Growing Torpedo Boobs!? A Skeletal Solution...?

[Demonwise]

Ok, so for all the folks that have used the pregnancy mods that are out on the community, you will know what I am talking about. When you set your boobs to grow via skeletal nodes and interesting side effect occurs. While you certainly get bigger boobs they become far more 'torpedo' like rather than actually getting bigger. This effect is actually quite hysterical when a gal with a body weight of 0-20 has her boobs grow by a factor of 3. They become quite long and pointed. Like two jiggly traffic cones stuck on her chest. From my limited understanding of skeletons in the game I am assuming that this is because the breast bone node is getting pulled farther and farther away from the skeleton as it is expanding? I could be wrong, as I said very little knowledge as to how that works. My thought though is that could a skilled modder create a skeleton that has multiple breast bone nodes. There would be the primary nodes that are already existent on the skeleton but then there could be secondary nodes that would be used for other factors of the breast. Perhaps they would allow for side to side movement of the boobs? Primarily, I thought with more bones in the boobs or nodes that were at different angles away from the skeleton when a pregnancy mod or any mod that increases the size of boobs does its thing then the boobs would be able to grow more naturally, both forward away from the chest as they do now but also outward via the sides and bottom. Picture it this way, perhaps with more nodes on a skeleton, breast enlargement would look more like the same progression as the breast slider in the Bodyslide programs, a nice smooth increase in bust. 

 

So long story short is such a skeleton possible and would anyone care to actually endeavor to make one? I don't have the slightest understanding of how to do so, so I would not be a good choice for making this.

[jbezorg]

I think the skeletal hierarchy is the cause of this. It's on my to-do list for Estrus Chaurus.

Using the left Breast as an example:

• Node "NPC L Breast" has the node "NPC L Breast01" attached to it. ( i.e. "NPC L Breast01" is a child node "NPC L Breast" in the skeletal hierarchy )
• "NPC L Breast" controls the size.
• "NPC L Breast01" controls the pointy/perkeyness
• As "NPC L Breast" (size) is scaled up, "NPC L Breast01" (pointy/perkeyness) inherits the scaling.

The solution would be to scale down "NPC L Breast01" as "NPC L Breast" is scaled up.

[Demonwise]

Ahhh, ok, so there is a way of doing this without the need for a new skeleton, cool. And it looks like you are already looking into it, kudos to you then. Wish I understood stuff like that better or I would look into it rather than pleading with the modders in the community to go out of their way to grant my (and hopefully a great many other's) wish.

[zhenzhiao]

I made this mod a while ago and found out when releasing it that not all body/skeleton combinations produce the same results when used:

 

http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/35908//?

 

The mod is as per the description, a set of rings that have a breast growth effect and use the papyrus Sine functions to accelerate and decelerate the growth rates when starting/stopping.

 

The xp32 / custom body I used gave non-torpedo boobs, but another user with I think BBP / CBBE had torpedoes, and another user with the Manga body had melons.

[genericuser27]

I had an issue similar to this, I don't know if it is exact though; I have a mod that allows you to change breast scale (showracemenu) and when its at defualt its okay but when moved up... Things get ugly...

[jbezorg]

There is a fix in the latest version of Estrus Chaurus. It's just an inverse proportion size increase. 

fPregLeftBreast    = fOrigLeftBreast + fBreastSwell
fPregRightBreast   = fOrigRightBreast + fBreastSwell
fPregLeftBreast01  = fOrigLeftBreast01 * (fOrigLeftBreast / fPregLeftBreast)
fPregRightBreast01 = fOrigRightBreast01 * (fOrigRightBreast / fPregRightBreast) 

fOrigLeftBreast & fOrigRightBreast are the original size of nodes "NPC L Breast" & "NPC R Breast"

fOrigLeftBreast01 & fOrigRightBreast01 are the original size of nodes "NPC L Breast01" & "NPC R Breast01"

 

fBreastSwell is the size increase
 

[Adam Jensen]

I think the skeletal hierarchy is the cause of this. It's on my to-do list for Estrus Chaurus.

 

Using the left Breast as an example:

• Node "NPC L Breast" has the node "NPC L Breast01" attached to it. ( i.e. "NPC L Breast01" is a child node "NPC L Breast" in the skeletal hierarchy )
• "NPC L Breast" controls the size.
• "NPC L Breast01" controls the pointy/perkeyness
• As "NPC L Breast" (size) is scaled up, "NPC L Breast01" (pointy/perkeyness) inherits the scaling.

The solution would be to scale down "NPC L Breast01" as "NPC L Breast" is scaled up.

 

Could the scaling be stopped at all for the pointyness? Like have only NPC L Breast scale up?

[Demonwise]

So it sounds like this is an issue with how mods choose to alter the skeletal nodes and not with the skeletons themselves. In other words, it will be up to each mod author to properly scale the breast nodes and therefore there is no quick permanent solution like making a new skeleton that everyone can use?

[jacques00]

Keep in mind it's not only about the skeleton but about how the mesh is weight-painted to the bones themselves that have an overall effect on how the breast looks. From my understanding, after studying the painted weights of a default TBBP mesh and skeleton, I noticed that there are two bones for each breast--one controlling the top half and the other controlling the bottom half of each breast. This way, the TBBP animations can create a better illusion of displaced weight in the breasts than the original BBP would, as that utilizes only one bone for each breast, making the breast animations look more solid.

 

Altering the position, rotation, or scale of these bones will effect the overall look of the breasts. Altering the paint weights of the bones will also affect how they look for movement and scale, especially in scale. I would honestly leave the skeleton alone as it's been altered so much already--I mean, BBP, TBBP, XPMS, etc. all have different skeletons from what I noticed, totally inconsistent with each other, and the breast positions vary from each skeleton, making it a mess for those using custom skeletons for custom meshes.

 

You can try to implement a skeletal solution, but it will be limited in terms of use.

[Demonwise]

That's a valid point. Your right in many ways. Hmmm, I guess, in a sense, it would be nice if a fix could be included into the sexlab framework. Since the framework is supposed to be a platform and a resource database for modders.  If someone came up with a really nice combination of a pregnant body mesh with proper breast weight and proper breast scaling algorithms then it could be thrown into the sexlab framework and all modders could use it and it could become a more unified asset to the LL community. 

[jbezorg]

That's a valid point. Your right in many ways. Hmmm, I guess, in a sense, it would be nice if a fix could be included into the sexlab framework. Since the framework is supposed to be a platform and a resource database for modders.  If someone came up with a really nice combination of a pregnant body mesh with proper breast weight and proper breast scaling algorithms then it could be thrown into the sexlab framework and all modders could use it and it could become a more unified asset to the LL community.

 

This is what I use in Estrus Charus.

fPregLeftBreast    = fOrigLeftBreast + fBreastSwell
fPregRightBreast   = fOrigRightBreast + fBreastSwell
fPregLeftBreast01  = fOrigLeftBreast01 * (fOrigLeftBreast / fPregLeftBreast)
fPregRightBreast01 = fOrigRightBreast01 * (fOrigRightBreast / fPregRightBreast)

NetImmerse.SetNodeScale( kTarget, NINODE_LEFT_BREAST, fPregLeftBreast, false)
NetImmerse.SetNodeScale( kTarget, NINODE_RIGHT_BREAST, fPregRightBreast, false)
NetImmerse.SetNodeScale( kTarget, NINODE_LEFT_BREAST01, fPregLeftBreast01, false)
NetImmerse.SetNodeScale( kTarget, NINODE_RIGHT_BREAST01, fPregRightBreast01, false)
if ( kTarget == kPlayer )
	NetImmerse.SetNodeScale( kTarget, NINODE_RIGHT_BREAST, fPregRightBreast, true)
	NetImmerse.SetNodeScale( kTarget, NINODE_LEFT_BREAST, fPregLeftBreast, true)
	NetImmerse.SetNodeScale( kTarget, NINODE_RIGHT_BREAST01, fPregRightBreast01, true)
	NetImmerse.SetNodeScale( kTarget, NINODE_LEFT_BREAST01, fPregLeftBreast01, true)
endif

[Groovtama]

Mmmmhh I must say jbezorg solution is really nice^^

 

Strongly increasing peakness comes probably from the distance between breast and breast01 that some skeletons have for example XPMS, if you scale up the node before the other node the node bone (the white line between the nodes) inherits the scale from the previous node. scale of the previous and position/translation of the next node work together to create the bone and so the position shifts farther away with increasing scale ( 1 * b < a * b; if a > 1).

 

A skeleton solution could be, setting the position/translation of the breast01 node to (0,0,0), so there is no distance, so no shifting (a * 0 = 0, for every a), depending on the weight painting the breast can still getting peaky through the scaling of Breast and Breast01, but not through the skeleton anymore.