Criticism to Amateur XXX games developer (RPG MAKERS & Renpy)

[Benn82]

I believe you all are Certified Pervert. 

 

I've been playing a lots of Hentai Games that using RPG Maker engine for this past 2 months.

Each games had interesting characters and story. From Anime to 3D styles.

Either it had battle and item management, or just pure straight H-novel.

 

Some of it were excited and I couldn't wait for them to deliver more update,

but some of it, I just wish they stop make it or do something more creative about it.

So I try to find the problem of which game are satisfying and which are far from it.

My thought came to one thing that make a H-games satisfying and it's not the story or character. (it's matter but not priority)

 

These amateur developer doesn't give us the detail of the H-Scene. Some of them just give a picture of sex scene.

Boom ... 1 or 2 pics, and you did it and succeed score with these hot chicks after what you done of doing this or that for 10-30 minutes.

What The HELL !?

 

This are the mistake of many H-Games I played. These developer/creator should had Certified Pervert's Training before creating games.

A good H-Games should write the detail of the H-Scene. I felt we all want that detail, cause if it's just a nude or sex picture, Internet are F#ing full of it.

 

Example of good H-Scene - M = Male ; F = Female

M : "Argh ... her V is so tight, my P is so hard right now"

F : "OMG, you P is so big, I can't stand it, F# me more, F# me harder."

M : "Holy S#, she even tighter her V even more, I can't hold no more."

F : "OMG, I cannot hold it no more, I'm gonna cum .. aaaahhhh."

 

And so on and on. Such as we often see in Jap Eroge-Novel Games. This detail of "communication" between the characters in the sex scene are building our Pervert Level to max. When they are finally cumming ... we the players are felt getting award for what we do to succeed the "mission".

 

But so many of these games just focus detail creating the character looks, polished the story and set a lot of details to the world.

And then, sex scene are just a bunch of stiff pictures and move on and on to different Sex Positions, ending with someone cum and done.

No "communication" at all, or simplified.

 

I cannot said the example of bad RPG MAKERS H-Games, but definitely I can said what is good.

Married Warrior Emma is the example of a simple game, but satisfying me, A LOT. The game H-Scene are very details even if they only show 1 or 2 picture per Sex scene. But I can correlate and grasp with the character. How Emma change from a loyal wife to a slave whore state. The progression of each H-scene by scene tell us how Emma from shame of doing what she done and to a state that she's so desire for a great sex and a larger P.

 

So this is my thoughts and criticism for Amateur Hentai-Games (or Sex-Games) developers.

What about you guys ? What are your criticism for them ?

 

Note : I bring these up because there are lots of them in Patreon, asking "donation" money before they can delivery a good solid games. I'm not saying they can ask donation after the game in full state, I'm asking them to had a solid skill yet before actually asking for donation or kickstarter or whatever it's called. Like how Chris Roberts ask for donation and kickstarter for Star Citizen, it's a valid for a quality developer asking for moneys. But if you just an amateur who still lacking of skill, it could lead to a scam or shame.

[Captain Cobra]

 

Example of good H-Scene - M = Male ; F = Female

M : "Argh ... her V is so tight, my P is so hard right now"

F : "OMG, you P is so big, I can't stand it, F# me more, F# me harder."

M : "Holy S#, she even tighter her V even more, I can't hold no more."

F : "OMG, I cannot hold it no more, I'm gonna cum .. aaaahhhh."

 

Sex dialogue is a boner killer always.

[SirNibbles]

 

 

Example of good H-Scene - M = Male ; F = Female

M : "Argh ... her V is so tight, my P is so hard right now"

F : "OMG, you P is so big, I can't stand it, F# me more, F# me harder."

M : "Holy S#, she even tighter her V even more, I can't hold no more."

F : "OMG, I cannot hold it no more, I'm gonna cum .. aaaahhhh."

 

Sex dialogue is a boner killer always.

 

For me it actually kept it interesting in for example "Monster Girl Quest" and the dialogues also did a good job in "Violated Heroine".

Then again I haven't played a lot of rpg maker games that actually left a reminder in my head except for those 2.

[GodSmack]

 

 if you are interested in "sex dialogue" H-rpgmaker games might not be the best place to look for in this.

 

Fenoxo has some good, dialogue quest games if you haven't given those a try you should check it out.

 

i'm not really in favor of supporting h-rpgmaker games, they aren't really all that difficult to make at all. all you need is a copy of rpgmaker, a copy of a good hentai you want to base the game off of and pictures of hentai and boom suddenly you got a hentai game.

 

don't get me wrong there are some gems that were made, like the monster hunter-type hentai game, forgot what its called, but its more combat and picture based. then there is the fact that most of them are [WIP]s that never get past 1.0 in the development, or simple traditional rpg with a hentai pic here or there after a quest or mission

 

As for supporting them on a patreon/kickstarter, unless i'm seeing something on the level of being its "own game" i wouldn't throw a dime in there direction, there are just so many clones of just normal rpgs with hentai pics in them,

[Tengubengu]

I translate H-games in my free time and I actually hate that kind of expository dialogue that sounds like it came from a cheap porn flick. It's completely stiff and immersion-breaking to me; they're talking as if they're being paid to do play by play commentary of their own sex act. Well-written H-games and VNs use a narrator voice for descriptions like that instead. 

[Benn82]

I read the comments above. First of all, I'm talking about Visual Novel RPG Maker & Renpy games, so "sex-dialogue" is important. Either it's direct speaking between the characters or narration, or can be also telling what in the minds of the characters in the Sex Scene.

 

Games like Illusion Sex-Games don't need sex dialogue as they had animated 3D characters and voice over. But this still need the gamers to roleplaying themself.

Games like Fenoxo Textual-Sex-Games did have very detail sex dialogue, but need the players extra imagination.

So Eroge Visual Novel are between it. It's must have interesting short sex dialogue but also must show a picture to depict the situation.

What I'm discuss in this thread is the Eroge Visual Novel, so don't compare to 3D sex games or to Textual H-Games.

 

If the RPG Makers (&Renpy) S-Games developer do not have the balance of it, in my perspective they were failed to delivery.

If these developer not creating a decent sex dialogue, then they have to make an animated sex scene, but it will take more effort.

 

Some of these game are basically walking simulation ... you go here and there, accept quest this and there, and finally the rewards is to copulate with the hot chicks.

Taking about 10 ~ 30 minutes, and all I get was a series of nude and sex picture. We all are Certified Pervert, we seen countless nude picture already. What we need is story, of the game plot and the sex scene story.

 

Do you play The Witcher 1 ? At the release, we don't have objection to the "Sex Scene Card". But if you replay the Witcher 1, your effort to make this and that female characters and only to get a nude card picture is outrageous. The Witcher 3 shown us how our efforts to choose between Yennefer and Triss, are paid with a good sexual (or kinky?) sex scene. Imagine if your effort only result a series of stiff nude picture ...

[windpl]

I think that comparing eastern (japanese) rpg maker games to western is a bit pointless. Because their sex gaming cultures is vastly different where CG>gameplay.

[Vanhal]

My only criticism is for guys who don't finish their games, as maybe 10% of them are even barely playable, rest are 0.0.3 alphas and tech demos and so on. Scurvy on them.

 

Anyone who makes a decently playable game is a hero, quality is secondary matter.

[Benn82]

My only criticism is for guys who don't finish their games, as maybe 10% of them are even barely playable, rest are 0.0.3 alphas and tech demos and so on. Scurvy on them.

 

Anyone who makes a decently playable game is a hero, quality is secondary matter.

 

Ouch ... you're brute, but it's the truth.

 

Somehow I wonder how games developers who often upload their games in Lesson of Passion and Force One (Flash Game) can finish their games. Some of these games quality indeed far from perfect (excessive using graphic picture) but it's finished. Akabur with his Princess Trainer (Renpy) did finish his work (main plot is done) and just a while ago release Princess Trainer Gold edition that perfecting his game (adding side story). Many Japanese RPG Makers had a simple story plot and simple gameplay, but it's done.

 

Following the news of these amateur developer progression, I found out 3 things that a game slow to reach the final state, or even never reach it.

1. Soloist - ALL of games that being develop only by 1 man (/woman), never reach final state. Advice, make a team or assistant.

2. Ambitious - They want to create many things. A lot of hot chicks, lots of activity, lots of sex scene. A few finished game I've played, usually the hero/heroine only interact with maximum 2 characters (love triangle thingy). Advice, make your game simple.

3. Donators Wishes - To make people donate his/her project, they offer the donator to be included in the progression. Now, as the main plot progression already takes a lot of time and energy, now they had to listen and agree to creating something from the donators will. Advice, don't offer/promise your donators to be included in the game developing process.

[Zeke]

This is what I've gotta say to the amateur devs, especially on RPG maker.

 

1. Some dialogue on sex is good, it doesnt need to be much(seriously, 2-3 lines per 'picture' is more than enough). Dont be lazy.

2. Avoid game over screens anyway you can, lose a battle, fine, be a monsters buttslut for X amount of time. Seriously hate it when I have to save after every single fucking encounter and every 3-5 minutes.

3. If you're adding shitload of combat, make standard boring enemies fairly easy and preferably add an item that prevents/autofinishes the 'auto-battles' after some point. Constant easy battles is boring, constant hard battles is frustrating. This is all assuming you wont go for a good-ish battle system a lá dungeons and prisoners.

4. No, you will not get all the help you need, you will not get the programmer, you will not get the writer. You may get some help but 99% of this shit is on you. You start it, you finish it.

(unless you can pay ofc). Slow progress is still better than a year of saying 'I need a writer for mah games' and having nothing else to show.

[Goryokaku]

I play a lot of these but when comes down to it all i think the most interesting game i played was text based and they actually hated Sex Haber's as they like to run around screaming before promptly murdering and stealing from you.  But yeah if you hadn't worked it out Hellmoo game play wise was great, if they made a single player game that had everything Hellmoo provided even with the old rape zombies they removed, that would probably be awesome.

 

As for dialogue with cg yeah you sort of need it a static image can't always show much, but as Zeke said stop the GOR crap, we play these games to some times see the heroine loose or hero depending on your fetish it gets dull having to start all over again just to get the next sex scene or cg image.  Try to avoid a grind fest, they bore me more then anything else i play roleplay games to role play not to run around killing things, surely there are more creative ways to give people xp then shoving monsters in the way every 5 steps.  

 

I would say not to worry to much about not being a programmer or an artist frankly you don't need to give me pictures if you can describe the scene well enough my head will frankly fill in all the blanks for you.  But frankly if your making a game or decide to make a game write it out what you want to happen first plan the damn thing in advance so you don't need a writer if you feel it's not up to scratch then re-write it once your first draft is done.  But yeah take your time and don't come into a project expecting to be able to get help on what you can't do yourself, instead just get creative and work around those issues.

[Professorg]

Looks like I might be grave digging a little bit but prior to the release of RPGMMV I was working on a h-game in RPGMVXAce and still am actually, I will feature fully animated idles, running (depending on your characters direction the animation on the left of the video will change), trading, crafting, sex, etcetcetc.

 

Obviously depending on my patreon (which I will not post until requested because it's pretty bland and empty right now) I will add more and have fairly large plans regarding how much is made.

 

Right now my team consists of:

Me (Scripting(RGSS), Animation(Anime Studio/3ds Max Contor rendering), Level Design, Minor Pixel art editing, UI Design, More Here)

Artist (FullScale art (there are many body types so he has a full plate )

 

Anyway I'll post the things that I have recorded, usually just things that I share with the artist to let him know what's going on.

 

Me explaining our music situation and other random things (ignore my scury voice D:)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRjVVPSsKho

 

Song V2 I just made a second song (yes pny background I don't know) WARNING VERY QUIET

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vX2ruZm9Vw

 

Me showing test rig v1.0.0 for animation (now v1.2.0)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-jilSnc9GY

 

Me showing some of the character creation and gameplay to the artist (all bugs seen in the video including quest book not opening are fixed (look at post date, lul, I work fast(ish)))

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J39GhKGiOBo

 

Anyway I do like any comments and am releasing pre-alpha 0.0.4 soon, so if you want to know more just post on here with @professorg or something, I'll probably reply with something.

[Benn82]

Looks like I might be grave digging....

 

Helo ... my advice for you.

1. If you make Slave Making/Dating sim style, focus 1 (or 2) slave/female and finish the game first. Then after that, you can expand side story and another activity.

2. If you make RPG style. Finish the main story first with minimum(important only NPC) character. Then after that, expand side quest, more chick and detailing H-Scene.

 

Reason : From my experience following amateur games, developer/creator who finish the main story first are success deliver their games. After they doing main quest/story, they have freedom to expand their game. Either making more content or continue to next chapter (/episode).

Developer/creator who dwell too much expand their game from the very early stage usually ended with their game abandoned or people lost interest to it. When there still no solid story or motive to their games, they already try to give people a lot of chicks, and try to be detail to each of them. While their intention is good, in real life, people have their own limit.

 

Limit =

a. Can be stuck up of ideas

b. Economy became worse and had to find real job, no more time taking care their games

c. The creator just tired continue the project.

d. Unexpected decent job/project offered, with a decent lucrative payment. All times focus to the new job.

 

I have "radical solution" for amatuer S-Games developer. Don't make the H-Scene yet or the Sex side. Create the core of the game first, from beginning to end without eroge aspect. After it finish, then add eroge/sex aspect to the game.

[Professorg]

Hm, I keep getting blocked by loverslab, whelp I'll just post what I was going to say as an pastebin, too long I guess?

 

http://pastebin.com/Tetb3tgZ

 

Anyway thanks if you do read that @Benn82 I ramble a bit however that's just my personality.

 

EDIT: Just noticed that I only need 2 things now, wow.... I've got quite the kickass team

Me: Everything

Artist: Drawing (I do animations)

I just need Pixel art and Scripter (which I'm doing but sometimes I get lost)

 

Like.... Image having a pixel artist like this guy:

http://i.imgur.com/HQjE6cD.jpg

 

EDIT2: Daydream time

Man, if I had that pixel artist on my team I would finish this them move on to my second game (theory developed) and make that, bloody terreria/thesims/rpg/(optionalmmo) with sensual content! Imagine the coding in a language I know and having an amazing pixel art game in DX11 (drooooolllllll) but that wouldn't happen for a while *dusts desk with hand*

[Benn82]

Hm, I keep getting blocked by loverslab, whelp I'll just post what I was going to say as an pastebin, too long I guess?

 

http://pastebin.com/Tetb3tgZ

 

 

Read it all. Just don't get too ambitious with your project. Ambitious project can only be made by a studio with proper number of workers in it. Idk if you a genius or a hardworker ... but as I said before, people have limitation (age, bankrupt, chase different dream, etc etc). If you finish the game core, it's a good news, but if game core still not finished, don't try too hard expanding the side quest/activity.

 

Btw, why don't you make your own thread about this game ... had you done that ? So people will start seeing your game progress. This place is quite supportive to S-Games.

[Professorg]

 

Hm, I keep getting blocked by loverslab, whelp I'll just post what I was going to say as an pastebin, too long I guess?

 

http://pastebin.com/Tetb3tgZ

 

 

Read it all. Just don't get too ambitious with your project. Ambitious project can only be made by a studio with proper number of workers in it. Idk if you a genius or a hardworker ... but as I said before, people have limitation (age, bankrupt, chase different dream, etc etc). If you finish the game core, it's a good news, but if game core still not finished, don't try too hard expanding the side quest/activity.

 

Btw, why don't you make your own thread about this game ... had you done that ? So people will start seeing your game progress. This place is quite supportive to S-Games.

 

 

I might today, I'd probably do it after I finish streaming

SHAMELESS SELF ADVERTISING:

https://www.twitch.tv/professorchill/

 

[kinre]

well alot of people already say what they want from  amateur developer  and hope they don't do a Ambitious project that they can't complete .

but my Q  is that ,don't you all want to see a good h game that got good pic and good story?

 

i understand that there is too many bad and too little good h game but  in the end is all about how interesting the game are  to you .

 

to me the big problem with amateur developer is that they can't give good pic (drawing/3d). too many developer they just want to make a text game and nothing near to jap h-game.  so i will say most amateur developer didn't even touch the harder part yet. the image part is always very hard to every developer.

 

when i make my H-novel game , the harder part is really to make the game feel nice and full of detail,  and not throwing anything inside the game and  all about sex sex sex.   compare  to   Monster Girl Quest or any other good game, there must be a good story and the sex is just a side thing.

too many amateur developer make the game is just all about sex , the world  turn around sex. and there lack the feeling of a good story. you don't feel sad for the char, or don't even fuck care if they got fuck up or anything.    

but i guess some people just like h-game that just all about sex. but to me too boring.  

 

so to make it simple what i hope to see in a h-game, is to have a good pic and the world in the story does not turn because of sex. give a reason why is there a have sex scene .

 

 

 

[Benn82]

well alot of people already say what they want from  amateur developer  and hope they don't do a Ambitious project that they can't complete .

but my Q  is that ,don't you all want to see a good h game that got good pic and good story?

 

I want to explain the "Don't be ambitious!" mean.

 

1. How many pervert Gamer like you in your inner circle ? ... possible answer = nearly non-existence.

-> This is for normal people, us.

 

2. How many pervert Developer that you know, AND who agreeing to work with your project ? ... possible answer = finding needle in a Lava Bed.

-> You can only making S-Games by your own, single-handedly.

- - - - - -

In real life, if you working alone, 24 hours per day is so short for developing a project, it don't add so much significant progress to it. 30 days later, it's only add a little progression to the project.

{UNLESS, you already had your own WORKING SYSTEM. If programmer - you have a ready to go script library. Also no wandering & Idling for ideas.}

- - - - - -

In real life, you have needs and obligation to be fulfill, and it need money to be spend. If you have main Job already, means you are okay paying your need and obligation, but it also means, you are less time working with your project, slower progression.

If the project is your main job, means you need other source of income. Either it money allowance from parents or donation.

- - - - - -

Games (Patreon) Donator need result, not small progression, they want significant result per 1~3 months. Because of this, developer must work so hard to satisfy the "fans". They put more efforts into the project. But this will come a hefty price to pay ... people had limitation.

 

Working hard days and nights, eventually they will meet to Burn Out state. Either their mentality or their physical condition. Even worse, if they stuck for ideas. Quality of work are diminishing, target deadline are slacking.

- - - - - -

This problem can be avoided, if you have a decent number of partner in your Development team. OR, if you set your game simple.

As a Pervert gamer, I do want to play a perfect S-Games. But as critics, I don't like with this shoddy situation in S-Games development's history.

[kinre]

@Benn82

 

in the end all you are saying is that is that making game is hard . and making alone is very hard and slow, and people who donator don't want slow game but they want fast game.

 

but in the end the problem from what i see is that  you don't like a game is not complete.

 

making the game alone or with a team make no diff,the only diff is the speed. in the end when making anything it will take time, and you must plan how much time it will take , if you can't do a good planing , it just simple mean you are not as skill as you though you are.

but for player the only thing that matter is if the game is complete state when  releases .

 

although  i must say your worry is understandable because there is just too many game that make too slow or stop  .  but in the end for developer when making game is all about their skill and exp  and not speed/time .  but for player is just about speed and time.

 

in the end making anything take time, skill,exp. but there is too many developer want easy money. and people not happy with it.

 

 

(As a Pervert gamer, I do want to play a perfect S-Games. But as critics, I don't like with this shoddy situation in S-Games development's history.)

well in human history , human have prove that they will do anything for money.

to me game that is bad is as good as a not complete game. that why i hope for better game.

 

there is no way for development to improve their skill or exp beside doing it. making less thing or simple does not really help them to improve their skill or exp. the only way is to fail .

[KibaLarnia]

Make it better. Make the best Game you can Imagine instead of criticizing from the off.

Gn8

[kinre]

Make it better. Make the best Game you can Imagine instead of criticizing from the off.

Gn8

 

i think the point that why people are criticizing amateur game is because they ask for money. and not because of the game it self.

and most game developer will ask for money when they only make little thing. if the game is free i don't think many people will criticizing it. and that the problem and that what we are talking about.

 

and i do understand that you not happy that, why people are criticizing game and not make it our self,  but  criticizing will always be there just the same as people need money .  and those developer already used to it, and if they are not they shouldn't have ask for money.

[windpl]

Asking for money is ok, but there has to be value to it. And recent patreon outburst is just sill, they just sell stuff there. Insted of supporting author, his idea you just buying access to a game, which is silly.

[KibaLarnia]

There are many factors. Lots of Game Developers work for free and don't expect any Money. Some amateurs try it and do the best they can...

But somet Players are jerks. Behaving like:

They get a 1 Dollar for free and instead of beeing thankful they start getting mad and expect 1000 Bucks... and please put it into their Pocket.

[Benn82]

As the OP of this thread, basically what I want to say to S-Games developers are this.

1. You can asking money all you want, we want quality.

2. You know that we were thinking with our penis-brain when seeing your game, even when became your patron.

3. But after a fap or two ... we will back to our common-sense. This when we will re-evaluate your games in a clear mind.

4. If we found out that you are a scam, OR, lazy developer ... we'll switch to became an angry-pervert ... and that is more dangerous than an Angry Bird.

 

Important Note : Some people don't care to buy +$150 DoA 5 (+DLC) when know that they will get super awesome nude mods. When it's about S-Games (S=Sexy or Sex), we put aside our logic and let our penis-brain take control. We don't care at all how much money we will spent on it. But as I said above, eventually we will back to our common sense. So it's better for S-Games developer to make a good game with a lot of efforts, and you are valid to ask a lot of money for your works. Not many good and advance S-Games, you guys are like Messiah for us, the Perverts. But if you were proven to be a false Prophet (aka Scammer or lazy dev but asking a lot of money), we won't hesitant to drag your ass and behead you in public (in S-Games modding & Forum community).

[Benn82]

Call me late, I just subscribe to IdubbbzTv recently and watching his Kickstarter Crap show.

It's seem, not only amateur games developer doesn't know the real deal of making games, they also don't know how to calculate their expenditure projection.

No wonder many of Patreon Projects were in complicated situation. It's not just X-Games, but to all genre and ratings.

There has to be many projects still live, but their incompetence of management and coordination (financial and target assignment) became the major problem that hinder them to finish the game.

 

Plus my past experience as 3D Animator's slave worker and now in learning game coding ... 3 months per update release is a very tight schedule, even if they were pro, but most of these Developers are soloist and amateur. Wow ... the more I learn the reality, the more I'm skeptical to the Patreon Projects.

 

And as I probably realize it late than most of you ... Patreon became the new Kickstarter.

As Kickstarter had limit days of pledge, Patreon had none, as limitless time of pledges. This is more dangerous than before !

 

(I need to review to all of my Patreon supporting, again and again, call me late, but better learn late than keep getting fooled. I have to start using my head brain and stop using my penis brain. )