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XEOSP++ VS ES74's Unique Race & NPCs for Anime Overhaul


mrsummerz

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Hey guys,

 

For my new Oblivion play through, I was planning on using MBP and XEOSP or ES74's Unique Race & NPCs for an anime like oblivion overhaul. I'm looking for feedback as to witch one people prefer more. Which one is more complete?(changes the most NPCs). Which one is more buggy/gamebreaking?

 

I also plan on using the one I chose to manually change npcs via TESCS from other 3rd party mods like Better Cities and Elsweyr Anequina, and wondering if anyone knows which would be easier for this task.. XEOSP is pretty cool but I like the idea of a MBP based NPC replacer since I will already by installing MBP anyway.

 

Also, I haven't seen or heard any mention of anybody trying out EURN's latest 2013 version, and was hoping to hear feedback from anybody who has used it.

 

Thanks in advance for your feedback guys... :)

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I have only used MPB and it's a nice one to use. I have never used the other 2 you listed. You will have to update many of the races that are in there with newer versions that are up on the nexus and I think one race files are not in there and that you have to download and add them manually if you want that race but other then that it's a good mod.

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Both xeosp and EURN are both NPC Replacers and can be used in addition to MBP, the latter is exclusively dependent on it though.

 

However, at this point I may just be skipping EURN and MBP altogether considering what a utter FUCKING nightmare MBP is turning out to be!! This is my first time Installing MBP and after a day of installing, reinstalling and hunting down updated versions of races...only about half of them actually work with the other half missing everything from Eyes, Hair, Skin, Double eyes/Googly eyes.....LOL! some even have entire head meshes missing and are basicly just floating eyeballs and teeth!!

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As I recall a bashed patch is also essential for MBP; it makes use of some WB tags. As for XEO, I made a custom setup using ONLY the xeorace.esm and xeoracex117.esm masters and resources, and then modifying those ESPs that make use of XEO assets to point to or use the two masters.

 

Keep in mind, if you plan on using any of the Lovers MODs that produce children (HiyokoGenerator.esp)and want to add XEO-based children (xeoracex117), you'll want a fully edited and stable LO of all MODs above HiyokoGenerator.esp. Any changes to LO above this ESP, AND if you have children in-game, will result in headless kids which will CTD your game when you encounter them. IF you need to edit and/or chnage your LO, then you want to remove all already born Hiyokos. Headless kids cannot be fixed.

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Yeah I've been been using boss for the load order and OBMM for archive invalidation and BSA redirection. Ironically, most of the races work in the in-game character section of the Imperial prison (the ones that bother to show up anyway!), except for most of the x117 races still have their eyes missing. They REALY fuck up hard when I load MBP into the construction set(all hell breaks loose with missing heads, double eyes and double sets of teeth etc.) which really sucks because one of the main reasons for installing MBP was to make custom Partners/companions in CS...I dont use it for my main PC, As I usually make a Redguard or Nord Tank fighter.

 

"As I recall a bashed patch is also essential for MBP; it makes use of some WB tags."

 

I rebuild my bashed patch every time I run BOSS but I usually use the default settings,,, as I'm not very skilled with Wyre/Bash patching and the MBP instructions dont go into any more detail other than "rebuild patch".

 

 As for XEO, I made a custom setup using ONLY the xeorace.esm and xeoracex117.esm masters and resources, and then modifying those ESPs that make use of XEO assets to point to or use the two masters."

 

OHHHHH, That explains why I had such a hard time last time I tried to convert vanilla npcs to XEO, I was using the esp intsed of the esm's as masters...I forgot the CS doesn't like esps as masters.

 

Yeah, I tried EURN and didn't really like it, so I'm gonna go ahead and use XEOSP++ I was thinking of playing it safe and Installing XEORC4 for the sole purpose of Changing NPC's but now I guess I'll just do what  varenne does and use XOESP's esm's as masters.

 

 

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As I recall a bashed patch is also essential for MBP; it makes use of some WB tags. As for XEO, I made a custom setup using ONLY the xeorace.esm and xeoracex117.esm masters and resources, and then modifying those ESPs that make use of XEO assets to point to or use the two masters.

 

Keep in mind, if you plan on using any of the Lovers MODs that produce children (HiyokoGenerator.esp)and want to add XEO-based children (xeoracex117), you'll want a fully edited and stable LO of all MODs above HiyokoGenerator.esp. Any changes to LO above this ESP, AND if you have children in-game, will result in headless kids which will CTD your game when you encounter them. IF you need to edit and/or chnage your LO, then you want to remove all already born Hiyokos. Headless kids cannot be fixed.

You must be using a different version of XEO than me cause I just realized that the version of XEOSP++ I'm using has no esm's, just one esp. should I just copy the xeosp esp to esm in wyre bash and try to use that?

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First a clarification is needed, along with some partial history of XEO's development.

 

XEOSP++ is the final merged compilation of most or all XEO related work. It started out as XEO Race I believe, most of this is based on memory. It was started by one Chinese or Japanese group of developers, dropped and then picked up again by another group of developers, which worked on making it compatible to use along with MBP as there were many cross conflicts between the two MODs. (I think you still need to install XEOSP++ first and then MBP and let it overwrite the previous XEO assets, again based on memory, not 100% sure on that.)

 

XEOSP++ is the easier way to go and (somewhat?) still supported here.

 

My way of using xeorace.esm, which I think came from an older version of XEO (XEORC4 1.6) is much much harder, and is the end result of tracking down XEO/MBP assets, running translations from Chinese/Japanese and using TES4Edit and other tools to fix issues. I likely spent a year of Sundays doing this many years ago. I cannot in any way support my final compilation and it still has remaining issues to fix. It only works for me as I am using those masters to then have edited ESPs point to them for resources. (Much of this came about as part of my really extensive Hiyoko/Tamago and x117 research and work.) 

 

Some of these are related to HOW the original XEO authors or follow up authors developed the ESMs/ESPs; they did not use a standard asset directory structure, but instead deviated from it entirely. For example, all Character related assets SHOULD be in the that folder, but instead are located elsewhere in custom named folders. (You would assume that not to be a problem but it is. I feel/think Oblivion is somehow hard coded to want to find certain assets in certain locations, and when it doesn't it throws an error and then defaults to vanilla assets.)

 

Add to this that some assets used, especially NIFs, point to one path for textures while in CS or CSE they are coded to use an entirely different path and asset. Very bad practice, but I think the previous developers didn't know of this limitation. It is certainly, not as far as I know, documented anywhere.

 

So with that said, I can PM either a link or direct upload of my ESMs and assets as 7z file for you to test run, but I am not inclined to post it 'publicly'.

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First a clarification is needed, along with some partial history of XEO's development.

 

XEOSP++ is the final merged compilation of most or all XEO related work. It started out as XEO Race I believe, most of this is based on memory. It was started by one Chinese or Japanese group of developers, dropped and then picked up again by another group of developers, which worked on making it compatible to use along with MBP as there were many cross conflicts between the two MODs. (I think you still need to install XEOSP++ first and then MBP and let it overwrite the previous XEO assets, again based on memory, not 100% sure on that.)

 

XEOSP++ is the easier way to go and (somewhat?) still supported here.

 

My way of using xeorace.esm, which I think came from an older version of XEO (XEORC4 1.6) is much much harder, and is the end result of tracking down XEO/MBP assets, running translations from Chinese/Japanese and using TES4Edit and other tools to fix issues. I likely spent a year of Sundays doing this many years ago. I cannot in any way support my final compilation and it still has remaining issues to fix. It only works for me as I am using those masters to then have edited ESPs point to them for resources. (Much of this came about as part of my really extensive Hiyoko/Tamago and x117 research and work.) 

 

Some of these are related to HOW the original XEO authors or follow up authors developed the ESMs/ESPs; they did not use a standard asset directory structure, but instead deviated from it entirely. For example, all Character related assets SHOULD be in the that folder, but instead are located elsewhere in custom named folders. (You would assume that not to be a problem but it is. I feel/think Oblivion is somehow hard coded to want to find certain assets in certain locations, and when it doesn't it throws an error and then defaults to vanilla assets.)

 

Add to this that some assets used, especially NIFs, point to one path for textures while in CS or CSE they are coded to use an entirely different path and asset. Very bad practice, but I think the previous developers didn't know of this limitation. It is certainly, not as far as I know, documented anywhere.

 

So with that said, I can PM either a link or direct upload of my ESMs and assets as 7z file for you to test run, but I am not inclined to post it 'publicly'.

 

From the two threads I've read on Xeosp, I think MBP should always be installed first. 

 

In your expert opinion, what would be the Simplest/best way to change NPC's from other mods(CM Partners, Better Cities etc.) into Xeo races?

 

Converting my XEOSP Esp to ESM or installing XEORC4 and manually change npcs via cs using this method https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auLhqCLUM54&t=2s

 

Or would you recommend using your custom Esm/Esp? If so, is there a special method you use to change npcs and would you be willing to show or guide me though the process?

 

Thanks.

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The primary driver for me using XEORC4 was found save games that made use of that ESM, that and later on having the resources available for use in other MODs (all ESPs). 

 

So what is your primary driver, just changing NPCs? My normal method is to do that from my bashed patch first, using either TES4Edit or CS/E. The next method would be to alter the XEO related ESP, editing or adding XEO related calls for resources, OR creating a brand new ESP that changes certain NPCs, where you want to use XEO features.

 

Editing NPCs is fairly easy and lots of guides already written. TES4Edit is easy, you just need to make sure when you load the MOD (ESP) you want to edit.

 

Example save games I wanted to make use of:

SJ Character Saves for MBPpp and XEORC4 by SJ

 

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My main motivation is to change the added NPCs from other modes like Better Cities, Elsweyr Anequina etc. into XEO Races. Since Xeosp only changes the NPCs of the original vanilla game, added npcs from other mods are vanilla and ugly...killing my whole anime overhaul thing Im going for.

 

I have very little experience with TES Construction Set and even less with TES4Edit, the later I've only used a few times to clean dirty mods. I I've used TESCS a few times to make a few custom race cm partners and dump a bunch of armor mods into a single esp, but thats about it. The only guide I saw online related to what I'm trying to do was for adding vanilla npcs to the main game, not changing the npc races from other mods. I tried to experiment by using the method I linked to above (how to make a custom race cm partner) to alter the races the Npcs of CM Partners themselves from vanilla to XEO versions (i.e. changing a Nord npc to XEO's Nord version). It technically worked (the head meshes were still kinda funky) but there was a disastrous side effect! LOL! Not sure how the hell it happened but I somehow managed to delete the oblivion world space so whenever I went outdoors, me and all the other npcs in the game would fall endlessly onto a black whole! Not sure exactly what I did wrong other than use the XOESP Esp without temporally changing it to Esm in wyre bast first. I forgot that TESCS doesn't like esps as masters. I ended up having to reinstall EVERYTHING! including Wyre Bash to fix it...reinstalling Oblivion alone didn't fix it at first.

 

Which method you recommend for a complete NOOB like myself? I like the idea of a bashed patch method since I do use wyre bash's bash patch feature. But I only use the default settings, I'm a complete noob at that as well. 

 

P.S. I checked out that link, those saved game characters were nice...do you use them for your PC or you somehow convert them into partners/NPCs?

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If you are using XeoSP++ it doesn't make any difference which you install first.  It was designed to play nice with MBP.  Earlier versions of Xeo and MBP do clash, but not if you use XeoSP.

 

Good to know, but I not sure if i'm gonna keep MBP. Its been about a week and I still cant get this shit to act right. The only other thing I can think to do is manually play around with the load order cause BOSS apparently sucks.

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My main motivation is to change the added NPCs from other modes like Better Cities, Elsweyr Anequina etc. into XEO Races. Since Xeosp only changes the NPCs of the original vanilla game, added npcs from other mods are vanilla and ugly...killing my whole anime overhaul thing Im going for.

 

 

I have very little experience with TES Construction Set and even less with TES4Edit, the later I've only used a few times to clean dirty mods. I I've used TESCS a few times to make a few custom race cm partners and dump a bunch of armor mods into a single esp, but thats about it. The only guide I saw online related to what I'm trying to do was for adding vanilla npcs to the main game, not changing the npc races from other mods. I tried to experiment by using the method I linked to above (how to make a custom race cm partner) to alter the races the Npcs of CM Partners themselves from vanilla to XEO versions (i.e. changing a Nord npc to XEO's Nord version). It technically worked (the head meshes were still kinda funky) but there was a disastrous side effect! LOL! Not sure how the hell it happened but I somehow managed to delete the oblivion world space so whenever I went outdoors, me and all the other npcs in the game would fall endlessly onto a black whole! Not sure exactly what I did wrong other than use the XOESP Esp without temporally changing it to Esm in wyre bast first. I forgot that TESCS doesn't like esps as masters. I ended up having to reinstall EVERYTHING! including Wyre Bash to fix it...reinstalling Oblivion alone didn't fix it at first.

 

 

Which method you recommend for a complete NOOB like myself? I like the idea of a bashed patch method since I do use wyre bash's bash patch feature. But I only use the default settings, I'm a complete noob at that as well. 

 

P.S. I checked out that link, those saved game characters were nice...do you use them for your PC or you somehow convert them into partners/NPCs?

 

I've never used Better Cities or Elsweyr Anequina, so not up on the details of each of these. You will no doubt need to run archive invalidate, after you have made either direct edits to either of these MODs, or don't edit them directly and alternately create a XEO-based ESP for each of them, which is probably what I would do.

 

If either of these MODs make use of BSAs you may also want to review them in a BSA archive tool, so you can understand where existing assets are being call from; directory & folder structure. If just vanilla assets, you can skip this step, but it is part of the overall learning process.

 

I'd also do most if not all of the work in CS/E. You will need to manually select and load the master or masters, first making note of all existing dependencies, but especially masters. If you go with a XEO-based master, those new races will become available to you in your new XEO-based ESPs. If you decide on staying with XEOSP++, then you'll need to learn exactly where all of the XEO assets are located in the directory & folder structure, within you Oblivion data folder. Fairly easy if you just look at the XEO download archive file, in your choice of archive tool. (I think some calls may actually be to MBP++ assets, I forget how they structured XEOSP++, been a couple of years since I've worked on anything Oblivion.)

 

When saving, create a new ESP for each, for example, Better Cities XEO.esp and Elsweyr Anequina XEO.esp.

 

I'd work on one at a time, and testing it out after making one minor edit to make sure it is going to work. Once that is established, I'd make a list of which NPCs I want to change and then progressively run through all of my edits, stopping to save often (even CS/E can be unstable at times) and also test changes. You may want to set up a set of save games so you can quickly go the where those edits are in-game.

 

As gregathit noted above, you're in the very deep end of the modding pool, very very deep. Patience, experimenting and learning features and functions of tools, and a systematic methodology are all that is required. (If you think this is hard, go read up on what G' and others had to do to accomplish the update for the Lovers Animations and files. Guaranteed to make your head explode. And what you are trying to accomplish here is not far behind that.)

 

I use those for both PC and to export out their face setup for importing to other NPCs, when I change their race to XEO. Acts as a quick starting point where I can then go into CS/E and make additional edits or tweaks to each NPC to my liking. The Exporting/Importing of faces requires both Wrye Bash 295.5 and Wrye Bash 304.3 and I prefer and use the Standalone versions of both. WB 295.5 is what I 'normally' use, WB 304.3 for the face export/import features, which are broken in prior versions.

 

Examples as PC:

(Contains Nudity)

 

 

post-18672-0-16266200-1504085414_thumb.png

post-18672-0-51255300-1504085505_thumb.png

 

 

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Wow, this sounds more complicated than I thought. I was hoping to maybe just load XEOSP and the mod with the NPCs I want to change into the construction set and just change the NPCs race one of XEO's races in the race edit menu and bada boom bada bing! I'm done! 

 

LOL....I guess not. this might be too hardcore for me. I will try and see what happens(hopefully I wont destroy the world again ;) ). I will take your advice and just start with a few edits on something small and hold off on big mods/projects like Better Citties for now. Worst case scenario, I will just have to suspend disbelief when talking to non XEO NPCs....plus, now that MBP is installed(if I keep it) vanilla npcs do look slightly less fuggly.

 

Just for quick reference, when you refer to CS/E, I'm assuming you're referring to the construction Set? not sure the the "E" refers to and I want to make sure I don't misunderstand anything.

 

Nice Pics, I was hoping to transfer those and some other save data files into partners for CM Partners or MCS. Do you know if the function is still broken in the 307 version of Wyre Bash?

 

 

Thanks for all your advice Varenne, you've been a real trooper for putting up with me for about a week now! smile.png

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E = extender

CS Extender,  a CS update.

I recommend version 51

CSE Link and how to start CS with OBSE: read my yellow Link below.

 

You must start CS with OBSE to save Mods with OBSE scripts. And he extender fixes many errors, so the CS is more stable, less crashes.

 

--------------------

Wrye Bash version 295  !!! All newer versions are shit ! ( or good for Skyrim but not Oblivion)

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E = extender

CS Extender,  a CS update.

I recommend version 51

CSE Link and how to start CS with OBSE: read my yellow Link below.

 

You must start CS with OBSE to save Mods with OBSE scripts. And he extender fixes many errors, so the CS is more stable, less crashes.

 

--------------------

Wrye Bash version 295  !!! All newer versions are shit ! ( or good for Skyrim but not Oblivion)

Ahh, thanks Fejeena.

 

I've been using 307 for a while now, is there a way for me to safely scale back to 295 or should I rebuild everything from scratch?

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You can use both 295 and 304 by downloading the Standalone Executable versions, instead of the Installer versions. 

Oblivion Works (SourceForge site)

 

Standalones highlighted

 

 

post-18672-0-57760600-1504467158_thumb.png

post-18672-0-94487100-1504467160_thumb.png

 

 

 

In fact this is my preferred setup now as moving to the newer versions of WB for Skyrim SE fubarred my prior 295 direct install. Now I just use the standalone executable for both.

 

I also go into the properties for each exe file and change it to run in Win XP mode.

 

 

post-18672-0-79383700-1504467484_thumb.png

 

 

 

295 boots fairly quickly, while 304 takes forever and a day to finally load, but I only use it for the face import/export features, so not used much and very targeted development. I usually line up a half dozen to a dozen save games I want to export faces out of and into others. That's typically a couple to a few hours of work, but I get it done all in one shot.

 

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You can use both 295 and 304 by downloading the Standalone Executable versions, instead of the Installer versions. 

Oblivion Works (SourceForge site)

 

Standalones highlighted

 

 

 

In fact this is my preferred setup now as moving to the newer versions of WB for Skyrim SE fubarred my prior 295 direct install. Now I just use the standalone executable for both.

 

I also go into the properties for each exe file and change it to run in Win XP mode.

 

 

 

295 boots fairly quickly, while 304 takes forever and a day to finally load, but I only use it for the face import/export features, so not used much and very targeted development. I usually line up a half dozen to a dozen save games I want to export faces out of and into others. That's typically a couple to a few hours of work, but I get it done all in one shot.

Thanks Varenne, I assume I'll be alright running 295/304 standalone exe while keeping 307 installed?

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Just got power and Internet backup today, I'm in Florida.

 

But yes, you can keep what is installed and when you want to use either standalone you run those via the .exe file, or just make a new link on your desktop for each .exe file to make it real simple for yourself.

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