Behaviours [FONV] - Idles, run, headtracking etc.

[A.J.]

 

You are right, that is a better solution. And either or both would solve my issue

 

 

I'm updating OP right now. If you'll see that it doesn't work fine for your problem, I'll try your solution!

[A.J.]

Updated OP with an optional beta version. The new features require Lutana and a custom skeleton to work. Hope I packaged everything right.

 

Custom skeleton: http://www.loverslab.com/topic/64485-apple-jam-skeleton-fonv/

[bkobri]

Hi there, A.J., i hope you will understand me, as i'm pretty bad at speaking english rather than understanding So, i'm experiencing some strange bug using Behaviours and Bodymorph both together. Cutting to the chase, idles and headtracking ceased to work after applying some metamorphoses on my character's body. Well, i should say that they are working, but in some strange unpredicable manner, so that HxT may start working on random NPC after a couple of hours playing, and character's head often ends up stuck in unnatural position. Or some general idle animation may occur at random time while character is standing. All other features like siting and proportional run are working all the time.

Though, everything works perfectly when i'm starting a new game with unmorphed character. Are these two mods incompatible? Or maybe i'm doing something wrong? I noticed that when the game with morphed character is loaded, Bodymorph applies all the changes on her body in real time so i can see her breasts moving in position and enlargening, arms and neck stretching and so on. I don't know, if it's meant to be so. But when i load an unmorphed character, no changes are getting applied and after 5 seconds or so Behaviours start working.

Well, that's my problem, hope you may help me, 'cause i adore all of your mods so much, and would like to use them all at once if it's possible.

Thank you in advance, and sorry for my sloppy language

[A.J.]

Hello bkobri, thank you for your feedback.

There is indeed some incompatibility between the two mods, but it COULD be viable. I'll try to explain better, putting few extra boring details in spoiler.

 

 

Everytime a mod has a scripted animation on an actor, it (NPC or PC) will stop playing any kind of idles. This means that you still will be able, for example, to sit down, stand up, eat something and see the animation (if you have the proper mod), push a brahmin down on the ground, etc.etc. because they are all scripted / forced animations, they will still work. What will stop working is another kind of animations, it's the kind of animations that Behaviours uses, those animations triggered by the game engine itself, ciclically, everytime a certain condition is verified (so, not forced via script).

 

 

Once, headtracking was using a forced/scripted animation, which was giving me more control, but as downside HxT was automatically stop any other kinds of behaviours to work (for the reason I wrote before). So, on my side, I had to make choices to make everything working together, and this is the most viable thing I thought about. Now HxT uses a spontaneous idle, it will stop playing after that bodymorph will call its morphs.

 

Now what happens with bodymorph: when you load a game, bodymorph forces scripted animations on yourself to change your aspect >>> after that you won't be able anymore to trigger idle animations (behaviours and hxt).

 

To make these idles work again, you simply need to sit down / stand up. You can sit down on a chair or even use Behaviours action to sit on the ground, it's the same.

 

Bad news is you probably need to sit down everytime you re-load the game, after those (about) 20 seconds that bodymorph refreshes your aspect. NOTE: even if you didn't change your aspect, bodymorph will still invoke animations on you, just to be sure. So, sitting down after about 20 seconds, after a reload, is pretty much mandatory to make things work again

 

But when i load an unmorphed character, no changes are getting applied and after 5 seconds or so Behaviours start working.

 

I believe this happens because BodyMorph isn't morphing if it finds another animation playing (like a behaviour). It should queue, so that when the animation will stop it will try to morph again. Problem is, if you have a very short timing on behaviours (i.e. trigger an idle every 10-20 seconds), probably bodymorph doesn't succeeed in its job.

 

 

Let's make a drastic example: you play an idle every 10 seconds, but the idle itself is pretty much long (i.e. 6-8 seconds, keep in mind that some DN animations are so subtle that sometimes you don't even notice you are playing them ), bodymorph queues its request to morph, but it has some delay, so... this repeats over and over, and after 10 minutes bodymorph is still trying to morph you. But since you didnt' change your aspect, you are not aware that it is still trying to do it.

 

 

 

It's hard to handle, the game engine doesn't give us many possibilities in this. However, I still believe it is viable with some MCM tweaking and timing. I suggest a long timing on behaviours, like 30-60 seconds. Eventually, if you have the impression that the idles are playing too rarely, remove the DN idles, so that only those less subtle will play.

What I should add on a future update is some extra check: if BodyMorph is found in Load Order, the idles will start playing only after 30-40 seconds, so that BodyMorph will have all the time to make its work without anything interfering, it deserves an attempt.

 

-------------------------

Last thing to say:

HxT may start working on random NPC after a couple of hours playing, and character's head often ends up stuck in unnatural position

 

It *could* be that in those 2 hours playing, you sat down / stand up, so idles re-started working.

However, the character's head in an unnatural position seems symptom of something got stuck. I can only think that headtracking started playing, then something like bodymorph overwrote it with another animation and things went bad.

This is a serious issue, but unfortunately I can't do anything on my own.

But maybe I could provide you (players) an option, a tool on MCM to reset, to unstuck. If you read on the first page, on bottom, 7keyscurtain had some issues with head in wrong position, but after I updated HxT files I thought it was solved. So:

 

- Are you using a recent version?

 

- Can someone else tell me if they had wrong head position? this is a serious issue that needs to be investigated more

[bkobri]

Oh dear, i didn't expect so much effort in your answer I understand the difficulty of scripting being caged in borders of Gamebryo engine. Working with python powered HMI's for logical controllers for about two years, and problems are all the same. Waiting for your answer, i tested the script by myself, and eventually found pretty much the same solution as you suggested. By the way, answering your question: I downloaded the latest versions of all plugins for NVSE, last Bodymorph and AJ skeletons and last versions of your plugins. So basikally everything is ok, we just need to follow some rules to get all we want Thanks a lot

[bkobri]

Okay, looks like the right and only solution for everybody who wants to use Bodymorph+RaceBodyMorph+BodymorphSelector and Behaviours is:

- install mods following all instructions and requirements;

- make a new save or a clean save;

- morph yourself, apply any options you want in RaceBodyMorph, i believe, the best is to do it before leaving Doc Mitchel's house;

- never, NEVER install mods that add some new animations, exept for vanilla replacers and, i guess, Sexout (though, never installed it, so i don't even know how it works). One of these mods is Animated Chems. It completely cracked the balls of my Behaviours when i used Stimpak, so after displaying the injection animation my character has returned to default stance and refused to play any idle or headtrack any NPC even after sitting. Looks like the influence of this mod is crucial in ruining the animation queue or script of Behaviours.

So i would suggest everyone who intends to use A.J.'s mods to give up using Animated Chems particularly and other mods that add new animations or interactions to game. Well, there is still enough immersion in this game even without realistic chems shooting, eh?

[A.J.]

*any* mod that forces an animation via script, using PlayIdle. Animated Chems is an example, but also Groovatron or even my very own Small Animator. Or even when you install a pose mod and they tell you "open console and write PlayIdle some_pose_name" - it will instantly break behaviours and more in general any general idle.

 

I do have my own mod where you can shoot chems using animations, I'm enough sad that I can't do it without breaking stuff. I hope in the next NVSE I'll be able to make them all work.

[Istill]

Hmm, i dont know if someone wrote that here. Weird glitch with camera being [leftside down?] When yout sit having enchanced camera.

[A.J.]

 

Hmm, i dont know if someone wrote that here. Weird glitch with camera being [leftside down?] When yout sit having enchanced camera.

 

 

Not much of a glitch, it's how they behave since they are meant to be played in third person. 3rd person is turned of 90° compared to 1st person

[Istill]

Any way to fix that? In skyrim with similiar mods it was working fine.

[A.J.]

Skyrim has a completely different way to handle both animations and camera.

[deblueseven]

It randomly stopped working. If I reload a save way back it works but why it stopped I can't tell. I remember that at one point, drinking water just wouldn't work unless I went first person. It's possible that all animations stopped triggering. It keeps saying "picking..." then a timer starts and it tries to pick but nothing happens.

 

I get the this in the console:

Error in script 7f016461

An expression failed to evalute to a valid result

File: Behaviours.esp Offset: 0x0011 Command: Let

 

Then something about a skeleton being compatible yada yada.

 

Edit: So it may have been about the hardcore idles because when I disable those and hardcore mode, sat down and stood up, the idles started to work again. God do I hope I can use this with Hardcore mode, the hardcore idles were really immersive but at least I get the other awesome idles.

 

I notice that on some walking idle animations, the legs does this weird moonwalk-ish thing, the legs look really stiff and moves in a very unnatural way, like when you refuse to bend your knees, they look like wooden legs sort of.

[A.J.]

For what concerns the script error in console, it shouldn't be so serious. I think it's because after some time a certain function was removed, causing the inability to understand if you are using a certain skeleton or not.

Now some time has passed and I don't remember very well, also at the moment unfortunately I can't put my hands on the mod, but I remember (and I could be wrong...) that the skeleton stuff was required only for v.2.5 . If it's so, if you're using 2.5, I'd say it could be a good idea to remove, make a clean save and install 2.4. Anyway, as I said, I don't think it's a serious issue.

 

Instead, the fact that the animations get stuck should be because of another problem. Here we have 2 cases:

- Animations get stuck, you sit down / stand up, animations start working again: this is perfectly normal, it means that in the meantime a scripted animation was triggered, maybe from another mod, maybe from few rare vanilla cases (i.e. pushing a brahmin).

- Animations get stuck, you sit down / stand up and they don't start again, only restarting the game works: the animation engine is completely stuck, narrowing down the source could be very hard. But I do think you are on the right path, me too one year ago had the impression that hardcore animations gave me random issues. However as I said it's not easy to debug this one, and your feedback is invaluable.

 

For the last problem, it's... complicated. Making something like this working while walking is not easy, it requires a lot of tweaking and trying in game. While it couldn't seem, I really spent a long time to tweak this bunch of idles and in some cases I couldn't do much and I had to find a compromise, even if it could mean stiff legs, but I tell you more, it can also happen that if a non-walking animation starts and then you start walking, you'll move in a very unnatural way, like your character could start swinging left / right or have robotic arms...

What could be possible is this: if you find that some specific animations requires extra tweaking, I could write them down and try to tweak them on a future update.

[KoolHndLuke]

I don't remember ever reading about how many idles the FNV engine can handle, but, I do run quite a few myself and seem to notice that the more I have the more trouble I have with them sometimes. For instance, Sexout animations don't work well like they used to before I added other idles like Behaviors. So, I think both Sexout and Behaviors work fine by themselves and might not even conflict with each other mostly. What I have noticed loading into a save is that I need to let the game run awhile sometimes before animations start working properly. Usually pulling your weapon and holstering it again will sort of kick- start them.

[A.J.]

Animations are a complicated subject, the engine is weak. There shouldn't be problems concerning the number of idles added, but the twos (SO and Behaviours) are somewhat incompatible. Behaviours uses a vanilla way to trigger an idle, which is picked by the game engine by itself based on certain conditions, while SO forces an animation via script, which breaks the previously mentioned vanilla behaviour. Then it's important to remember that sometimes some animation files could have problems by themselves and cause troubles in the game.

[dongding]

What exactly is the condition for the puke animation, and will there be any updates for this mod?

 

I am loving it so far.

[Lynche6669]

Why is the Apple Jack or whatever skeleton still mentioned? I tried every single file from that mod and literally I've downloaded skeletons from everywhere and the idles still never ever happen. I mean my character might...look around...I guess, sometimes. That was with the Deedus skeleton or whatever on the first 2 PCs I tested it on for 2 weeks. Afterwards I brought it over to 6 new gaming PCs that just showed up in my shop a while back ago using 4 different skeletons. It worked beautifully on 3 out of 6 using "The Skeleton" on the Nexus. Such weird packing though. I've tested over 9,000 Skyrim SE and LE mods, 21,000 Fallout 4 mods, all for around 11 years now. I've got to say, New Vegas and Fallout 3 have the most strange tone to the modding. It's always either half there, or just very reluctant, like, here's the mod, whatevs. lol. It's got to be the single most damning thing to the modding community, but luckily I'm seeing a huge spike among fellow software engineering hobbyists making mods left in right, 8 mods a day, one website says, 12 mods a day another website says, and all for New Vegas. I hope this new wave picks up this mod too. Becuase it's a damn good idea. The frame is already right here. Now it justs needs, security. Stability. Certainty.

[A.J.]

6 hours ago, Lynche6669 said:

 

I would ignore the fact that this means an average of 14 Fallout 4 mods / day for 4 years without counting sundays and saturdays and holidays in general, and instead will give you a couple of infos.

 

I just reinstalled it and jumped in game, it triggered some dozen idles for some minutes and it worked fine so I take it for good, but I also have a very minimal Load Order.

 

Look for NV Compatibility Skeleton, that's the most compatible, look for it on Nexus unless you're using CBBE. However, this is a general suggestion, because I think your issue has nothing to do with the skeleton. Keep in mind that there's plenty of mods that break the vanilla functionality at the core of this mod, making it not working correctly, this includes some gameplay mods which came out in these last years. Everytime you install a mod that contains an animation, there's a very good chance that will break this mod. Some examples are Solid Project, Quickthrow or Sexout itself. This leads to the impossibility to reach "security, stability", because that's a choice made by those modders.

 

 

[Lynche6669]

13 hours ago, A.J. said:

Look for NV Compatibility Skeleton, that's the most compatible, look for it on Nexus unless you're using CBBE. However, this is a general suggestion, because I think your issue has nothing to do with the skeleton. Keep in mind that there's plenty of mods that break the vanilla functionality at the core of this mod, making it not working correctly, this includes some gameplay mods which came out in these last years. Everytime you install a mod that contains an animation, there's a very good chance that will break this mod. Some examples are Solid Project, Quickthrow or Sexout itself. This leads to the impossibility to reach "security, stability", because that's a choice made by those modders.

 

 

Yaaaaas! That was my thoughts exactly with the NV Compatibility Skeleton, but I ended up using "The Skeleton" instead. I decided to start from scratch with a minimal load order and swear off gun animation replacers, most of the Nexus' map of failures, and on 6 different PCs so far, this mod is awesome. 2 PCs using Astymma's NV Compatibility Skeleton. Wonderful stuff. This is honestly the most reliable mod, by it self and with it's requirements. I have a very very stable setup with this now. Most of the people in my testing team on Discord are telling me the same. Thank you very much for your efficiency and hard work. Now my team is going to test it with CBBE. And well, we will see what the hell happens. lol

[A.J.]

On 11/30/2020 at 1:11 AM, Lynche6669 said:

on Discord

Oh is it a Discord about modding Fallout? can I have an invite?

[Lynche6669]

On 12/3/2020 at 10:43 AM, A.J. said:

Oh is it a Discord about modding Fallout? can I have an invite?

I own a computer business called Black Goat Technologies and I have a private discord for my employees. One day I started using it to talk to my friends who work with me about Fallout 4 mods. Eventually it became a testing center and sometimes the 20-30 computers I have laying around become simultaneous testing dummies. Eventually my brother's Air Force buddies decided to join the team. It's got some strict requirements. But we don't allow other people to come on. I wish I could convince Brando to share his mods with people especially, but a lot of us have been doing this for over a decade and just hate modding websites.

We have very strong feelings about most modders. lol. We only invite a modder temporarily during large projects where we are testing a maaaaaaassive mod. Just like when someone repairs a computer, I like a full report. Everything about the PC. That's what I want with mods. Everyone tests it within 48 hours, and gives me a full report about the mod. We share them with each other and assign the mod to a list. We have tested over 40,000 mods for 9 games so far. I have NOT brought CBBE New Vegas to the testing table yet, but I REALLLY want to. You might get a temporary invite. I'm sure everyone would be okay with it. I mean, they seem to like Lovers Lab more than the Nexus because people on the Lovers Lab try to work together a lot more as a team. Well it wasn't that way 5 years ago. See, we write reports on modding sites too. We get pretty twisted, but I'd like to think it's in a feelgood way. We notice a pattern tho with Nexus modder teams; they tend to only team up offsite, because of disruptive elements. Lovers lab modders are more reliable, more efficient in many ways, and sometimes overtly casual, but it's nice. 

SO! I will bring it up. We must fire all test PCs at CBBE NV. Realistically, that would be around 50 computers. Because we all own multiple. One time we had as many as 60 computers all testing 400 Skyrim mods. lol. That was fun. We've probably constructed a few pretty invincible un-crashable Skyrim SE mod installtions. That's the goal. I will P.M. you with the link. Keep in mind, it's temporary. We are a private testing group. It was a lot of drama getting real intertwined with a bunch of modders in the past. Too bad the Interesting NPCs makers never joined though. But we try. I will be in touch, AJ!

[A.J.]

On 12/5/2020 at 11:10 PM, Lynche6669 said:

 

Oh if it's private no problem then.

I just updated the mod, since a good soul gave me a new function to solve that incompatibility. Now it always works, even if another mod is trying to block it. It still requires some tweakings here and there, since I would like to rewrite most code from scratch (it's old), I hope to update it for xmas holidays

[Lynche6669]

On 12/7/2020 at 2:20 PM, A.J. said:

Oh if it's private no problem then.

I just updated the mod, since a good soul gave me a new function to solve that incompatibility. Now it always works, even if another mod is trying to block it. It still requires some tweakings here and there, since I would like to rewrite most code from scratch (it's old), I hope to update it for xmas holidays

OMG you are a soldier. Well done. Really well done. I wasn't even having any problems with this. I mean, sure sometimes my head gets stuck, but I just talk to someone or sit down and it resets. I mean, well, the animations don't seem to customize from the MCM. I turn certain ones off but it don't care; it keeps the animations I have unticked in the cycle. It didn't do that until I started messing with stuff though, so I don't think that's a bug, maybe even just the MCM. NV's mcm is really quirky.

Can't wait to try this. I will give you as much information as I can after testing the xmas version. Thank you SO much for all your hard work, AJ. You're my hero.

[A.J.]

On 12/9/2020 at 12:08 AM, Lynche6669 said:

 

@Lynche6669 I just updated it with a lot of fixes and stuff, now it never stops playing idles. But due to the huge amount of rewritings, I need more tests and I doubt I'm gonna upload it this month. If you're willing to give it a try and test it please let me know

[Lynche6669]

6 hours ago, A.J. said:

@Lynche6669 I just updated it with a lot of fixes and stuff, now it never stops playing idles. But due to the huge amount of rewritings, I need more tests and I doubt I'm gonna upload it this month. If you're willing to give it a try and test it please let me know

OMG That's awesome! I'm on it right now. I can't wait. I'm not the only one either. I have a few friends that *very* fascinated by this mod being in New Vegas.