Body by race AND clothing by body- a discussion thread

[Bromm83]

There is allready a body by race mod out wich seems great. But I want there to be a body by race mod that also places the right clothes on the different bodytypes. And it is quite possible to do it!

 

What would we need?

- Permission from all authors of the major bodytypes.

- We need to decide wich races uses wich bodies.

- Non-replacer versions of vanilla armors for all body types, with permisson from authors.

 

This is not somethign I am going to do anytime soon, I would just like to put the idea up here for either the author of the current body by race mod or someone else to be able to pick up.

 

Once you hae decided wich races uses wich bodies, you can just have a look at helmets under armors to see how you could add different armor models for every armor to different races.

 

The idea is quite simple, but the workload is rather large...

 

I really hope someone does this since I would really love to have this possibility.

 

As addons to this you could add different armor replacers, with permission from authors AND the most important part: Any replacer has to have a model for every single bodytype that gets added!

 

You could also set up a shop to actually use all the different standalone armors that are made and sell them from there where you would have one merchant for every race, or just tag all the clothes by wich race is supported by the armor...

 

So pretty please to someone with more free time on their hands!

[dreamtourist]

Copy&Paste reply for the same question/request.

 

 

 

 

Okay so I'm hopeful that this mod can solve a huge problem. That is' date=' using certain armors retextures for specific races. I'm using UNP for all elves, CBBE for Imperials and Bretons, 4rB for Nords (and all males), and CHSBHC for Orcs.

 

Playing around with this to see which make the most sense from an immersion perspective. I tried your mod and gave up due to the loli issues. The 4RB guy made a plugin that separates each body type out and it works great. However I'd like to use your armor mod so that I can have UNP retexts for my elve's armor, CHSBHC armor for orcs and all barmaids, and Killer Keos skimpy for the imperials and Bretons.

 

Does your CustomArmor.esp function indipendently and if so, how do i use it? Where do I put the different armors?

[/quote']

 

-I suggest you read the CustomArmor changelog to understand what it really does.

 

Okay. Read it. If I understand correctly, your mod does not do what i hoped it did, namely rendering custom armors to match the body type assigned for a race. Killer Keos made a great skimpy set for Cbbe and there's a derivitive set that works with cherry's bod, but so far I have not found a way that I can have both of those in game and only appearing on the bodies that match them as assigned by your mod. So since I'm using UNP for elves, if an elf puts on a CHSBHC optimized armor, the body mesh changes and the body texture stays UNP, which looks terrible. I hope someone and come up with as solution.

 

It should be possible by opening the armor in the CK, double clik the model (Lower right corner, to the left of the script part) in the right cornerish (will open the armoraddon for the armor), here you can select wich races can use that model. Then you can make an alternative model and select the other races that would use that model..

 

This will not scale the model to the body per se, but will lett you have different models for different races.

If you open ArmorAddon you can create new ones (example for dragonscale):

Current Model: DragonplateCuirassAA

Make new ones called DragonplateCuirassAANord and so on... In those you just select the race you want to use that model (link to where you place it) and then you can add these in the armor again, remember to remove the one currently there. This should force Skyrim to place different models on different races.

 

Disclaimer: I have not tried to do this since I run a completely unmodded game thus far, but it looks viable in the CK...

 

 

EDIT:

 

I just saw that the game allready does this with helmets, so it is a viable way to do it.

 

Only problem is that if you were to make a mod do it all races would need a set body from the start, not a open system like here where you can pick and choose wich bodytype you want to use on each race.

 

 

How to achieve what you want:

-In the data/meshes/ folder, make alternate folders for you race's armor/clothes.

-Chuck all the vanila version nifs in there.

-Overwrite those with the modded versions you want your race to use.

 

-Open Custom Armor in CK

-Goto Armor

-Open one of them(ARMO), double click it's ARMA/model.

-In the ARMA, change the race at the top to the one your making a custom Armor&Clothing set for.

-In the rightside column, remove all but the vampire version of that race.

-Change the location of the used nif for male/female to where you've placed the race's version of the armor/colthes.

-Rename the new ARMA, click OK and save it.

-In the same ARMO, change the race at the top to the one your editing.

-Delete the default ARMA it uses.

-Add the new one you made.

-Click OK and save the ARMO.

 

-Rinse and Repeat for every Armor/Clothing you want separated for that race.

 

Unfortunately, I won't be doing this anytime soon for my mod.

Since, I'm perfectly happy using Caliente's body with Cherry's BBB and their versions of the armors.

 

Anyone with the motivation to see the work done, is welcome to use my mod as a base to start off on.

Have Fun Modding.

And don't forget to "play" Skyrim!

[lumenbeing]

Okay cool. So now this has its own topic. My thinking is that it is unrealistic to expect someone designing armor replacers to make one for every "established" body. In fact it is unreasonable to insist that such a mod rigidly force a particular body mod to a particular race. I might want think curvy orcs and someone else might want super lean and ripped orcs. So in my view, such a mod has to build on the existing body by race work where the user can pick the bodies they want for each race.

 

What I would like to see is the ability to have armor folders that coincide with each race, but with a fallback to the vanilla. People are spending a lot of time, making some great armor replacers for many of the alt body meshes. CBBE has a comprehensive set, UNP is getting lots of love and TNT has its whole closed system thing going on. One guy is reworking all the KK skimpies for CHSBHC. And those are all great. But there are tons of one-off replacers that you may want to use instead. Some of them you may think they are ridiculous and want to remove one in favor of the vanilla.

 

I suspect there will be some major issues with faces matching bodies and that will force the end user to carefully select which ones they include in they personal collection, but going the route Bromme suggests just seems wrong to me.

 

 

[Bromm83]

Okay cool. So now this has its own topic. My thinking is that it is unrealistic to expect someone designing armor replacers to make one for every "established" body. In fact it is unreasonable to insist that such a mod rigidly force a particular body mod to a particular race. I might want think curvy orcs and someone else might want super lean and ripped orcs. So in my view' date=' such a mod has to build on the existing body by race work where the user can pick the bodies they want for each race.

 

What I would like to see is the ability to have armor folders that coincide with each race, but with a fallback to the vanilla. People are spending a lot of time, making some great armor replacers for many of the alt body meshes. CBBE has a comprehensive set, UNP is getting lots of love and TNT has its whole closed system thing going on. One guy is reworking all the KK skimpies for CHSBHC. And those are all great. But there are tons of one-off replacers that you may want to use instead. Some of them you may think they are ridiculous and want to remove one in favor of the vanilla.

 

I suspect there will be some major issues with faces matching bodies and that will force the end user to carefully select which ones they include in they personal collection, but going the route Bromme suggests just seems wrong to me.

 

 

[/quote']

 

I totally agree with you that having the option to pick everything yourself would be the best way to go, but at the moment I just don't see any easy way to do it. If you want the armor to use different models for different body types, you can easily do this in the CK if you have a set bodytype for each race. If you don't use different models for each bodytype you will end up with them looking all the same anyways, and then a body by race mod is only useful if the NPCs are nude.

 

As to the vanilla replacers:

- each body mod mostly have replacers for vanilla clothes, those can be used it doesn't all have to look the same.

- Standalone replacers can also be added as alternative downloads wich you then will have to overwrite the files in the main pack. You just can't download a standalone replacer without having it only use that model for the race that use the bodytype it is made for.

 

And in the end not everyone will be happy with wich races get wich bodytypes, but that's life.. The alternative would be to make a mod for every possible configuration wich would just be too much work to make and maintain.

 

So until som wiz scripter comes along and gives us a small script that does all this wrk automaticly this is the only way I see to have an actual body by race using the current bodytypes.

 

You can also make a new bodytype that is similar enough that they can all use the same clothes and then make clothes for them..

 

[badcock]

Bromm83,

I'm glad you started this topic. It took me a while to get to sleep last night as I mulled this topic over and over. I've only been playing a week or so concepts and file structures are still somewhat new.

 

This is what I was thinking last night. Tell me if I'm on the right track. This is the basic concept:

 

1. Create a new race for each body type (e.g. UNP, CHSBHC, CBBE, TNT, etc)

2. Create a race appropriate character folder in Meshes and drop the UNP meshes into this folder

3. Create a race appropriate character folder in Textures and drop the UNP textures into this folder

4. Create race appropriate armor and clothing folders in meshes and place all (or select) the UNP created armors in these folders

5. Create race appropriate armor and clothing folders in textures and place all (or select) textures for the current UNP armor/clothing into these folders

 

Then if someone wanted the UNP body for Breton, they could copy the folders and rename the "UNP" folders to "Breton" folders?

 

Then I read somewhere that the NIF files may have to be modified because they point to the texture files.

 

I'm willing to help. I just need to get further up the learning curve.

[lumenbeing]

Bromm you may have misunderstood me. Have you used any of the unique bodies mods? Use of those mod requires you (the end user) to put your preferred body meshes in separate folders by race. I'm calling for a mod that will require the same amount of leg work from the end user with regards to armor. So if you have Imperials and ONLY imperials using CBBE v2, then you would have an armor folder within the imperial folders (mesh and texture) where you have Keos's skimpy armor and any other CBBE armors you like.

Rinse and repeat for each race that uses a different body mesh. So when an NPC is of a certain race, Imperial for example, your game looks for the armor they are wearing in the armor folder within their races's folder. If its not there, it would use the Vanilla armor. Some of the custom body meshes out there are made to look good under Vanilla armor. For the ones that don't, just start filling up your folder as the content comes out, or make your own.

I think having a mod like this would actually encourage a lot more armor retexting and most importantly, keep the fresh new body meshes coming. You don't want to stifle innovation by creating something that enforces a "standard" set.

[lumenbeing]

Bromm83' date='

I'm glad you started this topic. It took me a while to get to sleep last night as I mulled this topic over and over. I've only been playing a week or so concepts and file structures are still somewhat new.

 

This is what I was thinking last night. Tell me if I'm on the right track. This is the basic concept:

 

1. Create a new race for each body type (e.g. UNP, CHSBHC, CBBE, TNT, etc)

2. Create a race appropriate character folder in Meshes and drop the UNP meshes into this folder

3. Create a race appropriate character folder in Textures and drop the UNP textures into this folder

4. Create race appropriate armor and clothing folders in meshes and place all (or select) the UNP created armors in these folders

5. Create race appropriate armor and clothing folders in textures and place all (or select) textures for the current UNP armor/clothing into these folders

 

Then if someone wanted the UNP body for Breton, they could copy the folders and rename the "UNP" folders to "Breton" folders?

 

Then I read somewhere that the NIF files may have to be modified because they point to the texture files.

 

I'm willing to help. I just need to get further up the learning curve.

[/quote']

 

This sounds fine except for the first bit about creating custom races. We need this to work for the Vanilla races so NPCs will have variety. That's kind of the point.

[Vitriks]

I have a total noob suggestion. Why it wouldn't be easier just write the different path for skin textures? So body with supported armor would link to the supported texture not the default one.

[Nalim]

because bodyshaders have forced texture locations; if something uses the bodyshader it will always point to the location of the .dds textures of the body armor item of that race.

 

It's the same reason that we couldn't have several bodymeshes before ck as we at that point only had one option for texure location.

[Bromm83]

I am a bloody idiot... The files all have the same names no matter what body they are made for, so all can be controlled by folder structure as you mentioned above... That makes it even easier... Then you would just need to make a mod pointing to a file structure and let the player add whatever they want to ad to those folders! I blae me being sleepy for not seeing this earlier... I was thinking that all the replacer mods were overwriting stuff in the CK, why would I think that? I am usually nt such a bloody moron... I hope at least.

 

Well then, that made it even more easy. Someone want to do this?

[Azuredragoon]

I posted about this a while back I think...

 

Really, imo, how it needs to go is for the elves to go from skinny to average and the human/khajiit to go from average to muscular, and the argonians also going average to muscular but with entirely flat chests for the ladies.

 

And when I say muscular I don't mean female body builder on steroids but a more fantasy she-hulk/power girl sort of muscular.

[badcock]

I am a bloody idiot... The files all have the same names no matter what body they are made for' date=' so all can be controlled by folder structure as you mentioned above... That makes it even easier... Then you would just need to make a mod pointing to a file structure and let the player add whatever they want to ad to those folders! I blae me being sleepy for not seeing this earlier... I was thinking that all the replacer mods were overwriting stuff in the CK, why would I think that? I am usually nt such a bloody moron... I hope at least.

 

Well then, that made it even more easy. Someone want to do this?

[/quote']

 

Using DreamTourist'c CustomBody.esp as a starting point, I am making decent progress. I've learned a lot in the last day or so, but still have more to go. I hopefully will have some screen shots up later.

[Nalim]

I posted about this a while back I think...

 

Really' date=' imo, how it needs to go is for the elves to go from skinny to average and the human/khajiit to go from average to muscular, and the argonians also going average to muscular but with entirely flat chests for the ladies.

 

And when I say muscular I don't mean female body builder on steroids but a more fantasy she-hulk/power girl sort of muscular.

[/quote']

 

My argonians will have tits coming out of their tets. The body by race mod alows you to do it according to your personal tastes which makes it awesome, if there is a version of an armor for each bodymodel you are using it would be nice if the bodymesh type of a particular mesh made that race point to a particular armorversion. That way you dont need to force people to use a particualr bodymodel for a particular race. Customization options feel like the main idea of a mod like this so deciding what race has what bodytype for the user kills a lot of the point.

[badcock]

 

 

 

 

Both of these have the weight set to max. I was moving meshes around so much I forgot which ones I placed where, but I believe the Breton is the UNP mesh. The High Elf on the right is a custom CBBE Super Silly Huge mesh.

 

Still have more to learn yet.

 

[Edit] - Actually I think the body on the left is CBBE thin and not UNP.

[badcock]

The attached file will set the female Breton body to UNP. I have uploaded here for those who wish to test it.

 

Look at the folder structure before loading. It should not overwrite any files. It contains the UNP mesh and textures in the defined folders.

 

Feedback is appreciated.

 

 

[lumenbeing]

I am a bloody idiot... The files all have the same names no matter what body they are made for' date=' so all can be controlled by folder structure as you mentioned above... That makes it even easier... Then you would just need to make a mod pointing to a file structure and let the player add whatever they want to ad to those folders! I blae me being sleepy for not seeing this earlier... I was thinking that all the replacer mods were overwriting stuff in the CK, why would I think that? I am usually nt such a bloody moron... I hope at least.

 

Well then, that made it even more easy. Someone want to do this?

[/quote']

 

Exactly. Not sure if Dreamtourist or Windflower's mod would make the best starting point. I'm not entirely sure how they are different. My guess is that Wildflower's is a little more fleshed out for beast races and males http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/downloads/file.php?id=5968

 

There are already two derivitive works based on it. "4RB Unique Bodies"

http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/downloads/file.php?id=6667

and "Unique Beast Races"

http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/downloads/file.php?id=6041

 

But I think dreamtourist has made more progress towards the unique armor part...

 

 

[DocClox]

This would be a good starting point for a Skyrim Community Resources mod (as proposed by Halstrom) a while back.

 

We can have leveled lists, or arrays of objects bound to a global quest, or whatever works best with Skyrim, and keep per-body lists of clothing. So if we have an outfit that fits all body types, then you can use any body you want. And if the outfit isn't available then you get to use the next body your list of preferred body types (and maybe slider settings) until you find a body that does have a version of the outfit or (worst case) end up with a vanilla body.

 

Not without a vested interest here: I'd love for the Slavers' Guild to be able to change the girls looks to suit the occasion. Possibly including unfeasibly large mammaries.

[badcock]

PM me if you want to test the mapping of Bretons to UNP. I have permission to redistribute a WIP version (and thats all it is) with the meshes and textures in different folders.

[itt1968]

WOW.. this sounds so freakn awesome.... Though I can see nord females with huge boobs cause of there size, elves IMO just dont look ryt with huge tits... UNP skinny or cbbe slim, yes. Im using UNP skinny with my breton vamp and I think its purrrrfect!