Realistic rape in SexLab?

[Cinnacism]

So I know soldier321 has already made a simple rape mod, but I have a pretty good idea of my own. The basic gist of it (for now of course) is that whenever you're staggered below a certain stamina percentage, the screen blacks out for a moment and comes back up with both characters naked and the Dragonborn getting raped.

 

Is there like a definitive how-to guide on this? I'd very much like to learn how to start doing this. Any programs I'll need? No custom animations (yet, though I'd like to make a few), I plan to use only the ones available in SexLab for now.

 

In the future I'd also like to make some custom animations a la LoversRapeStruggle for Oblivion. Secondary question, would it be possible to use some of Xaz's resources in an animation? I'd like two have a stagger animation where the attacker grabs the Dragonborn's hair and slaps a pair of cuffs on them (I'm sure you know where it goes after that of course).

 

My other future ideas include skill checks (high two-handed=push attacker off and counter-attack, high destruction=cast cloak spell, which makes them run for the hills, high sneak=stab attacker with a dagger) and some magic-oriented stuff like... magic rape hands, I guess? Haven't really thought that part out much yet. Cross that bridge when I get there, I suppose. For now just imagine your Dovahkiin in the hands of some very horny mages who keep summoning rapezombies.

 

Any help would be much appreciated, and thanks in advance.

 

Edit: so I'll need the Creation Kit and Sublime Text 2? Seems somewhat simple, I used to write simple programs in high school... I'll keep this thread updated on my progress/questions. Thanks guys.

[aravis7]

Why not using the bleeding idle (like the old sexis defeated) instead of a black screen? It was much more realistic.

[Zsar]

Regarding this "realistic" part, I think the way to go would be a "killmove" which does not kill. After all, in order to rape the victim has to be overpowered and unless psychically broken physically restrained at all times. The current system as seen in SexLab Submit or in Sanguines Debauchery, where "things just happen" does not do well to represent this invariant. A "knock unconscious" killmove would solve the problem most easily: No need to restrain what cannot will to move.

 

... From my limited insight into the technical circumstances it would seem though, that one has to wait for fore's FNIS 4.0 and object animation (which incidentally would solve the manyfold alignment problems) to explore such a solution. Gamplay-wise, something can be done right now: To reintroduce TES3's collapse-when-0-stamina-and-taking-stamina-damage. It should be possible to translate from the end of a ragdoll animation toward a regular one; the sex scene exit works that way, after all (ragdoll-to-stand-up)... after a bit more thought, not ragdolling in the first place may be viable enough.

[Trixy]

 

Is there like a definitive how-to guide on this? I'd very much like to learn how to start doing this. Any programs I'll need? No custom animations (yet, though I'd like to make a few), I plan to use only the ones available in SexLab for now.

 

If you're completely new to modding, here's the gist of it:

 

To "just run a script", you create a quest and attach the script to that quest. If the quest and script are set up properly, the script will run when the mod is first loaded. You can look up how to do this fairly easily on the creation kit wiki. I also highly recommend you set up Notepad++ to recognize Papyrus script and color code it, as well as set up a compile shortcut in Notepad++. How to do this is also on the wiki. Most of the basic stuff is tutorialized on the wiki, at least the scripting stuff (but if you don't have any programming/scripting experience, you may have a hard time...).

 

I like the idea of this mod, hope something comes of it.

[Ashal]

I also highly recommend you set up Notepad++ Sublime Text 2 to recognize Papyrus script and color code it, as well as set up a compile shortcut in Notepad++ Sublime Text 2. How to do this is also on the wiki.

 

Fixed that for you.

 

 - Signed a currently drunk programming elitist.

 

 

But really; ST2 > NP++  every day, all day. I don't know how I ever thought Notepad++ was good. After using Sublime Text 2 I feel stupid for having ever used any other IDE, and I'm fairly certain that's not just drunken hyperbole. Fairly.

 

But more on subject:

 

It should be possible to translate from the end of a ragdoll animation toward a regular one; the sex scene exit works that way, after all (ragdoll-to-stand-up)... after a bit more thought, not ragdolling in the first place may be viable enough.

There's exists an option to disable the ragdoll animation at the end with the regular vanilla reset idle. It's labeled as "Ragdoll Ending" in the configuration menu, and defaults to on; hence the ragdolling.

 

I've been talking to Arrok lately though, and we've been discussing the possibility of developing some generic enter/exit animations. One for each standing, kneeling, and laying. An actor would play the appropriate generic animation before starting the normal sex animations, and exiting them. So a female giving a blowjob would play a generic kneeling animation, then a generic standing up from a kneel at the end, and the male in that same animation would play a generic standing entrance/exit animation.

 

That's all theoretical though, just an idea we were tossing about and both seemed to like. I haven't heard from him for a week or so though, so who knows if it will come to anything at this point.

[Zsar]

Ashal... as a programming elitist, why do you use anything but Emacs?

 

Ahem. Yes, I am aware of the option, it has proven the technical viability of my last thought, though I am not convinced of the viability in terms of look&feel. Skyrim uses a generic straight-line translation to go from one animation to the next and if those animations' entry and exit poses are similar enough, it looks good if noticeable at all.

Looking at, say, Sanguine's Debauchery and its missing animation between stand and kneel, this translations does not hold up the graphical standard of Skyrim's game environment. It looks out of place and thus automatically bad. If it can be guaranteed that translations always stay small enough to avoid this effect, all be well.

 

In consensual situations, it is probably possible to align everything in ways that make things work. Not easy though: the dreaded effect of "we stop the game here and start a video" is hard to avoid. Mentioned killmoves are a floor reference. Still, it probably can be done, especially with FNIS 4.0 and game-handled alignment.

 

In the set of scenarios we have here, though, the job becomes that much harder due to the less controlled environment: People may surrender in the middle of some stairs or who-knows-where and would one really like them to just stand up and walk normally to a "more suitable" location? Or worse: Outright teleport there!?

The sensual representation of the enforcer-enforcee relationship then is not just another requirement on top of all already there, it has to be integrated into every part of the scene, from the beginning to the end.

... Easiest when the victim were mentally shattered and did not resist, but even then more difficult than the consensual version.

 

- It probably can be done. Question is, whether the required workload is reasonable enough to be fulfilled. And then, whether the result of a reasonable indeed invested workload were while not good still "good enough to be used".

... Mmh, look at that rambling, it may be my pessimistic-worldview day. Bah! Better pay me no heed.

[color]

just make sneak option to rape for start.

[somename.sn]

Ashal... as a programming elitist, why do you use anything but Emacs?

 

emacs!? pah, "vi" you mean (though admitably i use vim in case i need it)

 

ps: might try some animations. just now i try to fix "rough behind" wich is mildly tricky since importing doesn't work that well

[somename.sn]

just make sneak option to rape for start.

 

the proper way would be

1)

sneak on victim

attack with crime radius

lead victim somewhere with crime radius

rape with crime radius

victim reports or doesn't report crime depending on xy

victim would be afraid of raper for lifetime (and reasier to rape again?)

 

2)

sneak in house

attack on husband (with smaller crime radius?)

wife would submit and can get raped

victims report crime depending on xy

if not reported husband would try to kill raper next time if no audience

[aravis7]

About foreplay anims, if you're doing a foreplay system I guess we only need transition for those foreplay anims?

Aboute rape I'd really like to see a foreplay anim that starts with the attacker standng and the victim in the bleeding pose (like the old sexis defeated system) and finish like the rough anims we already have.

[Scramagon]

In the set of scenarios we have here, though, the job becomes that much harder due to the less controlled environment: People may surrender in the middle of some stairs or who-knows-where and would one really like them to just stand up and walk normally to a "more suitable" location? Or worse: Outright teleport there!?

I've run into this problem when using Sanguine's Debauchery.  They just sorta 'go at it' wherever.  All the clutter they have makes it nearly impossible for one participant to not be nudged out of place. 

 

Maybe a good way around this is if they favored going to nearby bedrolls or beds.  You can make the general assumption that there is rarely anything on an empty bed.  That might give you some room to work.

[jdods13]

Now I don't want to start a battle and that is not my intention. I am basically saying this as a point when it comes to making a rape mod... I'm all for hardcore immersion in skyrim and think rape should def be in the game. The act of it and the aftermath. Rape is pretty damn terrible... now the reason I don't install rape mods is mainly because it simply isn't "hard core enough" and all the violent and terrible struggles are not present. When you fight and then suddenly an animation plays because your health drops to a certain point, IMHO, doesn't do rape justice. With all respect as I don't want this to fall into a flame war i'm just saying I feel like we are going about rape in skyrim the WRONG WAY. The sex is not really the "Big deal" when it comes to rape... it's how you get there... the struggle, the desperation and the pain.

 

I'll give a scenario....

 

Hunter is out doing her hunting thing with her dog when 4 bandits attack her. She fights like normal then whatever trigger, whether if be health dropping to a certain level or NPCs are able to use rape powers or spells on her they initiate rape. While rape is initiate there should be an animation that plays. Depending on how many hostiles are present the might surround her and knock her to the ground. She tries to crawl away only to be pinned down by two other bandits. The hunter needs to struggle violently and say whatever mercy dialogue is in the game. "Mercy! Somebody help!" She kicks while the two other bandits rip her clothes away and force themselves onto her. Muffled moans of pain and tears should be a clue for players that might be nearby and you can rush to her aid or keep on walking.

 

There needs to be a scene for the rape not just sex but a desperate struggle... you should feel bad after you rape someone. The victim should be broken and it should show all over them  after they have been violated. Sure some NPCs can like it and this could be hooked into slave mods but most of the time...well pretty much all of the time RAPE SUCKS FOR THE VICTIM!

 

I guess my point is that rape needs to be "slowed down" if you will so that all the horrible details are there. Which is why I think there almost needs to be a completely separate framework built just for rape with animations an variations to accommodate the sex of the rapists and victims, the amount of rapists, the vicinity that the rape is taking place and who is being raped.  Sex lab is great for sex consensual but there needs to be a Rape lab that is equally robust.

 

Thoughts?

[Zsar]

I agree. Spelled out what I only hinted at, assuming everyone would see it as an axiom of the topic.

... Now that I see it written out, I am no longer sure whether this assumption was not rather presumption.

 

In any case, I deem this an important core aspect.

[jdods13]

@ jdods, yeah I've suggested a few times here and there that some of the animations be linked to killmove code, so everything goes slowmo' for a few seconds, where pc loses control, or gains control of sexual situations, aka Sex Combat, where pc changes about animations that are less submissive preparing to escape a rape, or more aggressive trying to prevent an escape. Not only would the pc change stages, but change animations in a rock/paper/scissors routine. If pc/npc escapes an intercourse event, with proper sequence of a few dominant game-moves/animations, they'll be given a temporary buff to stagger opponents with a fist attack and attempt escape on foot, though at low stamina a bleed-out state may cause slow movement, and too many special fist attacks will likely spend down stamina.

 

So, say player gets three 'dominant' animations, a sex/kill-move plays on final and they then have chance to escape. Perhaps attacker goes into ragdoll.

 

ArizonaSteve's RandomSex mod has surrounding npc masturbating during rapes, simply add gangbang train, bleed-out state for victim, delays here and there, cries for help, fist attacks triggering sex, and you've got the rape scene you describe.

 

SexAddict or Sanguine Debauchery has such a setup where after being raped, you'll loose your gear to attacker and get a debuff; you would have to figure out how to get your stuff back from the bastard using all your uber gear against you: could take days, but revenge is sweet. Some of the best gaming I've ever had. Cudos to WaxenFigure and jbezorg.

 

... add on top of all this a pregnancy module and you've got some severe consequence.

Exactly see that is awesome. That amount of depth would make for some amazing and extremely unique experiences. Literally all bases are being covered and as long as these mods are designed so that they actually matter to the PC and the NPCs and carry on through out the game Skyrim will literally be a true fantasy RPG sim. I imagine the scenario where you are traveling and stumble upon bandits having their way with some poor woman and you jump in and slay them all. The woman is literally sickly, injured and in need of care. Perhaps you can actually pick up and carry a rape victim and use a bed to place them on it. Maybe she gets pregnant and wants you to help her kill it but you ultimately have to decide. A Cool mechanic would be to allow for rape victims to be cared for which is actually a feature I've been wanting for a long time...

 

I use fros tfall and can say that I've been locked out in the cold with no place to go and no gold even though there are people around and houses every where. How cool would it be if you could ask any NPC if they would be willing to put you up for the night. Depending on the NPCs mood and your speech craft they might offer you a bed for the night or at least allow you to take warmth by their hearth. This mechanic would play in nicely if rape victims that are left alive actually make their way to the nearest settlement and seek help/ alert guards. Guards might actually go out on patrol to search an area for the specific NPCs that were responsible depending on where the victim was actually raped. Or a rape victim might wander to your door step and ask for help and shelter. These features would allow for so many cool situations. 

 

The good thing is the vanilla game pretty much has most of the assets that you would need. The voices are there, the animations for sickly and injured people are there we would just need to script everything in an intelligent way. 

 

We just need someone like Arrok to create a very well done birthing animation with stages just like sex lab anims. For Females delivering babies by themselves or with help. Anyway hehe, it's difficult for me to avoid going all over the place with ideas there is just so much to be done!

[Cinnacism]

Stupid question: Does anyone know what the killcams are named?

 

Basic plan atm is to use the one unarmed killcam (pick up and slam down, I've taken to calling it The Undertaker because wrestling), then both actors strip and trigger Arrok's "Rough" positions.

 

I assume I can make it not kill the actors, and just change the trigger to stamina%, right? Sound simple enough?

[Zsar]

"Idle Animation\*KillMove*Root" - those with the condition "ShouldAttackKill". Invert that one, so it only triggers when the attack should not kill and add a stamina-based condition.

... I hope it is as simple as that. Might be that killmoves are hardwired to kill but then I have encountered cases where they just do not often enough.

[threeddd33]

Why not using the bleeding idle (like the old sexis defeated) instead of a black screen? It was much more realistic.

 

The black screen/unconsious victim phase would be cool.... as long as you moved both participents to a better location for the animations to fire.  Unrealistic is having someone having sex while 93% of them is floating off the side of a mountain.       Or maybe you could have an animation of the victim being dragged/carried to a better location.

[Zsar]

Something like the fade out effect when being rescued in http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ue0fg1CziTE'>Far Cry 2 would be nice.

... I recall that there was an Oblivion mod that simply raised blur in relation to health loss - one would end up almost blind with very low health but (or thence) it added immensely to the atmosphere.

 

If these effects - blur and fading - were combined, that should work nicely; and may at the same time cover for relocation where necessary.

[Cinnacism]

Alright, I found the character killmoves in the Creation Kit, is there a way to show them? Or do I need NifSkope for that?

[LunarDeLuna]

THIS Why not let enemy go (or finish him/her) them AFTER sex?

[Zsar]

But not like "this". For the whole ordeal one has to maintain a script handle of the actor anyway. Can trigger the calm (or fear?) effect from there once everything is done (or mayhap: moments before to ensure a seamless transition).