that from reading that mod's description a week or two ago).

load game ctd fix works flawlessly i have yet to see a single load game ctd since i began using it 2 months ago. everyone should be using that instead of his older mod which he no longer recommends, that mod was never the solution to the load game CTD problem but a cheeky workaround but now we do have a better workaround for it.

ok a couple of things that may help

do you have Crash Fixes installed?? ( http://www.loverslab.com/files/file/2551-crash-fixes/ )

move XPMSE way down in load order (it should be near or at the very bottom) so that you can be sure no other mod that also adds a custom skeleton will overwirite it.

you have some SOS stuff before XPMSE and some after, if I remember right some versions of SOS have a skeleton.

check on your PAH mods (support threads for those mods) it looks out of order (PAH_AndYouGetASlave.esp before the PAH_SLExtension.esp???)

edit

do you have a bashed patch??

I installed crash fixes and re-ordered what you told me to, but no dice. No, I have not wanted to mess anything up, so I've never bashed a patch. The only mod I've ever upadated was Live Another Life (I just installed it as a seperate mod and disabled the original), but I've since rolled back that update because of my current issue.

Thank you very much, all, but it still isn't fixed. Any other ideas?

valcon767 · September 29, 2017

hmm 2 things

are you trying to load older saves with the new list??? (saves made before you installed crash fixes??)

if so you an try the following:

from main menu try the following (with the new list)

open console

coc qasmoke

open console

type "showracemenu"

close console

edit character (make a female character of any vanilla race)

start sexlab wait for mods to finish updating

make a new hard save

load that save

wait for mods to finish loading again

make another new hard save

exit game to desktop

start skyrim again

load last hard save made

if that works and lets you play you probably hit Skyrim's default string limit previously (those games will not work due to that limitation).

if that does not work I will try to help find the cause of ctd's.

check on Sanguine's Debauchery Enhanced (SD+), I know he made changes to its master requirements not to long ago, to be sure you

have the correct master files installed. (need to mainly check that you are using a high enough version of the master files...it looks like you

have the correct master files but I cannot tell if the version is high enough, - DDA, DDI, DDX, DAYMOYL).

also if it is not too much trouble could you list just the mods you are trying to add?? this might help to find the problem.

That_Dude79 · September 29, 2017

Neither of them worked, and something that I forgot to mention is that I've tried going from a fresh, new game to a few different saves (I've tried that method ~10 times (included in my above total)), without success on any of those ~10 tries. It seems like that 1st mod works very similarly to what I tried (I actually got the idea to try that from reading that mod's description a week or two ago).

This is just a shot in the dark, but can you start a new game. In the character creation, flip through the male and female defaults of all races, then choose one and go to the location you last saved at?

I had an issue where I accidentally overwrote the beast race skeleton, or argonian textures(don't remember which it was), so every time an argonian tried to render, my game would crash. The character creation will show if this is the case. And if it's a messed up custom npc or object present at the location, you might narrow it down.

Also try a save cleaner tool on a backup of the save to see if it's just a script instance that's not working right.(personally, I doubt it but it cant hurt to check)

check on Sanguine's Debauchery Enhanced (SD+), I know he made changes to its master requirements not to long ago, to be sure you

have the correct master files installed.

Sadly we could rule that out, because the game would crash immediately if it detected a missing master.

Stiffon · September 29, 2017

Also remove either ECE or RM - you don't need to use both at same time (even though you can have both active) - pick the one you like. Not saying it's the cause, but it adds load.

N3v3r3nding_N3wb · October 1, 2017

hmm 2 things

are you trying to load older saves with the new list??? (saves made before you installed crash fixes??)

if so you an try the following:

from main menu try the following (with the new list)

open console

coc qasmoke

open console

type "showracemenu"

close console

edit character (make a female character of any vanilla race)

start sexlab wait for mods to finish updating

make a new hard save

load that save

wait for mods to finish loading again

make another new hard save

exit game to desktop

start skyrim again

load last hard save made

if that works and lets you play you probably hit Skyrim's default string limit previously (those games will not work due to that limitation).

if that does not work I will try to help find the cause of ctd's.

check on Sanguine's Debauchery Enhanced (SD+), I know he made changes to its master requirements not to long ago, to be sure you

have the correct master files installed. (need to mainly check that you are using a high enough version of the master files...it looks like you

have the correct master files but I cannot tell if the version is high enough, - DDA, DDI, DDX, DAYMOYL).

also if it is not too much trouble could you list just the mods you are trying to add?? this might help to find the problem.

Sorry for the wait, but I did what you said, and I can load the saves and start new games, but it is not stable at all. Starting a new game only works ~1/5 of the time, though loading has yet to fail. Also, when I try to load any cell except for the Abandoned Prison, qasmoke, or where I choose to go from the Abandoned Prison (so far I've only tried small, indoor ares, but I will be doing more testing later today) the game crashes.

SD+ has the correct master files.

I'm trying to add the following mods to my game: SexLab Dialogues 29.7, SlaveTatsEventsBridge, SlaveTats-anal, SDPlus, SD Customization Addons, Remodeled Armor for CBBE Bodyslide TBBP HDT, Paradise Halls v0_7_3 Script Patch, JContainers, ImmerSlave, CT77 SD+Slave Outfit, Angrim's Apprentice, newest Alternate Start, Devious Training, SlaveTats.

Thank you again!

valcon767 · October 1, 2017

@ ThatDude79 - yes he had the master files installed ..I saw that ..but having a wrong version will cause problems without instant CTD (it sees the files are there, so it loads, but

wrong version can, and has for me, caused other problems, including belated ctd when it tried to do something newer version had but older one did not).

well at least that rules out SD PLus (mostly, unless it has some hidden conflict)...so that does narrow it down a little more.

ThatDude79 makes an excellent point about having a changed vanilla race skeleton/texture, and that would be a very easy way to check those parts.

sigh as for the mods you are adding I have used them all in the past and not run into this problem.

did you just move XPMSE or replace it when you moved it?? (if you just moved it and it was already overwritten by another mod a re-install would fix that).

FYI - JContainers should be near the bottom of the Load order (left pane of MO), due some mods including older versions.

something to try also would be to go ahead and make a bashed patch

reasoning - it can resolve some conflicts, and it can give a missing master error (for a missing master OR just a misplaced master)

a misplaced master will usually cause instant CTD (game wont load) but not always .. and making a bashed patch will give you a

"missing master warning" for missing or misplaced master files (and it will tell you what file is not correctly placed {or actually missing})

install WyreBash

add as excutable in MO

run thro MO

just make Bashed Patch (right click "bashed patch, 0.esp" and rebuild patch)

activate to test if it solves the problem

if that does not help you can try the following

you can try adding the new mods by sections to see which is causing the problem

Misc section

SL Dialogues (this one actually works independently of SD Plus but is used by SD Plus)

Angrims Apprentice

Remodeled Armor for CBBE Bodyslide TBBP HDT (you did build the armor in Bodyslide ??)

Devious Training

AS-LAL (newest version)

ImmerSlave

the SlaveTats would be one section

Slavetats

SlaveTatsEventBride

SlaveTats-anal.

the SD Plus stuff would be a separate section

SD Plus (SL Dialogues is useful for this but it should work without it {it has for me before}, SL Dialogues just adds more options for SD Plus)

SD Customixation Addons

CT77 SD+Slave Outfit

the paradise halls stuff would be a last section

Paradise Halls v0_7_3 Script Patch

if you can add a whole section and it does not give the CTD issue anymore that would narrow it down faster.

for reference to XPMSE, JContainers, and Bashed Patch I have included a recent screenshot (it was for someone else having trouble with FNIS)

but the part to look at is the left pane numbers 332-340.

in that screen shot you can see that nothing overwrites JContainerss, XPMSE, and the only thing I have overwriting the Bashed Patch is FNIS Output

(which is where I put all the stuff FNIS outputs and my newer version of the bashed patch), the Bodyslide Output is where I put all the stuff Bodyslide

outputs so that I can be sure it overwrites what it is supposed to.

I know some of what I am saying is obvious, but sometimes people (me included) can overlook the obvious.

Stiffon · October 2, 2017

in that screen shot

Off topic but I like your desktop wallpaper

N3v3r3nding_N3wb · October 4, 2017

@ ThatDude79 - yes he had the master files installed ..I saw that ..but having a wrong version will cause problems without instant CTD (it sees the files are there, so it loads, but

                            wrong version can, and has for me, caused other problems, including belated ctd when it tried to do something newer version had but older one did not).

well at least that rules out SD PLus (mostly, unless it has some hidden conflict)...so that does narrow it down a little more.

ThatDude79 makes an excellent point about having a changed vanilla race skeleton/texture, and that would be a very easy way to check those parts.

sigh as for the mods you are adding I have used them all in the past and not run into this problem.

did you just move XPMSE or replace it when you moved it?? (if you just moved it and it was already overwritten by another mod a re-install would fix that).

FYI - JContainers should be near the bottom of the Load order (left pane of MO), due some mods including older versions.

something to try also would be to go ahead and make a bashed patch

    reasoning - it can resolve some conflicts, and it can give a missing master error (for a missing master OR just a misplaced master)

    a misplaced master will usually cause instant CTD (game wont load) but not always .. and making a bashed patch will give you a

    "missing master warning" for missing or misplaced master files (and it will tell you what file is not correctly placed {or actually missing})

    install WyreBash

    add as excutable in MO

    run thro MO

    just make Bashed Patch (right click "bashed patch, 0.esp" and rebuild patch)

    activate to test if it solves the problem

if that does not help you can try the following

you can try adding the new mods by sections to see which is causing the problem

Misc section

    SL Dialogues (this one actually works independently of SD Plus but is used by SD Plus)

    Angrims Apprentice

    Remodeled Armor for CBBE Bodyslide TBBP HDT (you did build the armor in Bodyslide ??)

    Devious Training

    AS-LAL (newest version)

    ImmerSlave

the SlaveTats would be one section

   Slavetats

   SlaveTatsEventBride

   SlaveTats-anal.

the SD Plus stuff would be a separate section

SD Plus (SL Dialogues is useful for this but it should work without it {it has for me before}, SL Dialogues just adds more options for SD Plus)

    SD Customixation Addons

    CT77 SD+Slave Outfit

the paradise halls stuff would be a last section

    Paradise Halls v0_7_3 Script Patch

if you can add a whole section and it does not give the CTD issue anymore that would narrow it down faster.

for reference to XPMSE, JContainers, and Bashed Patch I have included a recent screenshot (it was for someone else having trouble with FNIS)

but the part to look at is the left pane numbers 332-340.

in that screen shot you can see that nothing overwrites JContainerss, XPMSE, and the only thing I have overwriting the Bashed Patch is FNIS Output

(which is where I put all the stuff FNIS outputs and my newer version of the bashed patch), the Bodyslide Output is where I put all the stuff Bodyslide

outputs so that I can be sure it overwrites what it is supposed to.

I know some of what I am saying is obvious, but sometimes people (me included) can overlook the obvious.

I created a Bashed Patch, which allowed me to create new games with relative consistency (it still crashed occasionally), although I was then completely unable to load any games.

I moved JContainers a little further down in my load order than I had it previously (it's now priority 181 out of 184), to no effect.

I re-installed XPMSE, to no effect.

I disabled all new mods, and the situation held. Then, when I started re-enabling mods in blocs, it all went to Hell. With the new mods enabled, no matter which combination of blocs, or even individual misc. mods, I can only start new games maybe 1/7 of the time, and about 1/3 or 1/4 of those games crash upon initializing a few mods after the RaceMenu character creation screen. I've also only been able to load a single game, which crashed almost immediately after I loaded it.

I just tested, and with those new mods disabled, my plight continues unabated.

I've included attachments that I hope help. It's my MO overwrite area and screenshots of all mods that WyreBash has labeled as red in the mod load area (screenshot WB1+WB2). My WyreBash save screen is also in there (WB_Saves).

valcon767 · October 4, 2017

sorry to say I am running out of ideas here

it sounds like some hidden conflict is occurring (something that does not show as a conflict thru any of the normal methods of conflict detection)

I had that happen to me once in the past, and to this day I still have no clue what it was (or what I did that fixed it).

from what you have working (the stable list) adding the others should not be causing this (the CTD issue), but it is.

a this point I am out of ideas (but I will keep trying to think of something else that could be the cause).

@Stiffon - that wallpaper is a image from one of the Bjinn mods (off nexus) saved to desktop is all.

Kriegera · October 4, 2017

What are your specs? If you're trying to play on a potato pc it's very possible your system just can't take the strain.

Stiffon · October 4, 2017

@Stiffon - that wallpaper is a image from one of the Bjinn mods (off nexus) saved to desktop is all.

Cool, I use the Bjin mods

valcon767 · October 4, 2017

I had another thought (doubt this applies to you)

MO will run .BSA archives without an ESP/ESM files for those archives

sometimes these unassigned BSA archives count towards the ESP/ESM plugin limit and sometimes not (I have never figured out why)

if you only have 150 or so mods I seriously doubt this is the problem, but if you run over 200 ESM/ESP plugins (active that is) this can come into play.

a quick way to test if this is what is happening would be to de-activate an equal number of mods as you activate of the new mods.

if the game works correctly doing this, you will need to check how many unassigned BSA archives MO is handling for you.

N3v3r3nding_N3wb · October 4, 2017

What are your specs? If you're trying to play on a potato pc it's very possible your system just can't take the strain.

No, I have a very good PC -- overclocked 1700x (3.8 Ghz), 16 GB of RAM, Radeon R9 Fury.

https://pcpartpicker.com/user/N3v3r3nding_N3wb/saved/NR9ycf

N3v3r3nding_N3wb · October 4, 2017

I had another thought (doubt this applies to you)

MO will run .BSA archives without an ESP/ESM files for those archives

sometimes these unassigned BSA archives count towards the ESP/ESM plugin limit and sometimes not (I have never figured out why)

if you only have 150 or so mods I seriously doubt this is the problem, but if you run over 200 ESM/ESP plugins (active that is) this can come into play.

a quick way to test if this is what is happening would be to de-activate an equal number of mods as you activate of the new mods.

if the game works correctly doing this, you will need to check how many unassigned BSA archives MO is handling for you.

Nah, I run nowhere near 200 active plugins. Thank you anyway.

sorry to say I am running out of ideas here

it sounds like some hidden conflict is occurring (something that does not show as a conflict thru any of the normal methods of conflict detection)

I had that happen to me once in the past, and to this day I still have no clue what it was (or what I did that fixed it).

from what you have working (the stable list) adding the others should not be causing this (the CTD issue), but it is.

a this point I am out of ideas (but I will keep trying to think of something else that could be the cause).

@Stiffon - that wallpaper is a image from one of the Bjinn mods (off nexus) saved to desktop is all.

Yeah, I ran out of ideas before I asked, and now I have even fewer ideas.

Well, thank you. If I happen to have any small breakthrough, I'll see if that sparks an idea from one of you.

Again, thank you a lot!

Kriegera · October 5, 2017

Try putting alternate start as the very last plugin in your load order, disabling the alternate start expansions, and starting a new game.

yatol · October 5, 2017

If I change my MO preset to my playthrough preset, the game works flawlessly.

that mean some mods in profile x that aren't in playthought profile don't work

to not have to mess around with dozen of mods to find the one that don't work, you add mods one a time

Poet Olette · October 5, 2017

This is actually pretty common with a lot of mods. https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/78557/? This helped me a lot.

N3v3r3nding_N3wb · October 6, 2017

If I change my MO preset to my playthrough preset, the game works flawlessly.

that mean some mods in profile x that aren't in playthought profile don't work

to not have to mess around with dozen of mods to find the one that don't work, you add mods one a time

Yeah, I know, I just checked the conflicts pretty thoroughly, and so hoped that it'd be a'ight. 'Twas not a'ight. Thank you.

N3v3r3nding_N3wb · October 6, 2017

Try putting alternate start as the very last plugin in your load order, disabling the alternate start expansions, and starting a new game.

No dice, but thank you very much!

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