How would I add HDT to werewolves?

[Gayton Kerslut]

SoS has it's werewolves now and I was thinking about learning how to mod for HDT to do something about the werewolf junk; fun learning project for the weekend and something I'd like to carry out myself.

 

Issue is finding resources is difficult. What tutorials would be relevant to me?

[blabba]

All the info is here on the forums you need to get setup.

 

Dunno why you would do this for werewolves though? B3lisario added SOS schlongs to werewolves in the newest updates.

 

But here's a good knowledge bomb post made by Yoo: http://www.loverslab.com/topic/26543-alphaempire-coat-formerly-some-random-shitty-test/?p=701199

[Gayton Kerslut]

All the info is here on the forums you need to get setup.

 

Dunno why you would do this for werewolves though? B3lisario added SOS schlongs to werewolves in the newest updates.

 

But here's a good knowledge bomb post made by Yoo: http://www.loverslab.com/topic/26543-alphaempire-coat-formerly-some-random-shitty-test/?p=701199

 

adding physics to the werewolf schlongs? why wouldn't I want to do it for the werewolves

[jacques00]

If you are using the latest SoS Full, you should have werewolf schlongs (or rather, werewolves should be schlongified)--and from what I'm aware, they should be using SoS's own Havok'd physics. I don't use Full, so I can't really confirm.

 

I had experimented a little with HDT-linked schlongs in a futa thread somewhere in the forum (I don't remember which topic), using the SoS bone chain. The only disadvantage you would have with HDT wieners is that their physics will always be constant--meaning if you make a flaccid member, it'll always be flaccid. While the behavior files may play and the penis will animate, the bones' HDT physics motions will go on top of the SoS ones, resulting in some weird looking erections. Else, if you remove SoS's behavior link in the .nif and keep the HDT link, you'll have your desired physics movements, but no SoS-related interactions would be possible (unless you do a swapping mesh method, where each .nif will have it's own unique HDT link; as well as needing an .esp and/or script to handle the mesh swapping). From what I've experimented with, HDT movement looks okay (though it could have been tweaked for better performance) but I preferred the motion of SoS. It would be could if the SoS movement could swap out with HDT upon actor death though--I think it looks great while falling. If I were to revisit applying both HDT and SoS again, I would probably consider making the HDT link apply to the scrotum, and leave the shaft behavior to SoS (that might be a good balance).

 

I have made another kit-bashed mod/resource using werewolves that does implement HDT (for females) and SoS-Light (for males) if you want to fiddle around with those assets. I'll get to posting it soon.

[blabba]

If you are using the latest SoS Full, you should have werewolf schlongs (or rather, werewolves should be schlongified)--and from what I'm aware, they should be using SoS's own Havok'd physics. I don't use Full, so I can't really confirm.

 

I had experimented a little with HDT-linked schlongs in a futa thread somewhere in the forum (I don't remember which topic), using the SoS bone chain. The only disadvantage you would have with HDT wieners is that their physics will always be constant--meaning if you make a flaccid member, it'll always be flaccid. While the behavior files may play and the penis will animate, the bones' HDT physics motions will go on top of the SoS ones, resulting in some weird looking erections. Else, if you remove SoS's behavior link in the .nif and keep the HDT link, you'll have your desired physics movements, but no SoS-related interactions would be possible.

 

 

xD, The easier solution around this is make a new bone exclusively for HDT to control, that bone would link to the original SOS bone that is in the rig map and still be controlled by SOS animations.

 

Of course, you'd have to paint each bone appropriately. RomeoZero's hdt penis xml is good, and with Groovtama's new skelly with the added HDT skelly schlong bones and some custom weight paints, you can get HDT Flaccid AND SOS erections with collision detection. This is probably the best way to go about interacting with a future HDT contolled vagina as well.

[jacques00]

 

 

If you are using the latest SoS Full, you should have werewolf schlongs (or rather, werewolves should be schlongified)--and from what I'm aware, they should be using SoS's own Havok'd physics. I don't use Full, so I can't really confirm.

 

I had experimented a little with HDT-linked schlongs in a futa thread somewhere in the forum (I don't remember which topic), using the SoS bone chain. The only disadvantage you would have with HDT wieners is that their physics will always be constant--meaning if you make a flaccid member, it'll always be flaccid. While the behavior files may play and the penis will animate, the bones' HDT physics motions will go on top of the SoS ones, resulting in some weird looking erections. Else, if you remove SoS's behavior link in the .nif and keep the HDT link, you'll have your desired physics movements, but no SoS-related interactions would be possible.

 

 

 

xD, The easier solution around this is make a new bone exclusively for HDT to control, that bone would link to the original SOS bone that is in the rig map and still be controlled by SOS animations.

 

Of course, you'd have to paint each bone appropriately. RomeoZero's hdt penis xml is good, and with Groovtama's new skelly with the added HDT skelly schlong bones and some custom weight paints, you can get HDT Flaccid AND SOS erections with collision detection. This is probably the best way to go about interacting with a future HDT contolled vagina as well.

 

 

Wait, which bones will be bound to the mesh? If it's only the SoS bone chain, then you really don't need to repaint (assuming the bones have not been moved from their bound state). If it's only HDT (and you have the same number of HDT bones as SoS, in the same position, etc.), you can just rename the bone names on the .nif mesh. If you mean bone bone chains influencing the mesh, then that might be easier said than done--I can only see weird things happening here.

 

As for how the bones are nested--I see how parenting it properly may allow the desired effect, but both are running two different ways and it really depends on the movement you are shooting for, really. Like it will work best when no HDT rotations are involved, but sliding up-down/in-out may be more plausable (jiggly wieners). But like, if you want HDT flaccid and SOS erections with collision detection--I'm imagining it wouldn't perform as expected, but I guess I'll have to see how it actually works to know.

 

[blabba]

 

Wait, which bones will be bound to the mesh? If it's only the SoS bone chain, then you really don't need to repaint (assuming the bones have not been moved from their bound state). If it's only HDT (and you have the same number of HDT bones as SoS, in the same position, etc.), you can just rename the bone names on the .nif mesh. If you mean bone bone chains influencing the mesh, then that might be easier said than done--I can only see weird things happening here.

 

As for how the bones are nested--I see how parenting it properly may allow the desired effect, but both are running two different ways and it really depends on the movement you are shooting for, really. Like it will work best when no HDT rotations are involved, but sliding up-down/in-out may be more plausable (jiggly wieners). But like, if you want HDT flaccid and SOS erections with collision detection--I'm imagining it wouldn't perform as expected, but I guess I'll have to see how it actually works to know.

 

 

O.o, you have me confused xD

 

Hmm, basically trying to get the collision effect for SOS schlong and maybe a bit of bounce for the balls. You can take a look at groovtama's skelly in the HDT vag thread, it has the new Schlong HDT Bones.

 

I don't really see a problem with setting it up this way, when I pushed forth with Project Flesh using this same idea/system it seems to work fine, the arms still flex and move correctly in animations but with some added jiggle from HDT and whatnot. The only problem is getting the correct collision capsule data, though I think I just recently figured that out in 3DSMax.

 

As long as I setup the collision filters correctly to ONLY collide with hands,vag,and the rest of the penis it should be fine.... I think...

 

edit: I'd have 2 bone chains to painted to the mesh, the biggest reasson why this setup will work better is because Animation weights are not good weights for Physics. Usually you never want to go above .3-.4 (from hours of personal testing) otherwise movement becomes way too twitchy and trying to compensate for it in the Physics equation side of things will introduce other problems, so it's best to have a smooth consistent weight (so the RB's pull on the schlong equally in collision) and then just tweak the physics stuff from their.

 

[Gayton Kerslut]

If you are using the latest SoS Full, you should have werewolf schlongs (or rather, werewolves should be schlongified)--and from what I'm aware, they should be using SoS's own Havok'd physics. I don't use Full, so I can't really confirm.

 

I had experimented a little with HDT-linked schlongs in a futa thread somewhere in the forum (I don't remember which topic), using the SoS bone chain. The only disadvantage you would have with HDT wieners is that their physics will always be constant--meaning if you make a flaccid member, it'll always be flaccid. While the behavior files may play and the penis will animate, the bones' HDT physics motions will go on top of the SoS ones, resulting in some weird looking erections. Else, if you remove SoS's behavior link in the .nif and keep the HDT link, you'll have your desired physics movements, but no SoS-related interactions would be possible (unless you do a swapping mesh method, where each .nif will have it's own unique HDT link; as well as needing an .esp and/or script to handle the mesh swapping). From what I've experimented with, HDT movement looks okay (though it could have been tweaked for better performance) but I preferred the motion of SoS. It would be could if the SoS movement could swap out with HDT upon actor death though--I think it looks great while falling. If I were to revisit applying both HDT and SoS again, I would probably consider making the HDT link apply to the scrotum, and leave the shaft behavior to SoS (that might be a good balance).

 

I have made another kit-bashed mod/resource using werewolves that does implement HDT (for females) and SoS-Light (for males) if you want to fiddle around with those assets. I'll get to posting it soon.

 

Well I have the mod there purely to remove the ken doll look of the werewolves, although SoS doesn't use physics as such.... its sort of a lag between when the character animates and when the schlong position updates. Creates an impression of a subtle swinging motion. If the schlong and balls flopped about properly like HDT can do then it would serve it's purpose better.

 

I dunno; if you release such a thing then I'd be even happier. Do you have a steam account? I'd like to defer to someone who knows what they're doing in real time while I try and learn this stuff. I create textures and models at most but I'd like to be able to do more things with them!

[b00marrows]

I have attempted to attach HDT to schlong's before, but that was when I knew nothing... I'm not even sure what bones to attach it to...

[jacques00]

 

 

 

Wait, which bones will be bound to the mesh? If it's only the SoS bone chain, then you really don't need to repaint (assuming the bones have not been moved from their bound state). If it's only HDT (and you have the same number of HDT bones as SoS, in the same position, etc.), you can just rename the bone names on the .nif mesh. If you mean bone bone chains influencing the mesh, then that might be easier said than done--I can only see weird things happening here.

 

As for how the bones are nested--I see how parenting it properly may allow the desired effect, but both are running two different ways and it really depends on the movement you are shooting for, really. Like it will work best when no HDT rotations are involved, but sliding up-down/in-out may be more plausable (jiggly wieners). But like, if you want HDT flaccid and SOS erections with collision detection--I'm imagining it wouldn't perform as expected, but I guess I'll have to see how it actually works to know.

 

 

 

O.o, you have me confused xD

 

Hmm, basically trying to get the collision effect for SOS schlong and maybe a bit of bounce for the balls. You can take a look at groovtama's skelly in the HDT vag thread, it has the new Schlong HDT Bones.

 

I don't really see a problem with setting it up this way, when I pushed forth with Project Flesh using this same idea/system it seems to work fine, the arms still flex and move correctly in animations but with some added jiggle from HDT and whatnot. The only problem is getting the correct collision capsule data, though I think I just recently figured that out in 3DSMax.

 

As long as I setup the collision filters correctly to ONLY collide with hands,vag,and the rest of the penis it should be fine.... I think...

 

edit: I'd have 2 bone chains to painted to the mesh, the biggest reasson why this setup will work better is because Animation weights are not good weights for Physics. Usually you never want to go above .3-.4 (from hours of personal testing) otherwise movement becomes way too twitchy and trying to compensate for it in the Physics equation side of things will introduce other problems, so it's best to have a smooth consistent weight (so the RB's pull on the schlong equally in collision) and then just tweak the physics stuff from their.

 

 

Sorry for the confusion but I'm thinking more on a specific basis--I'll try to illustrate it with words the best I can...  D :

 

Well, that's the thing, Project Flesh is a little different than what I'm referring to since we are talking about animating a penis, not jiggling muscles/fat, or flowing hair/clothes/fur. I assume you want to maintain the rigid animation of the penis and it's just not possible to have key'd animation at the same time with a dynamic setup--unless you have an animation controller to blend between the two (a la Batman's cape in the Arkham games). When you choose dynamics, you are most likely wanting jiggle movement (thus I mentioned "jiggly" wieners), or hinge/spring/axle-type movement (a flaccid wiener)--but if you want it specifically to go from limp to erect, that requires some keyed animation (what SoS currently has).

 

And yes, I am aware that the faux-physics that SoS uses are by way of "Lag Bones", it will still conflict with the dynamic movement (HDT Physics)--and it would look real awkward no matter how well you paint weight it (especially if both bone chains are affecting that one tubular shape--the phallus), primarily because both move in two entirely different ways. And while yes, if you parent the bone chains a certain way, you can get a good effect, but it will come down to what movement you want (and I'm predicting that unless you can blend between the two kind of animations, flaccid to erect with both HDT and SOS would be  pretty hard to pull off).

 

Ideally, you would want one bone chain to attach to the mesh--whatever that bone chain does, you see it reflected on the mesh. And if the game engine can handle it and we have developers on it, we would need an animation engine to blend between two or more bone chains. So essentially we have three bone chains: one for the mesh to bind to, one for keyed animation, and one for dynamic animations. The animation engine would parent the bound bone chain to the keyed chain for one value, say 0, and then parent itself to the dynamic bone chain for another value, say 1. Then, when triggered (through script or what have you), the engine will blend the bound chain between the two bone chains and we can get what we want--the best of both.

 

But unfortunately, we don't have that. And judging by the .nif file extension, I am very doubtful that can even support parenting constraints, much less animation blending (last I was aware, GameBryo uses .nif files and a friend of mine who had to use that in grad school say it doesn't support parent constraints). I am blaming it on the reason that the files use a nested-array type structure than a node-based structure, where that kind of animation technique is easier to support.

 

Aside from that technicality--you can better use HDT for the collisions, but definitely not the movement (for the shaft anyway, the testes is okay, because jiggles and all that jazz), but again it really depends on the type of movement.

[blabba]

O.o

 

you may be right, can't say I have much experience in animating and HDT stuff.

 

Guess I won't know/understand the problem you illustrate until I try it out myself and see what happens

[Gayton Kerslut]

I feel dumb, all I wanted was jiggly werewolf bits! I don't understand this XD

[b00marrows]

Well i finally managed to get HDT "working" on a schlong (I'm a futa fan so no balls attached here....)

 

When I say "working" I mean I got it to be solid, ignoring the stupidly deforming/ugly/off-putting lag bones.

the next step is to set up limits/motors, which i will not be doing.

 

good things is I learned something new and i'm going to try and fix my tail with the new knowledge.

 

I have attached the .XML, have fun!

HDTSchlong.xml

[Redflyingmonkey]

Well i finally managed to get HDT "working" on a schlong (I'm a futa fan so no balls attached here....)

 

When I say "working" I mean I got it to be solid, ignoring the stupidly deforming/ugly/off-putting lag bones.

the next step is to set up limits/motors, which i will not be doing.

 

good things is I learned something new and i'm going to try and fix my tail with the new knowledge.

 

I have attached the .XML, have fun!

Dude you sure like playing with tails don't cha ?