? The Selachii - Shark Race

[Blaze69]

32 minutes ago, NightroModzz said:

How do you feel about a new mouth mesh when I get to the full body work? I'm almost done with the upper half of my body btw.  I could elongate my current one, further edit it with matching verts to the Citrus head, then flatten it over the high poly surface area. Not sure of the weighting work, but would imagine less then a dozen tri files. Unless your gonna want to take on the new UE4 head mesh for it? Chances are, I wouldn't touch that head further, maybe until after I learn animations.

AFAIK the mouth mesh only uses the Head bone at 100% weight all over it, so it should be easy to weight. For the tris, though... You would have to be the one to create them, at least the separate OBJ for each morph/expression (I can take care of building the tri with them). And we would need a OBJ per phoneme, per facial expression and per CharGen morph (at least the ones that affect anything close to the mouth), so certainly more than a dozen files.

 

I guess we can give it a shot if you want, but I'd rather do it after the female heads are done (not sure if you wanted to edit male ones as well). That way, if the new mouth works out, good, and if it doesn't, we can use the vanilla one in the meantime without delaying the new heads. I assume that's what you mean by UE4 heads.

32 minutes ago, NightroModzz said:

Also, there was a pic of this deer race type thing I'm interested in doing, just can't find it anymore. It had a bigger nose and a different horn design.

Really? I don't recall anything like that. Someone posted a pic of a deertaur in your race mods thread, but the humanoid half is basically a pink-skinned elf with antlers (also it's a character from SMITE or some game like that).

 

Was it actually in here, or did you see it somewhere else? Also, by your mention of a "bigger nose" I assume it did have a deer-like head instead of human-like; am I right?

[NightroModzz]

Well, the UE4 head would have the same or similare mouth mesh made with it anyways.

 

No, the pic was elswhere. You purposly look at that stuff (often I assume), so thought you would be familiar with a similar design. The nose was somewhat big and black. Something between a K9 and lion. Also, I think it had two sets of horns. A small set, and a medium set. Maybe a deer isn't the right search term.

[NightroModzz]

I should probably brows anthro stuff once in a while and save some good reference images.

[Kuroyami]

 

Quote

The start itself makes sense, but wouldn't having the full Blades set from the start be a bit OP? I mean, you don't get it until you enter Skyhaven Temple, and by then you are not exactly level 1 or 2. But then again, the Orc race specifc start gives you a full set of Orcish armor and a weapon, so...

Well, I'd think that with even just the few mentioned colors, the variants added could somewhat match up to the vanilla armor ratings, like say a version that is blue(basically using whatever vanilla textures a user has for the Blades Armor) would match up with Steel or Dwarven, etc - this being the one the player spawns with. 

 

The new pieces could be named something Selachii specific, and not be called "Blades" at all. 

Quote

I contacted Aoki a while back about using meshes from the Revealing Armors mod (mainly the ragged trousers as mentioned before), but he said most of the meshes in the mod were made by Vector Plexus, and that's whose permission I would have to obtain. Do I need to mention how... strict VP is about permissions? I know this is for SOS and so far he's only gone full-on control freak on SAM, but I get the feeling I won't get that permission either. So better forget about packing Revealing Armor meshes with the mod unless they are not done by VP (like for example BadDog's).

I'd almost want to say that it might not exactly be a problem, given that as said, it is SOS work, and nothing related to SAM - even if SOS likely served as the basis for what SAM is now. An option is to use the meshes from Aoki's mod, and if VP does want them removed...I think the point is obvious. I'll leave that choice up to you, though. 

Quote

Don't think there is any such thing. There are ship resources that look more like the traditional image of "ship" (like a galleon or something like that) instead of Skyrim's Viking Longships, and I think there are even a lore-friendly resources for Nord and Breton ships; but nothing that is explicitly Altmer or Thalmor in design. I guesss they would look more or less like the Prowler does in ESO, but since it isn't actually a Dominion Military ship but rather a privateer/mercenary vessel, it may not even be accurate.

 

So... maybe? I dunno, if/when this actually happens we could go for a vanilla ship and that's it, or see which custom resources are available and choose whichever fits best.

Yeah, DeviantKaled. I'd think that modder might have plans for Altmer ships at some point, but who knows when that will be. 

 

Something that I found odd though, and had for quite some time, was the fact that the vanilla game's Nordic ships, at least the larger two, had no Wheel. Sure, they have sails, but with no way to steer? Well, they do. The Trade/Long ship and Greatships(both docked in Solitude's harbor) are just huge rowboats. Makes sense. 

 

[Blaze69]

1 hour ago, NightroModzz said:

No, the pic was elswhere. You purposly look at that stuff (often I assume), so thought you would be familiar with a similar design.

To be honest, I don't actually look at that stuff regularly (or at least as regularly as, say, I log into LL to see if there's anything new). I sometimes feel like doing some browsing and so at random, but it's not that common.

 

Most of the time it's because of a sudden interest for some reason, i.e. I searched for sabre-tooth tiger pics when Sabrelions were mentioned for YA, searched for otters when BadDog took up work with the Cellan race, and will probably search for deers after your comment (I'll keep an eye out in case I see something that may be of use). That, or it's the one day in a while in which I decide to go on a spree and check all the projects I'm following like Patreon games or (usually furry) comics, which in turn can lead me to stay and browse for a while afterwards.

1 hour ago, NightroModzz said:

The nose was somewhat big and black. Something between a K9 and lion. Also, I think it had two sets of horns. A small set, and a medium set. Maybe a deer isn't the right search term.

Actually, while it will depend on where you search, if you use for example E621 (which is what I mainly use because FA is a bit harder to navigate IMO and unlike FA it doesn't require you to register to be able to see all content), there are some broader species tags that include more specific ones. For example, the "deer" tag will probably apply to stuff like elks, reindeers or moose too (apart from the more specific tags for those, which should also be present) as well as hybrids or anything that is similar enough to a deer to deserve that tag.

 

Of course this depends on whether the tags added by the poster/author and the users are accurate; for example, I once decided to search for Night stalkers (snake/coyote hybrids) from Fallout to see if someone had done them and only 3 results or so came up, but if I searched for "hybrid" + "canine" + "snake", a few more pics showed up that were obviously night stalkers but had not been tagged as such. So I guess YMMV.

 

EDIT: yeah, also I don't think you should search for that stuff using Google or Bing straight away. Better to do so on a site designed specifically for that. FYI those don't only have explicit stuff, they usually have different "levels" of NSFW-ness  (Safe -> Questionable -> Explicit in E621, for example) you can use to filter and some may not even allow you to see the explicit content unless you register and sign in (FA).

1 hour ago, NightroModzz said:

I should probably brows anthro stuff once in a while and save some good reference images.

I really think you should. To be fair, Sturgeon's Law (aka "90% of everything is crap") is in full effect and even when using tags to filter the results there's plenty of stuff you won't like; but the remaining 10% will actually be pretty good most of the time, or at least it has been from my experience.

[NightroModzz]

Yeah, found out about E621 around mid 2017. Or at least that is when the name stuck...  Somewhat.

[Blaze69]

2 hours ago, Kuroyami said:

Well, I'd think that with even just the few mentioned colors, the variants added could somewhat match up to the vanilla armor ratings, like say a version that is blue(basically using whatever vanilla textures a user has for the Blades Armor) would match up with Steel or Dwarven, etc - this being the one the player spawns with. 

I guess that's an option, yes. But I wouldn't want to have more than a few variations of that. Maybe one like the vanilla Elven Light set (which is visually identical to the standard Elven set but with lower stats), one on par with the Blades armor but a different texture, and one closer to the top-tier armors and yet another custom texture (maybe something similar to the Dovahkiin Armor from Blades Samurai Armour and Kimonos?).

2 hours ago, Kuroyami said:

I'd almost want to say that it might not exactly be a problem, given that as said, it is SOS work, and nothing related to SAM - even if SOS likely served as the basis for what SAM is now. An option is to use the meshes from Aoki's mod, and if VP does want them removed...I think the point is obvious. I'll leave that choice up to you, though. 

Well, the Permissions section of the Nexus page explicitly requires asking for permission before using any assets from the mod, and Aoki said I would have to get those permissions from Vector, so if I went ahead and uploaded it I would be breaking the terms.

 

Of course chances are it would go unnoticed unless someone reported it or messaged Vector about it, but still, I won't do it because it's wrong. Note that otherwise I would be happy to pack it, though.

40 minutes ago, NightroModzz said:

Yeah, found out about E621 around mid 2017. Or at least that is when the name stuck...  Somewhat.

Okay, then. Do remember to share whatever you end up saving for reference, please. Lol .

[Kuroyami]

6 hours ago, Blaze69 said:

I guess that's an option, yes. But I wouldn't want to have more than a few variations of that. Maybe one like the vanilla Elven Light set (which is visually identical to the standard Elven set but with lower stats), one on par with the Blades armor but a different texture, and one closer to the top-tier armors and yet another custom texture (maybe something similar to the Dovahkiin Armor from Blades Samurai Armour and Kimonos?).

Well, I don't mean many variations to match ALL of the vanilla heavy armors, just a few - perhaps going up to the stats of Ebony for the Black variation. Something like...

 

Blue(Vanilla Blades) - Steel 

White/Silver - Dwarven

Red - Orcish or Nordic(DLC Armor)

Black - Ebony

 

Could go with the stats of Light Armor on the same tiers as well. 

 

Otherwise...

Might have to run through the quest again, just to make sure two problems(those being not getting any dialog for beginning the quest by getting the necklace - it just went right to the dialog where it assumes you spoke to Mizuno previously, and not getting any of Mizuno's extra dialog lines once he is a follower). Made the mistake of setting up Kage's profile for a YA setup, but had the Follower plugin for this mod loading as the vanilla version. Probably going to have to restart because of that. 

 

[Blaze69]

26 minutes ago, Kuroyami said:

Might have to run through the quest again, just to make sure two problems(those being not getting any dialog for beginning the quest by getting the necklace - it just went right to the dialog where it assumes you spoke to Mizuno previously, and not getting any of Mizuno's extra dialog lines once he is a follower). Made the mistake of setting up Kage's profile for a YA setup, but had the Follower plugin for this mod loading as the vanilla version. Probably going to have to restart because of that. 

First part is intended. Well, sorta. It just worked out like that when I set up the alternate stages, and I thought the dialogue was good enough; the first part anyway ("Is this yours?" *obviously yes because he's the one Deekus' note spoke of and his name is on the amulet* "well yes, thank you for bringing it back, here's something for your trouble"). Hell, many vanilla dialogues are already set up like that, so I didn't think it was that bad. Should be able to add alternate lines for that path if need be, though, so there's that.

 

Second part should not happen, though. I'll double check with the uploaded files when I get the chance, but it was working just fine on my last test before packing, so it would be really weird if it had broken somehow. Let me know if it happens again (or it doesn't).

[Kuroyami]

1 hour ago, Blaze69 said:

First part is intended. Well, sorta. It just worked out like that when I set up the alternate stages, and I thought the dialogue was good enough; the first part anyway ("Is this yours?" *obviously yes because he's the one Deekus' note spoke of and his name is on the amulet* "well yes, thank you for bringing it back, here's something for your trouble"). Hell, many vanilla dialogues are already set up like that, so I didn't think it was that bad. Should be able to add alternate lines for that path if need be, though, so there's that.

 

Second part should not happen, though. I'll double check with the uploaded files when I get the chance, but it was working just fine on my last test before packing, so it would be really weird if it had broken somehow. Let me know if it happens again (or it doesn't).

I had a save close to the Talos statue where you find Ilas-Tei's Ring(for the cut "Missing Apprentices" quest, where you find at least a single skeever alive, even with Cutting Room Floor disabling most of the bodies, items, and the fire/charred landscape for Ysra before you begin the quest), but I started on an earlier save after making sure I was using the YA version(what I imagine was a few cells away from Deekus camp(could just about see Yngvild through the fog), as the changes to the camp were there[as seen in the image, and the necklace was where it should be]). 

 

Probably going to clean up the mod list for Kage and restart with Skyrim Unbound instead. There is a Wilderness->Winterhold Coast option that puts the player just northeast of Whistling Mine, close to Bleakcoast cave and a small abandoned camp. 

 

As for the mouth, I'm not too sure about mesh details, though having a little more detail texture wise is what I think it needs. Other than that, making the teeth look close to a shark is ideal, as mentioned before. Such as(some NSFW shots possible)...

 

nummynumz

 

ehbear, ehbear

[NightroModzz]

9 hours ago, Kuroyami said:

As for the mouth, I'm not too sure about mesh details, though having a little more detail texture wise is what I think it needs. Other than that, making the teeth look close to a shark is ideal, as mentioned before. Such as(some NSFW shots possible)...

If you sink the camera in at the right angle. Plus, for the UE4 version, if a camera system can be made. Have you ever watched "3d girlfriends 4 ever?"

 

Maybe I should mention that I bought the stuff bellow and plan to combine them, then further add and edit stuff.

 

https://www.unrealengine.com/marketplace/photo-mode

https://www.unrealengine.com/marketplace/photomode

https://www.unrealengine.com/marketplace/look-color-grading-pack

 

Maybe I can do some unique stuff with this and set it to mesh parts in the photo mode camera system as another unique function? Likely won't be a function in the game if I can get that far. (because of the obvious use)

https://www.unrealengine.com/marketplace/fade-camera-occluders

 

 

@Blaze69

 

Just some heads up about DDS and Substance painter for the future. That plugin will likely have version compatibility issues and don't really want to bother with it. I could just export it as a TGA (since it is best for game engines), then import the finished textures to Photoshop, then export it back out with the Nvidia DDS plugin.

 

There is also this. Not sure of reliability though.

 

[Blaze69]

16 minutes ago, NightroModzz said:

Just some heads up about DDS and Substance painter for the future. That plugin will likely have version compatibility issues and don't really want to bother with it. I could just export it as a TGA (since it is best for game engines), then import the finished textures to Photoshop, then export it back out with the Nvidia DDS plugin.

Yeah, that should work. Or you could even send me the textures as TGAs straight away. Fun fact: I'm pretty sure Skyrim can load TGAs, because some mods that included ripped assets from other games had the textures in that format and they worked just fine both in NifSkope and the game itself.

 

But yeah, better to have them in DDS format anyway.

[NightroModzz]

7 minutes ago, Blaze69 said:

Fun fact: I'm pretty sure Skyrim can load TGAs, because some mods that included ripped assets from other games had the textures in that format and they worked just fine both in NifSkope and the game itself.

Oh, that is interesting. Yeah, TGAs are performance friendly and well compressed. Maybe they are just easy for the engine to read because of it. But yeah, the engine was most likely built around just DDS.

[Zudien96]

Please make SAM support for shark race. I use SAM instant of SOS. Im afraid if install this mod with SAM cause make crash.

[Blaze69]

18 minutes ago, Zudien96 said:

Please make SAM support for shark race. I use SAM instant of SOS. Im afraid if install this mod with SAM cause make crash.

Sorry, not gonna happen. I don't use SAM nor like it, adding support for it would be hard and time consuming, and AFAIK the file would have to be uploaded to VectorPlexus' web page only as per his EULA.

[Kuroyami]

Okay, so...

 

Went for more testing with a different character, though with mostly the same setup. However, it seems there is a different problem. 

Went to Deekus' camp first, dealt with him, got the necklace, read the note, and headed to Mizuno's camp. Something to consider is that the quest does begin when you take the Amulet, only it does not consider if you have already read the note, and update based on that. Instead, even if it marked as read, you have to read it again for the quest to update in that case. 

 

Otherwise, the main problem is - now the quest can't be progressed for some reason. 

 

Also a few other random shots...

 

[Blaze69]

9 minutes ago, Kuroyami said:

Okay, so...

 

Went for more testing with a different character, though with mostly the same setup. However, it seems there is a different problem. 

 

Went to Deekus' camp first, dealt with him, got the necklace, read the note, and headed to Mizuno's camp. Something to consider is that the quest does begin when you take the Amulet, only it does not consider if you have already read the note, and update based on that. Instead, even if it marked as read, you have to read it again for the quest to update in that case. 

 

Otherwise, the main problem is - now the quest can't be progressed for some reason. 

 

Also a few other random shots...

Okay, so no dialogue at all is showing? You said this is a new game, right? Maybe you are seeing the "missing dialogue" bug? Try starting again, console your way to Deekus camp and save, and then quit the game and load it again. I'll test it on a new game ASAP to make sure the plugin is right anyway, but I really can't see any reason for it to have broken. I even updated the SEQ files before packing, so this shouldn't be happening in at all in the first place.

 

The mod scripts seem to be working properly otherwise, though; that "2" in the JournalKnown global tells me you have both opened the bag and seen the journals (so you get the dialogue to ask him if you can read them) and read the journals themselves (so Mizuno will metion you knowing about Lana if you have a female PC when you ask him if he has been with other females after he checks you out).

[Blaze69]

28 minutes ago, Kuroyami said:

[...]

Just ran a test of the mod and everything seems to be working as intended. Both paths trigger the right quest stages and all the dialogues are there (both the quest-specific ones and Mizuno's dialogue afterwards). Even used the files from the mod instead of my dev build just in case I missed something while packing, so it should be working fine.

[box of rocks]

so when I try to play with this race (even from a fresh save) I seem to get a human body texture bot the rest is fine, do you know how to fix this? Thank you

[Blaze69]

33 minutes ago, box of rocks said:

so when I try to play with this race (even from a fresh save) I seem to get a human body texture bot the rest is fine, do you know how to fix this? Thank you

Do you use any Unique Player mods? Or some kind of player-only Werewolf replacer?

[box of rocks]

21 minutes ago, Blaze69 said:

Do you use any Unique Player mods? Or some kind of player-only Werewolf replacer?

No not anymore, though I did find some leftovers when I was looking after the culprit in the Creation kit. Thank you very much for your help and incredibly rapid response. Happy new year!

[Kuroyami]

Loaded the last save I made with that character - in the Elven Light armor and glowing tattoos - and then the dialog was there. Both the line to progress the quest, and once I got him as a follower, his other dialog was there too. Still going to restart that one, and try getting the introduction dialog and quest from Mizuno first this time. 

 

Otherwise, some more dialog for Loki.

 

Concerning Ancano...

Spoiler

[PC] [MG06 At or Below 55, NOT Above or Completed]What do you think of Ancano?
         |
        L – [PlayerIsAltmer] Well, I just might think far better of you, than him.
               |
              L – Mostly because you are not as likely to lord some title or position over anyone here. 
                    |
                   [PC] I could do that all the time – you have no idea.
                           |
                          L – Perhaps. But you are at least nice enough to know your standing, and not believe it means far more than it actually does.

                   [PC] If you are superior to anything or anyone, saying such constantly makes you less so.
                           |
                          L – Not exactly how I would put it myself, but I see your point. 

 

        L – He is someone who, while telling others the same, does not know his place. 
              |
             L – From what I understand, he is overstepping his bounds here, and believes that there is nothing anyone can do about it.
                   |
                  L – Due to that, he persists. 
                        |
                       [PC] What do you think his real purpose here, is?
                               |
                              L – Likely not what he told the Archmage Arren.
                                    |
                                   L – But I honestly do not care why he is here. If it comes to something, then it will be dealt with.

 

                       [PC] How has he treated you?
                               |
                              L – Same as the others, though I have not given him the satisfaction of listening. 
                                    |
                                   L – Do not know if you heard of it, but his words to Ko'Maru are something Mirabelle took offense to.
                                          |
                                         L – I did not hear them myself, or hear of them, but I can imagine. 

 

Asking About Lana...

Spoiler

[PC] [PlayerReadMizunoJournal] Did you know Lana?
         |
        L – Not as well as Mizuno did. If you know enough about what happened, you probably know that I arrived here long after she left.
              |
            [PC] Did you ever meet her?
                    |
                   L – Yes. When she visited Windhelm, believe me, people were at odds with what to think.
                         |
                        L – The fact that she was so good at her magic to heal, many offered her free meals, I think the owner of Candlehearth offered her a warm bed for a few nights...you get the point.
                              |
                             L – While others, like a certain stone-headed man I loathe, had both a problem with her magic, and the fact that...
                                   |
                                  L - ...she was a beautiful, proud Nord woman who would offer her help to even the Dunmer and Argonians of Windhelm. She took no payment from them, believing their gratitude was enough.
                                          |
                                        L – Believe me – I respect her, even if there are those who would not. 

 

            [PC] What do you think of her ideals?
                    |
                   L – Better than most of my foolish flesh and blood. They have a point, but it becomes stale when you realize just what it leads to. 
                         |
                       [PC] I suppose you know what it leads to?
                               |
                              L – Not the exact outcome, no. But the basic idea is, we become an insular, self-important province who believes it's own people are the most important. 
                                   |
                                  L – You ever hear of Morrowind? THERE is your example. Which is a certain kind of irony, given how those in Windhelm think so little of the Dunmer.
                                         |
                                       [PC] Have you been there?
                                               |
                                              L – Being born after the Red Year? No. But the stories here, the tales from those like Breylna, and others – are enough. 
                                                    |
                                                   L – Some of it could be wrong, but if I come across the truth, then I will change my opinion. 

 

                                       [PC] Do you think less of the Dunmer?
                                               |
                                              L – No. So long as a mind can find intelligence, and reason, it can change, hopefully for the better. 
                                                    |
                                                   L – But they had other reasons for their cultural ideals. Idle Gods wary of their Immortality, or losing it? 
                                                         |
                                                        L – Or so some stories say, anyway. 

 

                       [PC] [PlayerIsASelachii] I have seen those ideals before...
                               |
                              L – Yes, I believe Mizuno told me about that once. 
                                    |
                                   L – How you Selachii learn to preserve life with magic, before other forms teach you how to take it. 
                                         |
                                        L – I believe it sounds reasonable – something many of my race believe that the savage beast races, cannot be. 

 

                       [PC] By “foolish flesh and blood”, you mean your family?
                               |
                              L – As they are included with my race? YES. 
                                    |
                                   L – I know there are those who do not have this mindset, but they are outnumbered by those who do.

 

[NightroModzz]

I know this isn't in your field of work, but any plans for shark race villages in the future? Maybe by lakes or the shores? Maybe posting a help wanted for someone willing that has that skill set would be a good idea.

[Kuroyami]

4 hours ago, NightroModzz said:

I know this isn't in your field of work, but any plans for shark race villages in the future? Maybe by lakes or the shores? Maybe posting a help wanted for someone willing that has that skill set would be a good idea.

Like other things, I've had that idea for a while. Mostly considering something like it in or near the Sea of Ghosts, though - similar to the abandoned towns in the Northern Encounters mod - some of them being on the larger ice flows. But that is of course a stretch from other ideas, where maybe they might just add a house(like for Seika, a blacksmith in Dragon Bridge - though this is not in the mod yet), or a small camp(like the obvious example of Mizuno). 

 

One of the reasons I have not mentioned it, would be the technical scope of it, along with the fact that I'm not too sure about coming up with enough stories to populate even a small town. Either way, that would be something I really would not consider at all focusing on anytime soon. 

 

Ideas like Helheim(a Nordic ruin which is home to a coven of Vampires - information in this blog entry, if interested), may be the biggest thing I intend on, and that is just adding the exterior to the Tamriel/Skyrim worldspace(likely somewhere in the Pale), and then maybe a few interior cells. 

[Blaze69]

5 hours ago, NightroModzz said:

I know this isn't in your field of work, but any plans for shark race villages in the future? Maybe by lakes or the shores? Maybe posting a help wanted for someone willing that has that skill set would be a good idea.

Maybe. Building it is just a matter of getting to it and reading some tutorials on town creation or whatever, and I kinda know my way around editing objects in the world as evidenced by the modified locations (Mizuno's camp, Reachwind Eyrie, Ko'Maru's room, the Wolfpack camp for the Lungaris...). Would have to think about it and come up with the proper locations and NPCs to populate them, as Kuroyami suggested, so it won't happen anytime soon (also there's plenty of stuff on the To Do list already), but I wouldn't rule out the possibility.